• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Sony has $10 billion left to spend on acquisitions through 2023

Square Enix should come with two really good western studios in Crystal Dynamics and Eidos Montreal. Eidos could make Sony a WRPG they are lacking. CD mucked up their last game, but they are a great studio.

I think the problem with Capcom and SE is that MS isnt interested in them. They are saving up for the online audience, and I bet they are going for either EA or Take2.

You make some good points on Eidos Montreal and CD, they would be good studio acquisitions just from a WRPG potential standpoint for sure. And apparently Guardians of the Galaxy was way better than it ever had any right to be (I never played it). The CD acqusition would be awkward, since they are basically making Perfect Dark at the moment.

While MS might not be interested, it does cement them for Sony and just allows their studios to grow much bigger (similar to the Bethesda deal for MS). I think Sony needs something like this to bolster their Spartacus initiatives as a rival to GamePass.

I just feel like EA or Take 2 is kind of a waste, and I'm not confident in the talent in those organizations. Sure, they have huge IP, but the quality/quantity just isn't really there for me. I'd rather Take 2, but they take forever to release games (when they do, they are massive though)
 
Last edited:

RevGaming

Member
Square is already pretty much exclusive it seems. Sony should just put a ring on it. Final Fantasy is the biggest IP of anything, and they have great underutilized IP as well (Chrono Trigger, Secret of Mana, Xenogears, etc). They have a massive GaaS with FF Online, and they provide RPGs as a counter to Bethesda being acquired.

Sony doesn't have as many exclusives with Capcom, and has probably a higher valuation relative to revenue. Capcom does have a bit larger global brands though, admittedly.
Do you ever think Square would backstab Sony after they saving them?

I think Capcom is more inclined to backstab Sony even tho they helped fund SF5.

I think it's safer to assume Square won't get bought. Maybe Microsoft doesn't want to handle the anime section from them and Square doesn't trust them.

Capcom, well the deal with MS almost went in 2014. Capcom barely got bought by MS.
 
Last edited:

vivftp

Member
Square Enix should come with two really good western studios in Crystal Dynamics and Eidos Montreal. Eidos could make Sony a WRPG they are lacking. CD mucked up their last game, but they are a great studio.

I think the problem with Capcom and SE is that MS isnt interested in them. They are saving up for the online audience, and I bet they are going for either EA or Take2.

Just my own personal opinion, but I don't see EA being worth it. In terms of dollar amount, I think Take Two is the absolute highest Sony might be willing to go for a reasonable return on investment. GTA is the crown jewel of crown jewels so that's an obvious plus. They'd get a couple more sports franchises under their belt with NHL and NBA plus everything else. Many of their IP could be used in Sony's transmedia approach (ie. we'd see the announcement of a GTA movie in record time) and Sony's got a good history with them (well, at least Rockstar).

As I mentioned above, in an ideal world if Sony were to acquire Take Two they'd opt to give them the Bungie deal where they remain an independent entity under SIE, free to publish on any platform they want. That way folks on other platforms don't get stripped of their content and Sony still gets to benefit from all the profits and from being able to fully leverage all the IP. They'd also get to take advantage of tech sharing, knowledge sharing and all the other fun stuff that comes with having new neighbors. I mean, if they're gonna learn a lot from Bungie to help out with their 10+ GAAS titles then imagine what they could learn from Rockstar, lol.

Speaking of the additional sports franchises, it seems that Sony's preparing to expand MLB even further than the current PS/Xbox/Switch platforms as San Diego Studio is hiring for folks with mobile experience. I'm sure before long we'll see a PC and mobile variant of MLB so it'll be on all platforms. In the event Sony were to acquire the rights to NLH and NBA 2k games then I wouldn't be surprised to see them negotiate with those respective organizations to do the same.
 

vivftp

Member
Do you ever thing Square would backstab Sony after they saving them?

I think Capcom is more inclined to backstab Sony even tho they helped fund SF5.

I think it's safer to assume Square won't get bought. Maybe Microsoft doesn't want to handle the anime section from them and Square doesn't trust them.

Capcom, well the deal with MS almost went in 2014. Capcom barely got bought by MS.

I think one of Sony's biggest cards they can play when trying to acquire Capcom or Square is the "Bungie deal" approach. Both companies also have close ties to Nintendo and they wouldn't want to piss off Nintendo and all those fans by stripping away all of their content from that platform. That just wouldn't sit right at all with anyone. If Sony offered the "Bungie deal" then post-acquisition those companies would still be free to publish on Switch or any other platform they choose to. Quite honestly it's the best guarantee against some other company swooping in and gobbling one of them up and ensures both Sony and Nintendo remain healthy.
 
Last edited:

yurinka

Member
I think one of Sony's biggest cards they can play when trying to acquire Capcom or Square is the "Bungie deal" approach. Both companies also have close ties to Nintendo and they wouldn't want to piss off Nintendo and all those fans by stripping away all of their content from that platform. That just wouldn't sit right at all with anyone. If Sony offered the "Bungie deal" then post-acquisition those companies would still be free to publish on Switch or any other platform they choose to. Quite honestly it's the best guarantee against some other company swooping in and gobbling one of them up and ensures both Sony and Nintendo remain healthy.
Yes, I think that if Sony acquires them, they will follow the same concept that Bungie: they will continue being their own multiplatform publisher under SIE, separated from PS Studios and selfpublishing their games with creative freedom. I think Sony made this structure to include more acquired publishers in the near future.

In this case those games they release for Nintendo wouldn't be exclusives anymore (I mean the next ones to be released, the ones signed pre-acquisition ones remain as they are), in the same way they wouldn't have Xbox exclusives anymore, the next ones for Switch/Switch 2 would be released both for PS, Nintendo and PC. They would continue releasing normal multiplatform games, being them day one on PS/XB/PC.

And as something that I think Bungie will also do, after acquisition the only game subscription that would have their games would be the Sony one. Both for upcoming new games and for catalog games. Sony would also bring all their IPs with potential to cinema, tv shows or anime.
 
Last edited:

vivftp

Member
Yes, I think that if Sony acquires them, they will follow the same concept that Bungie: they will continue being their own multiplatform publisher under SIE, separated from PS Studios and selfpublishing their games with creative freedom. I think Sony made this structure to include more acquired publishers in the near future.

In this case those games they release for Nintendo wouldn't be exclusives anymore (I mean the next ones to be released, the ones signed pre-acquisition ones remain as they are), in the same way they wouldn't have Xbox exclusives anymore, the next ones for Switch/Switch 2 would be released both for PS, Nintendo and PC. They would continue releasing normal multiplatform games, being them day one on PS/XB/PC.

And as something that I think Bungie will also do, after acquisition the only game subscription that would have their games would be the Sony one. Both for upcoming new games and for catalog games. Sony would also bring all their IPs with potential to cinema, tv shows or anime.

Pretty much, that's how I think they may proceed. I like the approach a lot as everyone benefits and no path of destruction is left in its wake, but we'll just have to wait and see what the reality will be should such an acquisition occur.
 

yurinka

Member
Pretty much, that's how I think they may proceed. I like the approach a lot as everyone benefits and no path of destruction is left in its wake, but we'll just have to wait and see what the reality will be should such an acquisition occur.
Yes. The more people enjoy the games, the better.
 

RevGaming

Member
I think one of Sony's biggest cards they can play when trying to acquire Capcom or Square is the "Bungie deal" approach. Both companies also have close ties to Nintendo and they wouldn't want to piss off Nintendo and all those fans by stripping away all of their content from that platform. That just wouldn't sit right at all with anyone. If Sony offered the "Bungie deal" then post-acquisition those companies would still be free to publish on Switch or any other platform they choose to. Quite honestly it's the best guarantee against some other company swooping in and gobbling one of them up and ensures both Sony and Nintendo remain healthy.
What if they keep supporting the switch and not xbox?

I mean they need to get something to bargain xbox with. Like trade capcom games for bethesda?
 

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
Yes, I think that if Sony acquires them, they will follow the same concept that Bungie: they will continue being their own multiplatform publisher under SIE, separated from PS Studios and selfpublishing their games with creative freedom. I think Sony made this structure to include more acquired publishers in the near future.

In this case those games they release for Nintendo wouldn't be exclusives anymore (I mean the next ones to be released, the ones signed pre-acquisition ones remain as they are), in the same way they wouldn't have Xbox exclusives anymore, the next ones for Switch/Switch 2 would be released both for PS, Nintendo and PC. They would continue releasing normal multiplatform games, being them day one on PS/XB/PC.

And as something that I think Bungie will also do, after acquisition the only game subscription that would have their games would be the Sony one. Both for upcoming new games and for catalog games. Sony would also bring all their IPs with potential to cinema, tv shows or anime.
I think Sony is getting better and better at growing organically and setting up the right M&A work yes. Good points.
 

hussar16

Member
With Microsoft taking all the American top devs , Sony should buy out the Japanese ones.capcom and Konami. It's only fair thing to do and I actually believe that Microsoft doesnt want these companies anyway otherwise they'd buy them by now.microsoft seems to want the American market first and doesn't care about Japan or their developers
 

Zeroing

Banned
With Microsoft taking all the American top devs , Sony should buy out the Japanese ones.capcom and Konami. It's only fair thing to do and I actually believe that Microsoft doesnt want these companies anyway otherwise they'd buy them by now.microsoft seems to want the American market first and doesn't care about Japan or their developers
MS is after big IPs to milk them as then done in the past.
They done so because they though Goggle and Amazon would do it.

Sony is betting on growing studios carefully and betting on multiplayer and FPS!
 

SlimySnake

Gold Member
You make some good points on Eidos Montreal and CD, they would be good studio acquisitions just from a WRPG potential standpoint for sure. And apparently Guardians of the Galaxy was way better than it ever had any right to be (I never played it). The CD acqusition would be awkward, since they are basically making Perfect Dark at the moment.

While MS might not be interested, it does cement them for Sony and just allows their studios to grow much bigger (similar to the Bethesda deal for MS). I think Sony needs something like this to bolster their Spartacus initiatives as a rival to GamePass.

I just feel like EA or Take 2 is kind of a waste, and I'm not confident in the talent in those organizations. Sure, they have huge IP, but the quality/quantity just isn't really there for me. I'd rather Take 2, but they take forever to release games (when they do, they are massive though)
Guardians is excellent. it's basically a Naughty Dog game.

I think in terms of content, Sony would be lucky to have Capcom and SE. it makes perfect sense. However, I see Satya's comments and it is obvious his mission is to be the only player in the market. He isnt out for content. He wants to be the platform holder like he is on windows. If he wanted content, he wouldve bought SE, Capcom, Take2 and Ubisoft. The fact that he went after COD is clearly to pressure Sony into dropping the console business and go third party and for the reason I think he will go after Take2 or EA next. They get GTA or Fifa and Sony will have no choice but to fold.

I was looking at yearly revenues and Take2 is only at $3 billion which is basically what SE did last year. Though they did have a FF single player game which comes out once every 5 years. Take2 is valued very high and them buying Zynga complicates things for both Sony and MS.

Jim said hes going multiplatform and has 10 GaaS games coming out in the next 5 years. So tbh, I am not sure what they are thinking. Have they decided to leave the console business? Are they developing these games in order to protect themselves from CoD and GTA leaving? If they buy SE and Capcom, they should have some leverage.
 
Marc Lamont Hill Wtf GIF by Identity
 

RevGaming

Member
They get GTA or Fifa and Sony will have no choice but to fold.
Pffffff. They rather try and see if they can capture those casuals with their GaaS of their own and it would probably work because these casuals play anything that's garbage. What is this? Sony doesn't give up like that lol.
I was looking at yearly revenues and Take2 is only at $3 billion which is basically what SE did last year. Though they did have a FF single player game which comes out once every 5 years. Take2 is valued very high and them buying Zynga complicates things for both Sony and MS.
Variety can trump two or 3 popular games.
Jim said hes going multiplatform and has 10 GaaS games coming out in the next 5 years. So tbh, I am not sure what they are thinking. Have they decided to leave the console business? Are they developing these games in order to protect themselves from CoD and GTA leaving? If they buy SE and Capcom, they should have some leverage.
They don't need too buy them. Capcom would make sense, but honestly, it's like Sony doesn't have the option to react by themselves. MS can't buy every publisher. Maybe 1 more.

Sony it's not talking to Capcom today and acting like : "Capcom please let us buy you or we'll die".
 
Last edited:

SlimySnake

Gold Member
Pffffff. They rather try and see if they can capture those casuals with their GaaS of their own and it would probably work because these casuals play anything that's garbage. What is this? Sony doesn't give up like that lol.

Variety can trump two or 3 popular games.

They don't need too buy them. Capcom would make sense, but honestly, it's like Sony doesn't have the option to react by themselves. MS can't buy every publisher. Maybe 1 more.

Sony it's not talking to Capcom today and acting like : "Capcom please let us buy you or we'll die".
I would say out of those ten GaaS games, maybe 1-2 will be successful, and while replacing CoD might be easier with a battle royale game like Fortnite or Apex, there is no way anyone can make a GTA Online kind of game. Other than Rockstar of course.

I agree, to me and you variety will trump CoD and GTA online, but 55% of console players CoD and 41% play GTA online. Most of those are on PS consoles. They are who make the vast majority of Sony's 48 million PS+ subs. THats $3 billion in revenue from PS+ alone.

So Sony wont just be losing those players. They will be losing $1.5 billion in what is pure profit from PS+. My point is that any cash they spend on Capcom or SE will be cash they couldve spent on Take2. They can survive losing RE which sells 5 million Lifetime or Final Fantasy which comes out once every five years. They have to prioritize GTA Online over everything.
 

RevGaming

Member
I would say out of those ten GaaS games, maybe 1-2 will be successful,
We have no clue. It could be 6. We don't know. Wish people had a little faith.

and while replacing CoD might be easier with a battle royale game like Fortnite or Apex, there is no way anyone can make a GTA Online kind of game. Other than Rockstar of course.

Maybe GTA6 doesn't do as well?

Thats $3 billion in revenue from PS+ alone.
Well people should have asked Sony to make multiplayer games and now they're all fear mongering lol. I wanted factions 2 but people were like, people buy tlou for just SinGle PlAyER, which is true, but look at us now.
So Sony wont just be losing those players.
They have time to react. If Factions 2 and GT7 are big, that's a good start.
My point is that any cash they spend on Capcom or SE will be cash they couldve spent on Take2.
Make Street Fighter 6 have better graphics than MK11 and Make MH6 GaaS, similar to Destiny. Yeah it won't be as a big, but they don't have to.
They have to prioritize GTA Online over everything.
No they don't. What is this? Not every IP survives for ever.

BELIEVE IN SONY

BELIEVE IT!!
 

yurinka

Member
I think Sony is getting better and better at growing organically and setting up the right M&A work yes. Good points.
When announcing they bought Bungie Sony said they expect do double their first party game revenue from now to March 2026. I'd say it either means a ton of unannounced games will be released in the next 4 years due to this organical growth or that maybe as Jimbo said there are more acquisitions coming soon. I think both things will happen, and that one of the acquisitions will be a Capcom sized publisher.

So ... Sony... you gonna buy Konami now or later then?!
I think Konami would be too expensive for this budget, and that they would be someone with more active AAA IPs and AAA dev teams. But if we look at the numbers they do in mobile gaming, their back catalog IPs and potential for movie/tv adaptations I think they could be a good candidate.
 
Last edited:

SiteSeer

Member
sony needs take two to keep leverage in the industry. tit-for-tat ‘you keep such and such multi platform we’ll keep gta multi platform.’
 

NoobleBear

Member
Buying Konami to get what? Metal Gear Solid and 2 dead franchises? (Silent Hill and Castlevania)

Nostalgia is a bitch. I'd love those Metal Gear remakes...but they are never buying Konami to get those. The company is actually quite huge overall. Unless somehow they buy the IP.
I'd settle with them buying the IP rights to Castlevania, Silent Hill, and Contra. I think because the franchises are considered "dead" they'd probably be able to purchase the company for a lower price than a company like Bungie which only has one franchise. I know Konami does a lot of casino machines and crap like that so maybe Sony would see that as a plus to break into another market who knows.
 
Buying Konami to get what? Metal Gear Solid and 2 dead franchises? (Silent Hill and Castlevania)

Nostalgia is a bitch. I'd love those Metal Gear remakes...but they are never buying Konami to get those. The company is actually quite huge overall. Unless somehow they buy the IP.
The obsession with buying Konami makes literally no sense.

Metal Gear is pretty dead too. One you don't have a developer for it and two the series has consistently sold less and less. Maybe a reboot changes that, but looking at how it sells across platforms, a big purchase certainly doesn't make any sense. MGS5 sold like 1 million copies on PS4. Metal Gear Solid 3 did 6 million on PS3. That's the wrong direction for a platform that did significantly better, particularly in North America and Europe.

Castlevania and Silent Hill are both largely worthless. Like MGS neither series creative directors are still at Konami, which means you'll need to find a new team to do both franchises. In best-case scenario, you put Castlevania in the hands of Sony Santa Monica, but is that a great use of their time? Is it going to outperform God of War? Santa Monica is going to be busy with their new IP and probably God of War 1-3 remakes for the rest of the generation. Neither Castlevania or Silent Hill have ever been that popular. At best you'd be buying these to modernize them, but what does that have to do with giving Konami billions of dollars?

Pro Evolution Soccer/Winning Eleven is probably their only valuable franchise remaining, especially if EA loses the FIFA license.
 

NoobleBear

Member
The obsession with buying Konami makes literally no sense.

Metal Gear is pretty dead too. One you don't have a developer for it and two the series has consistently sold less and less. Maybe a reboot changes that, but looking at how it sells across platforms, a big purchase certainly doesn't make any sense. MGS5 sold like 1 million copies on PS4. Metal Gear Solid 3 did 6 million on PS3. That's the wrong direction for a platform that did significantly better, particularly in North America and Europe.

Castlevania and Silent Hill are both largely worthless. Like MGS neither series creative directors are still at Konami, which means you'll need to find a new team to do both franchises. In best-case scenario, you put Castlevania in the hands of Sony Santa Monica, but is that a great use of their time? Is it going to outperform God of War? Santa Monica is going to be busy with their new IP and probably God of War 1-3 remakes for the rest of the generation. Neither Castlevania or Silent Hill have ever been that popular. At best you'd be buying these to modernize them, but what does that have to do with giving Konami billions of dollars?

Pro Evolution Soccer/Winning Eleven is probably their only valuable franchise remaining, especially if EA loses the FIFA license.
Ok fine, then they should buy Capcom... I"m trying to be realistic here lol. *edit: just looked up Capcoms net worth and it's under $5B. They could buy both! :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 
Last edited:
I'd settle with them buying the IP rights to Castlevania, Silent Hill, and Contra. I think because the franchises are considered "dead" they'd probably be able to purchase the company for a lower price than a company like Bungie which only has one franchise. I know Konami does a lot of casino machines and crap like that so maybe Sony would see that as a plus to break into another market who knows.
Companies don't sell their IP anymore, it just doesn't happen. It's almost impossible to find a price that would make sense to both parties. It's why Sony never bought Crash Bandicoot and Spyro the Dragon back. Don't you think it would have made sense to try and get these franchises back in house even if Naughty Dog and Insomniac didn't work on them? But what's the value of the franchise? When the games were selling 6-8 million copies a pop?

On PS4, Crash trilogy remake did 2.5 million copies, Spyro did 2.17.

Crash 4 (multiplatform) debuted 11th on the NPD list. It was off the list by November. Player count estimates had it below 850k by the end of November across platforms. That's pretty bad. It might get a bump with Microsoft advertising budgets, but it's never going to be the franchise it was during the PS1 days, unlike Mario which is still relevant, the series just never evolved.
 
I'd settle with them buying the IP rights to Castlevania, Silent Hill, and Contra. I think because the franchises are considered "dead" they'd probably be able to purchase the company for a lower price than a company like Bungie which only has one franchise. I know Konami does a lot of casino machines and crap like that so maybe Sony would see that as a plus to break into another market who knows.
Contra? Sony would gain nothing by having that IP.
Ok fine, then they should buy Capcom... I"m trying to be realistic here lol. *edit: just looked up Capcoms net worth and it's under $5B. They could buy both! :messenger_tears_of_joy:
Capcom is much more realistic. They'd get Monster Hunter (which is honestly a system seller at this point), Resident Evil, a fighting game that would go along with their Evo plans (Street Fighter), Devil May Cry, Dead Rising, etc...
 

NoobleBear

Member
Companies don't sell their IP anymore, it just doesn't happen. It's almost impossible to find a price that would make sense to both parties. It's why Sony never bought Crash Bandicoot and Spyro the Dragon back. Don't you think it would have made sense to try and get these franchises back in house even if Naughty Dog and Insomniac didn't work on them? But what's the value of the franchise? When the games were selling 6-8 million copies a pop?

On PS4, Crash trilogy remake did 2.5 million copies, Spyro did 2.17.

Crash 4 (multiplatform) debuted 11th on the NPD list. It was off the list by November. Player count estimates had it below 850k by the end of November across platforms. That's pretty bad. It might get a bump with Microsoft advertising budgets, but it's never going to be the franchise it was during the PS1 days, unlike Mario which is still relevant, the series just never evolved.
Right, that's why I was saying to just buy the company outright. Here are my picks for Sony to potentially pickup in no specific order, bonus points if they acquire more than one. Also, keep in mind Sony is in the movie business as well so any IP they pickup they can farm out to make movies as well. Here's my dream list:
1. Capcom
2. Konami
3. Sega
 
Ok fine, then they should buy Capcom... I"m trying to be realistic here lol. *edit: just looked up Capcoms net worth and it's under $5B. They could buy both! :messenger_tears_of_joy:
Add a premium to actually buy the stock and for Capcom alone you're probably looking at 7.5 to 8 billion dollars.

I think Capcom would make a lot of sense, but Konami makes zero.

I think for Japan you want to buy From Software even if you have to buy all of Kadokawa to do it, but it also makes sense to buy Capcom or Sega.

Square Enix and Konami are bad choices and every other major publisher is probably too big.

I can see Sony buying Capcom or Sega and whichever company they don't buy merging with Konami.
 

SlimySnake

Gold Member
The obsession with buying Konami makes literally no sense.

Metal Gear is pretty dead too. One you don't have a developer for it and two the series has consistently sold less and less. Maybe a reboot changes that, but looking at how it sells across platforms, a big purchase certainly doesn't make any sense. MGS5 sold like 1 million copies on PS4. Metal Gear Solid 3 did 6 million on PS3. That's the wrong direction for a platform that did significantly better, particularly in North America and Europe.

Castlevania and Silent Hill are both largely worthless. Like MGS neither series creative directors are still at Konami, which means you'll need to find a new team to do both franchises. In best-case scenario, you put Castlevania in the hands of Sony Santa Monica, but is that a great use of their time? Is it going to outperform God of War? Santa Monica is going to be busy with their new IP and probably God of War 1-3 remakes for the rest of the generation. Neither Castlevania or Silent Hill have ever been that popular. At best you'd be buying these to modernize them, but what does that have to do with giving Konami billions of dollars?

Pro Evolution Soccer/Winning Eleven is probably their only valuable franchise remaining, especially if EA loses the FIFA license.
It's the obsession with old franchises in general. People cant seem to let go of their favorite franchises.

I see people want MS to acquire Sega lol. Sega.
 
Right, that's why I was saying to just buy the company outright. Here are my picks for Sony to potentially pickup in no specific order, bonus points if they acquire more than one. Also, keep in mind Sony is in the movie business as well so any IP they pickup they can farm out to make movies as well. Here's my dream list:
1. Capcom
2. Konami
3. Sega

Konami has a market cap of 8 billion dollars. To buy them would cost 12+ billion. To get Metal Gear Solid, Winning Eleven Soccer, Castlevania, and Silent Hill? With no developer talent to speak of? Does this sound like a smart move to you?

Sega makes WAY more sense. They have a market cap of 4 billion dollars and way more talent and active IP.

Sonic - Could make a comeback say in the hands of Insomniac, but honestly isn't worth
Persona - Series on a huge upswing and close ties with Sony
Shin Megami Tensei - Series on the up as associated with Persona
Yakuza - Decent sized franchise, could get a level up with Sony funding
Total War - Not sure how this would do on console even with KBM support, but Sony really doesn't have anything like this
Virtua Fighter - Would give you an evo fighting game
Shenmue - Shenmue 1-3 remake would be easy enough to do, especially if the show is in anyway successful

When you compare Sega and Capcom it is a no brainer dollar for dollar. Capcom is a better buy.

Capcom
From Software
Level-5

Those are the best options in Japan right now

in the West Take2 or CD Projekt but those are obviously much larger investments (take2, that is).
 
Last edited:
It's the obsession with old franchises in general. People cant seem to let go of their favorite franchises.

I see people want MS to acquire Sega lol. Sega.
I think it would make a lot of sense for Microsoft to buy Sega, especially if Sony were to buy Capcom. Whether they could get passed the market and regulators is another thing.

They would get Total War for PC which they could have along side Age of Empire. They'd have a fighting game and you could put Sonic together with Crash, Banjo Kazooie, and Spyro. Getting Persona wouldn't hurt them either. Small purchase for them to get some decent Eastern talent.
 
Sony definitely wants From Software, but 2.72B dollars plus premium is a lot of money for a company that doesn't own any of its own IP. Doesn't make sense to buy the parent company wholly when they don't give you much of anything. I think that is the only sticking point.

Sony could have bought From Software back in 2014. They worked with them on Demon's Souls in 2009. Dark Souls came out in 2011. Dark Soul's 2 came out in March 2014. Kadokawa bought them in April 2014.

Now you'd have to pay a huge premium to buy them.

In October of 2014, Kadokawa was worth 1130 yen per stock.

They had a 2:1 stock split in 2021.

Their stock is currently 2255 yen, meaning Kadokawa is actually worth 4x what they were before they bought From Software give or take a few months (I only have their stock info dating to 10/14, they bought From in 4/14).
 
Add a premium to actually buy the stock and for Capcom alone you're probably looking at 7.5 to 8 billion dollars.

I think Capcom would make a lot of sense, but Konami makes zero.

I think for Japan you want to buy From Software even if you have to buy all of Kadokawa to do it, but it also makes sense to buy Capcom or Sega.

Square Enix and Konami are bad choices and every other major publisher is probably too big.

I can see Sony buying Capcom or Sega and whichever company they don't buy merging with Konami.

Why is Square bad?
 
MS is after big IPs to milk them as then done in the past.
They done so because they though Goggle and Amazon would do it.

Sony is betting on growing studios carefully and betting on multiplayer and FPS!
Milk them? Other than the debacle with early Rare pre-2010, who have the milked?

They bought Minecraft, have improved it and made it even more successful than it was.

Even Rare, made Sea of Thieves and is the most successful title they’ve ever made and has millions of players.

Allowed Obsidian to make a niche game like Grounded which has been successful for them and are now working on a big RPG called Avowed.

Brought in the insanely talented Playground Games and they just launched with FH5 which is insanely successful at 18 million players after only 4 months, they are also making the new Fable.

I’ve heard nothing but good things from developers about being with MS/Xbox, they give them full freedom to make what they want and give them all the resources and investment they need.
 
Why is Square bad?
Because purchasing would be based off nostalgia and symbolism rather than prudent financial sense.

Square Enix had only a handful of best selling PS4 games

FF7 Remake
FF15
DQ11
FF12 Remaster
Kingdom Hearts 3

Collectively, these games sold about 11 million copies, though admittantly doesn't taken into consideration revenues from FF14.

Is this limited level of success (and declining) worth 6.5b (plus premium). At the end of the day you're probably looking at 10 billion dollars or a billion dollars for each million copies sold on PS4...

That's madness CD Projekt would cost less and would give you access to the witcher series that sold by itself almost as much as all of the games I listed combined as well as Cyberpunk 2077. Now throw in GOG to boot and rebrand it to the PlayStation Store. All of that for HALF the price of Square Enix.
 
Because purchasing would be based off nostalgia and symbolism rather than prudent financial sense.

Square Enix had only a handful of best selling PS4 games

FF7 Remake
FF15
DQ11
FF12 Remaster
Kingdom Hearts 3

Collectively, these games sold about 11 million copies, though admittantly doesn't taken into consideration revenues from FF14.

Is this limited level of success (and declining) worth 6.5b (plus premium). At the end of the day you're probably looking at 10 billion dollars or a billion dollars for each million copies sold on PS4...

That's madness CD Projekt would cost less and would give you access to the witcher series that sold by itself almost as much as all of the games I listed combined as well as Cyberpunk 2077. Now throw in GOG to boot and rebrand it to the PlayStation Store. All of that for HALF the price of Square Enix.

Final Fantasy is an enormous IP and FF14 is hugely successful as a GaaS. Dragon Quest is another huge IP that is becoming more popular globally.

They also have a lot of talented teams that have improved greatly over the ps4 generation

Capcom has RE and Monster Hunter with lesser titles, so they are just as reliant on a few IPs

I feel Square’s IP is more valuable to Sony in claiming the JRPG market
 
Final Fantasy is an enormous IP and FF14 is hugely successful as a GaaS. Dragon Quest is another huge IP that is becoming more popular globally.

They also have a lot of talented teams that have improved greatly over the ps4 generation

Capcom has RE and Monster Hunter with lesser titles, so they are just as reliant on a few IPs

I feel Square’s IP is more valuable to Sony in claiming the JRPG market
Enourmous historically, not really enourmous at this time.

Square Enix has a market cap of 6.05b, meaning you're looking at anywhere close to 9b.

Is the JRPG market worth 9B?
 

DarthPutin

Member
That's madness CD Projekt would cost less and would give you access to the witcher series that sold by itself almost as much as all of the games I listed combined as well as Cyberpunk 2077. Now throw in GOG to boot and rebrand it to the PlayStation Store. All of that for HALF the price of Square Enix.
I thought I've read that CD Projekt was expensive? I'm not sure how to check it for sure, but ycharts says that today CD is 4.67 Bil and Squenix 6.2 Bil. Both went up as high as 8 bil at some points (not sure how reliable is this site)

I'm not sure Sony even wants a company perceived as "messy" and with controversy surrounding them. Don't get me wrong, unless they've lost the talent from W3 (some people left but then it's natural thing), they remain potentially great studio, but seems OOC for Sony to partner with people they have troubled history with. They always seemed to me very careful/pretty conservative.
 

thenordicstar

Neo Member
Because purchasing would be based off nostalgia and symbolism rather than prudent financial sense.

Square Enix had only a handful of best selling PS4 games

FF7 Remake
FF15
DQ11
FF12 Remaster
Kingdom Hearts 3

Collectively, these games sold about 11 million copies, though admittantly doesn't taken into consideration revenues from FF14.

Is this limited level of success (and declining) worth 6.5b (plus premium). At the end of the day you're probably looking at 10 billion dollars or a billion dollars for each million copies sold on PS4...

That's madness CD Projekt would cost less and would give you access to the witcher series that sold by itself almost as much as all of the games I listed combined as well as Cyberpunk 2077. Now throw in GOG to boot and rebrand it to the PlayStation Store. All of that for HALF the price of Square Enix.
OMG, Square Enix is one of the richest indepent gaming companies and I wouldnt be suprised if they start to buy some studios for themselves and they have the same revenue as take two,
 
Because purchasing would be based off nostalgia and symbolism rather than prudent financial sense.

Square Enix had only a handful of best selling PS4 games

FF7 Remake
FF15
DQ11
FF12 Remaster
Kingdom Hearts 3

Collectively, these games sold about 11 million copies, though admittantly doesn't taken into consideration revenues from FF14.

Is this limited level of success (and declining) worth 6.5b (plus premium). At the end of the day you're probably looking at 10 billion dollars or a billion dollars for each million copies sold on PS4...

That's madness CD Projekt would cost less and would give you access to the witcher series that sold by itself almost as much as all of the games I listed combined as well as Cyberpunk 2077. Now throw in GOG to boot and rebrand it to the PlayStation Store. All of that for HALF the price of Square Enix.
Now add all the games that they did not release on PS4.

Also, just DQXI: Echoes of an Elusive Age and KH3 sold 11M at least. So, don’t know where you’re getting your numbers feom.
 

yurinka

Member
Capcom is roughly the same

Is RE and MonHun worth 9B?
Even if the market cap is the same, Square Enix makes way, way more revenue. I'd say Capcom's acquisition would cost $6-9B. But if we consider Bethesda's price $7.5B as a reference yes, Capcom is worth more than that.

Capcom is much more than RE and MH. They also have DMC or SF, to have a dominant presence in 4 genres/niches. Plus smaller beloved series like Mega Man, Ace Attorney or G&G perfect for game subs, several big dormant IPs with potential like Marvel vs Capcom, Onimusha, Lost Planet, Dino Crisis or Dead Rising a ton of back catalog full of classics, proven success in movies, tv shows and animations plus many workers, the ability of creating more top AAA new IPs (Pragmata and another one were planned for this year, maybe delayed due to covid), presence in mobile etc.


Because purchasing would be based off nostalgia and symbolism rather than prudent financial sense.

Square Enix had only a handful of best selling PS4 games

FF7 Remake
FF15
DQ11
FF12 Remaster
Kingdom Hearts 3

Collectively, these games sold about 11 million copies, though admittantly doesn't taken into consideration revenues from FF14.

Is this limited level of success (and declining) worth 6.5b (plus premium). At the end of the day you're probably looking at 10 billion dollars or a billion dollars for each million copies sold on PS4...

That's madness CD Projekt would cost less and would give you access to the witcher series that sold by itself almost as much as all of the games I listed combined as well as Cyberpunk 2077. Now throw in GOG to boot and rebrand it to the PlayStation Store. All of that for HALF the price of Square Enix.
FFXIV as of now is the most successful MMORPG in the market and it's the most profitable game in the series. Plus I don't have their numbers but I'd bet these games you listed combined sold way more than 11M.
 
Last edited:
Even if the market cap is the same, Square Enix makes way, way more revenue. I'd say Capcom's acquisition would cost $6-9B. But if we consider Bethesda's price $7.5B as a reference yes, Capcom is worth more than that.


I didn't mean to say that Capcom wasn't worth that amount.

I was just saying that, all else being equal, if I can purchase either Square or Capcom for roughly the same amount (but I can only buy one), I would easily go with Square.
 
Last edited:
Even if the market cap is the same, Square Enix makes way, way more revenue. I'd say Capcom's acquisition would cost $6-9B. But if we consider Bethesda's price $7.5B as a reference yes, Capcom is worth more than that.

Capcom is much more than RE and MH. They also have DMC or SF, to have a dominant presence in 4 genres/niches. Plus smaller beloved series like Mega Man, Ace Attorney or G&G perfect for game subs, several big dormant IPs with potential like Marvel vs Capcom, Onimusha, Lost Planet, Dino Crisis or Dead Rising a ton of back catalog full of classics, proven success in movies, tv shows and animations plus many workers, the ability of creating more top AAA new IPs (Pragmata and another one were planned for this year, maybe delayed due to covid), presence in mobile etc.



FFXIV as of now is the most successful MMORPG in the market and it's the most profitable game in the series. Plus I don't have their numbers but I'd bet these games you listed combined sold way more than 11M.
They didn’t and FF14s success has no guarantee over the next 10 plus years. You but companies for their future not their past.
 

yurinka

Member
They didn’t and FF14s success has no guarantee over the next 10 plus years. You but companies for their future not their past.
Square Enix makes almost $3B/year (+ profit), they have way more than FF14. Someone could pay $12B for them in 4 or 5 years they will already have generated that revenue.
 
Last edited:
Square Enix makes almost $3B/year (+ profit), they have way more than FF14. Someone could pay $12B for them in 4 or 5 years they will already have generated that revenue.
Please learn the difference between profit and revenue.

Square Enix had their best net income in 2021 in the last 5 years.

Net Income
2021 - 233 million dollars
2020 - 185 million dollars
2019 - 167 million dollars
2018 - 223 million dollars
2017 - 173 million dollars

Over the last 5 years, they made 981 million dollars as a multiplatform publisher. They'd certainly make less as an exclusive PlayStation Studio.

So you're looking at a billion dollars over 5 years, extrapolate that to 2 billion dollars over 10 years.

With a conservative 130% acquisition price over market capital you're looking at at least 8 billion dollars to buy square enix and what recover that over the next 40 years if you keep them multiplatform? And as I mentioned before a lot of their profit comes from FF14 and they'd have to replicate that success, which is a gamble. Who sees Sony buying Square Enix to keep them multiplatform? This isn't like Bungie. This means it would take you even MORE than 40 years to recover the investment. That's a longer period of time than either Dragon Quest or Final Fantasy has even been IP. But what gets worse is when you look at the previous 15 years of Square Enix net profit...

These last 5 years have been their best. There were years when they didn't clear 100 million and even years where they lost money.

Just overall a poor investment to make unless you buy thinking you could really turn their studio around and probably keep publishing games on PC and Switch at least.
 
Last edited:
Top Bottom