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Super Robot Wars OG Saga - Masou Kishin The Lord of Elemental (DS) - May 27th

Bebpo

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Jun 7, 2004
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TreIII said:
They more than likely have to. The original game's story was crafted around the original SNES SRW series. So things like how Shuu died in 3, only to come back to life in EX, were all integrated into the original LOTE storyline (which basically was like "two games" in one).

Since a lot of that same stuff hasn't occurred in OG (yet?), they'll have to change at least a couple of details around. For example, ol girl Xenia can't make a super powerful "Masouki" inspired by a Gundam, when Gundams don't exist in the OG-verse. I'd imagine Huckbeines would have to sub in, in that respect.

But then again, for that matter, how could she even make that Masouki when the OG crew hasn't taken a trip to Masaki's stomping grounds yet?

These are the kinds of things that would have to be "fixed" for the sake of the OG-verse (and more, if the likes of "Asakim" are going to be integrated into the OG-world sooner or later). But, I'm sure they'll work it out some how...

I think it said in the product description that the remake will link to the OG series, so they'll probably make some retcon changes.
 

TreIII

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Bebpo said:
I think it said in the product description that the remake will link to the OG series, so they'll probably make some retcon changes.

Still, I do wonder how they'll clean some things up. I don't think Banpresto and Terada are going to be able to just do a small bit of alterations here and there.

Furthermore, considering that the overall package deal was basically like two games in one, part of me wonders if they may just end up splitting the original game into two. One for before the next OG game (where lots of shit should stand to go down), and the other to follow up and conclude the original Masoukishin storyline, OG-style.
 

Bebpo

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Jun 7, 2004
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If they do that I'd hope the 2nd game is a console one. Imagine if this one had been a console game with sprites/animation on the level of SRW Z. But I guess the OG team is busy working on OG3 and the Z team is busy working on Z2 so there really isn't anyone to do that level of spritework atm.
 

hteng

Banned
Aug 13, 2007
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mutsu said:
What's was the license dispute about? Does anyone have more details?

it's such a long time ago barely anyone remembered it, basically the masou kishin robots were originally created by Winky Soft, a different developer. No one knows whose suppose o be the owner but somehow banpresto was able to secure Cybuster only.
 

Mandoric

Banned
Jan 6, 2005
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mutsu said:
What's was the license dispute about? Does anyone have more details?

hteng said:
it's such a long time ago barely anyone remembered it, basically the masou kishin robots were originally created by Winky Soft, a different developer. No one knows whose suppose o be the owner but somehow banpresto was able to secure Cybuster only.

This is from memory and may not be accurate.

* Banpresto contracts Winky to make all SRWs until Alpha.
* Masaki/Cybaster and Shu/Granzon (along with an extremely prototypical version of the Shuroga from Z) were designed for SRW2, ergo they belong to Banpresto to some degree.
* Lune and Valcione are designed for SRW3, ergo they belong to Banpresto to some degree.
* The rest of the Masoukishin crew and setting are LoE-centric and primarily belong to Winky--whether this is in terms of copyright, moral rights, or just "x is the guy that can write this", I don't know.
* Winky goes ahead with the Cybaster anime in some way that ticks off Banpresto.
* Everyone takes their particular ball and goes home.
 
Jun 9, 2004
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I feel like a fool.

I was always interested in the SRW games when they featured my favorite familiar licensed characters; but SRW-OG. . . I feel as though I fail mecha by not mustering interest in it. :(
 

TreIII

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Mandoric said:
This is from memory and may not be accurate.

* Banpresto contracts Winky to make all SRWs until Alpha.
* Masaki/Cybaster and Shu/Granzon (along with an extremely prototypical version of the Shuroga from Z) were designed for SRW2, ergo they belong to Banpresto to some degree.
* Lune and Valcione are designed for SRW3, ergo they belong to Banpresto to some degree.
* The rest of the Masoukishin crew and setting are LoE-centric and primarily belong to Winky--whether this is in terms of copyright, moral rights, or just "x is the guy that can write this", I don't know.
* Winky goes ahead with the Cybaster anime in some way that ticks off Banpresto.
* Everyone takes their particular ball and goes home.

In any case, the big thing is that, a while ago, Terada basically came out and said that there was no real "rights dispute" to consider. The main reason we haven't gotten that much in the way of Masoukishin love in these last few years? ...He just thought "it needed the rest". :lol


Any way, it seems he's living up to his former promise of "that series is coming back", and Masoukishin was what he meant. :D
 

Shouta

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Jun 6, 2004
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PataHikari said:
Really?

I thought K looked pretty good.

It looks pretty good for a slightly souped up GBA game. Let's be honest though, a lot of the K sprites could be on the GBA maybe with some minor coloring downgrades and etc. I mean the GBA ones dont't look at all out of place with the K ones when they brought them together for Academy.

Anyway, I do smell some retcons for OG3 if it really does come to fruition.
 

duckroll

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Jun 7, 2004
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There are two things which set Masou Kishin apart from SRW significantly though:

- non-SD sprites
- actual isometric SRPG maps

If they bring the graphical level of Masou Kishin up to the level of modern SRPG games (even at the DS level), it should rightfully be a game which looks closer to FFTA2 than a normal SRW game. As for the battle animations, I'm really hoping that by adopting the "OG Saga" label, the animations are at least on par with the character attack animations in the Endless Frontier games.

If that's what they're doing with the remake, then it will by that virtue only be much more impressive than the other SRW DS games imo. Especially for oldschool fans who know what Masou Kishin is. :D
 

PataHikari

Banned
Aug 16, 2007
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Shouta said:
It looks pretty good for a slightly souped up GBA game. Let's be honest though, a lot of the K sprites could be on the GBA maybe with some minor coloring downgrades and etc.

...what?

K is not a "slightly souped up" GBA game. There is no possible way that K could be done on the GBA even close to what it is on the DS. For one, the GBA's screen resolution is simply too small. K's sprites are rather large. Also, the sheer number of animation frames would fill up a GBA cart before they got close. All the dynamic kills in the game add up even more.

W was a "slightly souped up" GBA game. Considering it rescued a fair amount of sprites from J, even then there was significant improvement in terms of effects and animation quality. (Plus dynamic kills) And J pushed the GBA to its limits, so anything better can't be done on it.
 
Jun 11, 2005
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duckroll said:
There are two things which set Masou Kishin apart from SRW significantly though:

- non-SD sprites
- actual isometric SRPG maps

The main series has used isometric maps since alpha. Is there some other difference? Is there height and stuff too?
 

duckroll

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pancakesandsex said:
The main series has used isometric maps since alpha. Is there some other difference? Is there height and stuff too?

It's not just the angle. In normal SRW games the stages are designed to be either cities or space. The entire terrain is a flat open zone just for combat. Masou Kishin is designed more like a more traditional SRPG, where you have in-doors as well as outdoor environments, there's elevation (cliffs, bridges, stairs) and in general the design is more like what you would find in a Fire Emblem or FFT type SRPG, than SRW.
 
Jun 11, 2005
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duckroll said:
It's not just the angle. In normal SRW games the stages are designed to be either cities or space. The entire terrain is a flat open zone just for combat. Masou Kishin is designed more like a more traditional SRPG, where you have in-doors as well as outdoor environments, there's elevation (cliffs, bridges, stairs) and in general the design is more like what you would find in a Fire Emblem or FFT type SRPG, than SRW.

I haven't done more than dabble in the pre-alpha games, but alpha+ also has indoor areas. Elevation is a big difference though.
 

ILikeFeet

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Oct 12, 2009
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how does Endless Frontier tie in. has a lot of references and even 3 (or 4) SRW characters (Axel, Alfimi(sp?), and Fighter Roar, Einst)
 

faridmon

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I don't know whats going on here and why is everyone excited, since i don't have a slight Idea about the universe.

is the game that have been remaking considered the best in the series or is it just becuase the Sprite that you lot are excited about?
 

durrrrrrrrrr

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Oct 4, 2009
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only a few people are actually excited, it's more shock/surprise because there was a dispute over who owns the characters.

heck a lot of people are disappointed. banpresto did this to themselves by mentioning "ps3 development" somewhere and not delivering a ps3 game time after time; almost everyone thought this was going to be OG3 or Z2.

pancakesandsex said:
I haven't done more than dabble in the pre-alpha games, but alpha+ also has indoor areas. Elevation is a big difference though.
i think you need to boot @G up again, the elevation in that games doesn't do anything. it's the terrain you're standing on giving you bonuses.
 

lupin23rd

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Sep 14, 2006
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Wow, cool, I'll pick this up. Too bad I don't have a SFC / SNES laying around or I'd play my SFC version.

But a little disappointed if this is the Famitsu game next week, I just want to see something NEW too :(
 
Jun 11, 2005
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durrrrrrrrrr said:
i think you need to boot @G up again, the elevation in that games doesn't do anything. it's the terrain you're standing on giving you bonuses.

We aren't talking about flying/grounded/submerged.
 

TreIII

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durrrrrrrrrr said:
heck a lot of people are disappointed. banpresto did this to themselves by mentioning "ps3 development" somewhere and not delivering a ps3 game time after time; almost everyone thought this was going to be OG3 or Z2.

Please. It's not like a PS3 game isn't coming, it's just going to take a lil while to get out there.

In the meanwhile, I'm appreciating the fact that this is getting a remake. And giving how Masoukishin has actually popped up in Famitsu dotted amounts of times in these last few years, at least a good number of people are happy about this over there too. :D
 

hteng

Banned
Aug 13, 2007
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elevation kinda exists in current games, they are terrains which affect your dodge and accuracy. Check out Alpha 3 or 2 i can't remember, there's this stage where you have to take down some Zaft base in a mountain (and to rescue someone), the fucking dog mobile suits have S rank on ground terrain and couple with the mountains and forest, makes them extremely hard to hit without using seishins.

Anyway, i think current SRW is lacking in the effects of direction. Where the robot faces doesn't affect anything, no backstabs, sidestabs..etc. So they can do something to improve that.
 

durrrrrrrrrr

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Oct 4, 2009
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everyone has their own ideas to make SRW better because it's a pretty barebones game, as long as the game's not completely messed up like K it's all good.
 

Mandoric

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Jan 6, 2005
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hteng said:
elevation kinda exists in current games, they are terrains which affect your dodge and accuracy. Check out Alpha 3 or 2 i can't remember, there's this stage where you have to take down some Zaft base in a mountain (and to rescue someone), the fucking dog mobile suits have S rank on ground terrain and couple with the mountains and forest, makes them extremely hard to hit without using seishins.

Anyway, i think current SRW is lacking in the effects of direction. Where the robot faces doesn't affect anything, no backstabs, sidestabs..etc. So they can do something to improve that.

This has terrains but also has elevation effects. Rather than "you're attacking into a forest you hit less", you can attack into a forest from above and compensate, or from below and be even worse off.
 

Zengar

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May 31, 2009
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I don't know if it's legit or not but I post it anyway


Looks fucking sexy.
 

hteng

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Aug 13, 2007
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Zengar said:
I don't know if it's legit or not but I post it anyway


Looks fucking sexy.

hot, but looks like there are no new animations? hmm.. new cut in for lune i guess.. still excited. might get a DS for it.. damit banpresto where's my HD SRW FFFFUUUUUUU!
 

PataHikari

Banned
Aug 16, 2007
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Bebpo said:
Looks awful. Fuck cg/3d srw. 2d sprites or bust.

hopefully it's fake.

They look good to me. The sprites are basically zoomed out versions of the OGs cutins. I imagine the animation will look good.

Also, if it's fake it's a very good fake, seeing as the image was found on Rakuten's own servers.
 

Bebpo

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Jun 7, 2004
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I dunno, I think the battle shots look pretty bad. That one in the bottom right is like shitty PS1-era CG still.

The pictures show a weird mish-mash of styles. There's like 4-5 different art styles/technique styles in those pics and I find it really jarring.
 

hteng

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Aug 13, 2007
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guys you are forgeting this is for the DS, you aren't gonna expect it to be a big jump like OG or Z in animation, they could barely do the animations in SD form for the previous games let alone a full scale model.
 

duckroll

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hteng said:
guys you are forgeting this is for the DS, you aren't gonna expect it to be a big jump like OG or Z in animation, they could barely do the animations in SD form for the previous games let alone a full scale model.

Being on the DS is no excuse for looking like cheap pre-rendered 3D ala Panzer Warfare.
 

PataHikari

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Aug 16, 2007
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hteng said:
guys you are forgeting this is for the DS, you aren't gonna expect it to be a big jump like OG or Z in animation, they could barely do the animations in SD form for the previous games let alone a full scale model.

...um... the DS SRW's look fantastic, I expect this game to have the same or better animation quality. In fact, I think they look better then any PS2 SRW not called "Original Generations" or "Z"
 

Bebpo

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PataHikari said:
...um... the DS SRW's look fantastic, I expect this game to have the same or better animation quality. In fact, I think they look better then any PS2 SRW not called "Original Generations" or "Z"

If you think W or K looks better than A3.....I don't know what to say.
 

duckroll

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If anyone really thinks that this has the same animation quality as this then I really don't know what to say. There's a very clear difference in the quality of the animation in terms of moving parts, details, and how the sprite moves when in motion.
 

Shouta

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duckroll said:
If anyone really thinks that this has the same animation quality as this then I really don't know what to say. There's a very clear difference in the quality of the animation in terms of moving parts, details, and how the sprite moves when in motion.

Yeah, K does not compare to A3 or most of the PS2 SRWs.
 

mjemirzian

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Jul 9, 2009
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I'm not as concerned with how it looks as much as how it plays.

This was one of the easiest SRWs on the SNES and I'd hope they make it less boring.. I assume it's because Winkysoft or w/e developed it and not Bandai. Add skill points, ex-hard mode, etc.

For some reason they keep making the DS/GBA games very easy.. with the exception of OG/OG2. I'm really enjoying Z though.. in between learning the common words/kanji found in the SRW series..
 

hteng

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Aug 13, 2007
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PataHikari said:
...um... the DS SRW's look fantastic, I expect this game to have the same or better animation quality. In fact, I think they look better then any PS2 SRW not called "Original Generations" or "Z"

the animations in the DS games are subpar and that's understandable given the hardware limitations. One of the issues is the colors and detail displayed, they can't seem to put enough pixels given the small screen.
 

lupin23rd

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Sep 14, 2006
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It's not even about the animation - it's all about dudes yelling "Buresto Faaaaaiya", "Choooooodenji spin", and "Geeeettttttaaaaaaaaa Beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeam".

Anyway off-topic, this remake should be improved on the SFC version and that's all that will matter.
 

Bebpo

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Jun 7, 2004
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mjemirzian said:
I'm not as concerned with how it looks as much as how it plays.

This was one of the easiest SRWs on the SNES and I'd hope they make it less boring.. I assume it's because Winkysoft or w/e developed it and not Bandai. Add skill points, ex-hard mode, etc.

For some reason they keep making the DS/GBA games very easy.. with the exception of OG/OG2. I'm really enjoying Z though.. in between learning the common words/kanji found in the SRW series..

Hmm, yeah the difficulty will be interesting to see which way they go. W/K are easy whereas OGs and Z put up a good fight (and OG Gaiden was hard!).

Basically if they are marketing this as a mainstream SRW for the kids, it'll be easy like W/K. But if they're marketing it as a hardcore remake for the fans, it'll be balls hard.