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So to be considered a next-gen console, the only thing that matters is a new chip?

RCU005

Member
Nov 9, 2016
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I am disappointed that the Series S exists. I can understand the reason and view all the advantages that you can tell me objectively (but the price!). However, it doesn't take away the fact that the console is just very-low spec'd.

When the PS4 Pro and Xbox One X launched, Microsoft and every fan were obsessed that the Xbox was 6TF and the PS4 Pro just 4. When Microsoft announced the Xbox Series X specs, no one would shut up about 12 TF! Even when many people proved that the PS5 is not really that far behind (like the PS4 Pro and Xbox One X), everyone was just about the TF and Xbox being a monster.

Then, rumors of Lockhart started and people were fine about it being 4TF? I understand that it has the same CPU and that it's an actual good improvement, but shouldn't a "next-gen" console improve in every aspect and not just one, in this case just the CPU?

If we look at each generation, every console has improved in every aspect possible. Some more than others, and some more or less than what it was expected.

I believe Microsoft is doing the Xbox Series S just because of price. They think that having the price advantage is having the win, but that's not true at all. Sony proved with the PS3 that having good games (whether exclusives or not), your console will sell. Nintendo also proved with the Wii that no matter how popular your console is, with no games, the sales plummet.

Everyone is considering the XSS as next-gen, even though it's lower spec'd than the Xbox One X. You will say, but the GPU is RDNA 2 which it's equivalent to 6TF. So, still, the same as Xbox One X.

You have all seen the comments that many developers said about the XSS. It will cause trouble (whether too much or not, I guess time will tell). People somehow believe that the games will be the exact same (same textures, same LOD, same geometry, etc) as the XSX, but just at 1440p or lower, but it will definitely won't.

For that matter, it would've been better if they made a companion portable console to compete with the Switch, because as it stands, do you think that just because of the price, people will jump all over it, like they did the switch? It doesn't have any compelling gimmick like the Switch, and the games look better on the other consoles. (Third party will be on PS5, too. Probably at $100 more). I'd give $100 more to have a much better console with much better graphics than the XSS, and I am not meaning this as a fan of xbox or ps, but thinking as an average consumer.

They already confirmed that the optimizations for Xbox Series X won't apply to the XSS. So, it is a current gen console with a better CPU and that's it. That's my question in the title, why are people calling it next-gen? People were calling the PS5 very disappointing when there were rumors about it being 8 TF. Why, then the XSS gets to be called a next-gen console?
 

Jon Neu

..he neus nothing
Jan 21, 2018
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Republic of Catalonia
 

Jon Neu

..he neus nothing
Jan 21, 2018
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Republic of Catalonia
"Why, then the XSS gets to be called a next-gen console?"

The SSD

The SSD, the CPU, the architecture, the fact that is going to play next gen games...

But who cares about that; have you heard that it doesn't support Xbox One X enhanced features?
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
 

Abriael_GN

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Feb 26, 2019
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I am disappointed that the Series S exists. I can understand the reason and view all the advantages that you can tell me objectively (but the price!). However, it doesn't take away the fact that the console is just very-low spec'd.

When the PS4 Pro and Xbox One X launched, Microsoft and every fan were obsessed that the Xbox was 6TF and the PS4 Pro just 4. When Microsoft announced the Xbox Series X specs, no one would shut up about 12 TF! Even when many people proved that the PS5 is not really that far behind (like the PS4 Pro and Xbox One X), everyone was just about the TF and Xbox being a monster.

Then, rumors of Lockhart started and people were fine about it being 4TF? I understand that it has the same CPU and that it's an actual good improvement, but shouldn't a "next-gen" console improve in every aspect and not just one, in this case just the CPU?

If we look at each generation, every console has improved in every aspect possible. Some more than others, and some more or less than what it was expected.

I believe Microsoft is doing the Xbox Series S just because of price. They think that having the price advantage is having the win, but that's not true at all. Sony proved with the PS3 that having good games (whether exclusives or not), your console will sell. Nintendo also proved with the Wii that no matter how popular your console is, with no games, the sales plummet.

Everyone is considering the XSS as next-gen, even though it's lower spec'd than the Xbox One X. You will say, but the GPU is RDNA 2 which it's equivalent to 6TF. So, still, the same as Xbox One X.

You have all seen the comments that many developers said about the XSS. It will cause trouble (whether too much or not, I guess time will tell). People somehow believe that the games will be the exact same (same textures, same LOD, same geometry, etc) as the XSX, but just at 1440p or lower, but it will definitely won't.

For that matter, it would've been better if they made a companion portable console to compete with the Switch, because as it stands, do you think that just because of the price, people will jump all over it, like they did the switch? It doesn't have any compelling gimmick like the Switch, and the games look better on the other consoles. (Third party will be on PS5, too. Probably at $100 more). I'd give $100 more to have a much better console with much better graphics than the XSS, and I am not meaning this as a fan of xbox or ps, but thinking as an average consumer.

They already confirmed that the optimizations for Xbox Series X won't apply to the XSS. So, it is a current gen console with a better CPU and that's it. That's my question in the title, why are people calling it next-gen? People were calling the PS5 very disappointing when there were rumors about it being 8 TF. Why, then the XSS gets to be called a next-gen console?


Generations are a marketing concept.
 

LordOfChaos

Member
Mar 31, 2014
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They already confirmed that the optimizations for Xbox Series X won't apply to the XSS. So, it is a current gen console with a better CPU and that's it. That's my question in the title, why are people calling it next-gen? People were calling the PS5 very disappointing when there were rumors about it being 8 TF. Why, then the XSS gets to be called a next-gen console?


Because it'll be able to run games that the 8th gen consoles can't when games are pushing the new Zen 2 cores and SSD architecture, and that's about that. A generation isn't just GPU ALU flops, never has been.
 
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Abriael_GN

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If they are a marketing concept, why are we not still playing on PS2 level hardware?

Because marketing needs to be based on elements acceptable to the average customer, or it doesn't work.

A semi-vague element of progress needs to be present to justify the marketing, and since this is the 239th thread whining about the Xbox Series S, it has plenty of these elements of progress to justify the marketing definition of next-generation. The conveniently reductive mention of the new chip isn't the only one.
 
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RCU005

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But we are, it's called the Nintendo Switch

But at least the Switch has a portable gimmick. In fact, that's the entire reason people buy this thing.


It’s not next gen. It’s Microsoft trying to pretend there the cheapest. Its basically a PS4pro or the old oneX.

It's like this time, instead of having an Xbox "Pro" they went the other way around. If this gen has middle-gen upgrades, the Xbox side is going to be a total mess!

Other thing, is that Microsoft is just being hypocritical. Why don't they compare the XSS with the Xbox One X, instead of the regular Xbox? Because they know there wouldn't be any difference.
 
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Chromata

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I don't know why people still stick to TF as the holy grail metric of performance when just about every dev or engineer has come out saying otherwise.
 
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kikonawa

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Jun 7, 2004
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lot of xbox fans damage control.
the s is not a next gen console, its a streaming box, a faster current gen box
as if it isnt confusing enough, not only the name of the consoles but also the specs
they arent believing in generations, in what are they believing ? looks like they dont know either
 

nkarafo

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I think the software determines console generations. It's when games become advanced enough so previous hardware can't manage it.
 
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Next gen is another console.

switch is next gen (even if is not powerful)

So the amount of TF is not next gen.

what is lame for me is xbox controller, was hopping for more changes.
 

danielJackson

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Jun 18, 2020
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Too many believe the marketing talk and "but lol just drop the resolution, it is easy, PCs have done it years you know?" Bullshit.

Meanwhile they dont understand that to be able to run the game on 4tf machine, there must be "something" ~3-4x more on the 12tf one to have the room to drop it 3-4x lower

12 vs 4:
4k 60 -> 1080p 30 = ok
1440p 30Hz very high details -> maybe 1080p very low 30Hz = maybe ok
1440p 30Hz ultra details -> 720-900p low = not ok
1080p 30Hz ultra -> 540p? = Not ok

So the easiest way is to force/waste 12tf into 4k and then games look worse than 1440p upscaled would have looked.

It is just not feasible to believe that having 4tf machine would allow devs to extract "100%" from 12tf one in same manner than without it

So series s is like something between current (gpu+ram) and next gen (cpu+ssd+feature set)
 
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GHG

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It needs an SSD.

Oh wait...

I thought we were meant to laugh at people who said the SSD was next gen?
 
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RCU005

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The XSS is a next gen console in all other ways than its GPU. Actually, even its GPU is next gen, it's just a weak next gen GPU targeting 1080p/1440p.

But do you truly believe that resolution is the only thing effected with the XSS?
 

McCheese

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Meanwhile they dont understand that to be able to run the game on 4tf machine, there must be "something" ~3-4x more on the 12tf one to have the room to drop it 3-4x lower

This!

The most powerful console is now forced to have higher res versions of games designed for a 4tf GPU, because it has to have that wiggle room to scale it back down. You cannot have a 1440p game on Xbox series X with all the bells and whistles, whereas on ps5 and pc you can.
 

Spokker

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But who cares about that; have you heard that it doesn't support Xbox One X enhanced features?
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With the way people carry on about backwards compatibility, it seems like this would be a significant factor in one's purchasing decision.

The Xbox Series S will be more important a year in when fewer and fewer games are being released for Xbox One. Once games predominantly are being released on Series S/X, the Series S becomes a low cost entry point for people to get in on whatever killer app is being released during Holiday 2021.

But for Holiday 2020, a Series S is but a marginal improvement over One X with diminishing returns, and in some cases a downgrade if you still plan to play, say, Cyberpunk in November. Remember, the S/X versions aren't being released until 2021.
 
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When the PS4 Pro and Xbox One X launched, Microsoft and every fan were obsessed that the Xbox was 6TF and the PS4 Pro just 4. When Microsoft announced the Xbox Series X specs, no one would shut up about 12 TF! Even when many people proved that the PS5 is not really that far behind (like the PS4 Pro and Xbox One X), everyone was just about the TF and Xbox being a monster.

Sony proved with the PS3 that having good games (whether exclusives or not), your console will sell. Nintendo also proved with the Wii that no matter how popular your console is, with no games, the sales plummet.

You have all seen the comments that many developers said about the XSS. It will cause trouble (whether too much or not, I guess time will tell). People somehow believe that the games will be the exact same (same textures, same LOD, same geometry, etc) as the XSX, but just at 1440p or lower, but it will definitely won't.
Who is this everyone? Xbox topics are always 75% shit posts or more.

With the PS3 all Sony proved was that having the best Blu Ray player for the price sells consoles. Lots of great games but they would of for sure "lost" the generation if there was a better more affordable stand alone player.

Many devs? I've noticed 2 and both were pretty open ended (I may have missed things, if so please enlighten). They will use lower res textures cause it will be lower res. Lod could be lower again because lower res. These are things that are hard to notice at lower res.

Wii U had awesome games and all first party. It sold shitty because it didn't have multi plats and the gimmick sucked.
 
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martino

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They are no rules what next gen should be and it's surely not Sony choices who decide what it should be.
They are trying to find success doing things differently. Will it work ? given the choice, you will not find the answer on high tech social media and forum fill in majority by competition bigger community.
But is doing things in their own ways with the cards they have (not a lot in the end) the worst choice ?
we don't really have voices of people those choices target around here to have an idea.
Don't like it, vote with your wallet (i will, and i will not vote for that)
 
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hyperbertha

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I don't think OP is concern trolling. Xbox series S is rather underwhelming for a supposed next gen console, but forgivable since there's the series X. And I know a lot of people here has taken the MS kool aid of no games held back but on that front, I'm not so sure because of the reduced RAM. Hopefully after November we'll have more devs shed light on it.
 
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Gravemind

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Apr 16, 2020
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lot of xbox fans damage control.
the s is not a next gen console, its a streaming box, a faster current gen box
as if it isnt confusing enough, not only the name of the consoles but also the specs
they arent believing in generations, in what are they believing ? looks like they dont know either

Damage controlling what? A cheap entry level console? What damage is there to control? The Series S will fly off the shelves. It will be a huge success at $299.

Also, If the Series S and X naming convention seriously confuses you, then you must be on the spectrum. No way around that. Sorry.
 

FeldMonster

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Nov 17, 2018
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I am disappointed that the Series S exists. I can understand the reason and view all the advantages that you can tell me objectively (but the price!). However, it doesn't take away the fact that the console is just very-low spec'd.

When the PS4 Pro and Xbox One X launched, Microsoft and every fan were obsessed that the Xbox was 6TF and the PS4 Pro just 4. When Microsoft announced the Xbox Series X specs, no one would shut up about 12 TF! Even when many people proved that the PS5 is not really that far behind (like the PS4 Pro and Xbox One X), everyone was just about the TF and Xbox being a monster.

Then, rumors of Lockhart started and people were fine about it being 4TF? I understand that it has the same CPU and that it's an actual good improvement, but shouldn't a "next-gen" console improve in every aspect and not just one, in this case just the CPU?

If we look at each generation, every console has improved in every aspect possible. Some more than others, and some more or less than what it was expected.

I believe Microsoft is doing the Xbox Series S just because of price. They think that having the price advantage is having the win, but that's not true at all. Sony proved with the PS3 that having good games (whether exclusives or not), your console will sell. Nintendo also proved with the Wii that no matter how popular your console is, with no games, the sales plummet.

Everyone is considering the XSS as next-gen, even though it's lower spec'd than the Xbox One X. You will say, but the GPU is RDNA 2 which it's equivalent to 6TF. So, still, the same as Xbox One X.

You have all seen the comments that many developers said about the XSS. It will cause trouble (whether too much or not, I guess time will tell). People somehow believe that the games will be the exact same (same textures, same LOD, same geometry, etc) as the XSX, but just at 1440p or lower, but it will definitely won't.

For that matter, it would've been better if they made a companion portable console to compete with the Switch, because as it stands, do you think that just because of the price, people will jump all over it, like they did the switch? It doesn't have any compelling gimmick like the Switch, and the games look better on the other consoles. (Third party will be on PS5, too. Probably at $100 more). I'd give $100 more to have a much better console with much better graphics than the XSS, and I am not meaning this as a fan of xbox or ps, but thinking as an average consumer.

They already confirmed that the optimizations for Xbox Series X won't apply to the XSS. So, it is a current gen console with a better CPU and that's it. That's my question in the title, why are people calling it next-gen? People were calling the PS5 very disappointing when there were rumors about it being 8 TF. Why, then the XSS gets to be called a next-gen console?
So when a new console has better everything except GPU over the previous most powerful console ever (which was a mid-gen by the way) it is not considered next-gen, but when a barely better CPU is used (a la the Jaguar in the PS4 and Xbox One) and everything else is basically the same except RAM over the predecessors is used, it is unquestionably a next-gen?

Logic does not prevail...