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Sonic the Hedgehog 4 - Wii/PS3/360; downloadable episodic release - [Update: $15?]

Sanjuro

Member
I was excited about a rebirth of the series.

The terrible art style shown to this point and with the EPISODIC content.....really? They have knocked me back down to the bottom of any hype pole I was dancing on.

w83r0p.jpg


It begins again.
 

-PXG-

Member
Sanjuro Tsubaki said:
I was excited about a rebirth of the series.

The terrible art style shown to this point and with the EPISODIC content.....really? They have knocked me back down to the bottom of any hype pole I was dancing on.

w83r0p.jpg


It begins again.

:lol
 
You know the Episode 1 prefix still baffles me. What better way to communicate to a potential customer they are most likely getting half of the content they would normally in a genre you shouldn't really be expected to accept such practices.

Why didn't they stick to the franchise's already established naming trope of "Sonic 4 & Knuckles" or whatever when the second 'episode' comes around. They could have even had some charming throwback Cutscene at the beginning of firing up the games showing old skool Mega Drive / Genesis carts that allow you to lock them all together (ala Sonic Jam) depending on what you've got on your console and play through the first episode as the new character.

But then thats something far too clever and creative that Backbone-level development could never consider!
 

Ramune

Member
Alphahawk said:
If Gaf existed in 92 it surely would of imploded over Sonic 2's reveal

This is how Sonic 2 went down in my class (there was a abandoned building on the street parallel to our school that had Sonic 2 posters plastered on the front door, which while very weird, was also pretty cleaver as it helped to put Sonic 2 hype in the school to a fever pitch. Almost on the level of Mario 3's hype! They weren't taken down till around the time Playstation & Saturn came out though -_-; )

-"Who's that next to Sonic, is that a Squirrel with two tails?" (American Sonic 2 boxart reversed with Sonic & Tails' back turned)
-"Tails looks like a girl to me" (Sega Visions first Sonic 2 cover issue which revealed the beta Sonic 2 logo)
-"The game was great, but seriously, where was that Desert level that we saw in that Sears ad in Sega Visions? There must be a secret level like they said!" (Sears ad that had a bunch of Genesis games, Sonic 2 is featured, but clearly shows that one screenshot of Dusty Hill Zone; first Sonic 2 Sega Visions cover issue had a interview with Yuji Naka and he mentioned a secret zone you'd have to work hard to find)
-There's a level select code and get this...a code to be Super Sonic! (Me telling friends at school about aforementioned codes after flipping through a Gamepro mag while Mom was grocery shopping; I didn't have anything to write it down at the time, so I didn't know the code at all)
-"We have to find those codes!" (The search was on, there was no internet back then, so we had to hope that same magazine was in the store or we'd be screwed; why I probably carry a pen in my pocket even when I don't need to started about now ^_^; )
-I got the code guys, get those papers and pencils! (revealing the legendary numbers to the schoolmates, yes I actually said that, I scarely remember it well ^_^; )
-"There's no desert level at all! WTH!" (Level select code had no signs of Dusty Hill, much to our disappointment)

I'm sure some semblance of GAF existed during your childhood. Where you had Sega fanboys and Nintendo fanboys and NeoGeo was the magnum opus of consoles if you could get your parents to buy you one (one schoolmate finally did....after we graduated from the 8th grade).
 

Kilrogg

paid requisite penance
SecretBonusPoint said:
You know the Episode 1 prefix still baffles me. What better way to communicate to a potential customer they are most likely getting half of the content they would normally in a genre you shouldn't really be expected to accept such practices.

Agreed. Also, the whole "Episode" thing makes me think that the emphasis will be put on the storyline, which I think we can all agree here is completely unnecessary for freakin' Sonic 4. I'm not saying they'll definitely do that, but that's what comes to my mind when I read "episode". When I think about episodic content, I think Telltale Games, in which, sure enough, the story matters. Not in Sonic.
 

Blueblur1

Member
gamergirly said:
I loveeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed Sonic 2's versus mode. Man, so many hours of fun back in the day. Stealing powerups from each other and the coin matches :D
I had a blast playing Sonic 2's splitscreen mode when I was a kid. It would be great if multiplayer races of that sort made a comeback. I'm not a fan of the teleporter item box though; it was super annoying. That reminds me: Sonic 3's splitscreen race mode was terrible.
 

Somnid

Member
Kilrogg said:
Agreed. Also, the whole "Episode" thing makes me think that the emphasis will be put on the storyline, which I think we can all agree here is completely unnecessary for freakin' Sonic 4. I'm not saying they'll definitely do that, but that's what comes to my mind when I read "episode". When I think about episodic content, I think Telltale Games, in which, sure enough, the story matters. Not in Sonic.

You've never played old PC games have you?
 
This Sonic 4 reveal is heavily overrated. Do you know why?






Sonic_Advance_Coverart.png

61VQ59G2ZBL._SL500_AA280_.jpg

Sonic_Advance_3_Coverart.png

20090426032335!Sonic_Rush_Coverart.png

614solm9a7l__aa280_.jpg



There you go. Episodic Sonic 4.





Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go fetch my anti-flame gear.
 
Luigiv said:
Anyone else notice something off about the way Tails is posed?
I'll give you a hint.

safe for work hint vvvv
http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/10178628/2/istockphoto_10178628-beautiful-teen-girl-sitting-outdoors-on-red-chair.jpg[img]

[spoiler]Sonic egging you on doesn't help either.[/spoiler][/QUOTE]
An open speculation has always been tails was a girl in super early concepts and development, no real proof though.
 

rvy

Banned
Sanjuro Tsubaki said:
I was excited about a rebirth of the series.

The terrible art style shown to this point and with the EPISODIC content.....really? They have knocked me back down to the bottom of any hype pole I was dancing on.

w83r0p.jpg


It begins again.
:lol :lol
 
NinMicroSega said:
This Sonic 4 reveal is heavily overrated. Do you know why?
Sonic_Advance_Coverart.png




Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go fetch my anti-flame gear.

Sonic Advance is a legitimate contender for the title "Sonic 4", the others? Not so much. They play completely differently.
 
As I said earlier in the thread, the race is on between Sonic Advance 1 and 'Sonic 4' as to which of them really deserves that crown. Is it Dimps vs Dimps, Dimps vs Backbone or Dimps vs 'Sonic Team'?
 
I hated Sonic Advance; I don't understand this outpouring of love for it.
Heck; I preferred Sonic Rush over Sonic Advance.

I want Sonic 4 to be closer to Sonic3&K than anything else
 
gutter_trash said:
I hated Sonic Advance; I don't understand this outpouring of love for it.
Heck; I preferred Sonic Rush over Sonic Advance.

I want Sonic 4 to be closer to Sonic3&K than anything else

My comment wasn't based on quality, just the game mechanics. Rush is a damn good game but its pretty far detached from the Mega Drive games.
 
Willy105 said:
The Dark Knight is also a direct sequel to Tim Burton's Batman. I mean how are we supposed to know where The Joker came from?

Do you wear a helmet and ride the short bus? This is absolute proof of retardation.

Aside from the fact that they directly mention nobody knows anything about him in The Dark Knight, the Joker is DEAD at the end of Burton's movie.

I know this was off-topic, but FUCK, I had to jump on this moronic statement.
 

Teknoman

Member
Sanjuro Tsubaki said:
I was excited about a rebirth of the series.

The terrible art style shown to this point and with the EPISODIC content.....really? They have knocked me back down to the bottom of any hype pole I was dancing on.

Episodic = 1 complete Sonic game per episode (not cut up full Sonic game) Think the way Sonic 2 - Sonic 3 + Knuckles, since apparently they called Sonic 3 "part 1" in the first place.

I know the episode 1 subtitle really isnt necessary, but if they went with Sonic 4, I guess they didnt want to call each new download entry 5,6,7,8, etc.

Art style = unless you're complaining about the model...which was kinda expected anyway, the few seconds of the first stage shown really isnt bad...

EDIT: What was wrong with Sonic Advance 1?
 
brain_stew said:
Sonic Advance is a legitimate contender for the title "Sonic 4", the others? Not so much. They play completely differently.
Sonic 1 and 2 were fantastic, but they were too fast to be Sonic 4.

Rush was also an awesome game, but it was basically something you watch moreso than play. It's trial and error.

Rush Adventure was the most tedious piece of shit I've ever experienced. Why do I need to run all around creation doing meaningless things in order to simply PLAY the game?
 
Sonic Advance 2 had the strange effect of making people forget that the first game wasn't a hold-right exercise in grind rails and shit level design, but a solid attempt on the classic formula.
 

-PXG-

Member
gutter_trash said:
I hated Sonic Advance; I don't understand this outpouring of love for it.
Heck; I preferred Sonic Rush over Sonic Advance.

I want Sonic 4 to be closer to Sonic3&K than anything else

Everyone does :p

Visually, Sonic 4 looks like Sonic Rush (at least, what we've seen so far). Hopefully the physics, level design and overall FEEL of the game is akin to the classics.

It might sound wierd, but the old games had somethings very memorable and visceral about them. Because we played these games at an early age, and have them branded in our minds, there is a specific way a Sonic game is supposed to be like.

The sound effects had a heavy and clear resonance to them. The sound when you detroyed a badnik, the sound of platforms crumbling, the sound when you lost your rings, the sound each time you beat Robotnik. And the music...

In regards to control, Sonic is about momentum, not just plain speed. It's not just about going fast, but it's creating game play and obstacles that utilize and incorporate acceleration, weight and timing, as well as traditional, precise platforming. Go back and play the older games and analyze how Sonic runs down a hill, or what happens after jumping on a badnik or an item box. Also refer to springs, pinball sequences and other objects that cause Sonic to bounce/ ricochet. Levels too. Again, it's not just about going fast in one straight shoot. Every single level has elements where you have to either stop, or slow down in order to precisely pass through and obstacle, scale a wall, ect.

The old games have a distinct and recognizable identity. It's not just about the visuals, but the entire package and how everything is presented in the overall experience and how it feels to the end user. We all grew up on these games, we know how they are supposed to play, feel and sound. In order for this game to truly be Sonic 4, Sega needs to capture these elements. Only those who've played the originals, especially at an early age, or those who have a keen attention to detail, will notice these things.
 

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
Diablohead said:
An open speculation has always been tails was a girl in super early concepts and development, no real proof though.
Man, if he was, imaging how frustrating that would be, as the guy you're always following continually chases after the pink girl with the hammer.
Kinda the Velma to Amy's Daphne.


-PXG- said:
The old games have a distinct and recognizable identity. We all grew up on these games, we know how they are supposed to play, feel and sound. In order for this game to truly be Sonic 4, Sega needs to capture these elements. Only those who've played the originals, especially at an early age, or those who have a keen attention to detail, will notice these things.
S3&K was the first true true video game that my brother and I ever played. That thing is on a f**king pedestal for me, it was such an incredible experience. If this game isn't 10x better, I wil disavow Sonic from my life >(
 
I have one request of Sega after watching some of the Sonic Advance videos on YouTube. For the love of God, Sonic needs to stay silent. If I hear "Okay!" and "All right!" and "Cool!" after every spring jump... I will go bonkers.
 

JaseC

gave away the keys to the kingdom.
Teknoman said:
Episodic = 1 complete Sonic game per episode (not cut up full Sonic game)

It's a bit early to be absolutely sure of this. Just because Balough mentioned S3 and S&K being two halves of the Sonic 3 whole despite both being two fully-fledged entries doesn't mean Sega will take a similar path with Sonic 4's episodic structure.
 

wRATH2x

Banned
PhatPhucGabe said:
Do you wear a helmet and ride the short bus? This is absolute proof of retardation.

Aside from the fact that they directly mention nobody knows anything about him in The Dark Knight, the Joker is DEAD at the end of Burton's movie.

I know this was off-topic, but FUCK, I had to jump on this moronic statement.
He was being sarcastic.
 

WillyFive

Member
PhatPhucGabe said:
Do you wear a helmet and ride the short bus? This is absolute proof of retardation.

Aside from the fact that they directly mention nobody knows anything about him in The Dark Knight, the Joker is DEAD at the end of Burton's movie.

I know this was off-topic, but FUCK, I had to jump on this moronic statement.

Thank you for proving my point.

FunnyBunny said:
I have one request of Sega after watching some of the Sonic Advance videos on YouTube. For the love of God, Sonic needs to stay silent. If I hear "Okay!" and "All right!" and "Cool!" after every spring jump... I will go bonkers.

When you play the game, it's not really annoying. It's actually relaxing, because the button presses mixed with the sound effect creates a cathartic effect when creating the trick making it feel good. When you mess up the trick and you hear nothing, it feels bad and you feel like you missed something.

Game Design 101.
 

RagnarokX

Member
Firestorm said:
I took it to mean he's rebuilding the Death Egg. Makes sense as that's what ties the Genesis games together.
What's with all the conclusion jumping? The game is full of rebuilt badniks from the previous games. Robotnik is revisiting and improving his best badniks.
 

Monroeski

Unconfirmed Member
The best part of the Sonic Cycle is that it's sometimes a self fulfilling prophecy. Here they announce a new 2D platformer on consoles with an episodic structure that's a throwback to what many people think its the best in the entire series, and here people are about to start setting mattresses on fire because of homing attacks and freaking EYE COLOR. Even when the good 2D platformers came out for DS, they weren't good enough for many because OH NOEZ THEY'RE NOT GOOD ENOUGH BECAUSE THEY'RE PORTABLE INSTEAD OF ON CONSOLES!

Never change, GAF, never change. :lol
 
Willy105 said:
When you play the game, it's not really annoying. It's actually relaxing, because the button presses mixed with the sound effect creates a cathartic effect when creating the trick making it feel good. When you mess up the trick and you hear nothing, it feels bad and you feel like you missed something.

This makes me feel better, but not much.

In the Genesis games, Sonic is "cool" because the speed at which he moves, the look of the sprite and what he does. There is attitude built-in (foot tapping, etc.). Sega made the mistake of trying to "force" the cool in later titles. It stopped coming naturally.
 

Teknoman

Member
JaseC said:
It's a bit early to be absolutely sure of this. Just because Balough mentioned S3 and S&K being two halves of the Sonic 3 whole despite both being two fully-fledged entries doesn't mean Sega will take a similar path with Sonic 4's episodic structure.

True, but those rumors earlier were right so far (About it being Sonic 4 episode 1) and they were quickly snatched down by Sega...so im guessing the information was pretty legit.

EDIT: I really think some of you guys need to track down non-speedrun versions of Sonic Advance 1 videos, or just replay the game. "speed based 2d" didnt really start till Advance 2.
 

Dandy

Member
Monroeski said:
The best part of the Sonic Cycle is that it's sometimes a self fulfilling prophecy. Here they announce a new 2D platformer on consoles with an episodic structure that's a throwback to what many people think its the best in the entire series, and here people are about to start setting mattresses on fire because of homing attacks and freaking EYE COLOR. Even when the good 2D platformers came out for DS, they weren't good enough for many because OH NOEZ THEY'RE NOT GOOD ENOUGH BECAUSE THEY'RE PORTABLE INSTEAD OF ON CONSOLES!

Never change, GAF, never change. :lol
It can't be a throwback if it has homing attack because that will completely change the level structure and enemy placement (for worse).
The Rush games are not good at all and not because they're handheld games.
 
JaseC said:
It's a bit early to be absolutely sure of this. Just because Balough mentioned S3 and S&K being two halves of the Sonic 3 whole despite both being two fully-fledged entries doesn't mean Sega will take a similar path with Sonic 4's episodic structure.
Sonic 3 and S&K were both the same length as the other two games though, more or less.
 

Teknoman

Member
Dandy said:
It can't be a throwback if it has homing attack because that will completely change the level structure and enemy placement (for worse).
The Rush games are not good at all and not because they're handheld games.

Not necessarily. Sonic Advance 1 had slide attacks, back flips, air dashes, and all kinds of other stuff.
 

Lijik

Member
Kilrogg said:
Depends what you mean by "old"... Were you referring to the old LucasArts/point & click games?
He means shareware titles like Duke Nukem, Jazz Jackrabbit, Hocus Pocus and Commander Keen which typically were broken up into "episodes' which were a set of levels you could buy at your leisure. The first episode tended to be the demo for the game.
 
Epic Tier 3 Engineer said:
Rush Adventure was the most tedious piece of shit I've ever experienced. Why do I need to run all around creation doing meaningless things in order to simply PLAY the game?

This.

I liked the first Rush a LOT.

However, I didn't even bother getting to the third zone in Rush Adventure.

Tedious piece of shit indeed.
 

Kilrogg

paid requisite penance
Lijik said:
He means shareware titles like Duke Nukem, Jazz Jackrabbit, Hocus Pocus and Commander Keen which typically were broken up into "episodes' which were a set of levels you could buy at your leisure. The first episode tended to be the demo for the game.

Oh, that was my other guess, actually, thanks. But that's shareware, not episodic content. Or am I ignorant and "episodic content" became the official synonym for shareware?
 

ckohler

Member
To this day, I still have no idea why SEGA continues to treat Sonic CD like it never happened. It was a pinnacle of gaming perfection. As much as I love the cartridge games, Sonic CD was in a whole other category when it came to presentation, gameplay, music and level design.

One of the best gaming experiences I have ever had was beating Sonic CD for the first time. Suddenly, this awesome full motion animated ending started to play. I totally did not expect that. This was back at a time when few games had endings so you never really knew what would happen. Not only was I glad to see something rather than just "Game Over", I'm treated to this beautiful FMV that tells the end story.

Then, just as I think the video is about to end and Sonic strikes a bad-ass pose, the video shrinks down into the corner and the credits start rolling AS MORE VIDEO BEGINS TO PLAY! I nearly shat myself. I clearly remember saying "Holy shit! This is like a real movie's credits!" It was epic beyond words.

Being an American, I saw the US ending (which didn't have sound effects and the US soundtrack) however I've now come to realize the Japanese/EU ending is supeiror if only for having some of the original sound effects. Granted, I prefer Sonic Boom but here's the ending in all its glorly. This is the GOOD ending. Watch it and marvel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFx6q7W1wl4

So, aside from sharing this video, the main reason I'm making this post is to point out why SEGA doesn't mine any of the gold from Sonic CD such as the time traveling aspect as well as the unique enemies. It had other interesting gameplay mechanics too like treadmill switches and anti-gravity (which showed up some in Sonic Advance). I do remember reading that the original Sonic the Hedgehog was supposed to feature Time Travel aspects as well but they couldn't fit all the stages on the cartridge to do it so they left it out. Just seems like a missed opportunity by SEGA to ignore what this game has to offer the franchise.
 
ckohler said:
To this day, I still have no idea why SEGA continues to treat Sonic CD like it never happened. It was a pinnacle of gaming perfection. As much as I love the cartridge games, Sonic CD was in a whole other category when it came to presentation, gameplay, music and level design.

One of the best gaming experiences I have ever had was beating Sonic CD for the first time. Suddenly, this awesome full motion animated ending started to play. I totally did not expect that. This was back at a time when few games had endings so you never really knew what would happen. Not only was I glad to see something rather than just "Game Over", I'm treated to this beautiful FMV that tells the end story.

Then, just as I think the video is about to end and Sonic strikes a bad-ass pose, the video shrinks down into the corner and the credits start rolling AS MORE VIDEO BEGINS TO PLAY! I nearly shat myself. I clearly remember saying "Holy shit! This is like a real movie's credits!" It was epic beyond words.

Being an American, I saw the US ending (which didn't have sound effects and the US soundtrack) however I've now come to realize the Japanese/EU ending is supeiror if only for having some of the original sound effects. Granted, I prefer Sonic Boom but here's the ending in all its glorly. This is the GOOD ending. Watch it and marvel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFx6q7W1wl4

So, aside from sharing this video, the main reason I'm making this post is to point out why SEGA doesn't mine any of the gold from Sonic CD such as the time traveling aspect as well as the unique enemies. It had other interesting gameplay mechanics too like treadmill switches and anti-gravity (which showed up some in Sonic Advance). I do remember reading that the original Sonic the Hedgehog was supposed to feature Time Travel aspects as well but they couldn't fit all the stages on the cartridge to do it so they left it out. Just seems like a missed opportunity by SEGA to ignore what this game has to offer the franchise.

I agree, I love Sonic CD from top to bottom, including the level design. It does put a lot of people off, however. But they're just chumps.

Chumps, I tell you!
 

Sanjuro

Member
Teknoman said:
Episodic = 1 complete Sonic game per episode (not cut up full Sonic game) Think the way Sonic 2 - Sonic 3 + Knuckles, since apparently they called Sonic 3 "part 1" in the first place.

I know the episode 1 subtitle really isnt necessary, but if they went with Sonic 4, I guess they didnt want to call each new download entry 5,6,7,8, etc.

Art style = unless you're complaining about the model...which was kinda expected anyway, the few seconds of the first stage shown really isnt bad...

EDIT: What was wrong with Sonic Advance 1?
I know, I'm more peeved about the whole episode idea. I rather just name them as complete games like Mega Man has done. It just makes it sound tackier and leaves them open to stretch that dollar for minimal content in future releases. It's not the biggest thing but just seems very needless.

I mentioned the very little they have shown graphically. It looks almost as bland as the Sonic 2-HD screens. Nothing really stands out, everything overly polished, and Sonic looks very strange.

Sonic Advance series I never liked much at all.
 

ThatObviousUser

ὁ αἴσχιστος παῖς εἶ
ckohler said:
One of the best gaming experiences I have ever had was beating Sonic CD for the first time. Suddenly, this awesome full motion animated ending started to play. I totally did not expect that. This was back at a time when few games had endings so you never really knew what would happen. Not only was I glad to see something rather than just "Game Over", I'm treated to this beautiful FMV that tells the end story.

Then, just as I think the video is about to end and Sonic strikes a bad-ass pose, the video shrinks down into the corner and the credits start rolling AS MORE VIDEO BEGINS TO PLAY! I nearly shat myself. I clearly remember saying "Holy shit! This is like a real movie's credits!" It was epic beyond words.

Being an American, I saw the US ending (which didn't have sound effects and the US soundtrack) however I've now come to realize the Japanese/EU ending is supeiror if only for having some of the original sound effects. Granted, I prefer Sonic Boom but here's the ending in all its glorly. This is the GOOD ending. Watch it and marvel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFx6q7W1wl4

Sonic Unleashed has pretty well-made cutscenes too...
 

Blueblur1

Member
PhatPhucGabe said:
Do you wear a helmet and ride the short bus? This is absolute proof of retardation.

Aside from the fact that they directly mention nobody knows anything about him in The Dark Knight, the Joker is DEAD at the end of Burton's movie.

I know this was off-topic, but FUCK, I had to jump on this moronic statement.
:lol :lol :lol
 
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