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[Pasedo]

I only use my Switch in portable mode and would prefer if it could get a bump in clocks to get the graphics up a notch even if battery life went down from say 3 to 2 hours on a charge. I don't see this as a problem with the use of a portable charger. Heck if they can give me more eye candy at only 1 hour charge I'd go for this also as I don't play for longer than that at a time. For the tech heads out there is it possible for Nintendo to patch the system to give it this extra performance with battery compromise and realistically what improvements could we see in portable, say if we used Doom as an example. Less blurry images due to dynamic res not sinking to shit etc..what extra effects could we see etc..?

 

[MrKeinov]

It's definitely possible but Nintendo would never do it in the current model, I think mod community will eventually do this. Just like they forced 3DS games to run at higher clock speeds in the new 3DS.

 

[Refreshment.01]

I only use my Switch in portable mode and would prefer if it could get a bump in clocks to get the graphics up a notch even if battery life went down from say 3 to 2 hours on a charge. I don't see this as a problem with the use of a portable charger. Heck if they can give me more eye candy at only 1 hour charge I'd go for this also as I don't play for longer than that at a time. For the tech heads out there is it possible for Nintendo to patch the system to give it this extra performance with battery compromise and realistically what improvements could we see in portable, say if we used Doom as an example. Less blurry images due to dynamic res not sinking to shit etc..what extra effects could we see etc..?

The battery life is one of the reasons the Switch works as an hybrid and why with it's cuarrent model works more like a "console" that can be played on the go.

Some handhelds downcloacked components in the past, but the Switch in portable mode downclocks it's GPU between 50 and 60% depending on mode. That's a figure unheard of, something that a manufacturer wouldn't do if the system's APU was for a handheld.

That battery range you speak of, in reality is more of 2 - 2.5 hours with the most intensive games. Zelda is around that and it isn't using Wifi extensivly like a multiplayer game would.

i think this would be in the cards for a revision or new model. Because even if Nintendo allowed Dock mode clocks while plugged the console gets a bit too hot for comfort in the hands and thats with the fan spining at full speeds.

 

[michaelius]

Aren't most of games on Switch 720p anyway in docked mode ?

 

[Out_Of_Ammo]

I think it's not the battery that's the biggest problem but the heat it would produce at full clock speeds. I'd imagine it would get too hot to hold comfortably at full speed, without a fan to reduce the heat.

 

[MrKeinov]

Aren't most of games on Switch 720p anyway in docked mode ?

Most are 900p with dynamic scaling while docked. I think there are more native full 1080p games than 720p games but I didnt count. 720p while docked is very rare.

 

[Pasedo]

So was thinking of getting it to a point where all it compromises is battery and doesnt produce an unreasonable amount of heat. I mean I've had mobiles that got pretty hot and they still passed with consumers. Something like a 10-15% bump I'd think is not out of the question. With something like that what improvements could we expect visually? One thing I don't like in Doom is how low the res can drop to in some scenes. If it could get closer to the native 720p screen I'd be much happier.

 

[Jodast]

So was thinking of getting it to a point where all it compromises is battery and doesnt produce an unreasonable amount of heat. I mean I've had mobiles that got pretty hot and they still passed with consumers. Something like a 10-15% bump I'd think is not out of the question.

Nintendo already have this option available to developers. Developers can choose between two handheld profiles, the default with the GPU at 307.2MHz and an enhanced mode that boosts the GPU clock 25% to 384Mhz. Most games would likely use the more powerful profile already.

 

[Pasedo]

Nintendo already have this option available to developers. Developers can choose between two handheld profiles, the default with the GPU at 307.2MHz and an enhanced mode that boosts the GPU clock 25% to 384Mhz. Most games would likely use the more powerful profile already.

Thanks for the source I didn’t know this. If games like Doom and Botw is using the highest clocks I still feel there’s more head room to bump it up with a bit of a hit on battery which I can live with. Heat wise I don’t find it bad at all playing Doom or botw for an hour and I’m in the middle of Australian summer at the moment. I reckon they could have gone to 450mhz. Perhaps give consumers the decision as well. Standard mode and performance mode with less battery. My expectations aren’t high. In games like Doom it just needs that little extra bit in fidelity. Happy with the frame rate at 30fps.

 

[Z3M0G]

Im scared to ask... but can you not plug the power in while in handheld mode?

If i get a switch, ill hardly ever dock it...

Edit: ok i assume yes from comments above. It would just be hot to hold.

 

[Lovely Salsa]

Isnt it possible to mod it so you get docked performance in handheld mode?

 

[Jodast]

Thanks for the source I didn’t know this. If games like Doom and Botw is using the highest clocks I still feel there’s more head room to bump it up with a bit of a hit on battery which I can live with. Heat wise I don’t find it bad at all playing Doom or botw for an hour and I’m in the middle of Australian summer at the moment. I reckon they could have gone to 450mhz. Perhaps give consumers the decision as well. Standard mode and performance mode with less battery. My expectations aren’t high. In games like Doom it just needs that little extra bit in fidelity. Happy with the frame rate at 30fps.

Yeah I'm pretty familiar with Australian summers. I'm guessing that not only is there heat and battery life balancing issues but also a dock/undock performance balancing issue. The default clocks on the Switch are a direct 2.5x difference, meaning that there is enough fill rate to run 720p undocked titles at 1080p docked all things being equal.

With the increased performance mode, the difference is dropped to just 2x so there already isn't enough fill rate for 1080p all things equal. By increasing undocked mode clocks further the performance difference drops even more. The clocks being 460.8MHz (76.8Mhz increase or 10% of total clocks) the fill rate difference between docked and undocked is just 1.6x and the potential resolution increase drops even more.

Basically the higher the undocked clocks the more unbalanced the system becomes. Nintendo already more or less sacrificed 1080p for the majority of titles to increase performance in undocked mode, any further and the system starts to either have even lower resolution in docked mode or worse, performance issues that aren't present in undocked mode.

Im scared to ask... but can you not plug the power in while in handheld mode?

You can but it won't change the clocks. The hardware in the dock tells the Switch to enter docked mode, not just a power cable. You just won't waste any battery.

Isnt it possible to mod it so you get docked performance in handheld mode?

Theoretically if hackers ever manage to create CFW a new performance mode could be created and games could be forced to try and use it.

 

[Refreshment.01]

Thanks for the source I didn’t know this. If games like Doom and Botw is using the highest clocks I still feel there’s more head room to bump it up with a bit of a hit on battery which I can live with. Heat wise I don’t find it bad at all playing Doom or botw for an hour and I’m in the middle of Australian summer at the moment. I reckon they could have gone to 450mhz. Perhaps give consumers the decision as well. Standard mode and performance mode with less battery. My expectations aren’t high. In games like Doom it just needs that little extra bit in fidelity. Happy with the frame rate at 30fps.

i already told you (well sort of) about the 2 Mobile performance modes. That's why i said the Switch behaves as an hybrid indeed when it runs it's GPU at 40% or 50% of it's "console" clock speeds when in portable mode.

The other thing you aren't considering is the balancing that takes place while designing a game. Developers that invest time optimizing properly for both modes tend to cleverly scale back effects that are harder to notice in the 6'' screen. Stuff like texture filtering, Ambient Oclusion, Shadow Quality, LODs for distant objects, etc are cut back when undocked. In a game that already matches the Switch build in screen resolution, what would be the benefit to have these Docked effects intact for portable mode when they are hard to notice in the smaller screen anyway?

Basically your suggestion brings more -s than +s. With complex games for Portable mode you' ll end up with a hotter console with sub 2 hour battery life. So a less confortable and shorter mobile experience over all.

As i undertand the 20nm process the Tegra X1 is made on is obsolete, the rest of the industry has moved on to 16nm and under. A Switch revision could use another Tegra variant with a 1080P screen, so basically games in portable mode could use the settings of todays docked mode while maintaining similar or better battery life.

 

[gspat]

Buy a second dock and mod it with both a display from somewhere like adafruit and enough lion batteries to replace the power supply... and maybe a fan if heat is an issue.

Let us know how it works!

 

[Ubername]

Is there anything where you can mod it to lower graphics settings and pump up the battery life? Like running at 240x200 or whatever and having ubermensch battery life.

 

[Kamina]

Isnt it possible to mod it so you get docked performance in handheld mode?

Question is how and if the handheld screen would display docked-mode resolutions.

 

[Pasedo]

Yeah I'm pretty familiar with Australian summers. I'm guessing that not only is there heat and battery life balancing issues but also a dock/undock performance balancing issue. The default clocks on the Switch are a direct 2.5x difference, meaning that there is enough fill rate to run 720p undocked titles at 1080p docked all things being equal.

With the increased performance mode, the difference is dropped to just 2x so there already isn't enough fill rate for 1080p all things equal. By increasing undocked mode clocks further the performance difference drops even more. The clocks being 460.8MHz (76.8Mhz increase or 10% of total clocks) the fill rate difference between docked and undocked is just 1.6x and the potential resolution increase drops even more.

Basically the higher the undocked clocks the more unbalanced the system becomes. Nintendo already more or less sacrificed 1080p for the majority of titles to increase performance in undocked mode, any further and the system starts to either have even lower resolution in docked mode or worse, performance issues that aren't present in undocked mode.



You can but it won't change the clocks. The hardware in the dock tells the Switch to enter docked mode, not just a power cable. You just won't waste any battery.



Theoretically if hackers ever manage to create CFW a new performance mode could be created and games could be forced to try and use it.

So it sounds like a new higher clock config for undock is possible for devs to develop to but they also need to develop for a docked configuration which will be at a different multiplier which means more development time and cost. I guess it comes down to how much more power can undock squeeze out and would it make any noticeable difference if devs used it. For me I'd like more consistent 720p rendering to make the image sharper.

 

[Pasedo]

Buy a second dock and mod it with both a display from somewhere like adafruit and enough lion batteries to replace the power supply... and maybe a fan if heat is an issue.

Let us know how it works!

I think you're on to something here. Nintendo could create an add on for portable enthusiasts which basically has an extra battery, fans and a design for better grip. The magic of it is it tricks the Switch into thinking it's in dock mode so you get the better performance mode in portable. So in the case of Doom it should look better on its screen as res drops are closer to its native 720p. They can call it the Super Switch Portable Pro.

 

[ShadowFox08]

i already told you (well sort of) about the 2 Mobile performance modes. That's why i said the Switch behaves as an hybrid indeed when it runs it's GPU at 40% or 50% of it's "console" clock speeds when in portable mode.

The other thing you aren't considering is the balancing that takes place while designing a game. Developers that invest time optimizing properly for both modes tend to cleverly scale back effects that are harder to notice in the 6'' screen. Stuff like texture filtering, Ambient Oclusion, Shadow Quality, LODs for distant objects, etc are cut back when undocked. In a game that already matches the Switch build in screen resolution, what would be the benefit to have these Docked effects intact for portable mode when they are hard to notice in the smaller screen anyway?

Basically your suggestion brings more -s than +s. With complex games for Portable mode you' ll end up with a hotter console with sub 2 hour battery life. So a less confortable and shorter mobile experience over all.

As i undertand the 20nm process the Tegra X1 is made on is obsolete, the rest of the industry has moved on to 16nm and under. A Switch revision could use another Tegra variant with a 1080P screen, so basically games in portable mode could use the settings of todays docked mode while maintaining similar or better battery life.

I imagine its gonna have to be a tiny ass super energy efficient node to play a graphically intense game like that for +3 hours on a 1080p screen. That extra resolution uses 2.5x more pixels and that's gonna be a huge draw to the battery. I'm thinking like current smartphones at 10nm. The pascal/x2 won't be able to do that without having the same battery life or even slightly worse than the current switch. It just wouldn't be worth it. I myself would just stick to 720p with 6 hours of battery life vs 1080p screen with 2.5-3 hrs. I'm guessing we'd have to wait for a 1TFLOP switch iteration(in docked mode) to have current dock performance(~400GLOPS) in 1080p resolution on the handheld for +3 hours without overheating fast.

 

[Anono]

I think the key compromise for Nintendo with this system has been to offer both a home console and a handheld one in the best possible conditions. For this very reason, the downclok of speeds in undocked mode seems a pretty obvious choice. No, I don´t want better graphics in exchange of 2 hours or less of battery life.
If we look forward, the next model will probably increase the battery life (16nm instead of 20nm for the litography, for example), not the contrary. It´s the way go, specially when you have a Pokemon game in the making.

 

[Donnie]

I think it's not the battery that's the biggest problem but the heat it would produce at full clock speeds. I'd imagine it would get too hot to hold comfortably at full speed, without a fan to reduce the heat.

Switch has a fan built into the handheld, it just runs pretty much only when docked because handheld clocks don't make the hardware hot enough to need the fan. No way would it be too hot to hold, the thing would melt if it ever became too hot to hold.

Nintendo could certainly run Switch at full docked clocks in handheld mode, but they won't due to battery life.

 

[delete12345]

So, let's think about the opposite:

Would Nintendo allow users to "overclock" the Nintendo Switch's GPU/CPU? It's definitely the same as increasing graphics fidelity and lowering battery life (or forgo that and jump straight to wired charging).

 

[Skyfox]

My switch's battery doesnt last long as it is so Id have to disagree with this.

On my vita though they have the brightness dropped during heavy gameplay. Id happily sacrifice vitas battery life to kill this "feature".

I hacked better performance out of my psp and it worked well but I dont see much coming out of switch AAA games as theyre heavily optimized to spec.

 

[lucius]

Not a good idea to lessen the battery, it is ok now but in a couple years it will be worse, my Wii U gamepad battery wasn’t lasting very long before I got rid of it. Yeah you can use a power brick but that still is a hassle which most people won’t bother with.

 

[Glass Joe]

I only use my Switch in portable mode and would prefer if it could get a bump in clocks to get the graphics up a notch even if battery life went down from say 3 to 2 hours on a charge. I don't see this as a problem with the use of a portable charger. Heck if they can give me more eye candy at only 1 hour charge I'd go for this also as I don't play for longer than that at a time. For the tech heads out there is it possible for Nintendo to patch the system to give it this extra performance with battery compromise and realistically what improvements could we see in portable, say if we used Doom as an example. Less blurry images due to dynamic res not sinking to shit etc..what extra effects could we see etc..?

I don't think anyone but "enthusiasts" like you would be satisfied with an only 1 hour play time via charge. That sounds like a major detriment to the convenience of playing a game on the go. Nintendo seems to have struck a balance that works fine for what their 1st party goals are, and the reality of the technology available (not just graphics but battery life and heat generated). You can always theoretically push a system harder by turning this or that off. But it's probably a bad idea. In the meantime, enjoy your blurry DooM or don't enjoy it at all. At least 3rd parties are on board, somewhat, for once...

 

[Pasedo]

I don't think anyone but "enthusiasts" like you would be satisfied with an only 1 hour play time via charge. That sounds like a major detriment to the convenience of playing a game on the go. Nintendo seems to have struck a balance that works fine for what their 1st party goals are, and the reality of the technology available (not just graphics but battery life and heat generated). You can always theoretically push a system harder by turning this or that off. But it's probably a bad idea. In the meantime, enjoy your blurry DooM or don't enjoy it at all. At least 3rd parties are on board, somewhat, for once...

I guess that’s my thing to know it can run at docked mode but not having the option. Would be better if they’d let the user decide with an option in settings. Run in performance mode. ‘Warning battery life will significantly lower but Doom will look less soupy.’

 

[ShadowFox08]

So, let's think about the opposite:

Would Nintendo allow users to "overclock" the Nintendo Switch's GPU/CPU? It's definitely the same as increasing graphics fidelity and lowering battery life (or forgo that and jump straight to wired charging).

No. T
Too much work or them to enable that feature for all their games like PC settings.. Also, not really worth it anyway, specifically on portable mode when the battery life averages 3 hours on games like botw and odyssey. The option to play 60fps at 720p or 30 fps at 1080p in FE warriors was amazing though

 

[HBP]

I think it's not the battery that's the biggest problem but the heat it would produce at full clock speeds. I'd imagine it would get too hot to hold comfortably at full speed, without a fan to reduce the heat.

It does have a fan, mine kicks in even in handheld mode but mostly when plugged into a charger.

 

[Pasedo]

Wish I had the smarts and connections to manufacture and sell the Switch Portable Pro add on. It shouldn't be difficult as the hardware is already there you just need a hack to make the Switch think it's in dock mode. Bought skyrim yesterday and the environment can get quite pixelated in portable but in dock although not perfect it's alot smoother. It would be nice to get those visuals on my portable screen. I'm sure I'm not alone. Some people just want that little bit extra dressing which is why 1 in 5 ps4 base has the Pro. To have 1 in 5 buy my Switch Portable Pro I'd make one million dollars. No one billion dollars.

 

[delete12345]

Many people would also be already doing that, knowing it will sell well.

But, in this timeline, it didn't happen. This means they know some critical faults at play preventing them from doing so.

 

[Pasedo]

Many people would also be already doing that, knowing it will sell well.

But, in this timeline, it didn't happen. This means they know some critical faults at play preventing them from doing so.

I dunno man. You'd think there would be more 3rd party options for open better ventilated docks due to the bending and scratching issues of the genuine dock but I've only seen a couple of options. Based on this I doubt anyone has made a real effort to make and sell something like this concept. I mean if something like this existed. A case which has extra battery, proper gaming grip design and tricks the Switch to thinking it's in dock mode so you get docked enhanced visuals on the go. Who would buy it? Say if it was 70-100$ Australian dollars?

 

[dckcheney]

i wish for an upgraded portable mode so much...i haven't even opened my dock as i can only imagine how booty these games look on a 4K display and combined with the heat from dock/ possible scratch issue ill pass.

 

[delete12345]

I dunno man. You'd think there would be more 3rd party options for open better ventilated docks due to the bending and scratching issues of the genuine dock but I've only seen a couple of options. Based on this I doubt anyone has made a real effort to make and sell something like this concept. I mean if something like this existed. A case which has extra battery, proper gaming grip design and tricks the Switch to thinking it's in dock mode so you get docked enhanced visuals on the go. Who would buy it? Say if it was 70-100$ Australian dollars?

Well, I didn't miss out. Ever heard of the Nyko dock burning and destroying the Switch due to faulty discharges? I would be seeing a ton of 3rd party options, if it wasn't for the fact the electronics themselves are subpar quality and are not vigorously tested like Nintendo Switch's stock docks.

Subpar quality, meant the circuitry is prone to damage because of fluctuating currents when switching from portable mode to TV mode. Switch also requires constant voltage, so any changes here will burn the chipsets inside, potentially losing your game saves in the process.

I personally wouldn't risk my game saves over the option to use 3rd party docks, unless it is partnered with Nintendo.