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Sony to sell PlayStation Vita for a loss, Profitable within 3yrs
- Thread starter onQ123
- Start date
Chuck Norris
Banned
PS Suite is the big wildcard IMO, Sony should be using it to leverage an iOS like library of arcade games onto the system based on Android.M.I.S. said:
Not sure if that is their end game with it though
When the PSP launched there were almost no 3d games on phones, it was before the first iPhone launched and before the mobile market exploded. It wasn't just a different world, it was a whole damn other universe in terms of mobile devices. You can't compare the PSP or the DS to today's landscape. The PSP lost against the DS, why? What did the DS offer? It offerred Brain Age, Animal Crossing - it catered to the "blue ocean" market nintendo talked so much about, like women and older people. Where are those people getting these experiences now? On their pads, smartphones and the likes.Drek said:
I doubt Sony can achieve enough of a success to turn a profit with a console they're selling at a loss. But clearly, they're in a bind - They couldn't have sold it for more, 250$ is pushing the boundaries as is. They'll have to find very creative way to justify the Vita's existence in the eyes of consumers who are not you or me, and frankly, I can't think of a way for them to do that.
And don't delude yourself, please, it's pathetic - The thing can't compete with the iPod anything. Even if it has more horsepower. People who are buying a product that competes with iOS products expects many features that Vita doesn't have (like apps). Sony can't market this device as a iOS competitor, they must go the Nintendo route and market it as something that can live along side your iOS device.
Opus Angelorum
Member
dude said:
I could not agree more.
The PSVita at its core is a dedicated gaming device and it should be marketed as such.
Woo-Fu said:
This time the Goliath isn't anywhere near as big and strong, Sony only have themselves to beat.
staticneuron
Member
Mama Robotnik said:
I think hacking has hurt bot nitendo and sony but not enough to deter them from the market. If I am not mistaken the tie ratio for the DS was 4.5 as of last numbers and the PSP tie ratio is 4.2. Maybe they could be higher if not for the piracy, but the numbers are pretty close so I doubt that piracy has completely destroyed sales when looking at the consoles comparatively.
dude said:
Of course there is. Actual "good" games. The vast majority of games out on the devices are casual fare. It isn't any different from years ago when casuals were content on playing tetris or chess on their smartphone. The casuals still won't care. Dedicated devices are for dedicated gamers who have never been satisfied with the casual titles on phones, and like buttons. Buttons! Who would purchase Lumines for the vita? I would.... especially because of the buttons. But this is sony we are talking about. They are not going to kill the PSP. So if there are gamers who are interested in dedicated gaming but wary of cost, chances are the PSP and the DS will still be on the market for those who are more frugal and don't mind being late to the party.
dude said:
Are you serious? The PSP "lost" to the DS? The PSP has been the only serious competitor to the Nintendo handheld dominance in 20+ years. If you yourself admit that the PSP is not aimed for the "the blue ocean" which is now being eaten up by the new tech, yet it still managed to sell 70 million units then you are simply ignoring the point you have just proven.
There is still a market for dedicated gamers and the success of apples platform has no bearing on the strength of appeal that dedicated platforms have.
Chuck Norris
Banned
What exactly is wrong with keeping gaming within the domain of gamers? There is a 100 million + audience of gamers available, and frankly I don't think either of the big three are making the most of that.
m.i.s.
Banned
dude said:
This is exactly it. PSV leaves Sony exposed on all fronts: minis, touchscreen and gyroscopic titles with iOS and blockbusters with 360 and PS3. Then there's competition from Nintendo's first party efforts on 3DS - and Nintendo have considerable room for price cuts whilst still making a profit on both hardware and games.
Yes, but that's not a easy thing to do. Unless Sony can make people actually believe they want a dedicated gaming device in this day and age, they'll fail miserably. We really should look at Nintendo to see this - On paper, Nintendo did almost everything right. They had many things to distinguish their product - The brand, the 3D buzzword. But they can't make the thing fly.Opus Angelorum said:
Can Sony really do this better? Right now it seems to me that both products belong to a different era - The pre-mobile era. And with the foresight Sony showed with the PS Suite, I really don't understand why they didn't create a different device.
SolarPowered
Member
This does not bode well for the price of individual games. I'm happy that it's cheap, but I'm honestly afraid of the methods they'll employ to recoup the money lost because of the hardware price.
oh boy...
oh boy...
Chuck Norris
Banned
Well apparently the iOS market is some inaccessible behemoth that Sony, MS and Nintendo could never touchGravijah said:
That's only true if you're a casual gamer. The elephant in the room is that 99.9% of the games available on smartphones and tablets suck. And that, for many genres, it's almost impossible to do better. Turns out that buttons are pretty important.dude said:
(I'm saying this as someone who owns the best smartphone currently available and has tried a lot of the offerings)
staticneuron
Member
dude said:
It is an assumption that people care about 3D. By large the industry is "forcing" 3D down consumers throats. The reason the 3DS isn't swinging right now is because of the launch lineup and the sheer fact that the DS is still pretty strong. The software is always what mattered in the end for game software. Very few devices can sustain momentum based off of name alone.
Why do you think Sony needs to create a different device if it has similar functionality to phones on the market with the simple twist of being a dedicated games machine?
Why does it seem as if you are so enamored with iOS and smartphones that you honestly believe people don't care about dedicated gaming devices anymore?
Dedication Through Light
Member
Fantastic move to making the PSV compelling and with true definitive out of the gate first party support. Let us hope it reaches greater status than PSP and is able to retain quality software from Sony Computer Entertainment Worldwide Studios and their publishing partners to reach profitability in less than three years.
m.i.s.
Banned
Zoe said:
Talking of PS3, there was a time when Sony were on the cusp of releasing the PS2 and also the precursor to PSP. Ken Kutaragi kicked that project into the long grass and said [to paraphrase] "No! concentrate all our energies on PS2".
Sony's 1998 portable gaming plans revealed - note: registration required
Gamecocks625
Member
Get ready to enjoy those fabulous customer friendly prices on software and memory cards!
staticneuron said:
Good in what way? I'm talking about sells here - In the only objective way I can think of, sales, Angry birds is better than most games recently released.
"Casuals" are what made the DS the monster it is today, with 140+ million in sells. When the DS and PSP launch there were no "Smartphones" in the current sense, The iPhone was announced in 2007! 3 years after the PSP. And it still took some time to the current mobile market to explode in the way that it has. And today, we have these kind of experiences on these things for a fraction of the price of what you paid for portable games on the PSP and DS. The "Casuals" won't care, we both agree - now the question is, will the "gamer" segment care, and is this segment even big enough to support a console being sold at a loss. We can't know that yet, but if you look at the future, like the nVidia Kal-El on mobile devices and devices like the Xperia Play and platforms like the PS Suite, it's clear where the wind are blowing even for some "gamers", but not only that - The Vita is now competing with the 3DS on this very small "gamers" segment.
The PSP sold half the DS, that's what I mean by "lost". I admit that the PSP catered mostly to the "gamers" segment - but the fact that they sold 70 million units is in no way proof catering only to the "gamers" segment will result in 70 million sells. We'll have to see how the thing will turn out, but I don't expect it selling anywhere near the amounts we saw this gen - And I still have strong worries about Sony's ability to return the investment if they are indeed selling at a loss.staticneuron said:
See what I said about Angry Birds. I don't like the game, neither do many people - But I have to accept that it's a good product because of it's sales.Durante said:
No industry is forcing anything down anybody's throat. This is a direct response to consumers decisions. 3D is a buzzword for a reason. This is from someone who can't watch a 3D movie without bleeding from my eyes.staticneuron said:
I think Sony would have done better for themselves if they made something that felt "right" for it's era. The Vita is a successor to the PSP in many ways, just as the 3DS is a successor to the DS, and I don't think people have interest in these devices any more.
I am not enamored with anything - I'm looking around me, and I see kids playing Angry Birds and Fruit Ninja on their iPhones instead of Pokemon. They don't want a Vita for their birthdays - They want an iPad. That's the future, and people should adapt to it.
fuzzyreactor
Banned
F#A#Oo said:
Gamecocks625
Member
darkwing said:
Memory cards will be needed if you want to download games/content from PSN or if you want to store something on there like movies, music, apps or whatever.
But you're right. If you simply are going to play retail games then it's possible to not need a memory card I suppose.
Tobor said:
I have a horrible feeling that game will be $50.
flyinpiranha
Member
Hawk269 said:
Wait, the 3DS had a "pretty good launch lineup"? I beg to differ.
And 3DS isn't "selling like shit" ... it's the fastest selling Nintendo handheld, it's just being held up to the ridiculous DS standard, which in time, I'm sure it will get close to.
And companies don't "usually sell at a lost", Microsoft and Sony have. Nintendo is making a killing NOT practicing that.
I don't personally care what Sony's financial status is with the project, $250 is a decent price and I'll scoop one up for that.
There's one thing I'm hoping to see from this announcement and its implication that, with cheap hardware, the games will be expensive: worldwide game distribution and the complete elimination of regional lockouts and even regional distinctions.
They need to get people buying games. As many as possible. The best way to increase the number of game purchases, aside from lower prices, is to make games available. There's no excuse for limiting purchases of a certain game to people who live in certain territory: get all those game available to a worldwide audience! There are many multilingual people in the world who can read languages other than the major ones in their territories, and they'd love to buy more games. Don't stop us from doing that!
But the pessimist in me fears that Sony will go the opposite route and aggressively set different game prices based on the maximum that each territory will bear, and then lock the console to the region it was purchased in.
A potential region lock is the only thing that would torpedo my desire for a Vita and a day-one purchase. My console must be region free because I am region free. Got that? Comprendes? Verstehst du? 分かった？
They need to get people buying games. As many as possible. The best way to increase the number of game purchases, aside from lower prices, is to make games available. There's no excuse for limiting purchases of a certain game to people who live in certain territory: get all those game available to a worldwide audience! There are many multilingual people in the world who can read languages other than the major ones in their territories, and they'd love to buy more games. Don't stop us from doing that!
But the pessimist in me fears that Sony will go the opposite route and aggressively set different game prices based on the maximum that each territory will bear, and then lock the console to the region it was purchased in.
A potential region lock is the only thing that would torpedo my desire for a Vita and a day-one purchase. My console must be region free because I am region free. Got that? Comprendes? Verstehst du? 分かった？
Minsc
Gold Member
Durante said:
99.9% of the games sucking still leaves about 100 good core games, not too shabby.
Obviously if you play genres that are catered to touch devices, board games like Monopoly, Life, Carcassonne, or puzzle games like Puzzle Quest, or Tower Defense games or Casual games, they're pretty incredible as you mention. And they're great for more educational games too. RPGs and SRPGs could also work very well (maybe even better), and perhaps a few other genres if controls are implemented properly.
They've always done this and Microsoft does this, but every time GAF acts like it is some new and crazy idea. They just can't seem to wrap their heads around it. Was it not painfully obvious when they announced the price that is was selling at a loss? Consider how much smart phone hardware costs when it isn't subsidized in a contract and then consider how much better the components are in the psv. Pachter needs to break this down for the kiddos.
Tobor said:
Exactly. And I forgot to mention patches in my original post. Some luddites on gaf would tell you patches are the devil's work, but I'd rather have a patch that eliminated a glitch in multi-player than have that glitch go unpatched and permanently end the online community for it.
The Omega Man
Member
Well, the oportunity of critizicing the price has passed, now ITT we criticize Sony's stupidity for selling such an awesome hardware for cheap and also we criticize the price of its games even when those haven't been announced.Hellion said:
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
The Omega Man said:
It's not stupid at all and nobody should be criticizing their decision.
That said, to believe that Sony is going to sit back and not make their money back somewhere else is ludicrous. They've got stockholders to report to and that's why it is completely reasonable to believe that the prices of games and memory will be higher than last generation.
You act as if this talk is completely unwarranted.