• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Super Street Fighter 4 |OT| BACK OF THE BUS, SAGAT!

Status
Not open for further replies.

DR2K

Banned
Cammy's standing HK is so good. Totally fucks over Geif, Dudley, Guy, and Fuerte. Pretty sure there's more.
 

KuroNeeko

Member
haunts said:
err, it's paperback guide, massive bible of info. obviously i cant read anything in there but you can still see how much effort that was put into it.

Is that the technical guide? It's broken up into two sections - a run down of the 30 characters and their move properties, followed by another list of the 30 characters with suggested combos and notes on the playstyles? Or a different guide?

If we're talking about the same guide, the frame data in the back is pretty useful but the actual content doesn't differ that much from what's written in the SSFIV Super Guide through 1up. In fact, that guide has a more in-depth listing of combos. The prism listing is pretty cool, but I'm not sure how accurate it is. The ease-of-use references don't seem to take into account how hard it is to hit those one frame links for bnb combos.

edit: To you guys saying guides are bad, how can more information be bad? Just take everything you read with a grain of salt...
 

gutabo

Member
haunts said:
err, it's paperback guide, massive bible of info. obviously i cant read anything in there but you can still see how much effort that was put into it.

thing is with print guide and fighting games, things evolve so quickly its hard to keep them up to date.
:(

Hey, very nice work! Some corrections on the honda section:

iplaywinner said:
WEAKNESSES: Very low stamina and stun in comparison to the rest of the cast
Obviously, taken from akuma.

iplaywinner said:
Useful Supers and Ultras.
I would remove ultras from that sentence. It's a chore to setup any of his ultras against a decent opponent.

I would add HP(both versions) as situational anti airs. They're better for that than in vanilla.

iplaywinner said:
SHIKOFUMI DF + HP
It's HK and it's an overhead. I would kill for that move to be DB+HK. Hell, I would kill for it to replace his sweep. Fuck his sweep.

iplaywinner said:
HUNDRED HAND SLAP
I would add info on the great frame advantage it gives even on block(+6 for the HP version, it's great!).

iplaywinner said:
Headbutt: The EX version goes even farther than the Hard Punch version, making it hard for opponents to jump out of its range.
Nope, the Ex version is almost like the MP version in terms of range(lil bit better). Can't catch an opponent holding backwards fullscreen.

iplaywinner said:
Headbutt:Both the Light Punch and the EX versions of the Sumo Headbutt have invincibility at the beginning of the attack, making them very useful as anti-airs or to punish unsafe moves thrown out by the opponent.
Light punch headbutt only has upper body invincibility and full body projectile invincibility on startup. Many jump in attacks can stuff it cleanly or trade.

iplaywinner said:
Oicho: It is an instant grab like Zangeif or Abels.
It is not instant, it has 5 frames of startup. Regular throws beat it.

iplaywinner said:
Super: All versions of the Super Killer Head Ram have invincibility at the beginning of the animation which allows the Super to go through projectile attacks if timed properly, making it very useful against those characters.
All versions have full projectile invincibility for a long, long time, making them go though projectiles even if honda whiffs the first hit. Only on contact(hit or block) they lose the projectile invincibility prematurely.

iplaywinner said:
Combos: cr.lk, cr.lp, cancel into ex hhs, cr.lp, cancel to ex headbutt
That combo is not possible, to be able to do the ex headbutt you need charge and charging makes EX hands to go backwards.

iplaywinner said:
Combos: mp hhs, cr.mk, cancel into hp headbutt
Very, very situational and character dependant. Also no one uses MP hands intentionally.

iplaywinner said:
Combos: jump in hk or mp, standing mk, cancel into hp headbutt
Should be crouching MK, close standing MK is weird, pushes the opponent back and sometimes comes as far s.MK.

iplaywinner said:
Combos: focus attack (opponent collapse), dash cancel into hp hhs, standing close hk
You can dash cancel into c.MK into HP hands too.

I would add a combo into super like j.HK, c.LK into HP headbutt into super or j.HK, s./c.HP into super. Also don't forget something into HP hands into HP hands cancelled into super.

Hope it helps.
 

Imm0rt4l

Member
haunts said:
btw, hve you guys seen the SSF4 japanese guide? checked it out this weekend, pretty ridiculous the amount of depth they have. the prisim chart for each character is awesome too.
Isn't prism supposed to be a sort of matchup favor/probability chart? I thought that was going to be in game and not in a guide, wish there was an English guide.
 

CPS2

Member
AkumaHokoru said:
FADC and Juri

Dont do it. It is a huge waste pretty much always.

she can only FADC low fireball and there is no need because you recover fast enough to follow it up anyway.

If juri is hit before she lowers her foot on fuhajin she WILL lose the fireball. she doesnt stock it till she lowers ler leg again.

All sempusha's and her ultra 2. the only attack box on it is her foot. does not hit behind her well (the only way you will ever see it hit behind her is trying to juggle it it will hit twice and then nothing)

I've found 2 uses for her EX FADC tho. Some FB combos only work in the corner, but they work midscreen if you EX FADC the fireball. It is worth the extra damage imo.

Also, this will only work for a few more days so probably not worth learning if you haven't already - cr.LK or whatever, _FB (thats my stupid notation for storing a fireball), knockdown, ^FB (more stupid notation for releasing a fireball), EX FADC, activate U1, unblockable into CC which everyone knows about already. Even if the unblockable doesn't work, it's safe and still a good setup because chances are they'll be in blockstun from the FB allowing you a free mixup.
 
CPS2 said:
I've found 2 uses for her EX FADC tho. Some FB combos only work in the corner, but they work midscreen if you EX FADC the fireball. It is worth the extra damage imo.

Also, this will only work for a few more days so probably not worth learning if you haven't already - cr.LK or whatever, _FB (thats my stupid notation for storing a fireball), knockdown, ^FB (more stupid notation for releasing a fireball), EX FADC, activate U1, unblockable into CC which everyone knows about already. Even if the unblockable doesn't work, it's safe and still a good setup because chances are they'll be in blockstun from the FB allowing you a free mixup.

her U1 unblockable is pretty hard and will be messed up 90.0% of the time against a dummy so trying it on a person who does a safe wakeup will beat both the fireball and juri. she has no priority. none. that ultra is bad. trust me I trained the hell out of that unblock the second unblockables were discovered to still be in you dont have to fadc the fireball actually. her best setup for it uses EX fireball to ultra off a back throw.
 

CPS2

Member
Yeah U2 is definitely better, and it'll probably remain that way with the unblockables gone. It is hard to do and not guaranteed, but if you can do it reliably you might start forcing people to EX DP or something else that you can just block and punish.

Just talking about this while I still can :lol
 

haunts

Bacon of Hope
gutabo said:

Wow thanks a lot for the corrections.

The combos are actually from the SF4 master guide so they are not up to date. Would you mind writing up a handful of bread and butters for honda? pls? ^______^
 
CPS2 said:
Yeah U2 is definitely better, and it'll probably remain that way with the unblockables gone. It is hard to do and not guaranteed, but if you can do it reliably you might start forcing people to EX DP or something else that you can just block and punish.

Just talking about this while I still can :lol
Oh dont you worry everything has been thoroughly researched the second I heard what U1 was i was like hell no that aint gonna work...sure enough it didnt. it worked in beta when she had ALOT more priority soon as she became a SF char proper though poof. u1 out the window.
 
I just bought a premium SSF4 PSN avatar. Damn I feel cheap, but whatever. Hope they show Sagat some love. They only have Dudley, Ken, Ryu and Bison so far.

Yeah, this is probably old news.
 

CPS2

Member
AkumaHokoru said:
Oh dont you worry everything has been thoroughly researched the second I heard what U1 was i was like hell no that aint gonna work...sure enough it didnt. it worked in beta when she had ALOT more priority soon as she became a SF char proper though poof. u1 out the window.

The only thing I could think of, was that perhaps she gets extra frame advantage off everything, since her overhead combos into stuff. So maybe pinwheel FADC into close LK or something else is easier (or possible), so you can go through 3 loops with 4 bars without even using fireballs. Have you had a go at anything like that?
 
CPS2 said:
The only thing I could think of, was that perhaps she gets extra frame advantage off everything, since her overhead combos into stuff. So maybe pinwheel FADC into close LK or something else is easier (or possible), so you can go through 3 loops with 4 bars without even using fireballs. Have you had a go at anything like that?
She doesnt get anything for activating other than the chains you also cant fadc pinwheel (because she isnt on the ground during it) when i said that shit useless I mean new york knick useless.(or should i say new jersey net useless?)
 

CPS2

Member
Overhead at least goes from +2 to +4, so I have a feeling that other moves might as well. And you can FADC pinwheel without CC (into cl.LK), so you definitely can with CC, it might even be easier. IDK thats where I think U1 is headed anyway, if anyone uses it.
 
CPS2 said:
Overhead at least goes from +2 to +4, so I have a feeling that other moves might as well. And you can FADC pinwheel without CC (into cl.LK), so you definitely can with CC, it might even be easier. IDK thats where I think U1 is headed anyway, if anyone uses it.

Hrm. LK pinwheel to fadc lk to lk pinwheel...sounds like a bad loop the meter use for the damage isnt worth it due to scaling. she gets better mixup off like expin because in the corner she can dash under the airborn body and then do something like late fireball overhead to chain or something nasty like that. but like i said good block or any kind of invulnerability will make it useless and there are alot of invul moves in this game that last just long enough to make her wish she had picked ultra 2 and concentrated on fighting.
 

Hitokage

Setec Astronomer
haunts said:
btw, hve you guys seen the SSF4 japanese guide? checked it out this weekend, pretty ridiculous the amount of depth they have. the prisim chart for each character is awesome too.
I own it, although I still have fighting game vocabulary to learn.

The amount of information not present in the SRK wiki is staggering. Also, I'm almost positive putting in "pursuit property" is bullshit despite it being 追撃可能技. Really reads more like "juggle/followup potential".
 

haunts

Bacon of Hope
Hitokage said:
I own it, although I still have fighting game terminology to learn.

The amount of information not present in the SRK wiki is staggering. Also, I'm almost positive putting in "pursuit property" is bullshit despite it being 追撃可能技. Really reads more like "juggle/followup potential".

yeah tbh i think they should have someone like Keits take info from the forums and update the SRK wiki to make it more relevant instead of focusing on front page news and stuff.

People can say what they want, there is a a lot of good info on SRK its just hard to find on the forums.
 

CPS2

Member
Hitokage said:
I own it, although I still have fighting game vocabulary to learn.

The amount of information not present in the SRK wiki is staggering. Also, I'm almost positive putting in "pursuit property" is bullshit despite it being 追撃可能技. Really reads more like "juggle/followup potential".

Should be called juggle potential imo. Pursuit property is very confusing.
 

Caj814

Member
haunts said:
S.MP and S.MK are good anti airs for her as well right? Ive beatn a lot of jump ins with C. HK but you obviously play her a lot more than I do.

Also for her super move you should add that you get a good amount of invincibility on it from the start up and can help with getting a reversal U1 out in situations that would other wise be unsafe.
Example:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VGmUmC2Fjjw

haunts said:
yeah tbh i think they should have someone like Keits take info from the forums and update the SRK wiki to make it more relevant instead of focusing on front page news and stuff.

People can say what they want, there is a a lot of good info on SRK its just hard to find on the forums.

I agree and there's also the problems with a lot of the general strat and match up threads never having the first posts updated to add all the general character match up advice that gets posted.
 

arstal

Whine Whine FADC Troll
AkumaHokoru said:
FADC and Juri

Dont do it. It is a huge waste pretty much always.

she can only FADC low fireball and there is no need because you recover fast enough to follow it up anyway.

If juri is hit before she lowers her foot on fuhajin she WILL lose the fireball. she doesnt stock it till she lowers ler leg again.

All sempusha's and her ultra 2. the only attack box on it is her foot. does not hit behind her well (the only way you will ever see it hit behind her is trying to juggle it it will hit twice and then nothing)

Annoying matchup

Fat ass honda.

Honda's pokes keep her out she cant beat him at keepaway so she has to put pressure on him...except big fat stupid honda has a tiny stupid almost blanka hitbox which gives juri problems. pray the honda is stupid. (this might be me though)


Juri pretty much has a hard time with anyone who can shit on her pokes. this is not limited to Anyone with a DP anyone with good pokes. those characters juri has to fight more defensively. if they dont have a wakeup game she goes from the butterfly to the spider. swarming her prey with attacks and wrapping them up before leaving them for a snack later.


Honda has it hard against Juri, the fireballs can keep him out some, and if Honda gets knocked down , Juri gets free pressure that Honda can't reversal out of, with lots of different angles. I'd rather deal with Fuerte's wakeup game as Honda then Juri's.

I think Juri's overall pretty solid. Ok, I need to see if I can troll with her today at some point- I am looking for that third char to go with Honda and Rose, and Sim is really difficult.

Hitokage said:
I own it, although I still have fighting game vocabulary to learn.

The amount of information not present in the SRK wiki is staggering. Also, I'm almost positive putting in "pursuit property" is bullshit despite it being 追撃可能技. Really reads more like "juggle/followup potential".

Pursuit to me means you can do a Darkstalkers/samsho-style knockdown attack afterwards. They were called pursuits in one of those games at least. Juggle potential to me would be either juggle limits or absolute juggle (SNK term when they allow BS comboing such as Kula AA jab into Freeze Execution in XI)
 

Threi

notag
Uh since nobody will attempt this

DeeJay's can use cr.hp, st. mk, st. hk and st. hp as anti airs.

His cr.hp has extremely good priority and his cl. mk hits twice and can break focus. cr.hp looks like an overhead but isn't, can trick people into thinking you are standing.

the first hit of his lk upkick does more damage than the mk and hk versions, however the additional hits add on to the damage, also his mk upkick can be comboed into his hk upkick if both hits connect.

You forgot to mention that his knee shot alters his jump arc and can be used as a short hop.

in the corner st.lk doesn't push deejay away so you can use that to continue combos

his bnb is either:
c.lp x2, c.lk xx air slasher (dread kick doesn't combo from c.lk)
c.lp x2, c.mp xx dread kick
or c.lp x2, c.mk.
 

ACE 1991

Member
Hey Haunts, do you plan on adding some sort of section about combo application? Lots of guides I read simply list combos, so it would be really cool if yours actually had a little footnote about when it is appropriate to use a specific combo.
 

Timedog

good credit (by proxy)
ACE 1991 said:
Hey Haunts, do you plan on adding some sort of section about combo application? Lots of guides I read simply list combos, so it would be really cool if yours actually had a little footnote about when it is appropriate to use a specific combo.

If you want combo application for Ryu, I can maybe help.
 

ACE 1991

Member
Timedog said:
If you want combo application for Ryu, I can maybe help.
That would be great :lol As I said a few pages earlier, I'm really trying to work on my zoning game, so starting to learn when and what to combos to use would be fantastic.
 
Threi said:
Uh since nobody will attempt this

DeeJay's can use cr.hp, st. mk, st. hk and st. hp as anti airs.
Did you forget s.MP? It's a good anti-air when the opponent is right above you. Also s.HP could be an anti-air, but it is an extremely shitty one. The hitbox on that thing is just awful.

In my opinion only good and reliable AA normals are c.HK and s.MP.

His cr.hp has extremely good priority and his cl. mk hits twice and can break focus. cr.hp looks like an overhead but isn't, can trick people into thinking you are standing.
Close s.MK doesn't actually hit twice. It is a great normal and is +3 on block. Far s.MK hit twice, but you still have to be kinda close to get the first hit. So it's more like "Close far s.MK" :D.
 
Haunts:

Simple stuff for Chun Li: You forget to add in the inputs for some of her command normals. You also forgot to add d/f+HK to her command normals.

For Ultra 2, another easy way to land is jumping forward HP (target combo), Ultra 2.

Also, for super, you can hit confirm it off of low forward.
 
AkumaHokoru said:
Point 1. The Stream. The stream would not be better have you ever seen a mlg stream? its bland as hell, and i mean uncooked dry rice bland unless its halo their premier game.

Point 2. The payouts. They have had issues in the past when it came to paying for the fighting game tournament winners. It it were once or twice it was fine but its been a few times.

Point 3 The Elitism. They pretty much change all the rules to their liking because they are the ones putting down the money the vocal majority gets priority when it comes to things like rules...which if you let it go unchecked results in things like seth and gouken getting banned because "wahh i cant fight them they are overpowered" and the like. the vocal majority often includes players who dont even play and are just talking out their asses/dont go to events.

1. If the stream sucks, someone usually just runs it on JTV. And even if the stream sucks, (tekken was fine), it's only on 5 weekends of the whole year. We still have the other streams with the GOD known as Chris Hu.

2. There was no problem. They (MLG) doesn't pay you cash right then and there. They give you a check that arrives at a later date because of legal stuff, corporation, sponsors, etc... I'm guessing, people at EVO 2k5 didn't expect that and were angry that they had to wait. Gran Calc and Clap of mlg already explained that every one who were owed money from late 05 were paid in the first quarter of 06. Who hasn't gotten paid (those are usually the complaints I hear)? Everyone who hasn't gotten paid needs to speak up and those who have no idea on who hasn't gotten paid need to shut up because they are obviously just spreading rumors. It's become a myth.

3. They change the rules to have the game as balanced as possible. If Street fighter doesn't need rules to balance the game there won't be. Secondly, I play competitive Halo and Halo 3 has the rules it has in mlg because Bungie's default settings are so scrubby that the tournament results would be completely random. Why should we the competitive community leave it as default? If you're into fps you would know how scrubby the default settings are. I mean, the main weapon on default can have the newest member to the genre and within 20 minutes the results would be 50-50. This doesn't apply to fighters though, so the complaint isn't valid. The Seth and Gouken ban is dumb, but they said that they would work with top players (which is what they do in Halo) on the rule set. Hell, Sundance (MLG CEO) even said they would let whoever runs tourneys now would completely run it in MLG, except MLG would host the venue, stream equipment, and give the prize money.

4. Everyone has elitists in any community. Go to any major community and they have elitists especially when it comes to a competitive community. If MLG picked up Street Fighter, the majority of the community would still be THIS community anyways. We would be the ones watching and participating on forums, stream chats, etc...




5. Ibuki's trial 23 has straight up beaten the shit out of me. : (
 

Threi

notag
Rocky_Balboa said:
Did you forget s.MP? It's a good anti-air when the opponent is right above you. Also s.HP could be an anti-air, but it is an extremely shitty one. The hitbox on that thing is just awful.

In my opinion only good and reliable AA normals are c.HK and s.MP.


Close s.MK doesn't actually hit twice. It is a great normal and is +3 on block. Far s.MK hit twice, but you still have to be kinda close to get the first hit. So it's more like "Close far s.MK" :D.

s.hp is pretty bad, it has slow startup and i never use it but it's there. c.hp is better, but if you have the d/u charge why not go for upkicks. I was thinking about s.mp but didn't list it because i don't use it much myself, it worked as an antiair once for me and i assumed it was luck. I will try using it more.


s.mk yeah i was wrong on that, its far mk that hits twice. regardless its a good poke.
 
Teknopathetic said:
"I also think that jumping fierce can now cross-up. It's been happening to me for quite a while."

It could always cross-up, it was pretty strict about the spacing, though. Maybe character specific, too? Never explored it much, personally.
Really? Well, I didn't really use the move to much in Vanilla, so that could have been a problem.

Also, here are some combos for Bison's section
- cr.jab > st.jab > cr.strong > scissors/PC
- cr. strong > cr. forward > scissors/PC
- st.short > st. short > roundhouse
- cr.jab x3 > cr. forward > scissors/PC
- j.fierce > st. fierce > scissors/PC

And j.strong into Ultra 2 works too, and does more damage.
 

Timedog

good credit (by proxy)
ACE 1991 said:
That would be great :lol As I said a few pages earlier, I'm really trying to work on my zoning game, so starting to learn when and what to combos to use would be fantastic.

First I will direct you to THIS POST I made, with some good info regarding hit confirms, block strings, comboing into fireball. Here is my personal assessment of the combos listed in the iplaywinner strategy guide...



NORMAL MOVE COMBOS

Crouching Light Punch, Standing Light Punch, Standing Light Punch, Crouching Heavy Kick ( 147 damage, 210 stun )
-This combo is useful if you are not REALLY comfortable with links. The advantage of ending a combo with sweep is that you get an untechable knockdown, giving you ample time to set something up for when they wake up. Also, with Ryu if you hold forward jump after a sweep you get an automatic safejump.​

Crouching Medium Punch, Crouching Medium Punch, Crouching Heavy Kick ( 192 damage, 280 stun )
-If you are very comfortable with links, this combo is better than the one above because it does more damage and stun. Because Ryu's sweep has such a slow recovery time, using any combo that ends in sweep as a blockstring is not a good idea vs. many opponents because they can punish you before you're recovered. For blockstrings use a combo that ends in fireball.​


HURRICANE KICK COMBOS

Jump-in Heavy Kick, Crouching Medium Kick, Heavy Hurricane Kick ( 256 damage, 460 stun )
-I'd change this in 2 ways:
(1) do a medium hurricane kick instead of heavy, because a heavy hurricane kick will make you land RIGHT next to your opponent RIGHT when they're waking up, leading to a potentially unsafe 50/50 situation. A medium kick hurricane will land you at a safe distance and give you a little bit of time to set up your next attack/mix-up/whatever. The difference in damage between medium hurricane, and hard hurricane is almost negligible ( 248 damage, no difference in stun )

(2) Half the time, you're going to want to replace the cr. med kick with a cr. hard punch, because it will make the combo do more damage and stun. Another big positive for cr. hp is that this move FORCES the opponent to stand up, so even if you start this combo on a crouching opponent, the cr. hp will stand them up, allowing the hurricane kick to hit. The cr. med kick has more range though, so if after the jump in attack you land somewhat far from the opponent then a cr. hp isn't going to connect. Learn the range of when you can use the preferable cr. hp, and when you NEED to use cr. mk. Changing to the cr. hp makes the combo do ( 278 damage, 560 stun )​

-That said, you can use this combo anytime the first jump in attack is gauranteed to hit (opponent dizzy, jumped over opponents fireball, opponent is in recovery from certain ultras, etc )​


Crouching Medium Punch, Crouching Medium Punch, Crouching Medium Kick, Heavy Hurricane Kick ( 252 damage, 420 stun )
-This combo is pretty hard, like the sweep combo above that similar, you need to be very good at links. It also will not work on a crouching opponent cause the hurricane kick will fly over them. On a crouching opponent you can substitute the hurricane kick for a fireball or EX fireball. Again, I'd say change the hurricane kick to medium, for the reasons already listed above, which will change the damage to 245, and cause no change in stun

-This is high damage and high stun. You can make this a jump-in punish combo, starting it out with a jump-in hard punch (provided you land RIGHT next to the opponent), you can use it after focus crumpling an opponent, or punishing a whiffed move.​

Solar Plexus Strike, Crouching Heavy Punch, EX Hurricane Kick ( 338 damage, 460 stun )
-This is most viable after you focus crumple an opponent, because the solar plexus is too slow a move for you to throw it out too much randomly, although once in awhile it might catch the opponent off guard as a poke. If done in the corner you can use ultra after the EX hurricane kick.

-The solar plexus to cr. hard punch link is super hard, so here's another one where you have to be really good at links.​


DRAGON PUNCH COMBOS

Crouching Light Punch, Crouching Light Punch, Heavy Dragon Punch ( 180 damage, 260 stun )
-This one is good as a whiff or blocked move punish and also in footsies. Say Hakan slides at you and you block, but you need to hit him with a fast move before he is able to block again, you could do a cr. lp and then dragon punch. This is viable anywhere you can get a cr. lp in whether your move blocks or hits. The second cr. lp gives you time to recognize if the opponent is blocking or being hit, if they are being hit you finish with the dragon punch, if you recognize that they are blocking, finish with a move that is more safe like a fireball.​

Solar Plexus Strike, Dragon Punch ( 270 damage, 300 stun )
-As for where you can use this, the same rules apply as the combo above that starts with solar plexus, most likely after a focus crumple. This combo, however, is much much easier than the combo above, so you're probably going to want to stick with this one as your default solar plexus combo, unless you're a combo expert.​

FIREBALL COMBOS

Crouching Medium Kick, Fireball ( 120 damage, 200 stun )
-This is ryu's most important combo/blockstring. Because the cr. mk has good priority, speed, and range, you can walk towards the opponent and throw this out effortlessly in order to keep pressure on them, Daigo-style. It is also almost always safe even if the opponent blocks it. You should be getting some damage/chip damage from this every round.

-One thing I like to do is sometimes on an opponents wake up, stay at a range where their dragonpunch/uppercut/reversal move would barely hit you, and block it. This should be close to the edge of the range of your cr. mk, where it's priority is at it's highest. If the opponent does a highly punishable move like a dragon punch, wait for them to land and punish like normal. If they too just sit there blocking, wait just long enough for you to recognize that they're blocking and not doing a reversal move, then throw out a cr. mk into fireball combo. If they try to do a move at the same time as you there's a good chance your cr. mk will beat it or at least trade. If they continue to block, you'll get chip damage from the fireball and not be in any worse a position. A lot of times though, they'll throw out a move a split second after you, or throw out a slow move, and your cr. mk will hit them during the start up frames of their move.​

METSU HADOUKEN COMBOS

Dragon Punch, FADC First Hit, Metsu Hadouken ( 398 damage, 150 stun )
-Use this any time you anticipate that the opponent is going to do a move that a dragon punch will beat, or if you anticipate that they aren't going to be blocking. If they do block, do not finish with your ultra after the FADC, because they'll just block it and punish you. Instead after the FADC go into a blockstring or do a throw attempt if they blocked the initial dragon punch.​

Crouching Medium Kick, EX Fireball, FADC, Metsu Hadouken ( 393 damage, 200 stun )
-This is pretty safe to use anytime you have 3 bars of EX meter and ultra meter charged. If the crouching medium kick is blocked, again don't throw out the ultra, do a blockstring or throw attempt.​

EX Fireball, Metsu Hadouken [Corner Only] ( 364 damage, 100 stun )
-Use this when pressuring the opponent in the corner. If the EX fireball lands, ultra, if they block it, keep on pressuring. What sometimes has worked for me is to throw a normal fireball, and if they block it, throw an immediate EX fireball. If you are at the right range, they will HAVE to block the 2nd EX fireball. If they try to jump (and they'll be looking to jump to get out of the corner) they'll get hit, which will allow you to​

METSU SHORYUKEN COMBOS

Level 2 or 3 Focus Attack, Metsu Shoryuken
With level 2 FA ( 433 damage, 150 stun )
With level 3 FA ( 493 damage, 200 stun )

This will be your main way to use this ultra, other than punishing a highly highly punishable move (like a shotos hard punch dragon punch, or hakan's slide). Use this anytime you can land a focus attack and crumple your opponent. Off of a jump-in (unlikely against good player), on the opponent when the wake up (unsafe), or absorbing an opponents poke and then releasing the focus attack (best idea).​

Dragon Punch, FADC First Hit, Metsu Shoryuken ( 304 damage, 150 stun )
This does ass damage, but hey, if the opportunity arises to use your ultra, take it. Use this in the same scenarios you'd use dragon punch > FADC > Ultra 1. It's the same, just less damaging.​
 

GuardianE

Santa May Claus
Timedog said:
Dragon Punch, FADC First Hit, Metsu Shoryuken
This does ass damage, but hey, if the opportunity arises to use your ultra, take it. Use this in the same scenarios you'd use dragon punch > FADC > Ultra 1. It's the same, just less damaging.​

Still does more damage than Ken's Dragon Punch, FADC, Shinryuken. :(
 
dragonballjoseph said:
Really? Well, I didn't really use the move to much in Vanilla, so that could have been a problem.

Also, here are some combos for Bison's section
- cr.jab > st.jab > cr.strong > scissors/PC
- cr. strong > cr. forward > scissors/PC
- st.short > st. short > roundhouse
- cr.jab x3 > cr. forward > scissors/PC
- j.fierce > st. fierce > scissors/PC

And j.strong into Ultra 2 works too, and does more damage.

Yes jumping fierce can crossup, its just really hard to do consistantly. In all honesty it usually happens by accident for me when it does lol, I usually don't try and use that move to crossup.

Some interesting combos there as well, most of them I knew about and use especially that last one for punishes. Didn't know three jabs could link into low forward, I'll have to try that sometime.
 
arstal said:
Honda has it hard against Juri, the fireballs can keep him out some, and if Honda gets knocked down , Juri gets free pressure that Honda can't reversal out of, with lots of different angles. I'd rather deal with Fuerte's wakeup game as Honda then Juri's.

I think Juri's overall pretty solid. Ok, I need to see if I can troll with her today at some point- I am looking for that third char to go with Honda and Rose, and Sim is really difficult.

Honda has 2 good options that stop juri pressure. ex buttslam (beats everything she has) and jab headbutt (fucks with her timing) if honda is on the attack and isnt respecting her bullshit honda will beat her. easy.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom