• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Put It In Your MAU-th: Pork Loin leading PS4/Xbone in NA

D

DocSeuss

Member
entremet said:
People still care about this? PS4 won. It's over.

It's nice that MS is doing better. Good for the industry.
Click to expand...

Man, last gen, when people had those fake PS3 sales numbers, they were SO EXCITED because they thought the PS3 had outsold the 360 finally. It was all "it's not over until the gen is over" for them. That appears to have changed.

But it's not like it matters. The X1 is outselling the 360, it's got Windows 10 into more houses, Play Anywhere's doing alright, and that's the only goal that Microsoft ever cared about.
 
K

kyser73

Member
Harmondale said:
Always been curious about this but is neogaf more of a NA forum? Because I often see discussions that only refers to the NA market. Like "This year Microsoft won the holiday season" when they actually sold less World Wide. Why is not the title instead "This year Microsoft won the holiday season in NA"? (as an example from previous years..)

Without digging too much Into the sales sometimes I am under the impression that xbox one are closing in on ps4 big time, when its not really happening taking global sales Into consuderation. Reading gaf can be missleading.
Click to expand...

Yeah, it leans heavily toward NA (read up on the site history, there's a Wiki page about it), and many posters can be pretty myopic about this - the persistence of the 'PS3 comeback' narrative is one of the most egregious examples of this.

Just bear that in mind & you'll be fine :)
 
C

Caddyshack

Banned
Seems likely XB1 is going to have sold more on BF considering MS have, as they usually do, basically cut their own throat to move hardware however they can.

That said, I thought for a while Sony would have had November as an easy win with the Pro launch, but BF has been a lot crazier than I was expecting, so XB1 outselling PS4 in November seems not only more likely now, but probably a safe bet at this point.

Never would have expected it to pan out like this last month. Guess MS just wanted it more.

DocSeuss said:
Man, last gen, when people had those fake PS3 sales numbers, they were SO EXCITED because they thought the PS3 had outsold the 360 finally. It was all "it's not over until the gen is over" for them. That appears to have changed.
Click to expand...

Which people specifically are you referring to? Was entrement one of those who were "SO EXCITED" by "fake" PS3 numbers or something? Was anyone who has even posted in this thread saying "it's not over until the gen is over" at any point in fact? Just curious who you are talking about.
 
R

Raylan

Banned
DocSeuss said:
Man, last gen, when people had those fake PS3 sales numbers, they were SO EXCITED because they thought the PS3 had outsold the 360 finally. It was all "it's not over until the gen is over" for them. That appears to have changed.

But it's not like it matters. The X1 is outselling the 360, it's got Windows 10 into more houses, Play Anywhere's doing alright, and that's the only goal that Microsoft ever cared about.
Click to expand...
It's what they now care about, because they got bitchslapped by the PS4 for 3 years straight.
 
G

gtj1092

Member
LuvOfThaGame said:
Is being happy for new owners of xbox something that bothers you?

Why does positive news or a positive outlook for MS often bother people so much? There's always a 'you shouldnt be so happy for your xbox brand because...' comment and its sad.
Click to expand...

I'm don't understand your statement. Has the persecution of the faithful been weighing on your heart and you used me a jumping point?

I'm specifically asking AZ what he felt about the tone of this thread since he has had such an issue with the "tone" of previous sales threads even after being presented with factual evidence that what he felt was happening was not actually happening to the degree he thought.
 
Melchiah

Melchiah

Member
DocSeuss said:
But it's not like it matters. The X1 is outselling the 360, it's got Windows 10 into more houses, Play Anywhere's doing alright, and that's the only goal that Microsoft ever cared about.
Click to expand...

Is it really outselling the 360? I recall seeing posts on the sales threads, that after the launch it's been selling less than its predecessor.

As for what they care about, I think it's safe to say no company would want to be 1.5 million behind on their home turf, let alone twice behind worldwide.
 
LuvOfThaGame

LuvOfThaGame

Banned
gtj1092 said:
I'm don't understand your statement. Has the persecution of the faithful been weighing on your heart and you used me a jumping point?

I'm specifically asking AZ what he felt about the tone of this thread since he has had such an issue with the "tone" of previous sales threads even after being presented with factual evidence that what he felt was happening was not actually happening to the degree he thought.
Click to expand...
Hhmmm. I must take statements like "chest thumping" as YOU disliking the tone of this thread for some reason. Weird, hu?

Also, for you to throw out "persecution of the faitful" for question you is just a fucking cute deflection. :D You have a super duper sunday, tho. :)
 
G

Genio88

Member
Microsoft really did an outstanding job with XB1 S, they managed to build a small, cool, 4K compatible for HDR and upscaling and 4k blu ray player, all for a cheap price and great bundles with key games like FIFA 17. Bravo Microsoft and especially Phil Spencer
 
N

Nightengale

Member
At best the sales streams for X1 and 360 are neck to neck.

External data from publishers and the assumed 1:2 ratio vs PS4 suggest XB1 would be around 25 million by now or by end of the year.

We don't have accurate data for how many 360s were sold in the same window but we do know that around March/April next year 360 hits 30 million.
 
Melchiah

Melchiah

Member
Nightengale said:
At best the sales streams for X1 and 360 are neck to neck.

External data from publishers and the assumed 1:2 ratio vs PS4 suggest XB1 would be around 25 million by now or by end of the year.

We don't have accurate data for how many 360s were sold in the same window but we do know that around March/April next year 360 hits 30 million.
Click to expand...

I find that telling, since they'd probably publish the numbers if it was putting the 360 sales to shame on monthly basis.
 
T

Trup1aya

Member
Fabtacular said:
So you're telling me that in a holiday season where Sony released not one, not two, but three new product skus (Slim, Pro and PSVR) it should be within the realm of expectation that they should lose the HW NPDs in every single month?

(The fact that the Pro's audience is people who already have PS4s is precisely the point. These sales should be in addition to, rather than substitutes for, your normal holiday demand for consoles.)

Nobody is saying that the Pro should be outselling the Xbox by itself. But it, plus never-lower prices on the Slim, plus interest around PSVR, should be able to give them the marginal increase in sales sufficient to beat the Xbox.

And if the answer is really "no silly, you shouldn't expect the Pro to sell more than 50k units in its debut November" then the Pro REALLY has problems. If Sony isn't going to move more than 1m of these worldwide annually, what incentive will there be for developers to invest resources into investing in the platform? You'll see only the laziest implementations, and then it won't even be serving the niche enthusiast community well.
Click to expand...

I do think MS will win november, or they will be narrowly defeated. However, the 'silly' takeaway would be that a Microsoft loss would be a red flag on the prospects of a Scorpio. I think both parties recognize that the holidays are dictated largely by price and that their upgrade consoles target a small portion of the market.

I think that people upgrading their OG ps4s make up the majority of ps4 sales. But i don't think a massive number of people will see the ps4pro as a compelling upgrade. I think most would rather just spend their gaming budget on new games.

Without ps4pro to consider, i think the xb1s would have crushed the Slim, considering the bundles MS has, and the previous 4 months. Slim just isn't as compelling. It will all come down to how many pre-orders the pro amassed before it launched. Anecdotally, most shops i go to haven't been stocking many pros and they don't have attractive shelf space.

Edit: also i don't think the psvr helped matters. You'll have existing ps4 owners who might have upgraded to a Pro, by it in instead got a headset.
 
R

Ricky_R

Member
Trup1aya said:
Without ps4pro to consider, i think the xb1s would have crushed the Slim, considering the bundles MS has, and the previous 4 months. Slim just isn't as compelling. It will all come down to how many pre-orders the pro amassed before it launched. Anecdotally, most shops i go to haven't been stocking many pros and they don't have attractive shelf space.
Click to expand...

Without the Pro, Sony would've released a more compelling slim and far better deals. They just aren't interested in aggresively taking the holidays this year.

For better or worse, they have a different strategy altogether.
 
R

RenditMan

Banned
Ricky_R said:
Without the Pro, Sony would've released a more compelling slim and far better deals. They just aren't interested in aggresively taking the holidays this year.

For better or worse, they have a different strategy altogether.
Click to expand...

Sony is printing money finally, MS is burning it.
 
T

Trup1aya

Member
Ricky_R said:
Without the Pro, Sony would've released a more compelling slim and far better deals. They just aren't interested in aggresively taking the holidays this year.

For better or worse, they have a different strategy altogether.
Click to expand...

So you're saying Sony didn't make a more compelling low end model because they wanted to spotlight the pro? I don't think that makes sense, Since Sony is well aware that price is king. The pro isn't going to compel people who wanted 3 years hoping to get a cheap next gen console.

Without the pro, Sony does with the Slim what they are doing now. The pro realistically doesn't affect how they target the low end-which will make up the lions share of their sales.

I do agree that Sony isn't interested in being aggressive during the holidays. They really have no reason to, since they are making plenty of profit as is.
 
R

Ricky_R

Member
Trup1aya said:
So you're saying Sony didn't make a more compelling low end model because they wanted to spotlight the pro? I don't think that makes sense, Since Sony is well aware that price is king. The pro isn't going to compel people who wanted 3 years hoping to get a cheap next gen console.

I do agree that Sony isn't interested in being aggressive during the holidays. They really have no reason to, since they are making plenty of profit as is.
Click to expand...

My point is that if there wasn't a Pro and a VR system in the equation, the slim would definitely be a different product, with more focus and resources on it. Do you actually believe that the slim we got would be the same either way?

Even if price is king, they're trying to cover quite a few bases right now and slim possibly suffered because of it.
 
C

Curufinwe

Member
Melchiah said:
Is it really outselling the 360? I recall seeing posts on the sales threads, that after the launch it's been selling less than its predecessor.

As for what they care about, I think it's safe to say no company would want to be 1.5 million behind on their home turf, let alone twice behind worldwide.
Click to expand...

The 360 sold 30 million after 3.5 years.

https://techcrunch.com/2009/05/28/xbox-360-sales-top-30-million-with-20-million-live-subscribers/

Some people keep repeating the mantra that the Xbone is selling more launch aligned than the 360 even though MS haven't given us sales numbers in years.
 
M

mrklaw

MrArseFace
Fabtacular said:
I'll say this: If Xbox takes November it's a disaster for the Pro, and will be a huge red flag for MS's Scorpio and "no more console generations" strategy.
Click to expand...

That makes no sense whatsoever. Pro is a the same price as the original PS4. It isn't designed to be selling high volumes to Black Friday customers.

Whether MS or Sony 'wins' November will be down to who had the better value at the lower end of the market, with Xbox one S and PS4 slim.
 
T

Trup1aya

Member
Ricky_R said:
My point is that if there wasn't a Pro and a VR system in the equation, the slim would definitely be a different product, with more focus and resources on it. Do you actually believe that the slim we got would be the same either way?

Even if price is king, they're trying to cover quite a few bases right now and slim possibly suffered because of it.
Click to expand...

Ok i see what you are saying, but i think Sony is smart enough to realize that the Slim would be their sales leader and would prioritize accordingly.

The reason they didn't devote more resources to it is because they think it will sell adequately enough due to branding and pricing (and they are right). I don't think removing the pro and psvr from the equation changes their strategy. Their low end console prints money, even if it's second in NPD for a couple of months. When you have a product that sells itself (ps4), maybe you don't have to spend so much to sell it.

In contrast, MS has had to vocally demonstrate that the xb1s is a much better product than the og xb1. So you see a ton of effort behind it.

The pro and psvr, imo, don't sell themselves. The consumer had to be educated and convinced
 
J

jroc74

Phone reception is more important to me than human rights
LiquidSolid said:
No offence but your posts are coming off like you're buying those consoles for yourself and your kids are just secondary. Not exactly the sort of mindset you should have when buying gifts IMO.
Click to expand...

Thats the way its supposed to be ;-)

In a perfect world we could have them all, all at once.

Eventually I was gonna get an XBO. We went with PS4 in 2014 for the same reasons I wanna wait for the Pro.

Back then the kids wanted PS4 instead of an XBO.
 
R

Ricky_R

Member
Trup1aya said:
Ok i see what you are saying, but i think Sony is smart enough to realize that the Slim would be their sales leader and would prioritize accordingly.

The reason they didn't devote more resources to it is because they think it will sell adequately enough due to branding and pricing (and they are right). I don't think removing the pro and psvr from the equation changes their strategy. Their low end console prints money, even if it's second in NPD for a couple of months. When you have a product that sells itself (ps4), maybe you don't have to work so hard to sell it.

In contrast, MS has had to vocally demonstrate that the xb1s is a much better product than the og xb1. So you see a ton of effort behind it.

The pro and psvr, imo, don't sell themselves. The consumer had to be educated and convinced
Click to expand...

I understand that, and I generally agree, but I'm quite sure that if the Slim would've been Sony's only focus, it would definitely be a more compelling product and a more attractive SKU (possibly bundled) than what we got.

Edit: Silly me. The Slim is bundled. ;)
 
B

bidguy

Banned
iceatcs said:
I don't think the price increased because of Xbox include, It basically pausing the price drop longer.

But they are so many free Xbox come together will lead more count.
Click to expand...

i have absolutely no idea what youre saying

edit : so retailers are packing in free xbones ? and ms is counting those as sales ?

i dont think the amount of pack ins is significant in any way
 
Y

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
DocSeuss said:
Man, last gen, when people had those fake PS3 sales numbers, they were SO EXCITED because they thought the PS3 had outsold the 360 finally. It was all "it's not over until the gen is over" for them. That appears to have changed.

But it's not like it matters. The X1 is outselling the 360, it's got Windows 10 into more houses, Play Anywhere's doing alright, and that's the only goal that Microsoft ever cared about.
Click to expand...

Fake sales numbers seem to get around these days
 
T

Three

Member
DocSeuss said:
Man, last gen, when people had those fake PS3 sales numbers, they were SO EXCITED because they thought the PS3 had outsold the 360 finally. It was all "it's not over until the gen is over" for them. That appears to have changed.

But it's not like it matters. The X1 is outselling the 360, it's got Windows 10 into more houses, Play Anywhere's doing alright, and that's the only goal that Microsoft ever cared about.
Click to expand...

Can you show me?

Ofcourse you can't
 
G

get2sammyb

Member
I know this is mostly a US focused thread, but I feel like the Slim did do its intended job here in Europe. PS4 Slim went below £200 at most stores in the UK, and was bundled with recent games to boot.

I'm not sure why Sony America hasn't been more aggressive, but I'd bet that on a worldwide basis, PS4's had a very good week.
 
M

michaelius

Banned
DocSeuss said:
But it's not like it matters. The X1 is outselling the 360, it's got Windows 10 into more houses, Play Anywhere's doing alright, and that's the only goal that Microsoft ever cared about.
Click to expand...

Yes I'm sure Microsoft is super happy about being outsold by 2:1 factor WW and all they ever cared about was Play Anywhere which wasn't even implemented until it became obvious that traditional keeping games exclusive for xbox is not going to move a needle even a small bit.

And that glorious Windows 10 success where they are going to miss their their adoption targets with third mobile pillar going below 1% market share of phones sold.
 
F

Fdkn

Member
get2sammyb said:
I know this is mostly a US focused thread, but I feel like the Slim did do its intended job here in Europe. PS4 Slim went below £200 at most stores in the UK, and was bundled with recent games to boot.

I'm not sure why Sony America hasn't been more aggressive, but I'd bet that on a worldwide basis, PS4's had a very good week.
Click to expand...

If the next quarterly shipment drops and PS4 is up YoY maybe we could put to rest the false notion that winning NPD is the most important thing in the world and tanking your profits to do so is a no brainer.

I'm joking, the US=World will never die.
 
ethomaz

ethomaz

Banned
DocSeuss said:
Man, last gen, when people had those fake PS3 sales numbers, they were SO EXCITED because they thought the PS3 had outsold the 360 finally. It was all "it's not over until the gen is over" for them. That appears to have changed.

But it's not like it matters. The X1 is outselling the 360, it's got Windows 10 into more houses, Play Anywhere's doing alright, and that's the only goal that Microsoft ever cared about.
Click to expand...
You talk about fakes sales then you say X1 is outselling 360.

That ironic and fun to be fair.

There is a reason MS stopped to claim X1 > 360 after late 2015... they were really close and 360 looks to be selling better since that.
 
A

Admodieus

Member
Anecdotal evidence, but my friend who works at Target in northeast US says that the PS4 Pro is a sales joke for them, and they still have stock from the initial shipment even after Black Friday. The PS4 slim bundle is the real seller.
 
V

VeryGooster

Banned
Side observation but interesting about Best Buy and Civil War because browsing for cheap Blu-rays over the weekend some movies I wanted went out of stock and then got restocked but CW was always available. Must have had a ton.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Did anyone else think that the Nintendo Wii was going to be the best selling console ever back then?
39
3K
Eddie-Griffin replied
The State of PlayStation Studios With SIE acquiring Bungie and more, let's take another look at the state of Sony's first-party studios (IGN)
Opinion 2
62
7K
Bryank75 replied
Of the current consoles, which had the best reveal?
43
4K
Monokrom replied
OFF THE TOP OF YOUR HEAD - What are your top 20 games and why?
2 3 4
196
19K
German Hops replied
The PlayStation 5 GPU Will Be Supported By Better Hardware Solutions, In Depth Analysis Suggests
13 14 15 16 17
812
68K
A Most Virtuous Cat replied
Top Bottom