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So what is the hardest boss in any video game ever?

luka said:
Getting a high score is determined by your understanding of the scoring system and your ability to experiment and learn it's tricks. Just getting to stage 3 in a game doesn't mean you'll do better than someone else who only gets to stage 2 but has a deeper understanding of the scoring mechanics.
Yes, but experimentation requires practice, and practice requires money. I am not saying that the arcade games are badly designed, but many of them were hard for the sake of being hard. It that bad? Absolutely not. I love games like Strider where I could play the game eventually on one coin but in order to do so I had to put in a lot of quarters. That being said, it is really easy for me to see why hard games are niche while easy games are popular. Hard games involve investment and risk that people have to trust that the game designers designed something that is fair and won't allow for progress and/or high score just if the player puts in more money. I believe that consoles killed the arcades because arcades could never really develop the communication to the mainstream that their games were fair except for a niche, and now free to play games are coming through the same problem (though with the internet, they have a much better way of communicating their games).
 
Other than shooters like the OP video, I can't think of much. I used to think SNK bosses were the worst, but then I discovered Japanese shooters and music games. There are some songs on the hardest modes in Pop'n Music which are more incredible to watch being completed than just about anything I can think of, but those aren't bosses.

In reality, it's probably a broken ass boss in an NES game no one remembers.
 
I don't even remember if it was a boss, but at the end of Killzone 2 there were a bunch of my idiot squadmates running around bungling up my pathways and getting in the way of everything, dragging some asinine setup out for an agonizing eternity. I remember seriously asking myself why I was still playing videogames at this point in my life, and I considered getting rid of all my games and equipment.
 
TheShampion said:
As far as Dark Souls, it is a rather ambitious game that is rather hard. It is easy to say a game like Castlevania is harder, sure, but that game only takes six hours of dedicated playing before you can probably beat the game in like a half an hour. People never seem to take into account that the ambition of a Dark Souls (full 3D world with multiple completely different play styles and physics based combat) is so beyond most bullet hell shooters and fighting game bosses that it is going to be naturally harder for people than the last boss of Mushihimesama. You can totally play Dark Souls wrong and not know what you are even supposed to be doing, while bullet hell shooters and what not the challenge is obvious: avoid the bullets.

i dont even know where to begin here. as for the bold, talk about oversimplification. just dodge bullets huh? so Dark Souls isnt just about avoiding/blocking enemy attacks? cant you beat the game if you just dont get hit? sounds so easy!

if you dont have a strategy and arent properly prepared for the challenge you will be murdered, in both types of games. the difference in a game like DS is that you can get a bunch of equipment and spells and shit to make life a hell of a lot easier. also exploits. a game like Mushi relies much more on your actual skill level than it does your equipment level. huge difference.

yeah DS is a hard game, but there are many ways to buffer yourself from that difficulty. in a game like Mushi, its all about practice, hard work, and skill.

as for Castlevania, are you refering to the NES CV's? six hours to master CV1 huh? you probably wont even beat CV in six hours the first time you play it. mastering it would take a hell of a lot longer.
 
dr3upmushroom said:
I was wondering if someone would post this. I played NG after it had been out for awhile so I knew going in that this fight was supposedly extremely hard.

When I started fighting here it indeed seemed pretty tricky, she does that spin thing to avoid most moves. However, if you hit her with just a plain ol' standing light attack (it was the X button on the Xbox) it always hits her. And you can do a combo that's X X X, just three simple standing light attacks off that, so any time she flies past you too close you can nail her for three hit. Doesn't do much damage but it adds up.

But, if you then do a rolling attack after the three hit standing light attack combo, you can continue the combo and Alma can't get out of it. So this boss that's remembered as one of the hardest ever can easily be defeated using an extremely simple combo. I figured this out totally by accident, but it was really disappointing and really funny to me. Maybe I just found a glitch or something, I'm really curious as to whether anyone else has ever found this or can try it. I definitely remember hitting X X X, and then the last hit was either a rolling attack or just towards+X. Ended killing her with a 50-something hit combo.

That is not the best strategy to use against her as I am quite certain that she can back out of it on master ninja or any difficulty above normal. Also, if you are playing on any difficulty above normal, then the lackies will just tear you to pieces while you try to whittle her down like that. Instead, properly timing your flying swallow attacks to knock her to the ground and using the non-throw version of the Izuana Drop (xyxxx) takes off large portions of her health and it ensures your safety.
 
Leona Lewis said:
584f0e459d4f9860.jpg


Old King Allant from Demon's Souls. The only boss in that game I really thought I'd never beat. But then I did and I felt awesome.

When he winds up for his grab... one of the scariest things in any game. I freak out everytime.
 
Requeim said:
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<-- this guy in Digital Devil Saga is a fairly good contender

Wait, wait wait... The MC from Nocturne is a boss in DDS? I'm a HUGE Nocturne fan, but I never really played DDS. Now this is giving me reason to dive in as I own both of DDS games. :O
 
Jarmel said:
What about Ninja Gaiden on the NES? Supposedly only a handful have beat it.

I beat it.

The most difficult and nerve-wrecking boss for me is without a doubt the Demi Fiend/Hitoshura in the first Digital Devil Saga. My GOD that was.... that was.... memorable

NaughtyCalibur said:
Wait, wait wait... The MC from Nocturne is a boss in DDS? I'm a HUGE Nocturne fan, but I never really played DDS. Now this is giving me reason to dive in as I own both of DDS games. :O

It's one of the cheapest and most difficult fights, I reckon, in the entire history of Shin Megami Tensei.

...And no, it's not really the MC from Nocturne.
 
Last boss in Vanquish on god hard was probably the hardest for me, and then it's the samurai sensei guy in god hand on hard, I think god hand was actually pretty hard and unbeatable for me if I don't abuse god hand/roulette on hard mode, so I got my ass kicked pretty early on gold and silver on KMS run and never tried again.

Outside of those I don't really play much hard games, I usually find them tedious, so yea there were a lot of games on nes/snes I've never beaten, so I can't speak for how how hard some bosses in the older games were.
 
The hardest bosses I've ever personally fought...

ZeromusDS2.PNG

Zeromus - Final Fantasy IV (DS Version)
Never mind that he's at the bottom of an absurdly long dungeon where almost every single random encounter is more or less a boss fight; the final boss himself is absolutely no joke. The first time I fought him my only reaction was a flat "what." My entire party was at around 70, the end of the regular leveling system--after level 70 your only stat increases are based on what augments a character has equipped. As the game tries to encourage experimentation, there's a good chance your first time through that you have given certain characters certain augments that won't do them much good at all. So Level 70 is really the upper echelon on how far the main game should be balanced around.
And he just slaughtered me.
FFIVDS is a game with many, many hard bosses, so I'll give it one thing--it really rewards thinking outside of the usual "hit it was physical attacks and magic, heal when low on health) routine. My final strategy ended up more or less making Edge (the fastest character normally) as fast as humanly possible. I Hasted him (doubling his speed), Berserked him (increasing both his speed even further as well as his strength), and had Rydia (who I had given Edward's augment) sing Hastemarch (to increase everyone's speed), so Edge became unto Sonic, getting numerous turns in before Zeromus could. I had Cecil and Rosa on buff duty and used the numerous Elixirs and Megalixirs I hadn't used up to that point for healing and had Kain jumping so he would hopefully be out of Big Bang's way in case everyone else was killed.
Managed to down Zeromus before he could do Big Bang more than once. Pretty good feeling.


5H5Ky.jpg

Mewtwo - Pokémon Puzzle League
This fucker, though, I will say, I have never beaten. In the single player VS. mode, you can only fight Mewtwo at the end of V.Hard and S.Hard after beating Gary for the second time at the end. Mewtwo himself is by far the most challenging opponent in any game I've personally ever played--the speed he moves around his playing field clearing blocks and racking up stupid enormous chains is almost inhuman. Within a second you find yourself underneath a garbage block a mile high and he keeps dropping them. Unless you're an absolute Puzzle League/Tetris Attack/Panel De Pon master, it's an uphill battle the whole way from the word go. And the worst part? And if you lose to Mewtwo, you have to fight Gary again in order to get another chance to fight Mewtwo, which is no mean feat!
 
Daigoro said:
i dont even know where to begin here.
You completely missed my point. I was saying that it is a lot easier to see what you did wrong in Mushihime and work to get better but in Demon Souls has a lot more variables and you could work on any number of things to get better and even then it might not do anything to get any sort of progress. You can watch a video of Mushihime and pick out points that could improve your game, unless you have the exact build and have the same items in Dark Souls, you can't really do that. Also dying in Mushihime is a lot less taxing by design. It wants you back in the game as soon as possible. The reason it is fun is that it is easy to pick up, hard to master. Dark Souls is not this by design.

And I played CV for NES for 4 hours over 2 years and got to death pretty easily. If I played that game for six hours and really studied enemies and got super serious with it I probably could beat it, though I will admit Super Mario Brothers is the better example.
 
TheShampion said:
Yes, but experimentation requires practice, and practice requires money. I am not saying that the arcade games are badly designed, but many of them were hard for the sake of being hard. It that bad? Absolutely not. I love games like Strider where I could play the game eventually on one coin but in order to do so I had to put in a lot of quarters. That being said, it is really easy for me to see why hard games are niche while easy games are popular. Hard games involve investment and risk that people have to trust that the game designers designed something that is fair and won't allow for progress and/or high score just if the player puts in more money. I believe that consoles killed the arcades because arcades could never really develop the communication to the mainstream that their games were fair except for a niche, and now free to play games are coming through the same problem (though with the internet, they have a much better way of communicating their games).
Well yes, of course the games were designed to siphon money from players. That's how arcades support themselves and continue to exist. The games live and die by being fair enough to enable gradual progress but hard enough to keep people putting money in. That's where the brilliance of their difficulty balance and design are apparent. If you play a game 2 or 3 times and see no visible improvement in your performance or understanding of the game than you can assume it's a poorly designed game and move on to the next one.

It wasn't so much the fact that consoles killed arcades due to difficulty, but something that developed out of the various cultural and geographical differences between Japan and the US. In Japan arcades are always located in areas with high foot traffic (such as near train stations), and people would stop in to play a few rounds every day after school or work. The one game one credit mentality was a logical approach to maximizing playtime per credit. The situation was very different in NA and I've never ever seen anyone let the timer run down and restart after each game over like I did in Japan. People would just credit feed their way to the end then move on to the next game. Their understanding of arcade culture was completely different. It's nice to see F2P and DDL games managing to convey this type of game better to westerners, but I still can't help but feel the experience is still missing something important.
 
luka said:
Well yes, of course the games were designed to siphon money from players. That's how arcades support themselves and continue to exist. The games live and die by being fair enough to enable gradual progress but hard enough to keep people putting money in. That's where the brilliance of their difficulty balance and design are apparent.
I agree for the most part, but I do want to at least say that the reason I think Dragon Quest and that genre took off in Japan is because there was a sort of guarantee that no matter what, if you spent your time leveling up, you could win eventually. It is something that couldn't be guaranteed by arcade games because that would come at the cost of the entire enjoyment curve of the game.

And yes, I miss arcades a lot. Going against a hard boss in Metal Slug with a co-op stranger in person is an amazing experience that online does not quite recreate.
 
Leona Lewis said:
584f0e459d4f9860.jpg


Old King Allant from Demon's Souls. The only boss in that game I really thought I'd never beat. But then I did and I felt awesome.

i will say, ive rarely been as satisfied with having beaten a boss than i was with this one. i played the game all sword and shield and heavy armor, so i had no magic and very little experience with rolling. my impression now (ive checked a lot of builds and strategies since beating it) is that this is basically hard mode, while magic user is easy mode.
 
I've got one. But I manged to beat him also, not sure if there's ever really been a boss I just couldn't beat so I quit the game.

Castlevania: Lords of Shadow.

Cornell, man he kicked my ass so many times! He's pretty much how I wanted the entire game to be, but sadly the game seemed to be at peak difficultly right as this fight ended.
 
Mama Robotnik said:
Of the games I have played, its probably Killalon from Lost Odyssey: Seeker of the Deep.

To beat him:

(1) be level 99 and max out your characters through insane grinding.

(2) delve to the bottom of the deepest dungeon in the game, twenty-six floors of the toughest monsters in the game, no save points.

(3) walk into his chamber and discover a giant fuckoff robot in a fantasy game piloted by the LO equivalent of a Goomba.

(4) begin the fight. Every round, he auto-heals more damage than your team can actually dish out with the most powerful weapons in the game. By the second round he casts immunity to magic, and in the third round he summons an asteroid that kills everyone.

(5) sigh.

How to win:

The only remotely feasible way of defeating him is by going in with 1HP, and using a bizarre reverse spell that dishes out a HP damage value that is (YOUR MAXIMUM POSSIBLE HP) minus (YOUR CURRENT LEVEL OF HP).

If you can do this for the entire first round, and through pure luck get a MISS from his attacks with at least three party members, then he will summon the superasteroid that causes instant death. If you are VERY lucky, this may MISS one of your team who can then resurrect everyone with low health and if you can hold out another round and his magical immunity wears off, you can use the HP damage spell again to defeat him.

Even maxxed out, at a point where you can kill the real final boss in a single round, this strategy only has something like a one-in-sixty-four chance of ever succeeding as it depends on the boss's manouvers missing you successively. The strategy was only discovered months after the game came out, I believe.

I've maxxed Lost Odyssey and all its DLC, but for the life of me I couldn't defeat this monstrous boss.

So I was intrigued and looked up some video on youtube, and the first one is a guy killing the boss in about 5 minutes without any character dying : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEMTWkePExs.

Doesn't look that hard.
 
I'm sure I've quit many games before getting to a really hard boss. I'm into fun, not torture.

But the hardest ones I beat were
Grunty in Banjo Kazooie
The asshole in GUN.
Lazarivich on Crushing in Uncharted 2
 
Shadow Red said:
Cerberus22.jpg

Damn dog made me constantly jumping at the edge blasting bullets for an hour.
Damn, that's a hell of a way to get through that one.

I always just grinded the prior level a bit to get some new moves and stuff, but yeah, that fight was quite a wake-up call.
 
Slappers Only said:
I don't even remember if it was a boss, but at the end of Killzone 2 there were a bunch of my idiot squadmates running around bungling up my pathways and getting in the way of everything, dragging some asinine setup out for an agonizing eternity. I remember seriously asking myself why I was still playing videogames at this point in my life, and I considered getting rid of all my games and equipment.
Oh God, that boss was frustrating as crap. HATED IT.
 
First "you're not supposed to win this scripted battle" boss in Demon's Souls. If you can do that, you can do anything.

(Edit: Depending on your build, I can see the Old King, boss of 1-4, being pretty difficult. That battle was, for me, perhaps my most satisfying and epic boss battle experience in any video game. I went in there overleveled by DS-esperts' standards -- maybe 84 or so -- and managed to beat him on the first try. Even has he sucked six levels from me, I hung on and emerged victorious. There were at least three shifts in the tide of battle where it looked like I was going to lose, then got the upper hand again. I felt like king of the world when I climbed to the top of 1-4 and beat that guy without dying. Went right to 5-1 and 5-2 afterwards and didn't die a single time on either of those stages. After how tough this game was in 1-1, I really felt like I had mastered Demon's Souls.)
 
Green Mamba said:
http://i.imgur.com/5H5Ky.jpg
Mewtwo - Pokémon Puzzle League
This fucker, though, I will say, I have never beaten. In the single player VS. mode, you can only fight Mewtwo at the end of V.Hard and S.Hard after beating Gary for the second time at the end. Mewtwo himself is by far the most challenging opponent in any game I've personally ever played--the speed he moves around his playing field clearing blocks and racking up stupid enormous chains is almost inhuman. Within a second you find yourself underneath a garbage block a mile high and he keeps dropping them. Unless you're an absolute Puzzle League/Tetris Attack/Panel De Pon master, it's an uphill battle the whole way from the word go. And the worst part? And if you lose to Mewtwo, you have to fight Gary again in order to get another chance to fight Mewtwo, which is no mean feat!
Yeah this is the point where you reach the game-breaking limits of the system. I've done it on S.Hard, and it wasn't too difficult for me since I am one of said PDP freaks, but at high-level play the game really kills itself. There are a few different things at work.

Stage 1) Start fast, obviously. Getting them buried first always gives you more options. This part is admittedly the most intense play of any game I have played. There was a unique sensation accompanying it, a feeling of burning inside my head. Like it was literally brain-fryingly fast. The only thing to come close was high-level Unreal Tournament play in the middle of a large fray. For PDP, I have no idea how my thumbs move so fast. Still, I longed to be able to advance my stack while blocks were still popping so I could do even more.

Stage 2) Be diverse. One huge block is easier to deal with than many tiny blocks, especially a mix of regular blocks and stone blocks. This is because when you clear a large block, the pile doesn't return to falling state until every block within it has flashed, giving you more time to set up the next line clear.

Stage 3) Don't blow your load. As mentioned above, you can set up to get the stack of garbage above you you immediately go into another transforming cycle when it finishes the current one. If you are smart and keep a steady run of 3s going you can indefinitely handle any block.

Stage 4) Be supplied for the siege. You need to leave yourself room for 3chains before they drop a stack on you, so if you know one is coming, push your stack up to give yourself more ammo for the long haul.

The rest is up to luck of the draw. You will each be using the exact same tactics. You will each have a massive stack on top of you, in threat of instant death. Once one of you is unfortunate enough to not have a 3 that can connect to the blocks above, you lose.

Pretty boring, right? These matches can easily exceed 6 minutes, too. So it really becomes a test of will to win vs boredom. Thing is, if you can beast them before they can replenish the stack, you can take them out early in like 16 seconds by suffocating them when they have only 2 lines at the bottom. That is hard to time and just as dependent on luck. Same for when they didn't keep a chain contact point at the top of their stack.

The new PDP for DS introduced weapons, sort of, which is a good move. However, it took away a color, making it over simplified and creating far too many impossible-to-avoid 3chains that higher level play was obliterated. For Pokemon Puzzle League on N64, playing in 3D expands the whole experience, and kind of helps make things not so stupid after stage 2 of advanced tactics.

I still long for the ideal PDP game. I wish fans would take to programming their own, like has happened with Tetris.
 
Shadow Red said:
http://devils-lair.org/gallery/dmc3screenshots/cutscenes/m3/1-cerberus/Cerberus22.jpg[IMG]
Damn dog made me constantly jumping at the edge blasting bullets for an hour.[/QUOTE]
I'm serious: I haven't killed him at all on Normal difficulty.
I fought him for a good two hours, constantly dying over and over, then just said "Fuck it, Easy Mode it is".
 
Verboten said:
Took me nine months to beat him.

The only game in existence where I bothered to finish all difficulty, including the hardest one (Super).

My God it felt NICE when I felled the last boss of Shinobi PS2 in super difficulty.
 
Jarmel said:
What about Ninja Gaiden on the NES? Supposedly only a handful have beat it.
In college I used to regularly go see a group play music under the names Contraband, Mega Band, and Ninja Gaiden Band. They played rock versions of Contra, Mega Man 2 and Ninja Gaiden soundtracks while a guy sat on stage playing them on an NES, hooked up to a little CRT, that was output to a projector behind the band.

He never died in Mega Man or Ninja Gaiden. He lost maybe one or two lives in Contra.
 
Absolute Virtue and Pandemonium Warden of FFXI, pre nerfs and whatnot. Nothing really comes close. The latter was a 20+ hour boss fight which was basically all of the major boss fights combined and then some. Absolute Virtue was just overpowering.
 
Radec said:
<<<<<<<<

On Elite.

On FPS.
Beam said:
The Radec level in Killzone 2 on hard. Man, i wanted to break the damn controller and the tv.

What made this worse was the fact the difficulty curve took a big spike at that point. He was such an unbalanced boss, there was no explanation as to why he had so much health -- he was just an another soldier with a personal cloaking device, which somehow activated faster than the speed of a bullet. The fact that KZ's guns recoil like there's a jackhammer attached to them was the cherry on top.

I couldn't get close to Radec on Veteran, let alone on Elite. WTF were Guerilla thinking?

rCIZZLE said:
Why was Demon's Souls such a horrible choice though that I get treated like someone who has never touched a controller?
What undermines DS the most is the lack of checkpoints. I don't mind a game treating me like I'm its bitch, but I object to a game demanding that I put everything else in my life on hold while I try to beat it.

And now I'm prepared to meet the wrath of GAF.
 
Para bailar La Bomba said:
What undermines DS the most is the lack of checkpoints. I don't mind a game treating me like I'm its bitch, but I object to a game demanding that I put everything else in my life on hold while I try to beat it.

And now I'm prepared to meet the wrath of GAF.

Quit to main menu when you want to stop.
 
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