Rise of the Tomb Raider: Preview and Technical Analysis (NX Gamer)

Crossing Eden

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Javin98

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Yea, how exactly does pixel counting work? Do you feed a computer program a direct capture and it tells you how many pixels it sees?
I personally have no idea, but it looks like several people already replied to your post.

You're damn right I don't. I trust my own eyes. I read these to determine if there's major framerate issues before I buy a game. Helps me decide if I should wait for patches, buy now, or pass completely.
That's not the point. The point is both DF and NXGamer get stuff wrong from time to time.
 

AP90

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Its prob going to be around 1334x1080, which is equivalent to 900p in pixels but looks better when it gets scaled up to 1920x1080.


We will just have to wait and see. I'd honestly prefer that for smoother and better fps vs 1920x1080 with issues.
 

thelastword

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the irony of you posting this when you literally just jumped out of the wings to drag DF in a thread that has nothing to do with them
Only because Nxgamer was right, he did not say something wrong, so Kinsella was wrong to accuse him with his; "a guy who has gotten resolution wrong in the past". I find it weird that he would accuse NX of such, when the only other viable faceoff outlet is the one that's always wrong (day in and day out) and missing facts, it was just a bit glaring and hypocritical in light of that.

Nice preview by NXgamer by the way, I was only able to watch it last night, snow tech is nice, nice improvements on graphics and animations.
 

dragonelite

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Yea, how exactly does pixel counting work? Do you feed a computer program a direct capture and it tells you how many pixels it sees?
Look for a diagonal line and count the vertical and horizontal steps is what im told.
Probably based on the Bresenham algorithm used in line rendering.
 

nelsonroyale

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It looks good visually. Definitely better than the last one visually, which is expected. I might pick it up down the road. Thought the last one was solid.
 

SenjutsuSage

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I'm sorry, but when I watched the conference, videos of this game it was obviously 1080p. I've got this video on my big TV now, and it's obvious.

So based on that, taking anything this guy says with a grain of salt.
I was at the conference right in the middle, second row (generally close enough to quickly bear hug phil spencer before anyone would be able to stop me), and I felt that the screen they used didn't do Tomb Raider's visuals any justice. When I saw Tomb Raider later at E3 I felt it looked significantly more impressive than when I saw it in action at the MS conference. Or maybe it was just that I was way too damn close to the screen they were using, but even people further back had the same complaint about the screen used, so I don't think it was just me.
 

etta

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I was at the conference right in the middle, second row (generally close enough to quickly bear hug phil spencer before anyone would be able to stop me), and I felt that the screen they used didn't do Tomb Raider's visuals any justice. When I saw Tomb Raider later at E3 I felt it looked significantly more impressive than when I saw it in action at the MS conference. Or maybe it was just that I was way too damn close to the screen they were using, but even people further back had the same complaint about the screen used, so I don't think it was just me.
Do they use standard cinema projectors? I doubt Xbox would cheap out on the screen used, unless they have different technology than theaters, that would have different results.
 

SenjutsuSage

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Do they use standard cinema projectors? I doubt Xbox would cheap out on the screen used, unless they have different technology than theaters, that would have different results.
It didn't strike me as some projector, but just a really damn big screen that possibly wasn't that good at presenting the footage in proper HD quality, and so the results weren't exactly as good as they could have been. I saw the exact same but even worse issue in the Arkham Knight section of E3. That screen they were using to showcase Arkham Knight made it look last gen as hell, but we all know it to be an incredible looking game. In fact, it may not have even been a screen for arkham knight, but just a really horrible projector. I mean, it was horrible.

Now the screen that Capcom used to show off the street fighter competition they were holding at their booth was fantastic. The screens that EA were using to showcase their games at their booth were similarly amazing, if not much better. And the screens that were playing game loops at the Microsoft booth were also of significantly better quality than what was present at the MS conference. Everybody that saw that Tomb Raider loop off to the side while waiting on line to play Halo 5 warzone mp were amazed at how good Tomb Raider looked in comparison to what was shown at the conference.
 

Dramos

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With almost 4 months before release...it still on 900p...and Uncharted 4 still 8 months away already hit 1080p with much greater graphic and physic...
Not all game developers are called Naughty Dog. Besides, 900p or 1080p both games look amazing.
 

chromatic9

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Well, engines get better, things become more efficiently done with maturity. Remember how taxing tressfx was at first, here it is now on the beard of Tenzin (Jonah) and on animals. TRDE was capped at 30fps on XB1 at 1080p for gameplay, same engine here...scaling it back to 900p they can leave it unlocked just like the PS4 version of TRDE, they won't get a rock solid 60fps, but I really don't think they will want to do 720p 60fps for PR purposes at this point. It's either 900p unlocked or 1080 30fps.


He never made a definitive statement, he said it was in the ball park, and he was right. The DF guy for F1 however said that it was 900p on the XB1 and went on a whole apologist tirade about how he doesn't see much difference between 1080p on PS4 and the 900p which he thought the XB1 version was running at, typical really.....even if it was truly (900p), he would have said the same thing in typical DF fashion... but yeah, the resolution was higher than 900p and therefore crisper as per evidence.....the writer was so quick to to minimize the difference between 900p and 1080p that he didn't even bother to think that it was running at a higher resolution on XB1. Hook line and sinker....

As per MKX, it's 1344*1080 on XB1, that's pretty much par with 900p pixel wise, so NXgamer was right in his assumption, his eyes are definitely sharper and better than the F1 DF guy. There are only 11,520 pixels between 1344*1080 and 1600*900. On the flipside there's a 115,200 pixel difference between 900p and 1440*1080p. One is much larger and should more of a noticeable difference.

Somehow, I suspect some people are just waiting in the wings to tear NXgamer a new piehole if he gets a stat wrong, quite funny tbh.
Thing is, if its native vertically, its obvious that it's native. Saying the pixel count is roughly similar whether its 1600x 900 or 1344x1080 doesn't make you look good or have a good eye. Only thing a similar pixel count determines is the rendering is at a similar cost.

When its 1600x900 it's upscaled both directions, when it's 1344x1080, only is it horizontally upscaled.

Regarding Rise of the Tomb Raider, the gamersyde E3 gameplay video is 1920x1080 counting the pixels. Not sure what NXgamer is looking at or referencing. One thing is for sure, its definitely 1080 vertically, and not as low as 1344 or 1440 horizontally. I can't rule out some funky small upscale horizontally slightly under 1920 like 17/18xx. I couldn't get a good long sample.

Also this doesn't mean its running on Xbox, could be their PC or right now its 1920x1080 on Xbox but who knows upon launch.
 

tbd

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Can't be worse than the first one, I guess. However, snow tracks and tracks getting covered up by fresh snow was already done by PS2 era games.
 

etta

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Can't be worse than the first one, I guess. However, snow tracks and tracks getting covered up by fresh snow was already done by PS2 era games.
But have all games with snow since the PS2 era done this? Because I can only thing of a few, such as Uncharted and Lost Planet. And neither of those had this much detail in the deformation. What other games did this calculation?
 

Inuhanyou

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True but the snow tracks still look better than in any other game that I've seen.
Dead or Alive 3 and DOA2U still have the GOAT snow deformation physics :p


Also have to commend Crystal Dynamics on their evolved TressFX, looks a world way from the rough PC original and even Tress FX 2.0 for the PS4/XB1 remaster.
 

Crossing Eden

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Can't be worse than the first one, I guess. However, snow tracks and tracks getting covered up by fresh snow was already done by PS2 era games.


^
Please point me to the ps2 game that was doing anything even remotely close to the above. And presumably that's not even how good it will look in the final game when they polish it up.
 

etta

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^
Please point me to the ps2 game that was doing anything even remotely close to the above. And presumably that's not even how good it will look in the final game when they polish it up.
Psh, this is clearly better.
 

LoveCake

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That snow looks great! can you make snowballs to use as an distraction option though?

I'm not too bothered about this being on the X1 first, i can play this & then play Uncharted 4 when it comes out later, that being said, i hope they can bring this up-to 1080p in optimisation though.

I wasn't that keen on the re-boot game as i preferred the classic games with all the exploring, now i know Indiana was first but Lara in a way created this genera & then Uncharted borrowed from it & then in turn Lara borrowed from Uncharted & we ended up with similar games but one where the player is a woman & the other is a man.

OT i know, just a thought i have just had, i wonder if there will ever be a crossover where you play as both Lara & Nathan either working together or to outdo each other to capture the treasure.
 

Shpeshal Ed

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Incredibly excited for this game. Resolution be damned. My favourite action series now. 2013 is a special game.
 

GnawtyDog

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Did tbd claim that PS2 era games with snow deformation effects were as good looking as Rise of the Tomb Raider's in 2015? NO.


I have yet to see a WOW moment for this game in terms of tech. It's obviously not a last-gen game but that's about it. Hopefully new footage at Gamescom has more to show. Also not sure why people brought U4 comments to this thread... just asking for a ban. It's not like it doesn't happen in Uncharted threads either......should be reported more.
 

etta

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Did tbd claim that PS2 era games with snow deformation effects were as good looking as Rise of the Tomb Raider's in 2015? NO.

I have yet to see a WOW moment for this game in terms of tech. It's obviously not a last-gen game but that's about it. Hopefully new footage at Gamescom has more to show. Also not sure why people brought U4 comments to this thread... just asking for a ban. It's not like it doesn't happen in Uncharted threads......should be reported more.
Then why did they bring up the point? They may as well have said "PS2 games had snow, PS2 games had water".

I'm sure Spencer and Co. saw the luke warm reactions to the E3 demo, and how more people liked that second footage shown, so they will probably bring some footage that matches that excitement level to show at Gamescom, if they bring up ROTR at all. I think it's more likely for them to just say TR:DE available for Games with Gold for September to get people hyped for the new one. Though, I am not sure, do statistics say that giving the prequel with GWG/PS+ increases the hype level for the new game? Or maybe it will deter people from getting the new one since they just got their Tomb Raider fix. Hmmm
 

GnawtyDog

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Then why did they bring up the point? They may as well have said "PS2 games had snow, PS2 games had water".
I'm sure Spencer and Co. saw the luke warm reactions to the E3 demo, and how more people liked that second footage shown, so they will probably bring some footage that matches that excitement level.
I think the lighting under different conditions and foliage will make the game shine more. Saw a bit of that in the sizzle-reel footage...the snowy, greyish/brownish colors are just a turn off. I mean they have their place for the setting BUT... it's visually pleasing to get something else more colorful, more vibrant and diverse.

As for why tbd bringing it up? I don't know, perhaps he wasn't impressed by its inclusion or use as much as others? What's clear is that he didn't claim what some posters are kinda baiting him to argue.
 

Synth

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I think the lighting under different conditions and foliage will make the game shine more. Saw a bit of that in the sizzle-reel footage...

As for why bringing it up? I don't know, perhaps he wasn't impressed by its inclusion or use as much as others? What's clear is that he didn't claim what some posters are kinda baiting him to argue.
In my case, I was just poking fun. My pic is basically just to say what etta stated above. So a game has had some implmentation of a feature in the past? How's that worth mentioning. We've had an approximation of pretty much every environmental effect imaginable in some form on older hardware... it doesn't have any meaningful bearing on a game today.

If you're not impressed with the effect, then just say that. Nobody took issue with jelly's post criticizing the effect, because he didn't dress it up as some strange multiple generations passed comparison. Saying what essentially reads as "I've seen a PS2 do that" is obviously not likely to get the best reception.
 

SURGEdude

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Looks great.

Only Xbox One exclusive released this year that i'm dying to play.
Me too. Well except Rare Replay of course. Looks great and there is a decent chance I might break my no-preorder rule for it. Possibly the game I'm most hyped from this fall unless ND knocks the Nathan Drake collection out of the park.
 

Synth

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No ps2 game comes close. UC2 on PS3 did look comparable and in many ways looked better in my opinion https://youtu.be/LR0yNtOy_ug?t=276
Whilst that does look pretty good (I'd agree that artistically it looks nicer than the snow trails in the Tomb Raider gif), the first thing I noticed within seconds of seeing it was...
...but with a shorter tail.

Meanwhile all the other trails not created by the player or NPC dynamically were clearly static and remained forever.
 

El-Pistolero

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Looks beautiful. I honestly did not enjoy the past entry that much, but I could be at fault, since I abandoned my play session after a couple of hours...
 

Percy

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^
Please point me to the ps2 game that was doing anything even remotely close to the above. And presumably that's not even how good it will look in the final game when they polish it up.
Looks like something from Assassin's Creed 3 tbh. That is not a compliment.

This game looks pretty much identical to the last one to me. Also not a compliment.
 

Synth

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Looks like something from Assassin's Creed 3 tbh. That is not a compliment.

This game looks pretty much identical to the last one to me. Also not a compliment.
I'm glad you clarified that these two statements weren't compliments... would have never been able to be sure otherwise.
 

GnawtyDog

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In my case, I was just poking fun. My pic is basically just to say what etta stated above. So a game has had some implmentation of a feature in the past? How's that worth mentioning. We've had an approximation of pretty much every environmental effect imaginable in some form on older hardware... it doesn't have any meaningful bearing on a game today.

If you're not impressed with the effect, then just say that. Nobody took issue with jelly's post criticizing the effect, because he didn't dress it up as some strange multiple generations passed comparison. Saying what essentially reads as "I've seen a PS2 do that" is obviously not likely to get the best reception.
It got no "bad", "suspicious" reception from me. The only thing that got a reception from me was the clear bait - because the disconnect was clear. I guess given the tension in this thread, coupled with the bannings..... some posters are naturally on edge....but that's about it.
 

alexbull_uk

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No ps2 game comes close. UC2 on PS3 did look comparable and in many ways looked better in my opinion https://youtu.be/LR0yNtOy_ug?t=276
That's a good last-gen implementation, but the snow there isn't being deformed. It looks like it's just having another mesh merged on top of it, which then disappears very quickly. It also only appears where Drake's feet are. When he rolled in it, it doesn't deform around his body.
 

Bgamer90

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I'm glad you clarified that these two statements weren't compliments... would have never been able to be sure otherwise.
Haha -- these Tomb Raider threads remain hilarious. The "covered up" console war criticism/concern is so obvious.
 

Synth

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It got no "bad", "suspicious" reception from me. The only thing it got a reception from me was the clear bait - because the disconnect was clear. I guess given the tension in this thread, coupled with the bannings..... some posters are naturally on edge....but that's about it.
*looks around*... holy shit, there's dead bodies everywhere, and I didn't even notice!

Well, I guess not everything gets a response from everyone (that would probably make discussion here difficult anyhow). I suppose "show me a PS2 game looking similar" is a bit direct... but the response would be basically as simple as the one you yourself provided, "I didn't say better".. which at worst would have lead to etta's followup of "then why even bring that up?". Doesn't seem to harmful to try and have someone qualify a statement imo.
 

Omnistalgic

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Haha -- these Tomb Raider threads remain hilarious. The "covered up" console war criticism/concern is so obvious.
come on man...not everything is some console war nonsense, this game is eventually coming to other platforms right?

The debut was pretty weak, simple as that. Mind you, I'm not saying there isn't some b/s going on, but it wasn't one of the more graphically impressive demos after seeing other titles around the same genre, and not even talking about the obvious comparisons to UC4.

The PS2 level graphics posts yeah, nonsense...but for me, it didn't do a lot.