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[jeff_rigby]

Edit: Any hardware that can support UHD Blu-ray with digital bridge can support UHD TV and VR from a browser. With hardware designed to also support games it can support game VR.

ATSC 3.0 UHD TV is also going to support HDR (High Dynamic Range) and by accounts can support everything coming for UHD Blu-ray and vice versa. UHD Blu-ray is not just for movies.....3D and Multi-view for Augmented Reality tours of Museums which require HFR and S3D etc. and Multi-view with HFR (High Frame Rate) for Live sporting events via UHD TV is coming.

Including the audio (true audio in the PS4 and XB1 support this and game middle ware has to downscale to 7.1 audio) there are 140 planned features for UHD TV. http://www.audioholics.com/hdtv-formats/atsc-3.0

If you remember the discussions early 2013 on Sony stating the next generation console would need to support 300 FPS and some of us quoted another Sony employee stating glassless 3D or Multi-view on UHD TVs needed 5 video streams...that will be supported by UHD blu-ray and TV and can be used by VR glasses. (With VR glasses, as your head moves from side to side the view switches from stream to stream and with Glassless 3D UHD TV you have to move your whole body and head right to left or left to right to see the different views.)

This is why Virtual Reality is coming in 2016, because UHD Blu-ray is coming in 2016 and it supports the same features needed by VR. UHD TV will use the same features UHD Blu-ray uses and only the Tuner and Transport layers need to be added to a STB that supports UHD TV or Blu-ray to receive ATSC 3.0.

Tuner and Transport (QFDM) layer for ATSC 3.0 are essentially the same as in Cell Phones. In other words there is a synergy in everything coming that is UHD. It explains why Facebook would buy Oculus Rift as it can be supported for media not games on every connected to the internet with browser UHD STB for blu-ray or TV not just PCs. When the internet can support UHD IPTV it can support VR with a browser. The STB would need a camera it likely will have for Skype and Gesture recognition and that will provide much of the head tracking for the VR goggles.

The problem is chicken and egg....getting people to buy the Vidipath STBs be they on Cable or Antenna TV so that the majority of the cost to move to ATSC 3.0 features is pain free. Most of the UHD Blu-ray players will be connected to the home network and will have a HTML5 browser. If they support the UHD Blu-ray digital bridge they will likely support Playready and are de facto Vidipath servers and Client. All they need is a Network tuner to support TV. This, I understand, is the plan for the PS4 and XB1.

• A solution for streaming 4K/Ultra-HD TV profiles will be included in the DLNA guidelines by Q3 2015,

Blu-ray 1080P (2006) was supposed to be a few years in advance of ATSC 2.0 which uses the same codec to support 1080P, S3D NRT and XTV (Java and Javascript). The PS3 was designed to support (except for USB or Network tuner) ATSC 2.0. The PS4's UHD blu-ray is supposed to be a few years in advance of ATSC 3.0 which will use the same HEVC codec and for XTV the same javascript and Java. It just requires a USB or Network tuner.

ATSC 2.0 has been delayed and it looks like ATSC 3.0 will be released early. Korea wants to broadcast the 2018 Winter Olympics Feb 2018 in UHD using ATSC 3.0. There are several additional factors that might make ATSC 3.0 come early.

1) Phone TV tuners. Phones use the same modulation scheme that ATSC 3.0 will use and the same UHF frequencies TVs used to use. With minor changes and firmware updates a Phone could support ATSC 3.0 mobile with very little additional cost. The FCC may require phones support ATSC 3.0 Mobile TV for emergency alerts. TVs will be required to be AOAC and turn on with an emergency alert (both the PS4 and XB1 support this AOAC network standby).

2) The FCC wants to auction off additional TV spectrum. In some markets this means not enough channels are available. ATSC 2.0 and 3.0 use h.264 and h.265 (HEVC) respectively which allow 2 to 4 times as many channels with the same bandwidth.

3) Requiring the consumer to buy a ATSC 2.0 STB and then two to three years later a ATSC 3.0 STB and possibly a new antenna does not make sense. Most of the Vidipath STBs being released in 2016 will support HEVC so with a network or USB tuner they can support both ATSC 2.0 and 3.0.

4) ATSC 3.0's primary short term use will be to support Mobile TV and 1080P channels. I suspect that sometime in 2016 DLNA network tuners will be on sale that support both ATSC 1/2 and 3.0. The current UHD TVs will require the same Network tuner and 1080P Smart TVs will require a DLNA server that transcodes to 1080P. All dumb 1080P TVs will require in addition a Vidipath STB with HEVC support.

The PS4 and XB1 have multi-stream codecs and are designed to be the HD and UHD DVR/DLNA server and transcode from HEVC to 1080P (Media Hub) as well as Vidipath client for 1080P and UHD TVs. All they need is a USB or Network tuner.

W3C extensions to HTML5 include USB and Network tuner control based on Hauppage USB and Silicon dust HD Homerun. HD Homerun prime is a DLNA tuner which serves a RUI for a Vidipath STB. No tuners currently support ATSC 3.0.

ATSC 1.0 supporting 480i to 1080i
HD Blu-ray was released in 2006 supporting 1080P
IPTV streaming in about 2010 along with Blu-ray S3D
ATSC 2.0 was supposed to release 2013-2014-2015-2016 supporting 1080P, S3D (using blu-ray codec), Non Real-time Transmission, S3D and XTV
UHD streaming about 2015
UHD Blu-ray 2016

2013 (PS4 and XB1) to 2015 for other Vidipath and HEVC capable STBs enter the market but no firmware support.
2016 the FCC no longer requires a Cable Card for Cable TV and DSS (Downloadable Security Scheme) starts. This allows Network tuners connected to PCs, XB1 or PS4 to support their being DVRs and servers to other platforms in the home.
2016 Vidipath STBs with HEVC codec and Firmware updates
2016 the PS4 and XB1 get firmware updates to support UHD blu-ray

UHD (ATSC 3.0) TV 2017 and Broadcast early 2018 in time for the Feb winter olympics in Korea. Supporting NRT, 1080P, S3D, UHD (using Blu-ray's HEVC), XTV and 140 planned protocols/features and is extensible

 

[Durante]

No. Not at all.

Consumer VR was released in 2015 and will become more widespread in 2016 because Palmer Luckey ran an incredibly successful kickstarter in 2012 and the community response since then has shown that its time is now.

An outdated 20th-century media delivery system has nothing to do with it. You don't even specify which nebulous "features" of blu-ray those are supposed to be.

 

[Yaser Tech]

Every time I enter a jeff thread, I try my best to understand what you are saying because it seems interesting and insightful. I unfortunately cannot.

Could you possibly simplify it a bit?

 

[Durante]

It's neither interesting nor insightful. It's a seemingly random agglomeration of facts and speculation which bears no relation to VR that I can discern.

 

[PnCIa]

I am sorry OP, but your post reads like something from misterxmedia minus the global conspiracy against microsoft.

 

[Linkup]

It seems like you haven't been following VR much at all.

 

[jeff_rigby]

No. Not at all.

Consumer VR was released in 2015 and will become more widespread in 2016 because Palmer Luckey ran an incredibly successful kickstarter in 2012 and the community response since then has shown that its time is now.

An outdated 20th-century media delivery system has nothing to do with it. You don't even specify which nebulous "features" of blu-ray those are supposed to be.

Edit, the 2010 leaked Microsoft 720 powerpoint has VR and AR glasses. Should we consider that the start? 2012 when Lucky asked for Kickstarter funding? 2015 when Lucky announced it no longer makes him sick? Or 2016 when more hardware supports features needed by VR like HFR supported by HDMI 2 which is what is needed to not make Lucky sick?.

First, it's 21st Century TV not outdated 20th century. I take some liberties with implementation dates as it's hard to pin down an evolving standard. VR needs high frame rates as most people start to up-chuck after 15 minutes at lower frame rates. And for VR to be successful you have a chicken and egg period where media and games are developed for it and then consumers buy it.

Point of the OP is that the hardware to support UHD Blu-ray and TV can support browser VR. The market for VR is not just PCs and the PS4. Eventually most UHD Blu-ray players will support browser VR also and the price for VR and Blu-ray players, given economy of scale, will be driven down.

UHD TV is IPTV delivered to a STB with browser and eventually after 2017 to a UHD smart TV and is designed to also be connected to the Internet. It can be delivered via the internet from a Cable Modem or Over the Air with an antenna.

If you take announced features for both the XB1 and PS4 and assume they have the same media plans then they will support UHD Blu-ray and TV.

 

[spekkeh]

OP reads like a collection of random computer terms thrown together and cooked into a semi-coherent story.

 

[hesido]

What Durante says, is that to assert that VR was "waiting" for the UHD bluray format is frankly, ridiculous.

The features the format will bring may perfectly complement VR, but the assertion is absurd.

I am sorry OP, but your post reads like something from misterxmedia minus the global conspiracy against microsoft.

Don't be so mean.

Spoiler

I was going to mention that Jeff Rigby's threads, although as knowledgeable as he is, began to sound like multimedia versions of MisterXmedia posts.

 

[KyleCross]

I realize it's more and better color, but HDR isn't really a necessity for the future, right? The Sony 4K TV I just bought doesn't support HDR (nor is the model getting a firmware update to add it like other models). The Samsung I returned prior was cheaper and did support HDR but it was a worse TV all around.

 

[jeff_rigby]

What Durante says, is that to assert that VR was "waiting" for the UHD bluray format is frankly, ridiculous.

The features the format will bring may perfectly complement VR, but the assertion is absurd.

VR requires many of the features that are going to be offered with UHD blu-ray and TV. Hardware has to be designed to support those features. Newer AMD APUs and dGPUs support 10 bit HEVC, high frame rates and high dynamic range. Did AMD develop this for the limited number of gaming VR users on PCs or did they design in those features for UHD TV, Blu-ray and browser VR? Why did Facebook invest in VR? For games or for browser VR? Does Facebook have plans to support VR on Consumer products other than PCs?

And many of you are missing the obvious. There is a synergy between all these formats and the same hardware that supports one can support the other. In my opinion, the PS4 and XB1 are designed to support UHD blu-ray, TV and VR for games and Browser. Any other view would make no sense.

 

[Velurian]

Does anyone even use physical media these days?
I mean sure, some rural regions do, but to assume that the corner stone of the new coming of VR is linked to an obsolete media delivery medium is absurd.
Video rentals are dying by the dozen and ain't now wonderdisk gonna save that...

And no, VR does not REQUIRE it, its done fine without it so far and the only thing it really needs is quality content thats easly accessable. Downloadable for instance.

 

[Oblong Schlong]

This is gibberish that actively concerns me, so much information but so little understanding. It's obsessive and extensive but not coherent.

 

[jeff_rigby]

Does anyone even use physical media these days?
I mean sure, some rural regions do, but to assume that the corner stone of the new coming of VR is linked to an obsolete media delivery medium is absurd.
Video rentals are dying by the dozen and ain't now wonderdisk gonna save that...

And no, VR does not REQUIRE it, its done fine without it so far and the only thing it really needs is quality content thats easly accessable. Downloadable for instance.

You all are missing the point. Read my posts and respond tomorrow after you have some time to think about it.

 

[Jonnax]

Sure thing Jeff. How's that DLNA 2.0 for the PS4 coming along?

You're just connecting a bunch of random dots together.

 

[Huggy]

Does anyone even use physical media these days?

I don't know. Streaming an ultra HD bluray at 90fps doesn't sound like something I'll be able to do. And I'll probably shouldn't be seeing any compression artifacts.
Those movies must be huge on disk as well.

 

[kyser73]

Does anyone even use physical media these days?
I mean sure, some rural regions do, but to assume that the corner stone of the new coming of VR is linked to an obsolete media delivery medium is absurd.
Video rentals are dying by the dozen and ain't now wonderdisk gonna save that...

And no, VR does not REQUIRE it, its done fine without it so far and the only thing it really needs is quality content thats easly accessable. Downloadable for instance.

Adam, is that you?

 

[gafneo]

They say, whatever the porn industry chooses for format is what will be industry standard.

 

[thekiddfran]

What has blu ray got to do with VR?

For the PS4, the blu ray is just used to install the data on the PS4 hard drive.

After that the disc is useless

 

[jeff_rigby]

Sure thing Jeff. How's that DLNA 2.0 for the PS4 coming along?

You're just connecting a bunch of random dots together.

In the OP:

• A solution for streaming 4K/Ultra-HD TV profiles will be included in the DLNA guidelines by Q3 2015, = DLNA 3

It's all tied together with UHD IPTV, Blu-ray, TV and VR. The UHD Blu-ray digital bridge proposals from Sony and Panasonic will use Playready 3's ND to stream UHD in the home the same way Vidipath streams HD using WMDRM10/Playready 2. In the same way ATSC 2.0 may be skipped in favor of ATSC 3, we might be seeing the delay for DLNA 2 (Vidipath) in favor of DLNA 3 (4k/UHD and HD TV profiles using Playready ND).

I am not party to first hand decisions on roadmaps and timing. Professional tech writers stated UHD Blu-ray was coming late 2015 and only last month were we informed it's coming in 2016.

What I am posting here except for the speculation that the PS4 and XB1 will support all this is fact based on professional articles. I'm only "connecting the dots" in that the hardware to support UHD Blu-ray can also support UHD TV and VR.

 

[Mindwipe]

I think I was a bit too polite (and job scared) to come in during the PS4 4k Blu-ray debacle, so let's nip this in the bud now. This is wrong. Many parts of it are significantly and materially wrong.

 

[Shuggananas]

Yeah right. UHD blu-ray hah, like that matters at all

 

[Zaptruder]

Wtf am i reading.

 

[DieH@rd]

Jeff. Never go full retard. You are typing nonsense.

Spoiler

You did it for a long time now.

 

[AbandonedTrolley]

Wtf am i reading.

My thoughts exactly

Jeff-

 

[Feep]

You really don't know what you're talking about, dude.

Blu-Ray players supporting VR? Most of us developers are being hamstrung by a GTX 980 TI, man. You can theoretically stream a spherical, stereoscopic video to an HMD and account for head-tracking without a ton of computational power, but it wouldn't support positional tracking, which is a serious must for any real sense of presence.

 

[Zaptruder]

You really don't know what you're talking about, dude.

Blu-Ray players supporting VR? Most of us developers are being hamstrung by a GTX 980 TI, man. You can theoretically stream a spherical, stereoscopic video to an HMD and account for head-tracking without a ton of computational power, but it wouldn't support positional tracking, which is a serious must for any real sense of presence.

Like seriously... the only correlation between UHD and VR is that both are in serious need of raw bandwidth.

But we call that HDMI 2.0 or DP.

360 4k 60 fps video? Well that'd be interesting, but I doubt that they'll be sticking that on BD any time soon.

 

[Jebusman]

Jeff I really don't get why you don't seem to understand the difference between speculation and fact.

You seem to think your speculation is air tight enough that it can be considered fact, when there is (and may never be) no actual confirmation from anyone involved that would matter.

It was bad enough in the "PS4 will support 4K Bluray" thread. It should have been renamed "PS4 'could' support 4K Bluray", and I still don't know why it wasn't.

I also see you bumped it with this new "info".

 

[hesido]

VR requires many of the features that are going to be offered with UHD blu-ray and TV. Hardware has to be designed to support those features. Newer AMD APUs and dGPUs support 10 bit HEVC, high frame rates and high dynamic range. Did AMD develop this for the limited number of gaming VR users on PCs or did they design in those features for UHD TV, Blu-ray and browser VR? Why did Facebook invest in VR? For games or for browser VR? Does Facebook have plans to support VR on Consumer products other than PCs?

And many of you are missing the obvious. There is a synergy between all these formats and the same hardware that supports one can support the other. In my opinion, the PS4 and XB1 are designed to support UHD blu-ray, TV and VR for games and Browser. Any other view would make no sense.

Whether the conclusion of PS4 and XBox One support for UHD blu-ray has close to 0 impact on VR coming out in 2016. The OP title is very problematic. "VR is coming on 2016 because UHD Blu-ray.." VR will do absolutely fine on PS4 whether I pop in a UHD blu-ray disk or not. You are free to connect the dots as you wish and conclude PS4 / Xbox One will have UHD support, but VR has no UHD BluRay requirements. An UHD video feed may complement a VR viewing of content because of the extreme resolution, but that's not a requirement.

 

[jeff_rigby]

You really don't know what you're talking about, dude.

Blu-Ray players supporting VR? Most of us developers are being hamstrung by a GTX 980 TI, man. You can theoretically stream a spherical, stereoscopic video to an HMD and account for head-tracking without a ton of computational power, but it wouldn't support positional tracking, which is a serious must for any real sense of presence.

Browser VR not game and doesn't head tracking require less computational power than gesture and Tensilica's HiFi audio DSP can do gesture and Voice recognition at the same time it processes audio.

Positional tracking for mobile VR assumes no camera and won't be supported by most VR in any case.

I prefaced the Blu-ray STB VR with it likely has a camera for Skype and gesture control. ALL AMD APUs have middle ware for gesture control that uses the same Xtensa processor it uses for codecs including HEVC. Most phones and tablets use the same ARM middleware for gesture control and Sony blu-ray players have used Xtensa processors for a decade. The video post processing in new UHD TVs to upconvert and process video can use Xtensa processors like newer AMD APUs use to do the same.

 

[jeff_rigby]

Like seriously... the only correlation between UHD and VR is that both are in serious need of raw bandwidth.

But we call that HDMI 2.0 or DP.

360 4k 60 fps video? Well that'd be interesting, but I doubt that they'll be sticking that on BD any time soon.

No, it's multi-stream 720P or 1080P S3D and with 5 S3D views it can easily use the entire bandwidth that one UHD 4K stream would need. Thus it needs HEVC and higher frame rates in addition to a higher bandwidth provided by HDMI 2 or DP.

 

[RibMan]

Interesting thoughts.

To be honest, I don't think the two are related at all. I think console VR is coming out in 2016 because of three reasons:

1) PlayStation VR has been in the kitchen for over 4 years now. The hardware is at a point where -- by all accounts -- it actually works as a virtual reality device. It's ready to be used by consumers. It makes no business sense to delay a product that's ready for market, so 2016 is when PSVR is going to release. If UHD gets delayed to 2017 or 2018, it won't affect Sony's plans to launch PSVR in 2016.

2) The Oculus Rift is coming out in 2016. Sony would be foolish to not capitalize on the buzz and media attention that's going to surround a working VR headset. In other words, the market for VR 'opens' in 2016, and Sony wants the PS4 to be associated with VR gaming. Just think back to when 3D became a thing, and how both Sony and Nintendo invested a lot of money into the technology.

3) The console installbase (PS4), software, and console price-point are at a point where VR can attract a sizable market on consoles. By sizable, I'm thinking > 300,000 < 1,000,000. PSVR would have been dead on arrival had it launched with the PS4. Look at what happened with Kinect on Xbox One for an example of how a lack of software, lack of installbase, an a poor price-point can kill an accessory.

 

[jeff_rigby]

Whether the conclusion of PS4 and XBox One support for UHD blu-ray has close to 0 impact on VR coming out in 2016. The OP title is very problematic. "VR is coming on 2016 because UHD Blu-ray.." VR will do absolutely fine on PS4 whether I pop in a UHD blu-ray disk or not. You are free to connect the dots as you wish and conclude PS4 / Xbox One will have UHD support, but VR has no UHD BluRay requirements. An UHD video feed may complement a VR viewing of content because of the extreme resolution, but that's not a requirement.

The PS4 has a custom HDMI port to support HFR (30, 60, 90, 120) confirmed so far. You can assume it's only for VR and I can assume it's for HFR UHD Blu-ray and TV which can also be used for VR.

There is a synergy in the hardware support for UHD Blu-ray, TV and VR. Also the same hardware to support being a Media Hub can be used to support the Game Social features we see already supported in the PS4 and XB1. This makes it difficult to say that the PS4 was designed as a Game Console or the PS4 was designed to be a Media Hub. The same logic applies to UHD blu-ray, TV and VR.

Was the PS4 designed to be a VR platform or can it support VR because it supports UHD Blu-ray? I personally don't care which just as long as it supports everything.

The point everyone is missing is that Microsoft for the first time with Windows 10 is supporting a blu-ray player without third party support. They have also announced that Windows 10 will support UHD blu-ray and in White papers Playready ND in Windows 10 will support DVR and Live UHD TV streaming to other platforms in the home. Panasonic and Sony UHD Digital bridge proposals support streaming HD & UHD blu-ray over the home network using Playready ND.

So a Windows 10 OEM PC will support UHD Blu-ray and TV as well as VR with the same hardware. The parts that do the media and tracking in AMD APUs are low power ARM so low power hardware can support browser VR, Blu-ray and TV. For games a larger GPU is needed.

 

[OfficerZap]

#teamjeff

Love your posts man, really thought provoking.

 

[jeff_rigby]

Interesting thoughts.

To be honest, I don't think the two are related at all. I think console VR is coming out in 2016 because of three reasons:

1) PlayStation VR has been in the kitchen for over 4 years now. The hardware is at a point where -- by all accounts -- it actually works as a virtual reality device. It's ready to be used by consumers. It makes no business sense to delay a product that's ready for market, so 2016 is when PSVR is going to release. If UHD gets delayed to 2017 or 2018, it won't affect Sony's plans to launch PSVR in 2016.

2) The Oculus Rift is coming out in 2016. Sony would be foolish to not capitalize on the buzz and media attention that's going to surround a working VR headset. In other words, the market for VR 'opens' in 2016, and Sony wants the PS4 to be associated with VR gaming. Just think back to when 3D became a thing, and how both Sony and Nintendo invested a lot of money into the technology.

3) The console install base (PS4), software, and console price-point are at a point where VR can attract a sizable market on consoles. By sizable, I'm thinking > 300,000 < 1,000,000. PSVR would have been dead on arrival had it launched with the PS4. Look at what happened with Kinect on Xbox One for an example of how a lack of software, lack of install base, an a poor price-point can kill an accessory.

100% agree those are factors but @ $399 for PS4 VR goggles (Sony said it would cost what a PS4 costs) I don't expect a large percentage of PS4 users will buy one till it drops in price. A larger percentage will buy a PS4 for Media than will buy one for VR.

Your figures at current installed base of 30 million would be 10% to 30% buying VR goggles. @ 10% is I think close. The price will rapidly drop and the % increase.

See my last post for other points.

 

[Zaptruder]

No, it's multi-stream 720P or 1080P S3D and with 5 S3D views it can easily use the entire bandwidth that one UHD 4K stream would need. Thus it needs HEVC and higher frame rates in addition to a higher bandwidth provided by HDMI 2 or DP.

Well, I was thinking more 4k vid at 60 fps reprojected into 360 degrees... which is how current 360 tends to be distributed.

 

[IvorB]

Does anyone even use physical media these days?
I mean sure, some rural regions do, but to assume that the corner stone of the new coming of VR is linked to an obsolete media delivery medium is absurd.
Video rentals are dying by the dozen and ain't now wonderdisk gonna save that...

When streaming is a viable delivery method for full fat high definition video and audio at a quality that matches blu-ray/ UHD blu-ray then I guess those formats will be obsolete but that time has not yet come. Of course for people that are happy with DVD/Netflix quality then, yeah, they have probably moved on. Which isn't to say anything about whether that's relevant for VR.

 

[Memorabilia]

Does anyone even use physical media these days?
I mean sure, some rural regions do, but to assume that the corner stone of the new coming of VR is linked to an obsolete media delivery medium is absurd.
Video rentals are dying by the dozen and ain't now wonderdisk gonna save that...

And no, VR does not REQUIRE it, its done fine without it so far and the only thing it really needs is quality content thats easly accessable. Downloadable for instance.

It boggles the mind how many people actually believe we are somehow close to high speed streaming nirvana. The reality in the United States is that the internet structure is poor for 10s of millions, the magnitude of the project needed to bring these areas up to spec is ginormous, and the political landscape is beyond fucked to the point that its not going to happen for at least another decade (when micro satellite tech may make high bandwidth affordable for most of the population). There is most definitely a need for optical media for at least several more years while solutions for the bandwidth problem are realized.

 

[Madness]

I think optical storage can also stall the growth of streaming and downloads by inventing larger format standards as well. 500gb discs would be crazy for anyone to try and rip and even with compression, in the era of data caps and broadband limiting, I wonder what it would be.

8K will probably not see physical media adoption, it's still at least a decade away from home adoption, especially with regards to size, since 4K can easily fit the 55"-85" niche that they've created. 8K would require larger television sizes.

But back to UHD, I want to know whether film companies will create new masters for 4K UHD either doing them in 4K/8K now, and whether things like LotR extended could fit on one disc start to finish. 3D and long movies had it tough even with dual layer BD's.

 

[Zaptruder]

So long as physical media can keep up its density growth at a reasonable rate... there'll still be uses for it.

I mean Lightfield video is a relatively recent invention... and a high resolution light field video takes up immense immense amounts of data.

Essentially it allows the user to reposition themselves anywhere within the capture volume (e.g. a 2ft sphere allows for 2ft diameter of repositioning).

And it does this... by essentially capturing ALL THE LIGHTRAY INFORMATION within that 2ft diameter volume.

By comparison, your average camera is capturing all the lightray information that falls upon the 2D sensor. So... you're talking about hundreds to thousands fold increase in data for the same resolution, depending on how wide a capture volume you use.

 

[30yearsofhurt]

 

[pottuvoi]

So long as physical media can keep up its density growth at a reasonable rate... there'll still be uses for it.

I mean Lightfield video is a relatively recent invention... and a high resolution light field video takes up immense immense amounts of data.

Essentially it allows the user to reposition themselves anywhere within the capture volume (e.g. a 2ft sphere allows for 2ft diameter of repositioning).

And it does this... by essentially capturing ALL THE LIGHTRAY INFORMATION within that 2ft diameter volume.

By comparison, your average camera is capturing all the lightray information that falls upon the 2D sensor. So... you're talking about hundreds to thousands fold increase in data for the same resolution, depending on how wide a capture volume you use.

Well, basically you store 4 dimensional information on the surface of the volume, not within the volume itself.
Raw data is huge, but it has huge amount of duplicate or similar data so it should compress very well.

Certainly it will be interesting and obviously the right way to go on how to distribute video for VR.

For those who want to know more..
Light Field Imaging: The Future of VR-AR-MR

 

[Throwaway123456789]

They say, whatever the porn industry chooses for format is what will be industry standard.

Didn't the porn industry back HD-DVD?

 

[Zaptruder]

Well, basically you store 4 dimensional information on the surface of the volume, not within the volume itself.
Raw data is huge, but it has huge amount of duplicate or similar data so it should compress very well.

Certainly it will be interesting and obviously the right way to go on how to distribute video for VR.

For those who want to know more..
Light Field Imaging: The Future of VR-AR-MR

Thanks for the correction.

Yeah, you store that surface information, and then computationally work backwards to retrieve lightray information in the volume of that sphere.

 

[spineduke]

Are you talking about VR or something else? Because we already have VR, and thankfully, there's no need for such large volumes of data to enable it.

 

[Insane Metal]

Yep, this is a jeff_rigby thread, all right.

 

[EGOMON]

I just want to say Thank you Jeff

 

[shandy706]

I like messing with those 360º 4k YouTube videos they have now.

 

[IvorB]

Didn't the porn industry back HD-DVD?

Hmmm... you got me curious enough to google it. Seems like they switched sides to blu-ray at one point: http://techcrunch.com/2008/01/14/porn-industry-turns-its-sexy-back-on-hd-dvd-format/. So the porn industry still remains the ultimate tech barometer, bless them.

 

[jeff_rigby]

Jeff. Never go full retard. You are typing nonsense.

You did it for a long time now.

Do some reading; read the Panasonic and Sony UHD Blu-ray digital bridge proposal and articles on TEE. Then my posts on the PS4 will support UHD blu-ray with digital bridge and will support Vidipath.

Check out AMD APUs and what the ARM block in them supports and how. The XB1 and PS4 use the same IP. It's customizeable and the only question is which Xtensa family is being used and how custom/powerful. We know more about the XB1 now than the PS4's Southbridge. My speculation is that Sony and Microsoft knew what is coming for the CE industry and co-operated (Microsoft-Sony.com domain registered by Microsoft) to bring it with the game consoles.

Nothing I have posted in the last 2 years is impossible or improbable and much of it has been confirmed by the XB1.

The Digital bridge proposal is KEY to understanding the performance required by the Xtensa DPUs. Since it needs TEE DRM the SoC has to contain all the video processing and a GPU can't be used for both power and DRM reasons. Digital Bridge is Media Hub sharing of UHD blu-ray over the home network and it will have a Hard Disk and Browser and Gesture as well as voice control. It will essentially be a PS4 without the large GPU for games. Since it has all the hardware to be a DVR and a Cable card is not needed, a network or USB tuner and firmware can turn it into a DVR.

All the above is obvious and the plans by the CE industry are in whitepapers and proposals to the FCC and the industry. The PS3 is getting a Playready update to support either 4K (unlikely because of the HDMI port but HDMI 2 does have HDMI served over the Home network to 4K TVs that treat video coming in from the Network port as HDMI 2 so a PS3 could comply with DRM 4K requirements in that delivery model) or Vidipath or both. And Sony proposals to the FCC to use Passage have examples of the PS3 and PS4 as Vidipath clients. Playready ND has examples of Game Consoles as DVRs and also Live streaming being supported. Both the XB1 and PS4 have h.264 encoder codecs and with HEVC decode codecs, are positioned to be the Media hubs and HEVC to h.264 converters that will be needed by the Digital bridge and IPTV over the internet.