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Sega announces extraordinary loss of 7.1 bn yen, layoffs, restructures, cancels games

Alex

Member
Not only are we still not getting Valkyria 3, they're going to go back in time and unlocalize the first two.
 

Truth101

Banned
if they are dying off funding games for this gen then funding games for a more powerful console even if only slightly will still kill them.

I meant compared to the PS4/720.

I doubt dev costs will balloon for the Wii U as it will probably have a lot of multi-platform titles with the PS3/360.

This is how I see it.

PS3/360/Wii U -- multi-platform releases (lower dev cost)
PS4/720/Wii U -- multi-platform releases (higher dev cost)

Though I don't see why publishers are so intent to push the limits for graphics. It's a huge money sink that isn't working out for them...
 

Suairyu

Banned
Honestly, the bulk of SEGA's pedigree has always been genre-leading arcade games with perfect controls and mechanics. They need to exploit XBLA/PSN/Steam much, much better than they have been with original content.
 

Mr Nash

square pies = communism
I eagerly anticipate Total Sonic: Alien Manager. It will be the defining game of a generation.
 

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
don't think that Ubi cares about though.

Right, but my point is, the hugest budget games get the sales in the retail market usually, so that's how we land where we are.

A console generation doesn't matter that much when we can seemingly push up budgets indefinitely with what we have.
 

Truth101

Banned
Because making games on the same budgets or slightly higher than what is currently killing them will help?

If, in 2013, Japan still can't make videogames that don't look like they're from PC era 2003 without spending their entire bank account, there needs to be some serious shakeups in how they are running the industry over there. We've been talking about how Japan was caught with their pants down in technology because they never had the PC to transition them to higher than 480p detailed gaming, but it's been SIX YEARS now. They can't keep being clusterfucked on every major project for the next 3 decades. At some point something needs to change and it's not "let's just makes all games in 320p for the rest of our lives because we are giving up on improving as programmers".

You say that as if the increased dev costs of this gen haven't hurt western studios either, get real.
 

FGMPR

Banned
Time to increase development costs with crazy new hardware I'd say.

What I don't get is how do all these tiny indie PC games like Hard Reset/Cryostasis/Dear Esther/ the upcoming Legend of Grimrock all look so great on shoestring budgets? three of the four games I mentioned were even built on their own engine. If a 4 man team can pull out something like 'Grimrock', I don't understand why costs next gen need to take a significant leap forward. Hell, today's console games with 8x AA at 1080p running at 60fps running on PC look close enough to what I'd expect out of next gen. Where do these rising costs fit in to the equation?

edit: I guess Cryostasis wasn't an indie game, but I'm the budget was still miniscule.
 

Zen

Banned
Budgets have went soaring despite the consoles staying static since 2005 though.

The issue is consumer expectations keep raising, and they continue to polarize around the biggest titles.

When Assassin's Creed 3 has over twice the budget of any other game in Ubisoft history, the static hardware isn't really doing anything to stop budget inflation.

I think this is an inevitable result of having completely static hardware specs. Because you're constantly stuck with that 512, the budgets have been getting higher and higher to find ways to make it continually more impressive. I think a lot of the problems with rising budgets wouldn't have happened if we'd gotten semi frequent hardware refreshes to placate the demand for more and more impressive experiences. It wouldn't make the rising budgets go away completely, but it would help.

Right, but my point is, the hugest budget games get the sales in the retail market usually, so that's how we land where we are.

A console generation doesn't matter that much when we can seemingly push up budgets indefinitely with what we have.

Apparently spending 100 million on advertising is somewhat of a magic bullet, as long as the game itself is top quality.
 

Dark Schala

Eloquent Princess
What a shame. I feel like SEGA's one of the few companies that's satisfied me this gen.

I eagerly anticipate Total Sonic: Alien Manager. It will be the defining game of a generation.
Almost sounds like a Chao Garden portable game a la Pokemon or MMO.
 

tearsofash

Member
image.php


Not only are we still not getting Valkyria 3, they're going to go back in time and unlocalize the first two.

Couldn't help it. One of those times where a post reads just like the actor's voice.

Also, how are the Valkyria Chronicles sequels? I really enjoyed the world and the story, but I don't see how sequels could get placed in it.
 

Endo Punk

Member
If there is one Japanese company that should succeed it's SEGA. I mean Valkyria Chronicles, VF5, Yakuza series, amazing DD ports like Sonic CD and Dayatona, plus publishing Bayonetta, Vanquish..... Seriously SEGA has delivered a lot more quality content then Konami, Capcom or SE. God if only I was a millionaire I would totally help them out :(
 

Let me in

Member
How in the hell did they lose almost 90 million dollars? Sales to consumers are down but their pachinko business is doing just fine. How?

Did anyone notice the filename...
20120330sega_kaikaku_e_final.pdf

All according to...urgggh.... so close
 
I meant compared to the PS4/720.

I doubt dev costs will balloon for the Wii U as it will probably have a lot of multi-platform titles with the PS3/360.

This is how I see it.

PS3/360/Wii U -- multi-platform releases (lower dev cost)
PS4/720/Wii U -- multi-platform releases (higher dev cost)

Though I don't see why publishers are so intent to push the limits for graphics. It's a huge money sink that isn't working out for them...

Yes but this is a thread about a company having trouble this gen and companies not coping, so even the WiiU will compound this if that is your thinking.............
 

Busty

Banned
Eeeeep. Given that we're entering that time of year for financial announcements I have a feeling that we might have a tough couple of weeks ahead of us.

But mismanagement is mismanagement, at this point I'm expecting SEGA to announce a deal to develop apps exclusively for Blackberry.

When Assassin's Creed 3 has over twice the budget of any other game in Ubisoft history, the static hardware isn't really doing anything to stop budget inflation.

WHAT?!
 

IrishNinja

Member
Welp, there go any dreams of Yakuza 5 getting localized.

people...you've got to stop saying this. you've just got to.

Out of all these? MS would be my preferred.

MS already got what it wanted by eating sega.net and a handful of exclusives early on last gen, though.

since you're around: Niro, what moves do you think specifically caused this incredible loss? i'm having a hard time putting the pieces together.
 

Haunted

Member
Sega has been an underrated publisher this generation.


That they have to "retreat" to their safest franchises is a real pity. :/
 

Alex

Member
image.php




Couldn't help it. One of those times where a post reads just like the actor's voice.

Also, how are the Valkyria Chronicles sequels? I really enjoyed the world and the story, but I don't see how sequels could get placed in it.

Second one plays very well, despite them still not fixing class balance issues but it went from endearing goofy to just goofy.

Heard the third one fixes the issues with tone, but I never saw the point of studying a game they tell us we can't have so that's all I've ever heard about it.
 

Busty

Banned
Seriously SEGA has delivered a lot more quality content then Konami, Capcom or SE. God if only I was a millionaire I would totally help them out :(

Given the eye watering costs of developing console titles these days I'm not sure just how much 'help' even a millionaire could be to them..... unless of course you're going to pick them up and drive them places in your fancy car.







....., j/k mang.
 

zoukka

Member
What I don't get is how do all these tiny indie PC games like Hard Reset/Cryostasis/Dear Esther/ the upcoming Legend of Grimrock all look so great on shoestring budgets? three of the four games I mentioned were even built on their own engine. If a 4 man team can pull out something like 'Grimrock', I don't understand why costs next gen need to take a significant leap forward. Hell, today's console games with 8x AA at 1080p running at 60fps running on PC look close enough to what I'd expect out of next gen. Where do these rising costs fit in to the equation?

edit: I guess Cryostasis wasn't an indie game, but I'm the budget was still miniscule.

Those games aren't comparable to proper AA(A) games at all. The shiny graphics might fool you.

They also don't pour tens of millions into marketing and are surely much more efficient in working and costs because of the small dedicated teams.
 

Nirolak

Mrgrgr

Yep: http://www.ubisoftgroup.com/en-US/press/detail.aspx?cid=tcm:99-40629-16&ctid=tcm:95-27313-32

Ubisoft said:
The largest project in Ubisoft’s history also introduces a new hero for the ages.

With a development cycle of over three years and twice the production capacity of any previous Ubisoft game, Assassin’s Creed III is set to release on the Xbox 360® video game and entertainment system from Microsoft, PlayStation®3 computer entertainment system, Windows PC and is also in development for Wii U™ from Nintendo. Assassin’s Creed III is developed by Ubisoft Montreal in collaboration with six other Ubisoft studios.

---

since you're around: Niro, what moves do you think specifically caused this incredible loss? i'm having a hard time putting the pieces together.

For Sega? Most of it is a $4.9 billion yen writedown of projected revenue/profits from their canceled games.

It's worth noting that this is only a $96 million loss total and ~$60 million is from that writedown mentioned at the bottom.
 

Beth Cyra

Member
Agreed.

MS exclusive Sonic, Bayonetta, Shenmue, and Total War if it ever comes to consoles would be butter.

LOL at the very idea that Micro would keep or fund these two given how they have been structuring and killing off studios and franchises.
 
Terrible news. I frequently rip off Sega for their neglect of the West vis localizations and content, but they still produce fantastic games. At least their core franchises and a few others (Phantasy Star etc) are safe.

Really??there's a case called RARE and yeah i dont like MS...

How to completely invalidate your argument.
 

Let me in

Member
Agreed.

MS exclusive Sonic, Bayonetta, Shenmue, and Total War if it ever comes to consoles would be butter.
They'd have Sonic Kinect out in two weeks! No thanks -- perhaps a publishing house that would know how to use them. I'd realistically only trust Nintendo or Sony (forget Ubi, EA or Acti. Sega would be gutted in a week) to get it right, but I doubt they'd do it if the opportunity arose.
 

Mandoric

Banned
Because making games on the same budgets or slightly higher than what is currently killing them will help?

If, in 2013, Japan still can't make videogames that don't look like they're from PC era 2003 without spending their entire bank account, there needs to be some serious shakeups in how they are running the industry over there. We've been talking about how Japan was caught with their pants down in technology because they never had the PC to transition them to higher than 480p detailed gaming, but it's been SIX YEARS now. They can't keep being clusterfucked on every major project for the next 3 decades. At some point something needs to change and it's not "let's just makes all games in 320p for the rest of our lives because we are giving up on improving as programmers".

That's only true to a degree, though. We're getting to the point where only a few key companies (platform holders, Epic, EA, Activision, Zenimax, S-E) can keep up with "top-tier" tech, presentation, and most importantly marketing without betting the whole company or outsourcing everything to eastern Europe/China. It mainly looks like a Japanese problem because their famous names haven't been completely gobbled up by one or another behemoth.

Sega's massive loss that just sent the hatchetman through the development department is somewhere around the TV buy alone for a single AAA title. There's no competing with that.

I think people are misreading the headline, too. "Extraordinary" loss means "one-time event", not "holy shit it's big".
 
Oh Sega ? Someone cares about them in 2012 ?

Sorry but I don't - I was a huge fan of them up to 2010 but considering they effectively killed Valkyria Chronicles, canned Aliens RPG and dropped Yakuza for Binary Domain they only game series they have I care about if Total War.

After they release STW2 expansion and those Skies of Arcadia + Shenmue HD ports they can go and die...
 
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