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RE2 fan remake has been closed down.

Koyuga

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Oct 5, 2010
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I love the fixed camera angles, but at this point I kinda want it to be over the should just to see all the meltdowns lol. I mean, we don't even know what the game is going to be like some posters have already been overreacting.
 

kamineko

Does his best thinking in the flying car
Oct 7, 2014
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Relax guys, it's just new good guy Capcom. They aren't going to let the programmers for a fan remake decide what the game should be on a fundamental level.

They're just engaging the community. Which I consider good. I mean, I like the way they've been about the whole thing so far.

we do it, y'all

 

Sanctuary

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Feb 10, 2012
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"They have invited us to a meeting to discuss further ideas."

Hopefully one of the ideas InvaderGames had WASN'T "Make the game over-the-shoulder like our game..."
I actually found their attempt at a remake to be horrible, compared to this one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flBvR9zl1Zg <THIS is what Capcom should be aiming for.

Although they did do a good job emulating Resident Evil: Left4Dead Edition.

(nobody could bring back to life the masterpiece of 1998 better than the creators themselves).
And they still won't be, so what's his point?

edit:

Well, seeing that version, I stand corrected. The version that was continually showcased was the one that was definitely not Resident Evil 2 though due to the perspective. Still, you should watch the other Rod Lima remake videos. It's a lot closer to the source material (since it uses so many of the original assets anyway), while feeling updated.
 

Mariip

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Dec 28, 2013
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wow.... it looks really nice for a fan made project 0_0

But i think the switchable camera idea would give some pacing problems...

I'm guessing they'll just get some ideas of how they can handle the remake... Good for the fans though, the fact that capcom sees how much time and effort they put into this is really nice =D

I like the new Capcom
 

FLAguy954

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Jan 27, 2012
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and just like that the remake is ruined.
Capcom will think that over-the -shoulder is what everyone wants...
Talk about knee-jerk reactions :/. If Capcom is really taking advice from Invader Games, they should at least use Unreal Engine 4. I absolutely think that the game should have fixed perspectives but they should go for full, real-time lighting and polygonal environments imo.
 

ZenTzen

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Jan 10, 2013
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Please dont go to capcom and say for the remake to go over the shoulder, or some option between fixed camera or OTS, the focus of the game should be only on one and all its development time to be focused on, with also having a focus on expanding the game
 

Mr_Antimatter

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Feb 5, 2013
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Makes sense. Why spend hundreds of hours rapid prototypeing what it would look like in UE4 or with over the shoulder vs fixed camera, if some fans did it for you?

FLy them out, play the heck out of their builds, then take what you find to your designers.
 
Oct 26, 2009
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I actually found their attempt at a remake to be horrible, compared to this one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flBvR9zl1Zg <THIS is what Capcom should be aiming for.

Although they did do a good job emulating Resident Evil: Left4Dead Edition.



And they still won't be, so what's his point?

edit:



Well, seeing that version, I stand corrected. The version that was continually showcased was the one that was definitely not Resident Evil 2 though due to the perspective. Still, you should watch the other Rod Lima remake videos. It's a lot closer to the source material (since it uses so many of the original assets anyway), while feeling updated.
I've been following Rod Lima for a while. He did an amazing job which was much more impressive than InvaderGames. However, he is never going to release his version sadly. He's afraid of getting sued by Capcom.
 

Nerrel

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Oct 13, 2014
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I love the fixed camera angles, but at this point I kinda want it to be over the should just to see all the meltdowns lol. I mean, we don't even know what the game is going to be like some posters have already been overreacting.
Yeah, with the way people are acting it's almost as if Capcom has been on a colossal shit-streak with the series or something.

Over the shoulder means the game will likely be the same as the past few let downs. There's reason to be skeptical that another RE game in that style will be good. There is exactly one good over the shoulder RE, RE4, and it was shaped by Mikami's vision. Without him, the best they've managed is Revelations 2, which is a solid game but really lacks its own ideas. They ripped off so many elements from The Last of Us especially that I felt embarrassed for them while I played it. They just don't know what they're doing at this point and they're pulling ideas from everyone else. It's hard to believe this is the same team that made a game as bold and influential as RE4 was.

Fixed cameras means that they're respecting the original content. They can't turn it into an action game. They can't wander too far from the original atmosphere and gameplay. It's bound to at least be an OK remake no matter what, and if they learned a lot from REmaster, it could become another great remake on par with that game. That's exactly what people have been hoping for all these years.


Over the shoulder means that "REmake 2" will never happen. At best we'll get a good new RE game but one that plays very little like RE2, which is not what people have been asking for. I think this fan remake demonstrated that over the shoulder changes everything. And at worst, it'll be another bland shitfest.

Even if they combine them, the combat and gameplay won't translate well between both modes. They'd have to develop two separate games to do it justice, and why? What does over the shoulder- an action perspective- have to add to a survival horror game like this? Capcom barely wanted to remake this in the first place. They're not going to break the bank to do it twice over.
 
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I don't see the problem with the remake being in third person. I'd rather have the remake be more than just a graphics upgrade.
I love the fixed camera angles, but at this point I kinda want it to be over the should just to see all the meltdowns lol. I mean, we don't even know what the game is going to be like some posters have already been overreacting.
You two are the masters of lockpicking my disdain.
 
Oct 26, 2009
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If you honestly think they're going to rebalance the game depending on the camera, then you're in for a rude awakening. That would be like them making two different games, in a game in which already has 4 different scenarios, The workload would be massive. If they honestly do it the way you are saying, it will cost them a lot of extra development time and they will have to make a decision over which one to go with.
I understand that. I'm just curious as to what Capcom will discuss with InvaderGames. I'm not really a fan of the changes that InvaderGames made in the UE4 build (real time health and inventory (a la Alone in the Dark (2008) and level design changes (fuse box)). Capcom would be retarded to not pursue a fixed camera perspective especially after how well REmake did. However, it would be interesting to see a OTS perspective version as well, even though I agree that it's not realistic.
 

Diablohead

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Jun 4, 2006
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TBH, the onyl way Capcom can satisfy its fanbase is to include both perspectives,
I would be fine with a code veronica approach, as long as the 3D was wll done and not full of jaggies.

Playing through parts of code veronica in first person was fun.
 

Dremark

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Sep 1, 2011
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"They have invited us to a meeting to discuss further ideas."

Hopefully one of the ideas InvaderGames had WASN'T "Make the game over-the-shoulder like our game..."
Eh, why not put an option for both? Probably about half the fanbase is going to be disappointed if it's one way or another.
 

AAK

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What advantage other than nostalgia does a fixed camera angle have over a dynamic one?

There's so much more you can do with an Evil Within style camera gameplay wise that you can't do with fixed camera angles.
 

News Bot

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Thats actually cool of Capcom to not C/D them into obscurity-and instead (hopefully) let them help with RE2Make!
"Hopefully"? The fan remake was nothing. Every bit of it was ripped from the other games, you really think that's useful to CAPCOM?

What advantage other than nostalgia does a fixed camera angle have over a dynamic one?

There's so much more you can do with an Evil Within style camera gameplay wise that you can't do with fixed camera angles.
There's a reason fixed camera angles were chosen for the series in the first place despite an FPS version initially being in development. Fixed camera angles are excellent at elucidating and enhancing feelings of tension and fear. Take the Licker corridor in BIO2 for instance, every single angle is carefully placed to make the player feel uncomfortable with a sense of foreboding. You can't do that with an over-the-shoulder perspective very well at all. It's the same principle in movies, they're shot in specific ways to maximize terror. With a constant OTS perspective, you can't do this. The OTS camera doesn't actually give the player more options anyway apart from being able to free-aim, which already severely decreases the possible tension because you then become a demigod.
 

AAK

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There's a reason fixed camera angles were chosen for the series in the first place despite an FPS version initially being in development. Fixed camera angles are excellent at elucidating and enhancing feelings of tension and fear. Take the Licker corridor in BIO2 for instance, every single angle is carefully placed to make the player feel uncomfortable with a sense of foreboding. You can't do that with an over-the-shoulder perspective very well at all. It's the same principle in movies, they're shot in specific ways to maximize terror. With a constant OTS perspective, you can't do this. The OTS camera doesn't actually give the player more options anyway apart from being able to free-aim, which already severely decreases the possible tension because you then become a demigod.
I highly disagree with the notion that you can't provide a sense of foreboding terror and tension with a dynamic camera. It might not be the same type of terror, but it can still be done for sure. And along with that you can have the ability to do the various gameplay enhancements that come with the dynamic camera angle. A very good example is Dead Space, the Ishimura is a fantastic environment invoking this type of terror we're debating.

I'm also OK if they go with the RE3.5 camera system of both the fixed cameras for exploration and OTS for combat.
 

News Bot

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I highly disagree with the notion that you can't provide a sense of foreboding terror and tension with a dynamic camera. It might not be the same type of terror, but it can still be done for sure. And along with that you can have the ability to do the various gameplay enhancements that come with the dynamic camera angle. A very good example is Dead Space, the Ishimura is a fantastic environment invoking this type of terror we're debating.

I'm also OK if they go with the RE3.5 camera system of both the fixed cameras for exploration and OTS for combat.
If it's not the same type of terror, it's not a faithful remake, which is what the majority of fans want based on the reaction to the first remake.

The BIO4 prototype's camera wouldn't work either because that game's areas were built around it. On top of that, there was no free aim. You could only aim side-to-side when over the shoulder. The Dead Space camera works because Dead Space was designed around the camera, just as BIO2 was designed around fixed cameras.

People give camera angles too little credit. It's a major part of the game, not some incidental piece that the developers just threw in at the end.
 
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There are plenty of OTS quasi horror games you goddamn heathens can play, why must you insist on fucking with one of the great isolated incidents that is RE2?

If I wanted to play an OTS I'd play the Silent Hill series. RE was a wonderful diversion from that kind of playing.
 

AAK

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If it's not the same type of terror, it's not a faithful remake, which is what the majority of fans want based on the reaction to the first remake.

The BIO4 prototype's camera wouldn't work either because that game's areas were built around it. On top of that, there was no free aim. You could only aim side-to-side when over the shoulder. The Dead Space camera works because Dead Space was designed around the camera, just as BIO2 was designed around fixed cameras.

People give camera angles too little credit. It's a major part of the game, not some incidental piece that the developers just threw in at the end.
I dunno man, IMO it's archaic and videogames have made considerable improvements as to how 3rd person adventure/horror functionally play. I think it will do the game wonders just how Metal Gear Solid 3's new camera system helped it considerably compared to the birds eye view.
 

News Bot

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I dunno man, IMO it's archaic and videogames have made considerable improvements as to how 3rd person adventure/horror functionally play. I think it will do the game wonders just how Metal Gear Solid 3's new camera system helped it considerably compared to the birds eye view.
How is it archaic? Not every game needs to be an over the shoulder shooter.

MGS3's new camera helped because the old camera was a bad choice to begin with. It was designed for MGS2 and its indoor sections, and Kojima thought he could get away with it in outdoor areas just because it constantly points north. This is a minor case where the original camera was the wrong choice, just like OTS would be in BIO2.
 

AAK

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I agree not every game needs it, but this is a shooting game. If this was a remaster for a game like Haunting Ground or Clock Tower I would say stick with the fixed angles. Because combat plays a big role in Resident Evil and with all the advancements to third person shooters in the previous console generation it would be waste to make such a big game without utilizing all of them.
 

News Bot

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I agree not every game needs it, but this is a shooting game. If this was a remaster for a game like Haunting Ground or Clock Tower I would say stick with the fixed angles. Because combat plays a big role in Resident Evil and with all the advancements to third person shooters in the previous console generation it would be waste to make such a big game without utilizing all of them.
It's not a shooting game. It's a survival horror game. Combat plays a bigger role than most horror games, but you're encouraged not to fight. OTS is detrimental to horror and encourages you to fight because it's fun to do so. There goes all of the tension and fear.

Take Umbrella Chronicles for instance. It's impossible to be afraid of any of the enemies. They're minor annoyances at best. Others are downright hilariously broken by the first-person view (Lickers need to stand there and wave their tongue around for a while otherwise they'd break the game by ripping you to shreds instantly).
 

Darkangel

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I'm happy for the mod team, but I really don't want them nudging Capcom towards a player-controlled camera. I actually thought that the Reborn mod did a good job showcasing how the RE4 camera doesn't work for RE2.
 

MikeBreezy92

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Jul 21, 2012
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I agree not every game needs it, but this is a shooting game. If this was a remaster for a game like Haunting Ground or Clock Tower I would say stick with the fixed angles. Because combat plays a big role in Resident Evil and with all the advancements to third person shooters in the previous console generation it would be waste to make such a big game without utilizing all of them.
Combat is a option in most encounters besides the occasional boss. I don't really think you understand the design of the older Resident Evil games compared to 4 and up.
 

ninjablade

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Dec 9, 2012
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"Hopefully"? The fan remake was nothing. Every bit of it was ripped from the other games, you really think that's useful to CAPCOM?



There's a reason fixed camera angles were chosen for the series in the first place despite an FPS version initially being in development. Fixed camera angles are excellent at elucidating and enhancing feelings of tension and fear. Take the Licker corridor in BIO2 for instance, every single angle is carefully placed to make the player feel uncomfortable with a sense of foreboding. You can't do that with an over-the-shoulder perspective very well at all. It's the same principle in movies, they're shot in specific ways to maximize terror. With a constant OTS perspective, you can't do this. The OTS camera doesn't actually give the player more options anyway apart from being able to free-aim, which already severely decreases the possible tension because you then become a demigod.
uhh the main reason they used fixed camera angle was cause the game had pre rendered backgrounds, which made the game as a result have much better looking backgrounds then it ever should have, a few other ps games did this, and some early ps2 games.
 

News Bot

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uhh the main reason they used fixed camera angle was cause the game had pre rendered backgrounds, which made the game as a result have much better looking backgrounds then it ever should have, a few other ps games did this, and some early ps2 games.
Pre-rendered backgrounds weren't decided until they already decided on fixed camera angles. The game started as initially full 3D until they realized it would look like ass.
 

AAK

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OTS is detrimental to horror and encourages you to fight because it's fun to do so.
I have a huge problem with this statement. The shooting aspect of the game not being fun as a design decision is not at all the way to go. You can still make a good survival horror game with a dynamic camera while making the combat system responsive and fun. The sruvival horror aspect can definitely come by tweaking the difficulty and availability of ammunition. Encourage the survival aspect by rewarding players on how they use the limited ammo they have rather than making the shooting a chore to go through. You still have the tension that comes from how you know you can't screw up this valuable and limited resource given to you. And having a dynamic camera lets the game provide a lot of different scenario's on how to use their ammo by implementing more environmental hazards, limb specific stuns to help maneuver your way around, among other things.
 

News Bot

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I have a huge problem with this statement. The shooting aspect of the game not being fun as a design decision is not at all the way to go. You can still make a good survival horror game with a dynamic camera while making the combat system responsive and fun. The sruvival horror aspect can definitely come by tweaking the difficulty and availability of ammunition. Encourage the survival aspect by rewarding players on how they use the limited ammo they have rather than making the shooting a chore to go through. And having a dynamic camera lets the game provide a lot of different scenario's on how to use their ammo by implementing more environmental hazards, limb specific stuns to help maneuver your way around, among other things.
It is the way to go for a survival horror game. Incidentally, the shooting is already fun in the older games, it's just not encouraged. Whereas it is openly encouraged in OTS games because it's much easier. There's no way around this.
 

AAK

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It is the way to go for a survival horror game. Incidentally, the shooting is already fun in the older games, it's just not encouraged. Whereas it is openly encouraged in OTS games because it's much easier. There's no way around this.
You're wrong about that. Evil Within on Hard mode is a great example of this. Resources are limited and it's all about how you use them in conjunction with the environment maintaining the survival horror aspect about the game.
 

ninjablade

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Pre-rendered backgrounds weren't decided until they already decided on fixed camera angles. The game started as initially full 3D until they realized it would look like ass.
you sure about this? anyway the is reason these type of camera angles are not used anymore cause they cripple gameplay, you can talk all you want about them being scary and tense, but i found evil within, dead space and resident evil first play through scarier and even more tense, and i'm a huge fan of resident evil 2.
 

News Bot

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You're wrong about that. Evil Within on Hard mode is a great example of this. Resources are limited and it's all about how you use them in conjunction with the environment maintaining the survival horror aspect about the game.
That is The Evil Within. Not BIO2. You can't equate one to the other as if they crossover perfectly. BIO2 would need to be completely redesigned for the new camera. The Evil Within was designed around it, and is still nothing like the classic BIO games. It is much closer to BIO4 than anything else.

you sure about this? anyway the is reason these type of camera angles are not used anymore cause they cripple gameplay, you can talk all you want about them being scary and tense, but i found evil within, dead space and resident evil first play through scarier and even more tense, and i'm a huge fan of resident evil 2.
We've spoken to several of BIO1's developers, so yes.

Dead Space was only tense for me because enemies came from everywhere. Can't really have that in a BIO2 remake. The Evil Within was garbage to me.
 
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You're wrong about that. Evil Within on Hard mode is a great example of this. Resources are limited and it's all about how you use them in conjunction with the environment maintaining the survival horror aspect about the game.
The difference is that the Over The Shoulder perspective that The Evil Within has only works because the game is HUGE. OTS wouldn't work in the design of the buildings in RE2, it would really reveal how small the game actually is.

you sure about this? anyway the is reason these type of camera angles are not used anymore cause they cripple gameplay, you can talk all you want about them being scary and tense, but i found evil within, dead space and resident evil first play through scarier and even more tense, and i'm a huge fan of resident evil 2.
If anyone is sure about anything RE2 (Or RE in general), you can bet your ass it'd be News Bot.
 

AAK

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That is The Evil Within. Not BIO2. You can't equate one to the other as if they crossover perfectly. BIO2 would need to be completely redesigned for the new camera. The Evil Within was designed around it, and is still nothing like the classic BIO games. It is much closer to BIO4 than anything else.
Hence, the game is a Remake and not a remaster. As game designer has the liberty to manipulate certain dimensions of the environment to incorporate these new gameplay enhancements. I'm not saying to rip-off TEW, but if you're going to spend millions of dollars on such a big budget game you should make it the best videogame possible.
 

News Bot

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Hence, the game is a Remake and no a remaster. As game designer has the liberty to manipulate certain dimensions of the environment to incorporate these new gameplay enhancements. I'm not saying to rip-off TEW, but if you're going to spend millions of dollars on such a big budget game you should make it the best videogame possible.
That still wouldn't work as most fans want a faithful remake akin to the remake of the first game. The layout and design of BIO2 is relied on by several other games in the franchise such as BIO3, Darkside Chronicles, Outbreak, even Operation Raccoon City. The design of the R.P.D. and Umbrella laboratory is engrained in the mythology. Changing what the fans want just to accommodate a gameplay style only a fraction desire wouldn't work. What you speak of isn't a remake, it's some other game with the same name and some similarities.

Who says this remake needs millions of dollars or that it's going to be a big budget game? If they're going to make a faithful remake they don't need a major budget anymore, we're not in 2002. They also don't need OTS to make it the best videogame possible, that's nonsense. They don't have some sort of standard defined by OTS games to live up to. BIO2 is not an OTS game, nor should it be.
 

AAK

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If RE2 is indeed a remake and not a remaster, it most definitely will cost millions. Just look at all the backgrounds and art alone from the original RE2. To remake all those into next gen assets that are rarely ever recycled throughout the game at a level of detail of a a next gen console will cost millions. There's no question about it.
 

News Bot

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If RE2 is indeed a remake and not a remaster, it most definitely will cost millions. Just look at all the backgrounds and art alone from the original RE2. To remake all those into next gen assets that are rarely ever recycled throughout the game at a level of detail of a a next gen console will cost millions. There's no question about it.
Are you speaking from experience or just taking a random guess? The backgrounds have never cost so much. It's extremely easy for anyone with assets to recreate each of them. They've already recreated them in Darkside Chronicles and that game had a mediocre budget.
 

AAK

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DC is not a remake, an on-rail experience, and developed for Wii hardware, that is obviously going to be a fraction of the cost.