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[Airbus Jr]

You're not very smart.

If you actually read the sentence it's self-explanatory. The PS4 has a PS2 emulator built-in, so Sony COULD have BC, they just won't.

Go play on PC if you care so much about backward compatibilty

PC backward compatibilty eternal forever

Us at PS are more concerned about future games

People here are getting fed up with your anoying anti PS post

 

[Ivellios]

Does the OP need to fill a personal quota of Sony is doomed/ Stadia and Microsoft are the future threads?

 

[Shifty]

You're not very smart.

If you actually read the sentence it's self-explanatory. The PS4 has a PS2 emulator built-in, so Sony COULD have BC, they just won't.

That's pretty fucking rich coming from you, mister walking clickbait headline nice to see you actually reply to one of your own trash threads though.

And no, PS4 does not ship with a built-in emulator. The emulator and PS2 BIOS are packaged individually with each game, because software PS2 emulation is a technical challenge and often needs specific per-game fixes in order to run properly.

Same methodology the industry has been using on things like classic collections for years now.

 

[Rayderism]

What's that built-in ps2 emulation locked behind paywall thing?

I assume he meant the fact that you can't put a PS2 disc in the PS4 and play it. The only way to play a PS2 game on PS4 is to buy from the limited selection they made available on PSN. Hackers have proven that PS4 has the ability to play many PS2 games at a 4x up-res that aren't available on PSN, but not by putting in a disc. Therefore, PS2 support can be considered as being locked behind a paywall.

 

[Rugabuga]

Surprised the OP didn't meantion the shitshow around PS Plus

 

[Voost Kain]

I assume he meant the fact that you can't put a PS2 disc in the PS4 and play it. The only way to play a PS2 game on PS4 is to buy from the limited selection they made available on PSN. Hackers have proven that PS4 has the ability to play many PS2 games at a 4x up-res that aren't available on PSN, but not by putting in a disc. Therefore, PS2 support can be considered as being locked behind a paywall.

Yep, simple.

Poor @ Shifty

 

[Azelover]

Truth is, Arrogant Sony never went away. But they got a mayhem on great first party games, so people were to busy playing to notice it.

The only pro consumer thing Sony has done was spitting out so many games. Not supporting cross play, digital refunds, not supporting mods (at first), along with all OP's reasons make me wonder how come people just blindly has accepted the business of Sony.

Yes. Sony has been arrogant since the very beginning. With the PS1.

It's just their way. Difference is, with PS1, PS2 and PS4, they were delivering quality for a good price. And with PS3 they didn't at first. That's the only difference. In fact, I think they've been most arrogant with the PS1, than any other system.

 

[Afro Republican]

While 49 users on gaf so far are very mad and may not buy a PS5 due to censorship, and 49 are iffy and taking a wait and see approach, that's the only thing that's really an issue.

the rest of the Op is all over the place. Nobody is selling their PS4's because of thumbsticks and 18 year old PS2 games.

Saying the word "complacency" without context means nothing.

Also PSN customer service? Why are we pretending that Xbox's and Nintendo customer service is better? They are all shit.

Also Sony Controls Japanese retail release dates in the west???

 

[Shifty]

Yep, simple.

Poor @ Shifty

Poor Voost Kain. Doesn't know how to @ properly, and needs someone else to bail them out by moving the goalposts when their argument is deconstructed

God forbid that a platform holder should charge for the time and money spent tweaking and QAing a software-emulated PS2 classics release to work within console quality standards.

 

[MDSLKTR]

Voost is very smart. A very stable genius.

 

[Snake29]

We can already predict that his next thread will be about Phil Spencer, and how he is the messiah and savior of global gaming.

Haters have no time for gaming, since Microsoft has nothing usefull to play in the coming years. So yeah, let’s just make worthless threads about the conpetition.

 

[Shifty]

Voost is very smart. A very stable genius.

To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to understand Voost & Kainy. The humour is extremely subtle, and without a solid grasp of theoretical physics most of the jokes will go over a typical reader's head. There's also Voost's nihilistic outlook, which is deftly woven into his characterisation - his personal philosophy draws heavily from Narodnaya Volya literature, for instance. The fans understand this stuff; they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depths of these jokes, to realize that they're not just funny- they say something deep about LIFE.

Spoiler

/s

 

[BusierDonkey]

Censorship on an increasing number of games Legit concern from me as well, but not only from Sony as it's an industry hurdle right now. Google will be 100 times worse, but you never seem to mention that in your abundant pro-Stadia threads. Compare Google search results to duckduckgo on controversial topics and you'll see just how much they love to censor.
Hesitant of crossplay Any time they agree to it, they are actively boosting the appeal of their competitors. They do crossplay with the PC, and the PS4 install base is more than the Switch/Xbox combined so why would they? MS does cross-play because they need to, Nintendo does because they have long been skirting the fringes of the market, almost in a market of their own, and don't really care either way.
Controlling indie developers Another legit concern, but when you don't exercise control, you have the problem Valve just ran into. There is no right solution it appears. Do you honestly believe that MS and Nintendo's Indie programs aren't there in part to control things?
Purposely locking the built in PS2 emulator in the console behind a pay wall. So they make you buy old games more than once as part of a service? I seem to recall another video game company doing that, wait how did I end up buying Mario 3 so many times?
Controlling some Japanese retail release dates in the west. Again, this isn't a Sony issue. Japanese game release dates in other markets have always been monitored by western/Euro branches. Some games require more localisation, some games might not sell well outside Japan.
Removing digital codes from offline and online retailers. How many times did you pop into BestBuy to buy a card with a code on it? I sure as shit never did. Who drives across town when they can just buy the game online? Is the little card important to you?
Rejecting features from other companies which would be good for gamers. They are a business, and they are in the top spot and have been mostly since they entered the market. Maybe the other companies should take note when they reject features.
Throwing Vita owners under the bus, most of them, 1.5 years after release What is this in reference to? It's price drop? If that's it, people were asking for a big price drop from day 1.
Complacentcy -Complacency doesn't sell 80+ million consoles. What have they done (or not done) that shows this? I don't even own a PS4 but they've certainly been keeping things rolling because the momentum keeps steady and I'm not hearing a lot of complaints from people that own them.
Not helping release original games unless they take control of the IP in many cases. Why wouldn't they? They are in a strong position to negotiate that.
Ignoring for 5 years of constant complaints from their loyal customers to improve thumbstick durability.
I work on controllers as a hobby, they all have issues, but the PS4 rubber issue is one I haven't seen in a while, since launch really. It mostly boiled down to cutting your thumbnails. My 2 year old DS4 sticks are like new.
Also as much as I like my Elite controller, in general it's got more issues than just thumbstick rubber, and none of these issues have been fixed. It was also $180 CDN.


Dismissive PSN customer service. Every company has ups and downs with CS. This is a non-issue.
And there's more I haven't even listed. Why stop there?
Since 2016 specifically, Sony's been nose diving into anti-consumer practices and pissing off many of their loyal fans. Such policies are in many cases petty, and they can help the competition in the future such as the newly announcef Stadia. Sony has been this way since the original PS. Nothing has changed. If you're worried about anti-consumer practices Google is not a great comparison to make.
The question is why? Why does a company that is leading the market try to control the market itself?
What happened the last 3-4 years at Sony to cause them to go down this route? They outsold their competition combined and have more power over the market. This is pretty standard fare shit, and still nowhere near what Nintendo was doing when they ran the market in the 80's and early 90s.
Is arrogant Sony back? There is no such thing, you've been shilling Stadia on 4Chan a bit too much. There is just Sony. When they are successful they try to implement more new policies, when they are struggling they reset and re-strategize.
Is Sony getting over complacent? The PS4 is still selling very well and we haven't even hit the end of cycle price drop era yet. Seems they have been keeping their audience happy. That doesn't occur through complacency.
Has the new leadership hired a bunch of fools? Who are these fools? Who are you talking about? Google hired Phil Harrison after he helped shit up Xbox, do you hold the same scrutiny over their decisions?
Is there inner turmoil inside the company? What if?!!! Tabloid level concern trolling right here.
It just seems so odd that Sony started the gen right and now seems to want to compete with old DRM Microsoft. If sales are anything to go by, they are finishing the gen just fine. I'm not even sure what you're on about with the DRM quip. Has Sony implemented a new online check-in requirement I haven't heard about?
As a PlayStation buyer for over 20 years it brings a tear to my eye that they would do a complete 180 out nowhere, for no reason, and turning into anti-consumer jerks

 

[Iorv3th]

Bullshit

I think he meant 20 years ago. Maybe, if he was even alive then.

 

[Lastyou1]

Censorship on an increasing number of games

Only in obscure Japanese games so far.

Hesitant of crossplay

They're at top of the league, it's Nintendo and Microsoft that are teaming up to keep the pace of Sony. With a cross play move, Sony would help the concorrente and competition. If your friends want to play online with you, they ought buy a ps4.
Again, with cross play Nintendo and MS have everything to gain, while Sony everything to lose.

Controlling indie developers

Everyone does that. Steam is the only exception and even then a little bit more of control, especially quality wise, wouldn't be bad.

Purposely locking the built in PS2 emulator in the console behind a pay wall.

The ps4 drive is projected just to read Blu rays and movie DVDs. Most of Ps2 games were on DVD and a significant amount on CD, so physical emulation was excluded from the get go.
Software emulation would have been possible, but not from launch and with no way of proving that you actually owned the game. So they are reselling it as a new game. Prices should be lower, though.

Controlling some Japanese retail release dates in the west.

The process of getting a Japanese game adapted for western audiences is long and complicated and way more than a simple translation. If we are getting Yakuza games in the west is mostly thanks to Sony. Judgement has been hindered by some "extraordinary" events, the western adaptation will be changed due to this fact, and again another hindrance. I would not be surprised if other Japanese games had to go through the same hellish process.

Removing digital codes from offline and online retailers.

That was due to taxes though, not Sony's direct fault. The selling of credit codes is a good loophole to digital taxes, which I found stupid and really anti-consumer.

Rejecting features from other companies which would be good for gamers.

Example?

Throwing Vita owners under the bus, most of them, 1.5 years after release

The only thing I fully agree with you.

Complacentcy

Seriously, what?

Not helping release original games unless they take control of the IP in many cases.

Have you got any evidence of this?

Ignoring for 5 years of constant complaints from their loyal customers to improve thumbstick durability.

Personal experience here: never had a problem with thumbsticks. Some problems with the controller connection, yes, but never the sticks.

Dismissive PSN customer service.

I've read a lot of negative feedback, so I'll concede the benefit of the doubt, but personally I needed ps support just once and they helped me.





Personal, highly unpopular opinion: professionals should never listen to fanbase. As a diehard Spider-Man and mortal kombat fan, the ideas that fans have, generally, are awful both financially and quality wise.

Let them do their job: if they do it wrong, criticism is welcome. If they do things fine, do your best wishes and compliments. Either way, vote with your wallet.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Censorship on an increasing number of games
Hesitant of crossplay
Controlling indie developers
Purposely locking the built in PS2 emulator in the console behind a pay wall.
Controlling some Japanese retail release dates in the west.
Removing digital codes from offline and online retailers.
Rejecting features from other companies which would be good for gamers.
Throwing Vita owners under the bus, most of them, 1.5 years after release
Complacentcy
Not helping release original games unless they take control of the IP in many cases.
Ignoring for 5 years of constant complaints from their loyal customers to improve thumbstick durability.
Dismissive PSN customer service.

And there's more I haven't even listed.

Since 2016 specifically, Sony's been nose diving into anti-consumer practices and pissing off many of their loyal fans. Such policies are in many cases petty, and they can help the competition in the future such as the newly announcef Stadia.

The question is why?

What happened the last 3-4 years at Sony to cause them to go down this route?

Is arrogant Sony back?
Is Sony getting over complacent?
Has the new leadership hired a bunch of fools?
Is there inner turmoil inside the company?

It just seems so odd that Sony started the gen right and now seems to want to compete with old DRM Microsoft.

As a PlayStation buyer for over 20 years it brings a tear to my eye that they would do a complete 180 out nowhere, for no reason, and turning into anti-consumer jerks

Wow, I cannot believe it... you got all the spots in Angsty Weekend Sony Rambling / Troll Bingo... classics such as over exaggerating crossplay, arrogant Sony (with the complacent super bonus), censorship, and many more.

 

[Trogdor1123]

Most of those are not anti consumer... At alll

 

[StreetsofBeige]

What's the Sony refund policy again? Something like it's not allowed, but if CS gives in with one freebie refund you are banned for life or something?

 

[ksdixon]

I've always said that exclusives make console sales. The worrying trend I see it that many of sony's games/experiences I associate with Sony, like until dawn and David cage's games are going multi console or ps4+pc. Until Dawn turns into multi console Man Of Medan, for example.

 

[AgentP]

Predictable thread considering OP. This is called confirmation bias, you are looking for a pattern and digging through the past to confirm it. Don't like Sony, don't buy theeir goods (like you do).

 

[ksdixon]

What's the Sony refund policy again? Something like it's not allowed, but if CS gives in with one freebie refund you are banned for life or something?

I dont get this. I've done numerous refunds on both my UK and USA accounts. They always give me the standard "well we shouldn't do this but in this instance I can do it for you " but they always do it, ya know?

I've always just figured that they are happy to refund back to my PSN wallet so the money will eventually go on something PS related.

 

[Zog]

Crazy how so many people are offended by criticism of Sony. Pulling out the ignore list for this?

My opinion is that the market leader always gets arrogant.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

I dont get this. I've done numerous refunds on both my UK and USA accounts. They always give me the standard "well we shouldn't do this but in this instance I can do it for you " but they always do it, ya know?

I've always just figured that they are happy to refund back to my PSN wallet so the money will eventually go on something PS related.

Who knows. Maybe people getting banned are frequent refunders taking advantage. Here's a Google search.

https://www.google.com/search?q=psn+banned+for+refund&oq=psn+banned+for+refund

 

[Afro Republican]

Voost & Kainy.

I remember that apparel store, all the shirts were made out of Styrofoam. Terrible customer service, went bankrupt just recently, March 23rd, 2019 iirc.

 

[SonGoku]

I agree with all except the following

Hesitant of crossplay

This is not an obligation, people buy a PS4 with the expectation of playing with other PS4 players, its not like the swarm of online PS4 players needs it
Its the other competing platforms that would benefit from PS4 crossplay not the other way around

Controlling indie developers

Explain how

Controlling some Japanese retail release dates in the west.

I think all pubs do this to increase sales, they do this by regionalizing content and marketing.

Rejecting features from other companies which would be good for gamers.

Name them

Throwing Vita owners under the bus, most of them, 1.5 years after release

As a Vita fan there's nobody to blame but the market, people just didn't want the damn thing. Thankfully the switch exist and more than excels at filling the void left by it.
Though i do agree Sony should have tried harder not cripling it with proprietary memory, the design was also fucked when most games run subnative resolution, the thing should have shipped with a 480p screen or waited for 28nm

Not helping release original games unless they take control of the IP in many cases.

Why should anyone invest in something they don't own? that's what 3rd parties are for

Go play on PC if you care so much about backward compatibilty

PC backward compatibilty eternal forever

Us at PS are more concerned about future games

Doesn't make it less anti consumer, its really fucked to deny loyal fans of it especially considering that the people who still own PS2 discs are probably a small number of loyal hardcore fans. It won't affect their profits.

Not that your play on PC argument held any ground but just fyi most people don't have a PC capable of running perfect PS2 emulation

 

[StreetsofBeige]

As a Vita fan there's nobody to blame but the market, people just didn't want the damn thing. Thankfully the switch exist and more than excels at filling the void left by it.
Though i do agree Sony should have tried harder not cripling it with proprietary memory, the design was also fucked when most games run subnative resolution, the thing should have shipped with a 480p screen or waited for 28nm

I'm not going to respond to all the OP points, but to be fair, Sony even stated in an article they are ditching Sony first party dev support of Vita only a few years after launch in favour of PS4. It's not like Sony has hardly any studios to make games. They could have supported it with more first party games throughout Vita's 7 year existence. They gave up first party support only a few years later and prayed for third parties to fill the void. At that time, PS4 was barely even out at that point too, so it's not like PS4 had 70 millions consoles already to Vita's 10 million.

 

[kevm3]

Sony always gets arrogant once they take a lead and then they get spanked for a generation and then they step it back up.

 

[SonGoku]

I'm not going to respond to all the OP points, but to be fair, Sony even stated in an article they are ditching Sony first party dev support of Vita only a few years after launch in favour of PS4. It's not like Sony has hardly any studios to make games. They could have supported it with more first party games throughout Vita's 7 year existence. They gave up first party support only a few years later and prayed for third parties to fill the void. At that time, PS4 was barely even out at that point too, so it's not like PS4 had 70 millions consoles already to Vita's 10 million.

That's all true but the market didn't respond favorably either... Launch lineup was impressive not to mention the future (now cancelled) announced games
At the very least market is 50% to blame. There just wasn't demand for it.

 

[Zog]

That's all true but the market didn't respond favorably either... Launch lineup was impressive not to mention the future (now cancelled) announced games
At the very least market is 50% to blame. There just wasn't demand for it.

There wasn't a demand for the 3DS at first either, Nintendo doubled down and fixed it's problems.

 

[Sparda]

At least they don't forced people to buy kinect and two console this gen, or spiyng their customers like MS.

 

[Afro Republican]

That's all true but the market didn't respond favorably either... Launch lineup was impressive not to mention the future (now cancelled) announced games
At the very least market is 50% to blame. There just wasn't demand for it.

Vita was considered selling fine at launch, it was the 3DS that people were going doom and gloom over until a mass ad campaign along with a price cut. Heck, the whole reason the 2DS even existed was because it was a way to put out cheaper models to boost sales. They did the normal and XL size thing to match phone company strategies.

 

[Zog]

They did the normal and XL size thing to match phone company strategies.

DS had an XL before phones started doing bigger models.

 

[Rayderism]

About the removal of digital game codes.....I've seen somewhere around the net something about a digital code generator. The instructions were to run the generator and keep generating a new code until one works. Could you imagine buying a $60 game code and getting a "already used" error when trying to redeem it? I didn't consider the taxes issue someone above mentioned, but digital piracy would be enough for Sony to take action against the codes.

 

[SonGoku]

There wasn't a demand for the 3DS at first either, Nintendo doubled down and fixed it's problems.

Compared to the Vita the 3DS was an iOS device

Vita was considered selling fine at launch, it was the 3DS that people were going doom and gloom over until a mass ad campaign along with a price cut. Heck, the whole reason the 2DS even existed was because it was a way to put out cheaper models to boost sales. They did the normal and XL size thing to match phone company strategies.

Hardware Launch months are always front loaded, the moment 3DS drop from the initial $250 the Vita was doomed. Even in Japan were PSP was strong the Vita was getting destroyed by the 3DS shortly after launch

Im more critical of Sony design decisions for Vita:
Lack of r2/l2 buttons
Shitty "analogs"
Propriety overpriced slow unreliable memory
SoC that did not match screen resolution. Flagship launch game (uncharted) looked like ass due to subnative resolution, they should have used a 480p screen instead

I was ready to dump $500 for the NGP when it was announced, my excitement was deflated launch day when we found out of the plethora of subnative res titles, Resistance and CoD shoddy efforts further killed my enthusiasm for it. The fact that many japanese PS2 looking games were a blurry mess due to sub native res was unthinkable.

 

[Afro Republican]

Technically the Vita did have R2 and L2 buttons.

Never really had many games that used them, and when I tried them they didn't work half the time, but I guess they though sensor-touch "buttons" was futuristic and cool and forgot to test them for consistency and fast input.

 

[Petrae]

About the removal of digital game codes.....I've seen somewhere around the net something about a digital code generator. The instructions were to run the generator and keep generating a new code until one works. Could you imagine buying a $60 game code and getting a "already used" error when trying to redeem it? I didn't consider the taxes issue someone above mentioned, but digital piracy would be enough for Sony to take action against the codes.

The same can be said for PSN currency cards and generated codes. Is Sony going to yank those from stores, too?

Now, if Sony allows storefronts to sell variable-value PSN currency cards (in which the buyer can stipulate the exact amount so that it can be the price of a game plus applicable taxes), I can live with that, as the eliminates necessary overpayment for a game because of firm increments that always leave free money for Sony hanging around in people’s accounts. Several other retailers/storefronts have a variable-value system (i.e. $20-$200).

 

[dark10x]

Honestly, in the face of Stadia and whatever Apple is cooking, among others, this doesn't bother me in the least. There are more serious threats to the hobby than any of that.

 

[LuvOfThaGame]

How many xbox agent/astroturfer hanging out on this website?

Get rid of them asap

Can we get rid of the posters that bomb every xbox thread too?

 

[nowhat]

Honestly, in the face of Stadia and whatever Apple is cooking, among others, this doesn't bother me in the least. There are more serious threats to the hobby than any of that.

Don't worry - I can guarantee this same thread will be reposted countless times with ever so slightly different wording (if even that). You'll have plenty of time to change your opinion!

 

[CyberPanda]

All corporations are turning into trash, and they will never be your friend. Anyone who thinks otherwise has their head up their own ass.

 

[Kagero]

Is GAF slowly becoming and anti Sony forum?

 

[Dirk Benedict]

The... wha... it sure is, but I thought like everyone knows it:



....I feel old.

Hmm. Looks like Queen were mememing way before it was the thing to do.

 

[chinoXL]

the Anti Sony stuff is comedy to me..we have no idea how the PS5 and XBox next are gonna be setup...yes crossplay they kinda took the L on but once they allow it AND continue their strong first party work with a strong spec console, how will that not equal dominant sony again?

 

[Grumpy Toe Nail]

How many xbox agent/astroturfer hanging out on this website?

Get rid of them asap

How many Sony sleeper agents are on this site? Never forget 12/7/41

 

[GTR R35_Supra RZ]

Some people in here sure do got a one track mind.

Make sure you post exact same thing what you just said in the Microsoft thread

 

[VincentMatts]

Is GAF slowly becoming and anti Sony forum?

Yes because they all moved over to the other website which is a Sony fest.

 

[CyberPanda]

Yes because they all moved over to the other website which is a Sony fest.

That site is more pro Nintendo, followed by Sony imo.

 

[Dragon Lord]

I don't feel particularly optimistic about Sony's future practices ... but then, I have yet to find a company in this niche that doesn't seem to have similar anti-consumer policies in one way or another

 

[VincentMatts]

That site is more pro Nintendo, followed by Sony imo.

Or as I like to call it: the shit on anything MS forum.

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

What are companies trying to force DRM, all digital, always online, multiplayer focused games, GAAS, streaming only with mandatory subscriptions considered then? Besides the stupid censorship policy, I think Sony is tame in comparison to the other companies. In the end of the day, technically aren’t most companies anti-consumer. Yes, even you Nintendo.