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TECH Nvidia stock falls after U.S. government restricts chip sales to China and Russia

winjer

Member

Nvidia shares fell 6.5% in extended trading on Wednesday after the company said the U.S. government is restricting sales in China.

In a filing with the SEC, Nvidia said the U.S. government told the company on Aug. 26, about a new license requirement for future exports to China, including Hong Kong, to reduce the risk that the products may be used by the Chinese military.

Nvidia said the restriction would affect the A100 and H100 products, which are graphics processing units sold to businesses.

“The license requirement also includes any future Nvidia integrated circuit achieving both peak performance and chip-to-chip I/O performance equal to or greater than thresholds that are roughly equivalent to the A100, as well as any system that includes those circuits,” the filing said.

The company expects that it could lose $400 million in potential sales in China in the current quarter after previously forecasting revenue of $5.9 billion. The new rule also applies to sales to Russia, but Nvidia said it doesn’t have paying customers there.

In recent years, the U.S. government has applied increasing export restrictions to chips made with U.S. technology because of fears that Chinese companies could use them for military purposes or steal trade secrets.

Nvidia said it was applying for a license to continue some Chinese exports but doesn’t know whether the U.S. government will grant an exemption.

“We are working with our customers in China to satisfy their planned or future purchases with alternative products and may seek licenses where replacements aren’t sufficient,” an Nvidia spokesperson told CNBC. “The only current products that the new licensing requirement applies to are A100, H100 and systems such as DGX that include them.”

An AMD representative confirmed to CNBC that it had also received new licensing requirements from the U.S. Department of Commerce which it believed applied to its MI250 circuit, which is intended for artificial intellegence. AMD said it did not believe the new requirements would cause a material impact to its business.

In a statement to CNBC, a department spokesperson said “While we are not in a position to outline specific policy changes at this time, we are taking a comprehensive approach to implement additional actions necessary related to technologies, end-uses, and end-users to protect U.S. national security and foreign policy interests.”


This year is not going well for NVidia. The mining crash, economic recession, no more demand from people stuck at home because of covid, and now these limitations of sales in Russia and China....
The are still more valuable than before 2020, but that margin getting smaller and smaller.
But after seeing NVidia trying to rip-off consumers for 2 years, I can't say I feel sorry for the company.
 
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winjer

Member
A 4080 is gonna costa 1000 dollars isn't?

Who knows. NVidia has been increasing prices on almost every gen, for several years now.

But his ban, seems to only affect workstations. Consumers cards, don't seem to be in the list.

This decision may impact the development of NVIDIA Hopper architecture because this new requirement will also require NVIDIA to transition ‘certain operations’ out of China, SEC notes.

NVIDIA may face approximately 400M USD lost revenue of potential sales of A100/H100 GPUs in China, but only if no alternative is given or SEC does not grant an export license on time.
 
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Ellery

Member
A 4080 is gonna costa 1000 dollars isn't?

I would be surprised by that. Not only because it is significantly more expensive than the 3080 (699$) and the 4080 is lower in terms of relative performance to the top dog than the 3080 was. So 3080 was the same chip as the 3090 and 3090 Ti, but the 4080 looks to be a much smaller and slower chip than the 4090 whereas the 3080 was only slightly slower.

That is the reason the 3080 was loved so much. It was a big flagship die and not a smaller one like the 3070.
 

GymWolf

Gold Member
Nop, they need to reduce prices now because people wont buy expensivr cards, recession is very close, probably before year end
And i'm sure that around the world there is enough rich nerds to still buy whatever they put out at whatever price since they still sell limited quantities...

Do you have any doubt that every gpu in their site is not gonna get sold during day one like every other time just because dark times are ahead of us? Many people are not that forward thinking and they only think about the present.

I sincerely hope you are right but i don't see a 4080 being priced less than 700-800, not 1000 but still way overpriced.

Edit: i hope all of you are right guys.
 
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Black_Stride

do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
This ban is only for their A100 and H100 GPUs, they are mostly used for AI, DataCenter and DeepLearning applications.

The GeForce and Quadros are still sold there as is.
 
Made in Taiwan. But can't ship to China...

Sure Jan GIF
 

Ellery

Member
Your ETF should in theory be only exposed to a very small fraction of this, and is designed to be shielded from this.

That is not how ETFs work. However there are some ETFs that have a great amount of diversification or are index based, but there are also ETFs on only a few tech stocks etc.

I think even single stock ETFs are now allowed (sadly. this is a big problem actually. Or not a problem if you are part of the rich elite)
 

jigglet

Member
That is not how ETFs work. However there are some ETFs that have a great amount of diversification or are index based, but there are also ETFs on only a few tech stocks etc.

I think even single stock ETFs are now allowed (sadly. this is a big problem actually. Or not a problem if you are part of the rich elite)

Well yeah I assumed you were holding an index based one. If not then continue with your worrying.
 

winjer

Member
Made in Taiwan. But can't ship to China...

Taiwan is not China, and it's very close allied with the US and EU.
Besides, TSMC depends on machinery from ASML, in the Netherlands.
UV tech was a joint development with several US and EU companies. Not Chinese.
And TSMC gets a lot of funding from US companies to assist development of new process nodes.
So when the US and EU have invested so much in tech and money, into TSMC, they get a word on whether China can receive these products.
 
Taiwan is not China.
Both Chinas disagree! That's the, actually troubling, "joke".
It's officially Peoples Republic of China (mainland China) and Republic of China (Taiwan), both pretend that they are the real China, claim to be rightful ruler of all of it. Although I guess the support for this stance is dwindling in Taiwan. And some would rather actually become a separate entity and get a seat in the UN.
 

winjer

Member
Both Chinas disagree! That's the, actually troubling, "joke".
It's officially Peoples Republic of China (mainland China) and Republic of China (Taiwan), both pretend that they are the real China, claim to be rightful ruler of all of it. Although I guess the support for this stance is dwindling in Taiwan. And some would rather actually become a separate entity and get a seat in the UN.

You are lagging in the news.
Tsai Ing-wen, and the Taiwan government ,in 2019 officially refused the "one country, two systems" and the 1992 Consensus.
 
You are lagging in the news.
Tsai Ing-wen, and the Taiwan government ,in 2019 officially refused the "one country, two systems" and the 1992 Consensus.
and China accepted this and all lived happily after?
unilateral plans are the reason why the tensions are higher than ever.
 
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REDRZA MWS

Member
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This year is not going well for NVidia. The mining crash, economic recession, no more demand from people stuck at home because of covid, and now these limitations of sales in Russia and China....
The are still more valuable than before 2020, but that margin getting smaller and smaller.
But after seeing NVidia trying to rip-off consumers for 2 years, I can't say I feel sorry for the company.
Good, fuck China and Russia. More 4090’s available here in the states 😎
 
The US needs to give up on this insane idea that they must remain the world’s sole superpower. That is impossible. Give up on it and figure out a way to make peace with China. As it stands Americans seem intent on causing a world war though.
America loves a good old war. They'll never have peace with China at least not without a war first. That's assuming the US wins any such war. They might not be a superpower 50-100 years from now. It wasn't that long ago that the British Empire was at its height of power. Look at the state of the UK now.
 
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Ellery

Member
I suspect this is the reason they overproduced chips

No they overproduced chips, because the demand in 2021 was so high that Nvidia couldn't meet it and when a big company has lots of demand they can't adress then they are losing money and so they ordered lots of parts for products, but then at some point the demand decreased (due to factors like crypto falling, people being saturated after 2 years of buying) and all the components they ordered and manufactured into a GPU now sit on shelves.

Also called the bullwhip effect.
 

John Wick

Member
Taiwan is not China, and it's very close allied with the US and EU.
Besides, TSMC depends on machinery from ASML, in the Netherlands.
UV tech was a joint development with several US and EU companies. Not Chinese.
And TSMC gets a lot of funding from US companies to assist development of new process nodes.
So when the US and EU have invested so much in tech and money, into TSMC, they get a word on whether China can receive these products.
This is the very reason why there can never be peace in the world. One country seems to think it can dictate to everybody else. They are happy to buy cheap products from China but want to restrict what is sold to them.
 

winjer

Member
This is the very reason why there can never be peace in the world. One country seems to think it can dictate to everybody else. They are happy to buy cheap products from China but want to restrict what is sold to them.

This is not a matter of peace and freedom.
Several western companies and governments invested billions into TSMC, ASML and other companies, to produce the most advanced process nodes.
They do not have to give this knowledge to other countries.
If China wants an advanced process node, then they have to invest in it. Like the USA and EU did.
 
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John Wick

Member
This is not a matter of peace and freedom.
Several western companies and governments invested billions into TSMC, ASML and other companies, to produce the most advanced process nodes.
They do not have to give this knowledge to other countries.
If China wants an advanced process node, then they have to invest in it. Like the USA and EU did.
What a load of horseshit. They only seem to not want to sell to two countries. We know why and it has fuck all do do with the shite your spinning. Is that why the US went on a world tour to stop other countries from using Huawei? Huawei was way ahead of the USA in 5G. Also they don't want to sell them any advanced CPU's or GPU's why? Why are they pressuring other countries to do the same.
 
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winjer

Member
What a load of horseshit. They only seem to not want to sell to two countries. We know why and it has fuck all do do with the shite your spinning. Is that why the US went on a world tour to stop other countries from using Huawei? Huawei was way ahead of the USA in 5G

Just because you have no knowledge about tech business, doesn't mean it's bullshit.
No country has to give free tech to China.

Might I also remind you the vast amount of laws that China imposes on western companies that want to do business in their country.
Did you know that these laws give a very unfair advantage to Chinese companies. But you don't complain about this. do you?
 
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John Wick

Member
Just because you have no knowledge about tech business, doesn't mean it's bullshit.
No country has to give free tech to China.

Might I also remind you the vast amount of laws that China imposes on western companies that want to do business in their country.
Did you know that these laws give a very unfair advantage to Chinese companies. But you don't complain about this. do you?
No knowledge of the tech world lol. You need to come out of this American propoganda bullshit. Try visiting the rest of the world and seeing the truth and the double standards. If your so offended by China why buy goods from there?
 

winjer

Member
No knowledge of the tech world lol. You need to come out of this American propoganda bullshit. Try visiting the rest of the world and seeing the truth and the double standards. If your so offended by China why buy goods from there?

So what do you think should happen?
Do you think that Intel, AMD, NVidia, Apple, ASML, TSMC, should just forgo all the billions they invested in new process nodes, and give it to China?
Why would that make any business sense? The answer is that it doesn't. And even China knows it doesn't make sense, because they don't give out the techs they have mastered.
 

poodaddy

Member
I would be surprised by that. Not only because it is significantly more expensive than the 3080 (699$) and the 4080 is lower in terms of relative performance to the top dog than the 3080 was. So 3080 was the same chip as the 3090 and 3090 Ti, but the 4080 looks to be a much smaller and slower chip than the 4090 whereas the 3080 was only slightly slower.

That is the reason the 3080 was loved so much. It was a big flagship die and not a smaller one like the 3070.
I think the 4080 is gonna be 650. Won't bs you, I'm using my special instincts that are pulled out of my ass, but that's my prediction. If I'm wrong and it's higher, I am cry. If I'm wrong and it's lower, I am happy boi.
 
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Ellery

Member
I think the 4080 is gonna be 650. Won't bs you, I'm using my special instincts that are pulled out of my ass, but that's my prediction. If I'm wrong and it's higher, I am cry. If I'm wrong and it's lower, I am happy boi.

I think it is going to be $799, but I'd be happy if it is 650
 

Three

Member
No they overproduced chips, because the demand in 2021 was so high that Nvidia couldn't meet it and when a big company has lots of demand they can't adress then they are losing money and so they ordered lots of parts for products, but then at some point the demand decreased (due to factors like crypto falling, people being saturated after 2 years of buying) and all the components they ordered and manufactured into a GPU now sit on shelves.

Also called the bullwhip effect.
Well I can't imagine the Russian and Chinese market disappearing helps with that overstock. Seems like they are getting hit from all angles.
 

Ellery

Member
It better be a fucking monster that eat 4k60 for breakfast at that price...

Well we roughlky do know the performance and it is like 50-60% faster than the 3080. So it is quite a good chunk faster.

Paired with bigger VRAM and new features it will be quite good at 4K that is what I expect. I see no reason for worry
 

Ansphn

Banned
What a load of horseshit. They only seem to not want to sell to two countries. We know why and it has fuck all do do with the shite your spinning. Is that why the US went on a world tour to stop other countries from using Huawei? Huawei was way ahead of the USA in 5G. Also they don't want to sell them any advanced CPU's or GPU's why? Why are they pressuring other countries to do the same.
I can't disagree with what you said because its facts and double standard that i see. It's the ugly game of Hegemony.

It was crazy what they did to Huawei with its advance camera that the U.S said Huawei stole but till this day, no phone had the same technology.

Then the 5G tech from China being the most advance and the U.S is out all over the world accusing China of installing the 5G so they can use it to spy.

The ugly game of Hegemony.

I'm sure the U.S gov did the same to Japan back in the days until they accepted that Japan wasnt a threat to take the #1 spot.
 
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SmokedMeat

Gamer™
Can’t say I feel bad for a company that had no qualms about fucking their bread and butter customers over, for an extra buck.

I’m also sure China has stolen whatever they need to already. It’s what they do.
 

Hari Seldon

Gold Member
I can't disagree with what you said because its facts and double standard that i see. It's the ugly game of Hegemony.

It was crazy what they did to Huawei with its advance camera that the U.S said Huawei stole but till this day, no phone had the same technology.

Then the 5G tech from China being the most advance and the U.S is out all over the world accusing China of installing the 5G so they can use it to spy.

The ugly game of Hegemony.
China bans US tech companies all the time from operating in China. Fuck 'em, turnabout is fair play. Plus it is 100000% obvious that they steal every single thing not nailed down. Imagine if the US government handed the CIA to Timmy Apple with the explicit instructions to steal everything that they can to become a tech powerhouse to boost the local economy. That is how china rolls.
 
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