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Drama Rumor Hardware Report: AMD expects “Big Navi” to compete with 3070, not 3080

Dec 14, 2008
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Well, there it is. This is only a rumor but it’s the first one so far about Big Navi. Let’s be absolutely honest, we still know next to nothing about Big Navi as AMD has been pretty mum but the fact that they had absolutely nothing to say about the RTX 3000 series announcement event other than “Ryzen CPU’s go well with them” is probably not a good sign. The word going around in the industry now is that AMD is quietly signaling to board partners to expect around 3070 performance from Big Navi, and that they are unable to use GDDR6X because that was a joint Nvidia-Micron project so Big Navi will be paired with just GDDR6.

To be quite frank, this was expected. AMD was already rumored to be planning on being around or better than 2080 Ti performance with Big Navi, and that’s exactly the performance Nvidia is promising from 3070. It looks like the 3080 will be untouchable, to say nothing of the monster that is the 3090. AMD fans should be used to no competition with Nvidia on the high end though, as the last AMD GPU which actually competed with Nvidia at the very top end was the 290X back in 2013.

The other issue is that AMD doesn’t seem to have dedicated tensor cores in RDNA2, instead relying on the compute cores to help enable ray tracing if reports of how PS5 and XSeX implement RT are to be believed. If so RT throughput will be significantly reduced compared to Ampere, and while Big Navi may be competitive with 3070 in traditional rasterization, it will likely be completely unable to keep up in ray tracing.

Also, no DLSS on Big Navi is going to make things very rough in games which have DLSS enabled but that’s another story for another day.
 
Sep 9, 2018
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3070 was tempting but I cant in good conscience pay more than £400 for a card with only 8gigs. I really hope AMD aren't complete cunts and do the same.

I'll never in a million years spend £600 for a card, so 3080 was never in the running for me anyway.

Used 2080ti tanking in price are gonna be difficult to ignore.
 

DonJuanSchlong

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3070 was tempting but I cant in good conscience pay more than £400 for a card with only 8gigs. I really hope AMD aren't complete cunts and do the same.

I'll never in a million years spend £600 for a card, so 3080 was never in the running for me anyway.

Used 2080ti tanking in price are gonna be difficult to ignore.
AMD usually offers 50% more ram than it's compete on average. Only problem is the performance just isn't there compared to Nvidia, especially in the upper end for enthusiasts.
 

Shmunter

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3070 was tempting but I cant in good conscience pay more than £400 for a card with only 8gigs. I really hope AMD aren't complete cunts and do the same.

I'll never in a million years spend £600 for a card, so 3080 was never in the running for me anyway.

Used 2080ti tanking in price are gonna be difficult to ignore.
3070 TI may be a product for you
 

wordslaughter

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All AMD GPU launches for years now have been a disappointment.

They always wind up being weaker and costing more than the rumors led us to believe. And in previous cases releasing much MUCH later than expected.

If it's only competing with a 3070 then I'm honestly curious if it's competing with Ampere at all. Is a 2080ti the most performance we can expect from Big Navi? Disappointing if true BUT at the right price may still be tempting for some.

Just as important as general performance is what kind of raytracing performance will Big Navi have? And what, if any, response do they have for DLSS 2.0+ ( my guess is nothing )
 
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Dec 14, 2008
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coretek accuracy is not that good. I avoid this channel now.
The rumor that AMD was targeting 2080 Ti class performance with Big Navi is many months old. I heard it early this year, before anyone knew anything about RTX 3000 series. If the newest rumor is also true, that AMD is planning to announce Big Navi on October 7th, then we’ll find out sooner rather than later. October 7th is of course after 3080 and 3090 have already launched, but not 3070. Hmm.
 
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Mhmmm 2077

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AMD usually offers 50% more ram than it's compete on average. Only problem is the performance just isn't there compared to Nvidia, especially in the upper end for enthusiasts.
But AMD has FineWine™️. My HD 7970 GHz (3GB VRAM) is WAY better than GTX 680 (4GB VRAM), which launched the same year
 
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DonJuanSchlong

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But AMD has FineWine™️. My HD 7970 GHz (3GB VRAM) is WAY better than GTX 680 (4GB VRAM), which launched the same year
Is that just in the one game, or the majority of games?

I'd compare newer stuff honestly. Can't take older gpu's to prove a point, as that was when AMD was once competitive in the gpu realm, many years ago.
 

Soltype

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I frickin knew it, I hope I'm wrong, im just glad Nvidia is not super crazy this year.
 

Silver Wattle

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There's several rumours concerning big Navi this is not the first.
One rumour has big Navi as 80 CU RDNA2, which puts it in the middle of the 3070 and the 3080, pair it with 16GB GDDR6 and launch it at $599 and we have some competition, the 3090 can be ignored, most sales are in the 3070-3080 price range.

Saying AMD isn't competitive is just pure ignorance.
 

Dargor

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That would be no surprise, amd has been running away scared from the high-end market for ages by now and its working for them, why would they take such a risk now?
 

Shmunter

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DonJuanSchlong

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Equal spec, there are DF comparison showing AMD outperforms Nvidia today. No horse in this race, just an observation and Q to raise
In a handful of titles I'm sure. But majority wise? I don't think so. Especially when it comes having all settings enabled and maxed out, like raytracing for instance. *Crickets*
 

BluRayHiDef

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There's several rumours concerning big Navi this is not the first.
One rumour has big Navi as 80 CU RDNA2, which puts it in the middle of the 3070 and the 3080, pair it with 16GB GDDR6 and launch it at $599 and we have some competition, the 3090 can be ignored, most sales are in the 3070-3080 price range.

Saying AMD isn't competitive is just pure ignorance.
20% market share is kinda sad considering how long AMD/ATI has been in the GPU market.
 
Dec 14, 2008
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20% market share is kinda sad considering how long AMD/ATI has been in the GPU market.
What's interesting is that 5700XT was actually pretty decent and sometimes close to a 2080 in benchmarks, but the absolutely memetastically awful drivers for the first 6-8 months of its life killed it stone dead in the eyes of PC gamers. The AMD subreddit was in a state of civil unrest full-on rioting 6 months after 5700XT's launch because the drivers were that completely broken. It remains to be seen if Big Navi will launch with drivers that work or not.
 

DonJuanSchlong

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What's interesting is that 5700XT was actually pretty decent and sometimes close to a 2080 in benchmarks, but the absolutely memetastically awful drivers for the first 6-8 months of its life killed it stone dead in the eyes of PC gamers. The AMD subreddit was in a state of civil unrest full-on rioting 6 months after 5700XT's launch because the drivers were that completely broken. It remains to be seen if Big Navi will launch with drivers that work or not.
I hope they make a 180 this time around. Their cpu team is on fire, while gou team is creating fires. Hopefully Nvidia fanned the flames and AMD comes out with the gloves on.
 
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TaySan

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AMD's bread and butter is the mid-range market. Nvidia has had such an advantage for so long and with how much they have in R&D i just don't see them ever having an answer to Nvidia's flagships, but then again they surprised me with Ryzen and I'm happy with my 3900x. I would love to be wrong of course.
 
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All AMD GPU launches for years now have been a disappointment.

They always wind up being weaker and costing more than the rumors led us to believe. And in previous cases releasing much MUCH later than expected.

If it's only competing with a 3070 then I'm honestly curious if it's competing with Ampere at all. Is a 2080ti the most performance we can expect from Big Navi? Disappointing if true BUT at the right price may still be tempting for some.

Just as important as general performance is what kind of raytracing performance will Big Navi have? And what, if any, response do they have for DLSS 2.0+ ( my guess is nothing )

I actually remember AdoredTV having a similar outlook on Navi months back and he postulated the exact same thing: Navi (and Big Navi) aiming for Turing, not Ampere, and that RDNA3 would probably be their Ampere-targeting GPU range (not exactly sure if he speculated that last part; that might also be speculation on my end admittedly).

IF this video's pointing to anything substantive, it'd affirm that earlier speculation from many months ago, but again, aiming for besting 2070/2080/2080 TI performance at the right price can work out extremely well and position AMD solidly in the PC space. We already know it is a big boon for PS5 and Series X (and Series S to a lesser extent) able to match that performance in console form factors at much lower TDPs, and things can only get better for AMD going forward IMHO.
 
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Boss Mog

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But AMD has FineWine™️. My HD 7970 GHz (3GB VRAM) is WAY better than GTX 680 (4GB VRAM), which launched the same year
That's because nVidia stops driver support for older generations so they tend to fall way behind after 6 years or so on the market.
 
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Well, if it's priced aggressively it could be a very big seller. The vast majority of gamers don't buy the high-end stuff anyway? I hope they can find a good balance between price, power, energy consumption and noise.
 

BluRayHiDef

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I actually remember AdoredTV having a similar outlook on Navi months back and he postulated the exact same thing: Navi (and Big Navi) aiming for Turing, not Ampere, and that RDNA3 would probably be their Ampere-targeting GPU range (not exactly sure if he speculated that last part; that might also be speculation on my end admittedly).

IF this video's pointing to anything substantive, it'd affirm that earlier speculation from many months ago, but again, aiming for besting 2070/2080/2080 TI performance at the right price can work out extremely well and position AMD solidly in the PC space. We already know it is a big boon for PS5 and Series X (and Series S to a lesser extent) able to match that performance in console form factors at much lower TDPs, and things can only get better for AMD going forward IMHO.
That's AMD's problem right there when it comes to making GPUs: they always target Nvidia's current generation of GPUs and wind up releasing their products way afterwards; hence, they're always behind. They need to target what they think will be the performance of Nvidia's next generation of GPUs.
 

Alexios

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I mean, if you don't want to pay that much for a 3080 or 3090, then I don't see why people treat this as so bad, most people don't buy the highest end and buying a worse deal at the mid-end just because that company has the highest end GPU, which you aren't buying, seems stupid.

Almost like that Leonidas troll pimping the most expensive highest end overkill watercooled Intel CPU as the king of gaming when Ryzen shits all over all the Intel products for price/performance ratio in pretty much every price tier regular consumers would actually care to go for.

We'll see if it's a good deal or not for the price range they actually go for and what models they compete against and how they fare overall (whether ray tracing performs on par with those models too or not for example) too. It's not very promising given recent history but who knows?
 
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DonJuanSchlong

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That's AMDs problem, not mine. After nVidia dropped the bomb, they have to be significantly cheaper or their products won't sell.
That's why I believe AMD will departure the PC gaming space, and be the defacto manufacturer for consoles and apple laptops, until Apple implements it's own in house graphics solution and go ARM all the way. Then again Nvidia might be buying out ARM. 2021 will be an interesting year.
 
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BluRayHiDef

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I mean, if you don't want to pay that much for a 3080 or 3090 then I don't see why people treat this as so bad, most people don't buy the highest end and buying a worse deal at the mid-end just because that company has the highest end GPU which you aren't buying seems silly.

We'll see if it's a good deal or not for the price range they actuall go for, and what models they actually compete against and how they fare too. It's not very promising given their recent history but who knows.
No alternative to DLSS, no dedicated ray tracing hardware (e.g. Tensor cores), no GDDR6X. They're done. I think that their market share will shrink.
 
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Alexios

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No alternative to DLSS, no dedicated ray tracing hardware (e.g. Tensor cores), no GDDR6X. They're done. I think that their market share will shrink.
AI enhanced image output is being worked on by a lot of different companies, even Facebook, for all we know that kind of upscaling method will be standard in game engines (or some other solution licensed by AMD to set at driver level or something) regardless of DLSS in a few years. I don't care about shares, just what I said.

I get the best deal for my money, my last GPU was AMD (7970), my current Nvidia (1080 but with these crazy prices I don't see me going for that tier this time, if I even upgrade any time soon, maybe go for a 5060 down the line). What the highest end is doesn't really matter to me, I'm not gonna invest $1500 in these things.

I didn't say they're gonna compete in any price tier either, it was all hypothetical. Presumably they won't offer doa products that are more expensive and less capable than that price tier's Nvidia equivalent. I don't think they've ever done that even, but I guess there's a first time for everything. Again, we'll just have to see.
 
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DonJuanSchlong

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People need to get off their amd high horse if they think any decade soon they will compete with Nvidia
Hate to agree with you, but I wholeheartedly agree. They would have impressive RT performance on consoles otherwise. No answer to DLSS of yet. I'm holding my breath, but I definitely have my doubts. Especially if history repeats itself. On the other hand, Intel is the equivalent of AMD gpu's when it comes to CPU's lately.
 
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Xyphie

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It should be faster than a RTX 3070, at least in rasterization. Just ballparking performance from estimated paper specs (80CU, 384-bit GDDR6@672-760GB/s) it's should be somewhere around RX 5700 XT +50-75%.
 
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HoodWinked

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It's crazy if you consider the pricing on the new cards how insane must have the margins on the current cards must have been.