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Sonic the Hedgehog 4 - Wii/PS3/360; downloadable episodic release - [Update: $15?]
- Thread starter Firestorm
- Start date
PeakPointMatrix
Member
I don't know, in that case Unleashed is the worst offender...Momo said:
All indicators show that it's not actually a bad game or anything. Progress is certainly being made on the front of 'good Sonic games'.
As an aside, I know that people feel like it shouldn't have been called Sonic 4 if it was going to be a blend of classic Sonic, and advance, but I think this game would be more inappropriately titled as Sonic Advance 4 than it is as Sonic 4. In terms of level design and execution it far and away above the type of games that Advance ended up being even if it shares a modicum of their DNA.
As an aside, I know that people feel like it shouldn't have been called Sonic 4 if it was going to be a blend of classic Sonic, and advance, but I think this game would be more inappropriately titled as Sonic Advance 4 than it is as Sonic 4. In terms of level design and execution it far and away above the type of games that Advance ended up being even if it shares a modicum of their DNA.
Ixzion said:
On a related note, I was watching this random vid of Sonic Megamix, and thinking "Why couldn't Sega do this?" The homing attack looks, dare I say, awesome. It's just the way Sega has implemented it in Sonic 4 that is so terribly wrong.
Have you seen the part where Sonic has zero momentum, the part where he uncurls when shooting off a ramp, the homing attack, the lack of multiple paths through the levels? (whats been shown) :lolNovella said:
What the hell is Sonic to you? to me it's momentum based gameplay and inspired level design.
PeakPointMatrix
Member
Yeah look at all that earned momentum.Anth0ny said:
BocoDragon said:I would call Sonic 4 an example of a new type of Sonic Cycle entirely - The Sonic Mobius Strip.
It just never fucking ends.
Wait.
Wait.
Sonic's world is named Mobius. I read that in his origin comic in Disney Adventures when I was a kid. Yeah, I'm weird for remembering that.
But that "infinite loop" symbol... it's called a Mobius strip.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Möbius_strip
Sonic 1... Mobius... Sonic Cycle... Mobius Strip...
They knew all along
/Green eyes
Segata Sanshiro
Member
Dimps have been making good games with Sonic in them all along. This isn't progress but it might seem that way to the people who never play anything handheld.Zen said:
The problem for some folks is that Dimps's games don't play the same way as the classic Sonic games, from physics to level design to pacing and more. So, for those wanting classic Sonic, it doesn't really matter that Dimps is making something good, because it's off-point.
Sonic 4 is adding to the pain by using a title and giving early statements that led the fans of the classic Sonic (and not so much the Dimps Sonic) to think this was going to be a classic Sonic game.
However, Novella is demonstrating nicely why Dimps' Sonic games continue to sell millions - the majority of Sonic players never dissected the game the way the hardcore guys did, and to them, Sonic is a blue mans who runs fast and grabs gold rings and hits a signpost at the end of the level and every few levels fights a fat guy in a machine. As long as Dimps hits those beats *and* makes a good game, it doesn't matter if it's actually totally different from the old ones to those folks.
PeakPointMatrix
Member
Novella said:
Sir_Crocodile
Member
RubyEclipse said:
That was the point.
Since sonic shouldn't have much of a story I was commenting that what was apparently being said is that nothing has been done on episode two at all.
Is that correct? You haven't started yet so all the physics problems with episode one can easily be fixed and level design built around the changes to such in two.
To Far Away Times
Member
Anth0ny said:
Um... What's the difference?
Catalix
And on the sixth day the LORD David Bowie created man and woman in His image. And he saw that it was good. On the seventh day the LORD created videogames so that He might take the bloody day off for once.
Bad example. From what I'm seeing there, it still cheapens gameplay.Anth0ny said:
Of course that's true. The general public are a non-discerning bunch. The surface-level aesthetics of this game (which Sega mostly got right) will be more than enough to satisfy their tastes.Segata Sanshiro said:
RobbieNick
Junior Member
Segata Sanshiro said:
Segata, your sanity is a welcome relief in this thread. I never dissected Sonic's physics myself. I happen to like both DIMPS and Classic Sonic. There's room for both.
Catalix
And on the sixth day the LORD David Bowie created man and woman in His image. And he saw that it was good. On the seventh day the LORD created videogames so that He might take the bloody day off for once.
Wish Sega realized this. If they actually made both types of games concurrently, it wouldn't be a problem.RobbieNick said:
But they don't. So the current state of the series is a justifiable bummer for Classic-style fans.
Azure Dream
Member
I both envy and fear the job you have right now, Ruby. I'm surprised if you have as much input in the game's progression as you say you do, but with the other staff redoing your desk and such, it sounds like you've thrown all your chips in to help this Sonic game be as good as it can get, given the circumstances. I appreciate that, even if some aspects fans don't desire are set in stone, due to developer tastes or assumptions about what will be expected of them.
With that said, if this is truly going to be an episodic property... I know this discussion has been had before, maybe the $15 price point was even a bargaining chip used in landing the delay, but Sega needs to take a page from Capcom on this, and price it no greater than $9.99/800MSP, and that in itself is not the ideal. It's money left on the table for some fans, and that's hard to swallow, but it will make a difference in how the game is received, and if people will continue to purchase future episodes, or only the die-hards as usual.
With that said, if this is truly going to be an episodic property... I know this discussion has been had before, maybe the $15 price point was even a bargaining chip used in landing the delay, but Sega needs to take a page from Capcom on this, and price it no greater than $9.99/800MSP, and that in itself is not the ideal. It's money left on the table for some fans, and that's hard to swallow, but it will make a difference in how the game is received, and if people will continue to purchase future episodes, or only the die-hards as usual.
PeakPointMatrix
Member
The price is the biggest potential nail in the coffin I think. People seeing this for the first time will think "15 dollars? For episode ONE?." With that title, it implies you're paying near premium to what is assumed to be a fraction of a larger game. It's going to stunt a lot of possible growth for their attempt at an episodic release with this. My fear when buying an episode of anything is, how much content until it is finished, since it's only a piece? I really hope they reconsider it...
Also, people griping about Sonic 4's title: there IS the text "episode 1" attached to it. Don't recall any subtitles in previous classics. From that alone you should have known it's approach would differ from the Genesis titles.... "They called it Sonic 4! Those bastards!" No, they called it Sonic 4 - EPISODE ONE. If we're as fickle as claiming a name change to Advance 4 would solve everything, then you should also note the added subtitle puts this apart from the classics...
Also, people griping about Sonic 4's title: there IS the text "episode 1" attached to it. Don't recall any subtitles in previous classics. From that alone you should have known it's approach would differ from the Genesis titles.... "They called it Sonic 4! Those bastards!" No, they called it Sonic 4 - EPISODE ONE. If we're as fickle as claiming a name change to Advance 4 would solve everything, then you should also note the added subtitle puts this apart from the classics...
Hitlersaurus Christ
Banned
Not in MY country it's not!RagnarokX said:
Azure Dream
Member
Not that this discredits your overall point, but Sonic 3's Part One/Part Two promotion was abandoned pretty early on (they didn't talk about a continuation until they started promoting Sonic & Knuckles), Sonic 3 was just billed as "Sonic 3" everywhere, and the box art that used that image cropped off the Part One text.
I don't live in Europe either, just pointing it out.Hitlersaurus Christ said:Not in MY country it's not!
I know, just saying that adding "Episode 1" or "Part One" doesn't mean anything other than it has multiple parts. Dropping "Part One" was a smart move, because I don't think consumers would have been happy if they all knew they were only getting half a game for full price.Kulock said:
PeakPointMatrix
Member
My point is that it's silly to rank a game as shitty or acceptable in name alone and isn't really fair. So to those clamoring this as an catastrophe under "Sonic 4", but not so if it was "Sonic HD" seems over dramatic and fickle. Shouldn't we judge the game on it's on merits for being a fun and challenging platformer, just like it's predecessors? Maybe when it comes to the physics and math it isn't on the dot correct, but if my eight year old self had fun with Sonic 2 and 3, and 4 could manage that as well despite it's differences, what's so wrong about that. Because when I was eight I know I didn't notice the physics, I knew I was playing Sonic and it was fun.
Segata Sanshiro said:
The majority of Sonic players probably don't care. I'm fairly certain the average person can't spot the differences between Sonic 3 and Sonic Rush outside of the rush mechanic and increased speed. Hell, I wouldn't even have noticed the difference.
And that Sonic MegaMix level looks horrible in design. It reminds me of various Super Mario World hacks, all harder then the original, but all without the spirit of the original game's level design.
IrishNinja
Member
segater - fair points, i dont know i'm an anomaly by saying im able to enjoy a bit've both, though...and its not nearly as removed as saying, say IGAvania vs belmont/tanky CV. i get the guys who didnt necessarily fancy the DC games, which upon replay dont hold up as well as i thought they wouldve. still dig 2 > 1, but that's neither here nor there.
i prefer old-school sonic with the platforming. i see a bit've that here, and long for a demo to see if i can make peace with the physics. anyway, it's totally subjective as to what's a dealbreaker (clearly advance stuff is for many) but i dig your point that if you know what you want from a sonic game, and what this one's offering, it's not fair to just outright shit on Dimps' efforts here.
Momo said:
you know, it bears repeating: werehog wasnt the worst part of that game. again, if you enjoyed Sonic Adventure 1/2 at all, Unleashed had some stuff for you; the parts i thought were bulslhit/quit on completely were when you have to go hunting or do fetch-quests or some shit to "unlock" the next playable level, fuck that hubworld shit.
sonikokaruto
Banned
wtf how many pages is this shit?
i'm getting tired of seeing this on the 1st gaming page.
if you don't like it, don't freaking buy it
i'm getting tired of seeing this on the 1st gaming page.
if you don't like it, don't freaking buy it
Upsidedown Fuji
Member
IrishNinja said:
This x1000
The wherehog levels were actually kind of entertaining once I got the hang of things. The only wherehog sections that can go eat a left nut is Eggman Land. Holy crap it's just masochistic.
I didn't mind the werehog levels either. They were by no means bad, and were kinda entertaining, if under-polished.
I do recall being able to make it as far as Chun-nan's hub world. (I think, it might have been after that...) Couldn't find the entrance to the next level for an hour, and when I did find it, I found I had to collect more medals. The only thing that stopped me from snapping the disc and tossing it across my room was the fact that it was a rental. :lol
I do recall being able to make it as far as Chun-nan's hub world. (I think, it might have been after that...) Couldn't find the entrance to the next level for an hour, and when I did find it, I found I had to collect more medals. The only thing that stopped me from snapping the disc and tossing it across my room was the fact that it was a rental. :lol
PeakPointMatrix
Member
The best part is the game hasn't even come out yet :lolsonikokaruto said:wtf how many pages is this shit?
i'm getting tired of seeing this on the 1st gaming page.
if you don't like it, don't freaking buy it
Catalix
And on the sixth day the LORD David Bowie created man and woman in His image. And he saw that it was good. On the seventh day the LORD created videogames so that He might take the bloody day off for once.
Destroyed by Colors in what way? Sales? Reviews? Fan reception?ILikeFeet said:
To Far Away Times
Member
sonikokaruto said:
Oh, we're just getting started. Wait 'til the game comes out. If you thought the pixel counting in other threads was bad, you haven't seen anything yet.
To Far Away Times
Member
Gravijah said:
You know, I'm somewhat looking forward to Colors even though I haven't enjoyed a 3D Sonic game yet. That one seems to be the best they can do with the formula.
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