akachan ningen
Member
That whole "no loading times" thing was bs. The game just used long ass animations to hide them but you can still feel them.
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Soul Reaver may have been the most overly ambitious game ever. (research thread)
- Thread starter Mama Robotnik
- Start date
Screenshots like this make me wish I could play these games in their original render resolution but with a modern display resolution, sort of like how Chocolate DOOM let's you blow the image up to 1080p but maintains the 480p internal resolution. Typically this is what we DON'T want but for certain games I think it looks better than the full HD resolution when the upscaling is done right. I guess DOSBOX games are a good example. I just don't like how Soul Reaver looks fully rendered at modern resolutions. Maybe it works better if you can add a CRT effect on top. Has anybody made such an effect specifically targeted at old PC games? I know SweetFX can sort of do it but I don't know if it works for really old games.
Correctomundo
Member
It streamed a lot of data, too, but the point was that you were never really removed from control in the game by loading screens in the way the first game was burdened heavily by.
I still prefer Blood Omen to Soul Reaver, but the streaming was beautifully implemented. To see it executed so brilliantly on the Playstation was a remarkable achievement.
If I'm not mistaken, it was one of, if not the, first game to stream in data like that, to be able to move across such huge areas with no loading times. It was indeed a big deal, I remember playing the demo and being blown away. One of my favorite games, along with its sequel.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Add to that modern gaming AAA "gameplay":
- QTE finishers
- Automated combat with XP multipliers and "U SO BADASS!" notifications when doing a successful combo
- Markers telling you where to go
- "Open-world" (Ubisoft style, not Zelda style)
- "Spectral vision" to highlight elements of interest, see enemies through walls etc.
- Arbitrary stealth sections because why not, also because fuck you
- Hints popping up when taking too long to solve a puzzle
- XP bars and "skill trees"
- Collectible Nosgothian coins scattered all over the map, get all 10 on each map for extra XP!
- Climb this cathedral spire to highlight points of interest on the map
Indeed. So glad Dead Sun was cancelled.
Agreed on both counts. And yes, I believe it was the first to do so. The loading was definitely masked in those transition corridors between each area, but it was seamless and really beautifully done, not intrusive at all.
RoninChaos
Member
Holy shit.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
I'm sorry. I do feel like I need a shower after writing this, haha.
JumPeRJumPzZ
Banned
Man i miss this franchise
SR1 and 2 were goat. Loved them so much.
SR1 and 2 were goat. Loved them so much.
Throw a blu ray disk into the air enough times, suppose that one day the disk lands on its edge.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
It never did. I can give you my JoyToKey config if you want. Only way I got proper controller controls out of it. I use a DS3 controller with MotionInJoy (to emulate a 360 controller lol) FWIW.
Sorta Maximus
Member
Great premise, story, and game. I just picked up the PSN version. Loved the PSone and Dreamcast versions back in the day. I'll grab the Steam versions of Soul Reaver 2 and Defiance next.
Shikamaru Ninja
任天å ã® å¿è
I'm not sure what to say about Soul Reaver. The original Legacy of Kain: Blood Omen blew me away with the brilliant narrative and characters, alongside an interesting adaptation of the overhead Zelda mechanic. With Soul Reaver, there was an incredible amount of hype, alongside one of the greatest introductions ever. But the game itself was a clumsy platformer with very repetitive puzzles. The world was empty and boring, and the opposite of what you want in a 3D adventure game. There were obviously some interesting mechanics, but everything else just wasn't there.
Soul Reaver 2 turned everything around by harking back to much of the characters and story line of Blood Omen, while focusing the gameplay with enough action that it mitigated some of the qualms I found in the first.
Soul Reaver 2 turned everything around by harking back to much of the characters and story line of Blood Omen, while focusing the gameplay with enough action that it mitigated some of the qualms I found in the first.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
I disagree, I prefer SR over SR2. The world wasn't empty, there were lots of cool secrets to find, and I really liked the Zelda/Metroid-like progression switched to 3D, especially since there were few hints and zero markers so you really had to explore and figure it out. Plus the architecture and art direction was amazing and it was just mesmerizing and engrossing to explore. Whereas the art direction in SR2 was of course still great (and the graphics improved due to the generation leap), the exploration wasn't there anymore, and the cut scenes were just way too long. Not MGS-long (fortunately) but they were quite lengthy and unskippable, which was very annoying if you somehow died or the game crashed (frequent on the Steam version, sadly) before you reached the next save point...
I also enjoyed the block puzzles, I don't care if people say they were repetitive. The ones in SR2 were generally improved though, and the reaver dungeons had amazing level design, I agree there. And I do agree that Blood Omen is the best one in the series.
Melchiah
Member
I disagree, I prefer SR over SR2. The world wasn't empty, there were lots of cool secrets to find, and I really liked the Zelda/Metroid-like progression switched to 3D, especially since there were few hints and zero markers so you really had to explore and figure it out. Plus the architecture and art direction was amazing and it was just mesmerizing and engrossing to explore. Whereas the art direction in SR2 was of course still great (and the graphics improved due to the generation leap), the exploration wasn't there anymore, and the cut scenes were just way too long. Not MGS-long (fortunately) but they were quite lengthy and unskippable, which was very annoying if you somehow died or the game crashed (frequent on the Steam version, sadly) before you reached the next save point...
I also enjoyed the block puzzles, I don't care if people say they were repetitive. The ones in SR2 were generally improved though, and the reaver dungeons had amazing level design, I agree there. And I do agree that Blood Omen is the best one in the series.
I hated the the block puzzles and platforming in SR, the latter particularly in Rahab's area, but I think SR2 was worse in other ways. The constant mob fights inside force fields were tiresome, and the boss fights were far better in SR. The premise was also much more interesting to me in SR, where you discovered how the world and your former brethren had succumbed to ruin during the millenia of Raziel's absence.
Allnamestakenlol
Member
Amazing post. Makes my heart ache, tho.
psynergylover
Member
Oddly enough I bought this by complete accident as someone suggested I play Legend of Dragoon but I bought the entie series as I thought this was what he talking about.
Tizoc
Member
Hmm does that thing with DS4Win? I use a software to use my PS4 controller as if it's a 360 controller.
Did it ever sell that well?
Soul Reaver 2 remains one of my favorite gaming experiences to this day.
Crankshaft
Member
Everyone seems to have good memories about this game. What I remember is getting to the end and getting the "to be continued." ending.
I never replayed the game again and I never touched another Legacy of Kain game. It's not like I was even that mad about the ending. I just got to the end was like "really? thats the end?" and after that I was done.
Maybe if they did a complete remake of the SR\SR2 together I would get into it.
I never replayed the game again and I never touched another Legacy of Kain game. It's not like I was even that mad about the ending. I just got to the end was like "really? thats the end?" and after that I was done.
Maybe if they did a complete remake of the SR\SR2 together I would get into it.
Exactly my post.
Soul Reaver sold over 1.5 million copies (excluding digital), while the franchise sold around 3.5 million, last numbers I checked. SR1 counted for nearly 43% of the franchise's sales.
Melchiah
Member
They'd need to remake Defiance as well for the whole story.
Oh my, so glad this thread was bumped. Such a great read. And about my most beloved series ever. <3 The voice acting, the music, the atmosphere, the plot. God, so many fond memories.
I played all the games in the series except the original Blood Omen, but I will definitely get it for the Vita thanks to this thread.
I played all the games in the series except the original Blood Omen, but I will definitely get it for the Vita thanks to this thread.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Yeah the constant combat was a bit annoying, especially since the combat was only serviceable. Defiance was a bit annoying with that too.
I actually enjoyed the puzzles in SR and SR2 though. ;_; I like how you interacted with the environments.
Probably.
Here's my config for Soul Reaver:
Code:
[General]
FileVersion=55
NumberOfJoysticks=2
NumberOfButtons=32
DisplayMode=3
UseDiagonalInput=0
UsePOV8Way=0
Threshold=300
Threshold2=20
KeySendMode=0
SoundFile=
[Joystick 1]
Axis1n=1, 25:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
Button01=1, 58:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
Button02=1, 44:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
Button03=1, 41:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
Button04=1, 46:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
Button05=1, 43:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
Button06=1, 53:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
Button07=1, 0D:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
Button08=1, 1B:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
Axis1p=1, 27:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
Axis2n=1, 26:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
Axis2p=1, 28:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
Axis3n=1, 60:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
Axis3p=1, A3:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
POV1-1=1, 26:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
POV1-3=1, 27:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
POV1-5=1, 28:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
POV1-7=1, 25:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0
Axis5p=1, A2:00:00:00, 0.000, 0, 0Melchiah
Member
IIRC, there was even more fighting in close quarters in Defiance.
The timed block puzzles in SR's Silenced Cathedral were the worst. You had to recreate the wall murals with the blocks, and those arachnid bloodsuckers kept coming at regular intervals. It was made worse by the fact that you could only use the Soul Reaver to kill them there, and it only manifested when the health bar was full.
Any Questions
Member
Loved this game. Fantastic thread and really enjoyed reading the OP. Thank-you!
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
You could impale or burn them like any other mob. I always tried to keep an impaling weapon around for exactly that reason. If I needed to cross a gate via spectral form I'd throw the weapon between the bars beforehand so I could have a melee weapon on the other side.
Melchiah
Member
I know, but to my recollection some of those block puzzle rooms didn't have other means to kill them, unless you threw a weapon there before phasing through the bars.
FantasticMrSnake
Member
Really nice thread OP! congrats!
Oh man, coming from this LTTP: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1236455 and reading all this make me wants to play this game again.
We should insist Square to make a remake including all these content in the game =D.
Oh man, coming from this LTTP: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1236455 and reading all this make me wants to play this game again.
We should insist Square to make a remake including all these content in the game =D.
Well, gotta be realistic, the voice actor of the Elder God has already passed away, and a lot the other actors were already pretty old when they did Defiance.
Along with the fact that the team that worked on it is spread out, and that lots and lots of games were cancelled and rewritten to achieve that level of narrative, we can assume that it is reeeally hard for us to see a sequel to the story.
Although, a novel would fit in like a glove. It gives the necessary freedom to finish that complex narrative.
As long time fan I have nothing but uttermost respect for both Legacy of Kain series and the research @Mama Robotnik put for every thread regarding this game.
Will you be also doing similar "digging" for Soul Reaver 2 and Defiance as well? There are some elements cut ( Earth, Water and Spirit forges in SR2 for example) and I am wondering, how original stories for those installments would play out.
Will you be also doing similar "digging" for Soul Reaver 2 and Defiance as well? There are some elements cut ( Earth, Water and Spirit forges in SR2 for example) and I am wondering, how original stories for those installments would play out.
Phoenix RISING
Banned
An HD Remaster wouldn't do this game justice.
It would require a full remake.
It would require a full remake.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
There is a chance that the artistic vision of the original may get lost in translation completely or in parts while pursuing greater advanced shaders and creating new geometry everywhere... like with the SotC remaster: kickass new graphics, technically excellent, but it changes the tone of the game art in a way that is foreign to the game itself IMHO.
I did some time recently to think what would be the best way to reboot / remake the whole Legacy of Kain series successfully. If I will find the proper topic, I will write about all of the games, however for the first Soul Reaver I have such ideas:
+ do not change the world structure, score and the main story
+ modern quality graphics
+ more types of enemies (like eg. more insect-inspired forms of Zephonim) and more demanding enemies (which would make Glyph spells actually useful)
+ maybe re-think and re-vamp (no pun intended) Dumahs constrict ability
+ add Priestess, Undercity and Possession ability
+ add Turelim teritory, but not Turel
+ last parts of the game could be a bit different from original, so that Constrict and Possession abilities would have their proper use
+ no reaver upgrades (this is to be set for next installments)
+ possibly add subplots preseting more details about Nosgoth history or life, more stories on murals (eg indication, that Glyph Shrines are attempts of re-creating long-destroyed reaver forges), fate of Razelim clan subplot
Cyber Caesar
Member
I have no doubt that there's a quality sequel/reboot/remake that can be made. I would support it.
The9BREAKER
Neo Member
What happened to the fremium title of Nosgoth it was a funky looking multiplayer game like UT... Did it get cancelled? I remember a friend was spending mad cash on the coins or whatever it was they had...
lifa-cobex
Member
It would be nice.
But if the idea is on the table somewhere, I would hope it would be done sooner rather than later.
Some of the voice actors are getting on in years.
Most notably Simon Templeman (Kain).
I love this guys voice and I can't imagine anyone else could do it justice.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1DejyjaNrtw
Lord Thrappleper The 49th
Member
We all know if this game was remade the new reavers will be sold as day 1 DLC.