• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
  • The Politics forum has been nuked. Please do not bring political discussion to the rest of the site, or you will be removed. Thanks.

Reddit Compiles Definitive List of All NMS Missing Features/False Marketing +Sources

Sad Affleck

Member
Apr 5, 2016
2,914
0
395
I was worried that game developers would circle the wagons and defend Hello Games against consumer backlash. It's great to see that other developers will not hesitate to criticize them. In my experience most indie devs are honest with their audience, they respect the money they get from every sale and they don't deserve to be lumped together with snake oil salesmen like Murray.
 

thecouncil

Banned
Jan 26, 2008
10,492
1
1,205
Here we are trying to talk to Sean through Twitter when the last time someone of his status talked to the common man was through a burning bush.

So, has anyone come upon one of those lately?
 

androvsky

Member
Sep 19, 2007
7,939
1
895
Is it possible to fly in the atmosphere in your ship freely on any planet ?

If the answer is "no", I'm going to be even more disappointed :(

Yes, with caveats. You can't scrape the ground, but you can get down to maybe 100 feet or less unless you engage the automatic landing sequence. So no flying in tight canyons or under the odd land bridges that are scattered across many of the planets. When you get to the edge of the atmosphere, the ship will fight you as it's trying to either take you into space or back down to the planet; you still have control there, it's just annoying.
 

themadcowtipper

Smells faintly of rancid stilton.
Jun 7, 2004
8,318
0
0
Do people not realize when they use game development is hard and Sean was under incredible pressure it is a slap in the face to anyone who has a job in this thread.
Everyone job is hard and stressfull, but try using that as an excuse when you screwup.
 

OraleeWey

Member
Jul 23, 2014
3,809
0
450
USA
Yes, with caveats. You can't scrape the ground, but you can get down to maybe 100 feet or less unless you engage the automatic landing sequence. So no flying in tight canyons or under the odd land bridges that are scattered across many of the planets. When you get to the edge of the atmosphere, the ship will fight you as it's trying to either take you into space or back down to the planet; you still have control there, it's just annoying.

Ok, cool. I guess that's good enough.
 

Delusibeta

Banned
Feb 18, 2012
10,873
0
0
delusibeta.tumblr.com
Would I be correct in stating that the file miners of the PC version has yet to find evidence of multiplayer being worked on? If there's no evidence, considering there seemed to be a tonne of stuff left over, it would imply that it wasn't ever being worked on.
 

BluFish

Banned
Aug 29, 2014
43
0
0
Austin
So... can I get a refund on this game from sony? I played like 5 hours last wednesday and haven't touched it since.

You can try, but the reason you should give for the request should be because the game is a buggy, broken mess, not because you're disappointed.
 

TheCanisDirus

Member
Sep 10, 2013
5,470
0
0
Um... No it doesn't? Each planet is rendered by the engine uniquely, and the engine reads from the procedural generation algorithm's output. Each planet is built in a unique position and is unique. Just saying they're 'rearranged' is disingenuous.



Yes,
- the space between stars is skybox
- the sun is skybox
- planets don't move or rotate

Which is very disappointing, but none of these impact the gameplay. In gameplay terms, it's not huge at all. The only thing that matters to gameplay is being able to fly between planets naturally and warp to new systems. And you can do that. That will be why they cut the inter-system space, etc.

Yes that's correct. The Galaxy Map is just a visual representation of all integers 0 through 18,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 (30 zero's is correct i think lol) where upon selecting a star system the algorithms rearrange the play-space accordingly. I dont mean randomize... just rearrange... based upon their complex formulas. Sorry if that read the other way.

That method is smart on the developer side of things; however, it's extremely boring for the player who understands what's going on and how "boxed in" you really are. You can't just fly free roam. There isn't anything else to find that isn't a planet, resource (asteroids), or anomalies
(black holes and the Nada Polo station)
. There's no real discovery of a star system. You click warp and your surroundings are changed and you're right smack in the middle of another system. You know there is a space station, 1-6 planets, (not sure what the max system size is) a fake star and some asteroids. You know what you'll see each jump. If you could select warps based on light year jumps alone you could explore between systems and there could have been all sorts of really cool things to find. (no direct fault of the dev nothing like this was promised aside from the "fly between... you can but nobody has yet" comment)
 

themadcowtipper

Smells faintly of rancid stilton.
Jun 7, 2004
8,318
0
0
Would I be correct in stating that the file miners of the PC version has yet to find evidence of multiplayer being worked on? If there's no evidence, considering there seemed to be a tonne of stuff left over, it would imply that it wasn't ever being worked on.
It has been brought up multiple times some do not care and will go to any length to defend his lies...
Some of the excuses brought up in this thread.
Game development is hard and stress full
Consumers are entitled nothing
Consumers fault for not doing more research
Who cares the games is a great
Things removed were minor
He so humble and shy
The team is so small
Sony's fault
It could still be there just super rare(not so much after game was data mined.but is still brought up)
 

Pepboy

Member
May 19, 2006
1,903
15
985
Guys we are going about this all wrong.

Sean isn't a liar! You see in multiverse theory, we have an infinite number of universes, and in some of them, Sean released a game that did what he said it would. As luck has it, this universe isn't one of those. But is it fair to call him a liar when he created those missing features in an infinite number of other universes??? And in some universes, he didn't even promise the features in the first place!

No Man's Sky |OT3| One Man's Lies are Another Man's Compromise
 

Adam_Vania

Banned
Mar 19, 2016
2,264
1
0
Atlanta, GA
It has been brought up multiple times some do not care and will go to any length to defend his lies...
Some of the excuses brought up in this thread.
Game development is hard and stress full
Consumers are entitled nothing
Consumers fault for not doing more research
Who cares the games is a great
Things removed were minor
He so humble and shy
The team is so small
Sony's fault
It could still be there just super rare(not so much after game was data mined.but is still brought up)

also the game is about being a solo space explorer not capture the flag
 

Kaffeemann

Banned
Apr 27, 2015
882
0
330
Germany
Yes,
- the space between stars is skybox
- the sun is skybox
- planets don't move or rotate

Which is very disappointing, but none of these impact the gameplay. In gameplay terms, it's not huge at all. The only thing that matters to gameplay is being able to fly between planets naturally and warp to new systems. And you can do that. That will be why they cut the inter-system space, etc.

Of course the fake solar systems impact gameplay:

- you obviously can't watch the planets and moons orbit and spin
- temperatures/biomes of the planets can't depend on the distance to the sun
- length of day and night cycles can't depend on rotation/orbit
- you can't have asteroid belts
- you can't have comets
- you can't crash you ship into the sun

And all of this leads to boring and unrealistic solar systems that severely hurt immersion.
 

Jacksinthe

Banned
May 26, 2014
6,237
0
0
Chicago, IL
You guys should make a game sometime! Its completely normal to say "we want to do this, were planning to do this, this part is already working" and then not being able to deliver for a million reasons. Maybe the feature was too heavy on the performance, maybe you didnt have enough time, maybe making games is really hard.

Did Sean Murray sin for being too open with the community? Yes, he obviously did, this is why developers usually dont say shit to the fans, because this can happen. No game ever ships perfect, finished and with all the features it "promised" or planned to release with, it just doesnt happen.

Create a AAA game with a small team of 15 core people (300 being the norm) over the period of 4 years with incredible pressure from fans. Pressure that is even visually noticeable. Your company is on the line, your dreams of making the game you wanted to make as a kid are on the line and everytime you have a chance to talk to fans you cant help but let shit slip. You are a game maker, not a public speaker, hell, its noticeable everytime you have to make a presentation at E3 that youre not comfortable selling things to people. Its probably not lying, these are things you want to put in your game, or maybe the pressure is so fucking constant, the avalanche of tweets, comments, forum posts, interview questions so incredibly overwhelming that you say the wrong thing, or you say what will allow the onslaught of shit coming your way to stop, even if its for a week.

You can sit and say hes a liar, that he has nefarious intentions in order to sell a videogame ... and you may be right, but, to me, this is just the result of wanting to please people, so maybe its not a case of evil developer hiding shit and maybe its that making games is really, really hard and we could all use a bit more empathy when it comes to micromanaging everything a developer has ever said.
PS4 and PC developer here.

Scope this, bro:

Sean tweets that they added a search for other player function to encourage players meeting each other.

Our own gaffers packet sniff and find out absolutely zero player position data is ever sent or received by the game. Not only that, very LITTLE data is actually transmitted and sometimes zero data is transmitted for extreme lengths of time.

Knowing nothing about the game but a tweet about making it easier for players to find each other then seeing in real-time it doesn't exist - what is your conclusion?

As a dev, spare me the "shit changes, it's hard, you do it" smack talk. I know shit changes. What we are seeing with a data mine and packet sniff is there was a lot that not only doesn't exist, but never existed.

Chances are if something was pulled last minute and we have the E3 demo planet still in the compile, they wouldn't be able to completely delete MP systems without breaking the game somehow due to dependencies. At best if it was in development forever it would be disabled.

There is shit I am leaving in that I don't use because I don't feel like refactoring 10k lines of code that depend on certain methods or calls. That's what happens. We all know it happens. If we spent time removing things without a trace gamedev would take twice as long.

Now, you go make a game. I'm dying for some good old fashioned 3D platformer goodness. Chop chop!
 

aeolist

Banned
Oct 31, 2006
17,538
0
0
Of course the fake solar systems impact gameplay:

- you obviously can't watch the planets and moons orbit and spin
- temperatures/biomes of the planets can't depend on the distance to the sun
- length of day and night cycles can't depend on rotation/orbit
- you can't have asteroid belts
- you can't have comets
- you can't crash you ship into the sun

And all of this leads to boring and unrealistic solar systems that severely hurt immersion.

also you can't leave a star system unless you warp so there is no actual contiguous galaxy, just a series of discrete skyboxes each with a few static planets and a fake star.

that's incredibly disappointing to me and basically killed the last chance i might have ever bought this game even when it goes on sale.
 

CaptNink

Member
Jun 26, 2007
1,126
0
0
Do people not realize when they use game development is hard and Sean was under incredible pressure it is a slap in the face to anyone who has a job in this thread.
Everyone job is hard and stressfull, but try using that as an excuse when you screwup.

So true.
 

jman2050

Member
May 18, 2005
31,847
0
0
I think this is probably true.
I do question why people were apparently expecting a Star Citizen killer from the studio that made Joe Danger though.

How can you kill something that doesn't exist?

I mean for as much of a debacle as NMS is at least they published a (semi-)completed product, something that will probably never happen for Star Citizen.
 

Moreche

Member
Mar 28, 2015
1,002
3
0
The whole point of what Sean pushed with this game was scope. It was all about what his game will do that no other game has done before.
But now that the game is out, it's nothing more than a procedural generation tech demo wrapped up in a collectathon to jump from one area to another until you get to the end.
There is no explore, trade, fight and survive.
 

Akronis

Member
Aug 20, 2014
4,439
0
0
Chicago, IL
How can you kill something that doesn't exist?

I mean for as much of a debacle as NMS is at least they published a (semi-)completed product, something that will probably never happen for Star Citizen.

Please list me the completed games that have the scope of what Star Citizen is trying to achieve.

Also I can play Star Citizen right now, how does that not exist?
 

Moreche

Member
Mar 28, 2015
1,002
3
0
I'm hoping that another dev takes this tech and game idea and delivers what Sean said he would.
Surely that's going to happen considering it's obvious how many people want it.
 

inky

Member
Dec 20, 2010
23,490
0
0
(*< - - - - - -
steamcommunity.com
Do people not realize when they use game development is hard and Sean was under incredible pressure it is a slap in the face to anyone who has a job in this thread.
Everyone job is hard and stressfull, but try using that as an excuse when you screwup.

It's usually the same kind of people that will tell you to "vote with your wallet" instead of raising concerns in a public forum, but then will cry crocodile tears for every time you actually do. Seen it a million times in here and elsewhere, when someone posts how they are "glad" a certain game failed because it under-delivered or whatever, it somehow means you are happy some people might lose their jobs, as if all that wasn't part of capitalism in the first place.

Yes, forget about the game they promised you in exchange for your hard earned money (at AAA price too). They tried hard guys!
 

LordRaptor

Member
Aug 20, 2015
9,768
579
520
Please list me the completed games that have the scope of what Star Citizen is trying to achieve.

Also I can play Star Citizen right now, how does that not exist?

In fairness, the budget SC is working from.... phew.
I don't think anyone else could literally afford to compete there.
 

thecouncil

Banned
Jan 26, 2008
10,492
1
1,205
After this thread, I just wonder what the point of trying hard even is anymore? Why bother? Why even talk about your game at all? Just sit through interviews, slouched in your chair, answering ‘maybe’ to any question that comes down the line. That’s apparently the only way to do it “right” according to some. It’s sickening what you’re all doing to Sean. It’s literally putting Christ on a cross here. Barefoot and all.
 

AwShucks

Member
Jun 19, 2010
3,444
0
0
After this thread, I just wonder what the point of trying hard even is anymore? Why bother? Why even talk about your game at all? Just sit through interviews, slouched in your chair, answering ‘maybe’ to any question that comes down the line. That’s apparently the only way to do it “right” according to some. It’s sickening what you’re all doing to Sean. It’s literally putting Christ on a cross here. Barefoot and all.

Or just don't tout all these features 4 months before you ship that don't exist in your game.
 

superNESjoe

Member
Feb 16, 2014
5,317
0
0
After this thread, I just wonder what the point of trying hard even is anymore? Why bother? Why even talk about your game at all? Just sit through interviews, slouched in your chair, answering ‘maybe’ to any question that comes down the line. That’s apparently the only way to do it “right” according to some. It’s sickening what you’re all doing to Sean. It’s literally putting Christ on a cross here. Barefoot and all.

Are you serious?

Like...I'm not mad at Sean. I'm not enraged about the game, but this is cut and fucking dry.

1. The man said things about his game that were not true in an effort to drum up interest and sell that product to people.

2. The product he sold is not 100% what he advertised it as.

Are people being ridiculous about it? Yes. But that doesn't just include people mad at him. It includes people like you going so off the wall in an effort to defend a man who makes video games that they place him on a pedestal and literally compare him to the son of God, and then compare people upset by him lying to crucifixion.

Step the hell back and reorient yourself fella.
 

Moreche

Member
Mar 28, 2015
1,002
3
0
After this thread, I just wonder what the point of trying hard even is anymore? Why bother? Why even talk about your game at all? Just sit through interviews, slouched in your chair, answering ‘maybe’ to any question that comes down the line. That’s apparently the only way to do it “right” according to some. It’s sickening what you’re all doing to Sean. It’s literally putting Christ on a cross here. Barefoot and all.
Or you could maybe describe the features that are actually there in the game.
I still think this would have fared so much better released as a bare bones game but using the elite dangerous model.
Sell for £15 but with community involvement and feedback add the things you and the gamer want in the game.
 
Jan 12, 2007
61,079
1
0
Toronto, ON. Canada
I would like to point out a few things.

1. If you've never refunded anything from PSN, you will get a one time goodwill gesture of a refund. I exercised it on this game.

2. Thank you to this thread. It helped me realize how much of a lie this game is. I exercised the refund on the game and and now I'm waiting for better games to release where I can spend $80 on.

It's a $20 game with an $80 wrapper. Sorry, Hello Games.
 

flkraven

Member
Jul 26, 2013
8,211
1
620
Ontario, Canada
Or just don't tout all these features 4 months before you ship that don't exist in your game.

Are you serious?

Like...I'm not mad at Sean. I'm not enraged about the game, but this is cut and fucking dry.

1. The man said things about his game that were not true in an effort to drum up interest and sell that product to people.

2. The product he sold is not 100% what he advertised it as.

Are people being ridiculous about it? Yes. But that doesn't just include people mad at him. It includes people like you going so off the wall in an effort to defend a man who makes video games that they place him on a pedestal and literally compare him to the son of God, and then compare people upset by him lying to crucifixion.

Step the hell back and reorient yourself fella.

Or you could maybe describe the features that are actually there in the game.
I still think this would have fared so much better released as a bare bones game but using the elite dangerous model.
Sell for £15 but with community involvement and feedback add the things you and the gamer want in the game.


I come back everyday just to see this, lol.
 

N.Domixis

Banned
May 30, 2013
6,882
0
310
This is why you always wait for reviews. Never pre order or buy day 1 without doing research. I was very hyped for this game but I never fell for the marketing to buy blindly. Based on the sales they managed to trick lots of people.
 

thecouncil

Banned
Jan 26, 2008
10,492
1
1,205
If I were to develop a game and got as much crap as Sean has, I’d leave the industry. And that is a terrifying thought to me. That Sean might leave the game industry behind. Though I would find some solace knowing that he may find a new job where his creative mind isn't a "bad thing".

We need more people like Sean, not less. Everyone acts like he misled people on purpose but I can’t make it any more clear than this:

Sean is a big dreamer, not a silly schemer.

I worry what Sean is thinking right now and how he is handling all of this negativity. Because he is so shy and so kind, I fear it might be bad for his health. People need to stop trying to crucify him before he gets too sad.

I imagine him going home at night, and just crying to himself because he feels he didn’t try hard enough. It’s so upsetting. This is a man who, I assume, is trying to feed a family. How honorable is that in today's world? Even if that “family” is just his bank account, he deserves it all and more.
 

belvedere

Junior Butler
Jun 2, 2006
9,148
1
0
I'll save my rage about not being able to land on an asteroid or dock with freighters just a bit longer. The game just launched and it's been mentioned plenty of times that there will be significant, gameplay changing content updates.

If I'm going to buy into hyperbolic, speculative conspiracy theories about lies, it's only fair to assume the creators occasionally fulfill their evil promises too.
 

Philly40

Member
Sep 30, 2013
693
0
0
After this thread, I just wonder what the point of trying hard even is anymore? Why bother? Why even talk about your game at all? Just sit through interviews, slouched in your chair, answering ‘maybe’ to any question that comes down the line. That’s apparently the only way to do it “right” according to some. It’s sickening what you’re all doing to Sean. It’s literally putting Christ on a cross here. Barefoot and all.


Are you aware of the concept of taking a joke, slapping it about, pushing it into the corner of a room and stomping on its head?

Maybe your friends are goading you on a bit, but might there not come a point where you realise everyone else at the party starts to look at you with pity, if not disgust.
 

Dynamite Shikoku

Congratulations, you really deserve it!
Jun 10, 2004
14,891
3
0
The thought that in this game you are in a big box with a few planets and when you go to the next system the box just resets with different randomised planets is hilarious to me, after all the talk of this being some huge space adventure
 

krang

Member
Mar 24, 2015
6,259
0
290
The thought that in this game you are in a big box with a few planets and when you go to the next system the box just resets with different randomised planets is hilarious to me, after all the talk of this being some huge space adventure

Wow. Is that how it actually works? No contiguous travel between systems?
 

jax

Banned
Jun 2, 2013
7,968
0
0
I've been having a great time with the game. These little nit picks don't ruin the overall experience. Many of the features I'm sure will be added with patches eventually.

A lot of you need to chill.
 

mcz117chief

Member
Sep 29, 2013
12,995
5,134
920
30
Bohemia
I'm tempted, but It'd have GBA graphics and all music would be done in FastTracker 2.

Well....Noctis is kind of like No Man's Sky and it's free. All the systems are real, no skyboxes and there is an entire galaxy's worth of planets. Don't expect amazing and deep gameplay though, you basically just move around looking at planets. There is no goal or no enemies to fight. It is purely an exploration game.
 

Ferrio

Banned
Jun 7, 2004
56,365
1
0
I've been having a great time with the game. These little nit picks don't ruin the overall experience. Many of the features I'm sure will be added with patches eventually.

A lot of you need to chill.

PS4 version already runs a little rough, I don't think they could fit all this stuff in without tanking the performance hard.
 

cicatriz

Member
Jan 19, 2007
887
0
0
I've been having a great time with the game. These little nit picks don't ruin the overall experience. Many of the features I'm sure will be added with patches eventually.

A lot of you need to chill.

This. The game I wanted is the game I'm playing. I hope I never see the day where I lose sleep because the large fleet of freighters isn't as large as previously hinted at (maybe?).