I feel pretty much the same way when I read statements like this. It really frustrates me to no end to see people actively think in terms like this.
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SM3DW sells 107k in Japan, lowest 3D Mario debut ever
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I feel pretty much the same way when I read statements like this. It really frustrates me to no end to see people actively think in terms like this.
Wickerbasket
Member
Is it really hypocrisy though? Maybe he just believes the Vita is a well designed product, whereas the Wii U isn't. There's a number of reasons any particular product fails, and they're argued about continuously.
The only thing that can't really be argued about is how poorly both are selling right now.
Herb Alpert
Banned
WiiU is a flawed product. Even Mario (and apparently a critically acclaimed one) is not able to sell on it. Not to speak about moving systems. They made a mistake with WiiU. Well, a thousand mistakes. At best, it will reach gamecube level. IMO it won't, and will fall far from it. It will become toxic to most franchises. The lowest Mario Kart, the lowest Smash bros, and so son.
But Nintendo as a company is not doomed. Now we will see what their strategy will be.
And I am not sure we will like it... I hope I'm wrong.
But Nintendo as a company is not doomed. Now we will see what their strategy will be.
And I am not sure we will like it... I hope I'm wrong.
It's one thing to argue the merits and failings of hardware. It's another to actively wish for one to fail while heralding the other despite both suffering from the same problems.
Sho_Nuff82
Member
Halo and Gears fans would abandon MS in droves if they sandbagged those franchises with hardware that far behind. The sports/fps/racer crowds would 100% go to Sony. (Moreso then they already have at launch).
The biggest disservice the Wii taught Nintendo was that "graphics don't matter". Graphics only don't matter when they are "good enough", like PS2 vs Xbox or consoles versus PC (or, at least at launch, PS4 vs Xbone). If your console can't even wrap its head around modern game engines, of course graphics matter then. The only reason the Wii was able to overcome a complete lack of support for things like UE3 was because motion and rhythm gaming exploded simultaneously, and designing games that utilized those features was easy and cheap for both Nintendo and other publishers. After that craze subsided/was made redundant by Kinect/Move, Wii sales cratered.
No, it's completely right.
Best selling console games by week
MC 46: 190k
MC 45: 120k
MC 44: 52k
MC 43: 83k
MC 42: 88k
MC 41: 360k (GTA)
MC 40: 24k
MC 39: 80k
The weekly numbers for console game sales are not high.
Hazelhurst
Member
It will have legs.
It's too bad that you can't download Wii U consoles...then they may have sold more.
But i think it's safe to assume that 3D World sold at least 500K with digital sales.
Right?
I think there are two reasons why the game underperformed:
1. Nintendo has released at least one (2 last year) mainline Mario game (2D or 3D) for every year since NSMB Wii in 2009. Iwata needs to stop milking the shit out of their brand. Aside from maybe another 3D Mario on Wii U, let the brand rest a few years.
2. Getting someone to impulse buy a 3DS is much easier than a Wii U not only because hardware and software is much cheaper for handhelds, but also because it sounds like that is the gaming platform of choice in Japan.
1. Nintendo has released at least one (2 last year) mainline Mario game (2D or 3D) for every year since NSMB Wii in 2009. Iwata needs to stop milking the shit out of their brand. Aside from maybe another 3D Mario on Wii U, let the brand rest a few years.
2. Getting someone to impulse buy a 3DS is much easier than a Wii U not only because hardware and software is much cheaper for handhelds, but also because it sounds like that is the gaming platform of choice in Japan.
Randolph Freelander
Member
There's a reason it has a way lower install base than most of those systems (some were at launch, where Wii U would have the advantage). It's because the platform and the games do not make anyone want to buy those systems, Mario 3D World included. To drive that point home, look at the MC thread and see only the slight uptick in Wii U consoles sold this week.
People want to say it should sell lower because the hardware is lower, but it's the unappealing games and hardware that's led it to that situation in the first place. If there's a comeback, it has to start somewhere. From what we can see in Japan, it's not starting here.
They aren't suffering from the same problems, though. They're both failing, but the reasons why are completely different.
Steve Youngblood
Member
OK, I'm really tired of seeing you do this, so I'm going to call it out in the hopes that others might also see this. The post you're quoting? It was from several pages ago. Let's agree that it's a bad post. Wouldn't it be better for the flow of the conversation to just let it sink into oblivion as opposed to drawing more attention to it and offering nothing more than a reaction gif in response?
and claw.
I know this is from the first page, but.... why would it?
Not at all.
I can only assume you haven't read any of my posts in this thread. Since when does describing a product as a failure equate to 'fighting the good fight'?
I love the Vita, no doubt. Despite that, I can see that it's woefully under-supported, serves a target demographic that doesn't exist beyond about twelve people, uses ridiculously expensive proprietary memory and yet has a focus on digital software, has a borderline useless rear touch pad (outside of Tearaway) that only serves to increase the BOM, has a battery life that, although better than its competitors, is still too short, and above all else is built upon the frail foundations that Sony barely managed to lay with the PSP (Seriously, in a whole generation they couldn't even create a handful of popular handheld franchises?!).
Both platforms deserve to fail, it's just that I feel one has considerably more redeeming features than the other.
CorporateClown
Member
Dave has been very honest in admitting the Vita is a failed product; he just really loves it, is all.And I think LR is a poor example. It's the third in a trilogy of games where people could not care less about the story or its characters.
LR bombing? Not surprising and good because that crap needs to be abandoned.
Mario bombing? A little surprising, but definitely bad for Wii U prospects.
LR bombing? Not surprising and good because that crap needs to be abandoned.
Mario bombing? A little surprising, but definitely bad for Wii U prospects.
Yeah, the one that has games to play on it
Cygnus X-1
Member
There isn't a single financial motivation to do that.
iamaustrian
Member
bingo.
a lot of people seem to ignore this and start hoping on the "wiiU fails and doomed"-train
107000 is not bad at all for such a low install base
edit:
but the WiiU is selling good(or way better than before) in the last weeks in japan.
schwabdizzle
Banned
I am not saying include the tablet. sub it out with 2 pro controllers.
Both have games. Both have good and bad games.
Wickerbasket
Member
Yeah, I'd never wish for anything to fail
except for shitty DRM policies
I don't personally believe they share all the same reasons for failure, but I could see why some people would.
Yeah, but the game is supposed to increase the install base.
Maybe we will see better number sales in the next month.
Nikodemos
Member
Unfortunately, that was by initial design.
Ah. Well that goes from nearsighted to impossible now. Nintendo won't fragment their base like that. They're all in on the Gamepad.
I want them to succeed, but man, they're doing a real crap job at it.
Try to cover... more weeks. There 38 more weeks on the year.
Wickerbasket
Member
It was also one of the worst mistakes they made in my opinion. They could have solved that in the new model, but chose not to.
Dave has said Vita deserved to fail because it is a product without a market, as Sony themselves have admitted. It is, however, a nice piece of kit for the money. Wii U is not.
edit: he can obviously speak for himself.
Zaraki_Kenpachi
Member
I have read your posts but thanks for the insult!
You stated:
Which is yet another vague answer that doesn't really explain anything. What is "somewhat significantly"? Using an explanation that's even more vague to explain your vague wording before isn't exactly helpful... WiiU is definitely more powerful than the previous gen so what at what point does it become "significant" since you seem to not believe it's significant at all.
Why?
Like what about previous games indicates it had a huge online sale adoption rate.
Not trying to be a schmuck, but statements like that need to be backed up by some logical thought process. And it has to be more than 'cuz it makes sense, right?"
gamergirly
Member
Nah I wouldn't say that. I think lifetime sales will be 500K or more as time goes by
3DWorld has gamepad required levels? I thought it was playable with normal controllers?
James Sawyer Ford
Banned
This was expected, which is a shame because it looks like a great game. The problem is the hardware it's tethered to. If it were on PS4, I'd absolutely pick the game up.
But I'm not buying a Wii U just for one game.
Nintendo is going to have to re-think their console strategy and merge their handheld with their console if they want to stay relevant in the hardware market. Otherwise, they really need to think about multiplatform development.
As we are seeing, their hardware profit margins are razor thin in this market. So it doesn't make much sense for Nintendo to continue their strategy of making hardware like it has done in the past where margins were much larger and allowed them to sustain profitability even despite lower sales relative to the competition (GCN/N64 era for instance).
But I'm not buying a Wii U just for one game.
Nintendo is going to have to re-think their console strategy and merge their handheld with their console if they want to stay relevant in the hardware market. Otherwise, they really need to think about multiplatform development.
As we are seeing, their hardware profit margins are razor thin in this market. So it doesn't make much sense for Nintendo to continue their strategy of making hardware like it has done in the past where margins were much larger and allowed them to sustain profitability even despite lower sales relative to the competition (GCN/N64 era for instance).
It is? How so?
Like my other post above, same thing here, what makes it more powerful / is it really? Demonstrably so?
I ask because to me, it looks like the equivalent of the 360 / PS3, not the superior.
fabricated backlash
Member
Unless the game does massively better in the rest of the world I'd say it's lights out for WiiU sooner rather than later.
I'll give it until the end of 2014 before they give up on it.
I'll give it until the end of 2014 before they give up on it.
What game made you pick up the PS4? Just curious.
The Wii U has plenty of great games now with more on the way. The PS4 will have a lot of great games too in the future.....just not right now.
I'm obviously exaggerating to put my point across, but okay, it was a poor choice of words on my part. What I'm saying is that the other two consoles have clearly defined demographics that dictate the type of games that will become massively successful at retail. We've already established that a third party Nintendo wouldn't be able to fall back on royalties and pure profits from sales of their first party IPs on proprietary hardware. Not only that, but they would make even less money on every game sold because of royalties paid to the other console manufacturers. How is Nintendo going to try and make up for that lost cash? They'll scramble to adapt their most commercially viable IPs (Zelda in this case) for that audience by adding elements from similar games that have already proven to be massive sellers in that market.
One could argue that the above wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing, but we've seen what happened with FFXIII and Resident Evil 6 (and 5, to a lesser extent) taking cues from "Western game design." We've seen what happened with Square-Enix adapting the majority of its RPG stable for mobile. In the West, we've seen several franchises become corridor shooters or open-world, with very little in between. We've seen an over-the-top snowboarding franchise trying to re-brand itself as Tom Clancy's Deadly Descents. There are obviously exceptions, but overall, the results haven't been pretty.
This is just the reality of the current third party development model that Nintendo would almost certainly be forced to embrace if they stopped making hardware but wanted to retain their usual profit margins.
Aquamarine
Member
It's for levels where you need to touch the screen / blow on the microphone to navigate.
Zaraki_Kenpachi
Member
Look at comparison videos? Ports definitely look noticeably better and I'm sure they didn't put much time into the WiiU ports too. Any comparison between the ports show WiiU with better detail, draw distance, etc.
Lordwindowlicker
Member
That's disappointing. It's such a great game, too.
A Wii U is made to play great new video games, yeah? Super Mario 3D World, among others, are great new video games, yeah?
I'd say Wii U isn't a flawed product at all.
In your opinion
Posting dozens of times in Wii U and Vita threads, making the same numbingly repetitive points literally thousands of times sure looks like fighting the good fight to me.
It's for levels where you need to touch / blow on the microphone to navigate.
Also to clarify those levels aren't required to be beaten to progress in the main game.
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