• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
  • The Politics forum has been nuked. Please do not bring political discussion to the rest of the site, or you will be removed. Thanks.

Sony doing patches for old games and not doing native PS5 version is such a shame

ACESHIGH

Member
May 16, 2020
1,058
1,853
395
Guys not to sound rude but... you play on console. A patch that gives you higher framerate and increased resolution for free is a godsend.

Do you want Sony to go the Nintendo route and ask for 60 USD for a couple of roms? Careful with what you wish for.

Sony's BC solution, while not ideal is a step in the right direction. Let them focus on new games for ps5 and porting their back catalog to pc
 

DenchDeckard

Member
Feb 28, 2021
1,878
3,286
375
60 FPS patch is fine, sure I’d happily take a couple of extra tweak but playing GOT and now LOUII at 60 FPS is sublime.
 

JerryinSoCal

Member
Apr 11, 2020
1,171
2,046
390
I think as long as they are adding patches to PS4 games that's all that's needed, the games already look great. Yeah it would be nice to see higher native resolutions and some graphical upgrades but with so many games to do that for they'd have to start charging and that would cause all kinds of other drama. The spider-man thing alone caused a lot of complaints because the remaster wasn't free.
 

lh032

I cry about Xbox and hate PlayStation.
Mar 8, 2021
1,366
2,745
445
i rather they spend money on a new IP or a sequel, the fuck u want them to spend more time and resources on an old game
 

odhiex

Member
Dec 15, 2008
1,661
406
1,130
Jakarta, Indonesia
twitter.com
Native ports sure damn nice to have, but they cost more money and resources.

That is why for some games, they offered "free upgrade" of the next gen versions, while others are charging more money. It is about value proposition.

For me, a quick performance patch is serviceable. Framerate is 👑 anyway.
 

Holammer

Member
Jan 3, 2019
1,550
2,073
440
Porting Days Gone to PC involved roughly a dozen qualified employees for an unknown period of time, probably less as they no doubt padded the list and I'm not counting QA.
PS5 version is getting what qualifies as a simple ini configuration, that's low energy. Especially now when much of the heavy lifting has been taken care of for a next gen version and one would imagine that they could have developed PC & PS5 versions in tandem, but they didn't.

It's possible a native version might not gain enough extra performance to be worth the effort. If a native version does perform better, do it. Otherwise future PC ports will continue to shame the PS5.
 
Jun 28, 2013
3,057
3,235
895
For 3rd parties they are just porting the PC assets. For Sony they would have to create assets for PS5 versions. They dont exist.

Plus they probably dont see any return. So they just upgrade the framerate to promote “game boost”
 

Shifty1897

Member
Sep 22, 2014
2,438
1,863
930
Livingston, AL
If I have to choose between a free patch or a full price native version a year later like The Last of Us Remastered, put me down for that free patch dawg.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Banjo64

Hugare

Member
Sep 8, 2019
1,282
2,912
475
Neither should be necessary, honestly

A smarter, system wide BC solution should be on Sony's top priority for next next gen

Imagine every PS5 game being automatically bumped with higher res and framerate on the PS6. Just like playing on PC.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Magikarp9

Bartski

Member
Jan 15, 2020
3,234
8,263
685
Katowice
no I don't think they should do any of that. It's expensive. Better invest in new games.
 
Last edited:

Ev1L AuRoN

Member
Oct 30, 2020
347
556
335
I understand but, that would require investments and developer time. I think Sony is doing the right call, concentrating their efforts in new games and next-gen experiences. It's nice what Microsoft is doing retro compatibility wise but in the end that's meaningless without the new experiences that someone who bought a next-gen system will want. I'm ok with these patches, they are a nice bonus for the people that didn't experience those games on PS4 or want it to revisit them now in 60fps.
 

KAL2006

Member
Feb 6, 2009
12,232
2,171
1,345
UK
For 3rd parties they are just porting the PC assets. For Sony they would have to create assets for PS5 versions. They dont exist.

Plus they probably dont see any return. So they just upgrade the framerate to promote “game boost”

We need a PC version of Death Stranding, Horizon and Days Gone then we might get a native PS5 version of those games. If only those PC versions existed.
 

jakinov

Member
Nov 19, 2008
989
1,124
1,120
Maybe, although I don't know that I agree the ROI would go better in making new products with unproven market value than ensuring the value of solid sellers. TLoU and Horizon and God of War will continue to count their future sales in terms of moving the 7th digit up higher and higher, and adding PS5 as a dedicated SKU will make it easier to sell than a PS4 game with patches (even if the differences are still not as compelling as a full "remaster" job.) Meanwhile, any new product (in a new IP, at least) will be lucky if it ranks 1 million in sales. It's one of the things that sucks about games today, that people ask why companies keep remastering hits and spending forever supporting games instead of making sequels, but the old addage "You have to spend money to make money" plays a little differently now when we're talking products that already make money.

(That said, your assessment of the ROI has more simple supportive evidence right now: Sony did not spend the money that I'm saying could have earned them more sales.)
The ROI is arguably potentially better as you can potentially sell tens of millions of copies. It's just that it's riskier. Not that you can't sell tens of millions of copies of a remaster but games tend to drop off in sales as time goes by. There are exceptions like Nintendo games, GTA and Minecraft. And like I said in my other post, since some of these games are already heavy discounted and already accessible, it's also going to be extra hard to convince people to buy these versions compared to PS4 ports of PS2 and PS3 games.

A lot of the remasters that exist I would argue stem from the games no longer being as accessible, or the games barely being able to run that well on hardware in the past. IMO you don't get as much value playing Last of Us 2 with remastered textures and random improvements as you do going from SD -> HD, stable framerates and being able to use the textures and possibly use the assets the artists always intended but never go to due to heavy limitations of hardware. So trying to get people to dish out extra money for those improvements is IMO harder.

The other point I brought up is also that, if the reward isn't that high, and they don't have strong reason to believe they'll get to their optimal reward, they might rather invest it in safer investments. By that I mean in just buying things like bonds and stocks which is something that companies do with extra cash.
 
  • Like
Reactions: CamHostage

KAL2006

Member
Feb 6, 2009
12,232
2,171
1,345
UK
Neither should be necessary, honestly

A smarter, system wide BC solution should be on Sony's top priority for next next gen

Imagine every PS5 game being automatically bumped with higher res and framerate on the PS6. Just like playing on PC.

That should be doable. I think if every game going forward has a hidden unlock to 120fps and a dynamic resolution preset. Then all games will be future proof. Unfortunately developers are not doing that, some games have a fixed resolution or checkerboard setup which is fine but if they had a hidden option for dynamic resolution for the sake of future proofing it wouldn't hurt the game. Also a hidden option of unlocking frame rate caps to 60 and 120 for future proofing wouldn't hurt either. Yes I know many games are 60fps already but an example is why doesn't Spiderman Miles Morales have a uncap framerate option for Ray Tracing mode, of course it would be unplayable on PS5 due to limitations but by the time PS6 comes out we would need to worry about having a patch.
 
  • Like
Reactions: scydrex

THEAP99

reposts tweets from kids about console wars
Mar 16, 2020
4,192
11,190
710
Nah you're not the only one. No need to be disappointed though, I am totally sure that they're working on a Remastered version
 

yurinka

Member
Jan 19, 2007
13,553
5,271
1,720
Barcelona, Spain
www.capcom-town.es
It's impossible to make everyone happy. People also complained when Sony made the native PS4 and PS5 versions (crossgen), complained about them making a remaster (Spider-Man) or when it's rumored they are working on a remake (TLOU) and now also for patching PS4 games to be improved on PS5 and when don't update old PS4 games.

If they do improvements for free, it will be something that won't require a lot of work, will be something minor. If instead they will make major improvements and a lot of work, they will charge for them. If that team is too busy with something else or they think to improve certain game won't generate them enough revenue to compenate the work (independently of the patch being free or paid), they won't improve it.

But in any case, their priority must be to make new great games instead of focusing too much on the older ones.
 
Last edited:

IntentionalPun

Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
Aug 28, 2019
8,672
16,041
660
Sony did a great PS5 version of one of their PS5 games.

Then hid it behind a $70 version of Miles lol

(i bought it)
 
  • Empathy
  • Strength
Reactions: tommib and Rea

Blond

Banned
Dec 10, 2019
2,907
4,890
600
Sactown
If only they were SMARTER in their DELIVERY. Believing in generations came back and bit them in their ass
Bro they ARE doing this it just doesn’t have a fancy nickname attached to it. Microsoft is literally editing .ini files and calling it next gen when it’s nothing but a damn patch like Sony is doing to last gen games. Great example: why isn’t Mass Effects 120hz on PS5? Because the pro never supported 120hz to begin with and it’s not like weaker PCs can’t run these jank games at 4K/120 but doing so would require BioWare to actually create and optimize specifically FOR the X/PS5 to achieve that res/framerate to begin with.
 
Last edited:

jroc74

Phone reception is more important to me than human rights
Jun 1, 2013
9,080
4,255
850
To this day, I still have no idea what this line means. It's one of those PR statements you can decipher in 20 different ways and it still holds true. To me it seems like each person made their own assumptions and feels betrayed based on something that was never actually said.
Its amazing when they have actual PS5 only games...lol. I still dont get why this is even a topic of discussion.

I'm one of those that didnt feel betrayed....because they have actual PS5 only games.

"believe in generations" doesnt equal "no cross gen games when the PS5 launches"

It means they will continue doing exactly what they have always done.

As far as doing patches for old games....I saw someone post that these patches feel next gen to them so....

This is about the support BC games get.














That was someone talking about BC games on XSX.

Bro they ARE doing this it just doesn’t have a fancy nickname attached to it. Microsoft is literally editing .ini files and calling it next gen when it’s nothing but a damn patch like Sony is doing to last gen games. Great example: why isn’t Mass Effects 120hz on PS5? Because the pro never supported 120hz to begin with and it’s not like weaker PCs can’t run these jank games at 4K/120 but doing so would require BioWare to actually create and optimize specifically FOR the X/PS5 to achieve that res/framerate to begin with.
Exactly.

Someone claimed that an insider lied about Sony having an alternative to Smart Delivery.

I just asked that person.....do they know the meaning of ...alternative....

Its almost like the "Sony doesnt do, wanna do cross play!!"

That was wrong, they never stopped doing it or never stopped supporting it. They were doing it the exact same way they did it on the PS3 when MS didnt want to. They just didnt do it to the extent MS wanted to after the XBO launched.

This is literally how narratives are created.
 
Last edited:

kyliethicc

Member
Mar 14, 2020
5,589
27,178
590
I know people are excited about Last of Us 2 finally getting a patch. But seems like I'm the only one that's disappointed. Sony did the same thing with Days Gone, Ghost of Tsushima, Rachet and Clank and God of War. Where the patch is a simple frame rate unlock which allows the games to run at 60fps. Don't get me wrong that's still great and better than nothing. But I would have though they would put more effort with their big titles from PS4 especially when third parties have done full PS5 native versions for free such as Mortal Kombat 11, Avengers, Terminator and etc.

With PS4 patches the only upgrade you get is a frame rate upgrade, due to the way PS4 games are designed they are restricted to PS4 memory so you don't get a resolution boost (unless game had dynamic res), no improved textures, no instant loading, no DualSense features. Obviously I don't expect Sony to do native PS5 versions for all their PS4 games but I did expect native PS5 version for their big and most recent games like Ghost of Tsushima, God of War and Last of Us Part 2.
I guarantee there will be a native PS5 version of The Last of Us Part II.

It'll likely get bundled alongside the remake of Part I or the multiplayer game.

Sony basically implied there's gonna be a PS5 version today.

 

JaksGhost

Member
Feb 25, 2021
122
334
260
I guarantee there will be a native PS5 version of The Last of Us Part II.

It'll likely get bundled alongside the remake of Part I or the multiplayer game.

Sony basically implied there's gonna be a PS5 version today.

How did they basically imply that? Real question because I want to see how that narrative was created in your head.
 
Last edited:

Hatemachine

Banned
Mar 7, 2021
297
583
455
Even if they did remake the game for PS5, it'll still look mostly the same, so who gives a shit.
 
Jan 29, 2019
6,604
7,263
520
I guarantee there will be a native PS5 version of The Last of Us Part II.

It'll likely get bundled alongside the remake of Part I or the multiplayer game.

Sony basically implied there's gonna be a PS5 version today.

I see how you could read it that way, but you are setting yourself up for disappointment.

I for one can't wait for an Uncharted game where half the adventure does not consist of waiting for your partner to drop down the ladder while the next part of the game is loading. It will make them save tons of money on the studio time as well since they had to record dialogues for all these hidden loading screens!
alot of these games you mentioned dont even look like they have largely improved assets.
If you squint you'll see the difference.

These games are still played best on PC, at the very least they give more options (this is the main reason people play on PC).
 
Last edited:
  • Thoughtful
Reactions: DonJuanSchlong

jigglet

Member
May 18, 2020
2,973
5,509
630
No one could have predicted corona. I'm sure they expected a stronger first year of content.

In hindsight if they had known development would be this affected, I'm sure they would have focused heavily on remasters and bigger PS5 patches. This is the easiest sort of work to handle with a big distributed team as there is no vision that can be miscommunicated. The vision and design goals are already set in stone...they just have to make things prettier and run faster.
 
Last edited:

LMJ

Member
Feb 7, 2019
1,324
2,348
580
Give it time amigo, I'm sure Sony will have "ultimate PS4 Collection, or something for the V here down the line, but for now their big seller is still the 4

So it make sense to support patches first as that's the current demographic (those who upgraded)
 

Dust-by-Monday

Formerly 'just-a-spaz'
Mar 16, 2014
1,131
946
750
Surely the cost and resources of a native PS5 version isnt much if 3rf party developers manage to do it and many do it for free. There are native versiom of Avengers, Mortal Kombat 11, Borderlands 3, Doom Eternal, Metro Exodus, Nioh 2, Monster Boy, Terminator, No Man's Sky and etc. If it was so complicated and costly then why are 3rd party devs managing, this isn't just massive 3rd party publishers doing it with games like Fortnite but low budget games like Terminator.
Wreckfest, Control…
 

Kerotan

Member
Oct 31, 2018
2,528
3,325
475
It all sounds well and good but if Sony took resources away from new games to do these old remasters we'd have next level meltdowns.

I like this approach where awesome games get a much needed fps boost. I benefited from it with days gone and ghost of tsutshima.
 

kyliethicc

Member
Mar 14, 2020
5,589
27,178
590
I see how you could read it that way, but you are setting yourself up for disappointment.

I for one can't wait for an Uncharted game where half the adventure does not consist of waiting for your partner to drop down the ladder while the next part of the game is loading. It will make them save tons of money on the studio time as well since they had to record dialogues for all these hidden loading screens!

If you squint you'll see the difference.

These games are still played best on PC, at the very least they give more options (this is the main reason people play on PC).
Play The Lost Legacy then.
 

lucius

Member
Feb 21, 2006
3,850
137
1,510
I think that’s a terrible idea right now, later on down the line maybe for some of them but seems like a waste when you got many new games to focus on. The Dualsense support would be the biggest thing, increasing the games to 60 FPS does affect everything since the camera is so much smoother, running, jumping shooting, fighting looks much better. Horizon really needs a patch, that’s the one game I was surprised they didn’t do it yet.
 

skit_data

Member
Nov 3, 2020
2,224
5,381
425
I think that’s a terrible idea right now, later on down the line maybe for some of them but seems like a waste when you got many new games to focus on. The Dualsense support would be the biggest thing, increasing the games to 60 FPS does affect everything since the camera is so much smoother, running, jumping shooting, fighting looks much better. Horizon really needs a patch, that’s the one game I was surprised they didn’t do it yet.
We’ll probably get a Horizon ZD 60fps update closer to Forbidden Wests launch, similar to how Insomniac did with R&C.
 

thatJohann

Member
Jun 26, 2007
2,148
455
1,395
Brooklyn, NY
I just wish Sony had the same focus Xbox has on improving last gen games like smart delivery, FPS boost, auto hdr, 16x AF, much faster loading times etc etc.
 

sn0man

Member
Nov 23, 2013
1,437
953
620
Most of these games look excellent to begin with. A native port would be nice, but even I as a player don't see much point. 4k CB to 4k native, it's like yay but whatever. Pushing the LoDs 10 meters further, uhm ok. Increasing that texture resolution so I can zoom in 200% on a wall, eh.
I’m 100% with you but some 60fps GoT and TLOU2 in a complete edition would be pretty choice. Plus for a physical collector like me it’d be cool getting the patches and stuff on disc.
 
Jun 28, 2013
3,057
3,235
895
If you squint you'll see the difference.

These games are still played best on PC, at the very least they give more options (this is the main reason people play on PC).
But in the end normal people cant tell the difference. And it doesnt help the bottom line. Except when it comes to marketing terms. Therefore “game boost”
 

Rea

Member
Jul 7, 2020
932
3,739
420
Simple answer, Just No! Waste time, waste human resources. They better spend those resources on making new PS5 only games. For GOW, GOT, TLOU2, even though they are last gen games, their graphics visual quality are already superior than any other games out there, except for few games like RDR2 and Cyber punk. So 60fps patch for free is more than enough.
 

skit_data

Member
Nov 3, 2020
2,224
5,381
425
I’d rather take full on remakes of 2-3 gen old classics than remasters of last gens games
 

YeulEmeralda

Member
Aug 8, 2020
1,019
942
305
I see how you could read it that way, but you are setting yourself up for disappointment.

I for one can't wait for an Uncharted game where half the adventure does not consist of waiting for your partner to drop down the ladder while the next part of the game is loading. It will make them save tons of money on the studio time as well since they had to record dialogues for all these hidden loading screens!

If you squint you'll see the difference.

These games are still played best on PC, at the very least they give more options (this is the main reason people play on PC).

A $1500 PC will always beat consoles I don't think anyone would ever dispute that.
 

Dodkrake

Member
Feb 28, 2020
1,663
7,261
535
This seems to only be a problem for console gamers that don't have exclusives and prefer to play last gen games on new hardware. Nothing against it, and I wouldn't knock down free updates with better eye candy, but the games run on my PS5 just fine, and getting a free patch with better framerates and/or higher resolution is already a pretty good deal. Let studios focus on new games and projects.
 
  • Like
Reactions: alabtrosMyster