Support NeoGAF

[Afro Republican]

Tekken 7 just recently broke 3.6 million sales putting it behind the outdated 5 million figure for Mortal Kombat X. Making Tekken the 2nd best selling traditional fighter this gen.

In fighting threads here and on other sites, people said that there was no way that japanese fighters could change and appeal to a wider audience without sacrificing quality and mechanics, while also remaining a niche genre because "1vs1" and other silly excuses, and Tekken 7 has proven this just isn't true. It's a huge success with more content on the way, and nothing had to be stripped or dumbed down to do it.

What kind of lessons should Japanese fighting devs learn from Tekken so that they too can sell to a larger group of consumers? With most other franchises struggling to hit 500k and SF having been through a slump, there should be plenty lessons to learn from the success of Tekken 7.

 

[Lucumo]

Doesn't Tekken have comback mechanics these days? Pretty sure that falls under "sacrificing quality and mechanics".

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

I am merely a casual Tekken fan but I was there Day One, haven't bought a single scrap of DLC, and I've been happy with the game!

Two big selling points for me were the Theatre for all the old story mode FMVs and the customizable music playlists with tracks from across the whole franchise. It would not be a lie to say that I played through a ton of modes just to get money to unlock more stuff.

 

[Woody Nvincible]

Doesn't Tekken have comback mechanics these days? Pretty sure that falls under "sacrificing quality and mechanics".

It makes for some pretty hype moments at tournaments. The twitch monsters explode.

Now that Marduk was revealed and Negan is finally almost here, I'll finally make a purchase at the steam xmas sale.

 

[Deleted member 752119]

I bought it day one (with first season pass etc) and enjoyed it a lot for a bit. I fell off as it's just too complex/technical for me. I just don't have the time or patience for games like it or Street Fighter anymore. I just stick to simpler fighting games with more single player content these days (MKX, Injustice 2, Soul Calibur 6, Smash soon etc.).

That said, it's fantastic for what it is and deserves the sales for sure. It's a great sign for the genre that such a complex and difficult game that's pretty thin on single player content has sold so well.

 

[God Enel]

Played so much tekken 4 (and 3) back in the days. Loved it though it grew old on me and I’m out of the loop for quite a while. Still happy to see tekken do so well!

Btw how many copies did street fighter move? Never thought that it’s numbers are lower than the ones of tekken. And never knew Mortal Kombat sold that many.

IMHO for me the best fighting game is killer instinct (to watch, so sad there is no tournament community anymore to watch).

People saying that fighting games are dead is quite dumb with twitch numbers on the rise. People are still interested in it and they are so fun to watch. Plus I always think the commentators are top notch!

 

[Deleted member 752119]

Btw how many copies did street fighter move? Never thought that it’s numbers are lower than the ones of tekken. And never knew Mortal Kombat sold that many.

Most recent thing I found was an interview in June that said SF5 was nearing 2.5 million copies sold.

It's bad launch hurt it a lot. I think the art style hurt it's appeal in the west. It's not that different than SFIV which sold better (though also inflated by having so many versions), but things like Ken's hair just look terrible and make it look super low budget. Compared do stuff like this or SC6 or Injustice 2 that look amazing.

 

[Space Runaway]

Btw how many copies did street fighter move? Never thought that it’s numbers are lower than the ones of tekken. And never knew Mortal Kombat sold that many.

SFV was at around 2.5m a little before AE's launch. I think it's still under 3m post AE though. It could have sold more but SFV at launch was a disaster and the game itself was very divisive within the community.

And yeah MK sells like crazy. Even during the "fighting games are dead" period of the 00's, MK was still moving millions. It helps they followed Tekken's lead of loading their games with "kontent".

 

[Nymphae]

I hated it. I mean it's a solid ass game for sure, but I can't get into it at all. I used to be a huge Tekken guy with 2, 3, and TT, but now I just prefer 2D plane fighters.

The story mode was a fucking massive bore, it felt like they were actually trying to put me to sleep with those narrator bits about the guy looking into the Mishima story.

 

[Hoya Destroyer]

The overly long juggle combos and ugly character models (for the females specifically) stopped me from buying it.
I used to love practicing the EWGF back in the day though

 

[DForce]

Like I said in another thread. Tekken is one of the few fighting game franchises that sell millions of copies within the initial release.

Many fighting game devs learned from Mortal Kombat by adding a cinematic story mode to attract a casual audience. This is one of the reasons why Tekken 7 was more popular than Tekken Tag Tournament 2, along with adding Akuma to the series.

The hardcore fighting game fans will buy the latest fighting games, but it's all about attracting a casual audience.

 

[Afro Republican]

Tekken 6 which was the best selling tekken (post 3) last LTD was 3.5

Tekken 7 is doing more than adding story mode (which 6 also had) as more people are buying tekken faster than the last several entries. A big deal.

 

[Cyber Caesar]

Tekken 7 introduced some great non-anime characters, even anime inspired Luky Chloe has grown on fans. Adding Akuma was a great addition that helped leach a few Street Fighter fans. The gameplay is better than ever and the game runs great online. Namco did their best to compete with Warner Brothers and that's commendable, including a decent NetherRealm style story mode. The mode is lacking when compared to NRS in its ability to accommodate an ensemble cast and the side stories are typical Tekken fare that hamper the overall quality of the production. Yet this effort alone puts them above every other Japanese competitor.

I think Tekken could benefit from a writing team with skills on par with NRS. Still Tekken has done a good job of keeping pace with the standards set by large development studios in the West. Very few developers can compete with Warner Brothers on a level playing field. Tekken 7 has actually surpassed Mortal Kombat X in terms the amount of content that can be expected when purchasing a fighting game. As a fan that has been with the series since 1995 I can attest to the fact that Tekken is the best it has ever been. The added gameplay mechanics have only helped improve an already best in genre system. There is a reason Tekken has sold more units than any other fighting game on the planet.

In order to maintain its dominance, Tekken has to get more weapons in this high fidelity production arms race.

 

[Deleted member 752119]

I think Tekken could benefit from a writing team with skills on par with NRS.

Or just use the Soul Calibur 6 writers (assuming they weren't just the same people who worked on T7).

Story isn't great, but it's solid. And it shows you don't have to have a huge budget for a bunch of CGI cutscenes and voice acting. I'm totally fine with the two modes mostly being text driven stories. I really just want some story there as motivation to do a shit ton of fights against the CPU in different conditions. SC6 delivers that in spades.

Granted, that may just be me--though reviews touted those modes as well. We'll just have to see how it sales. It did pretty well in the October NPD charts, so just a matter of seeing if it has legs like T7 has.

 

[Afro Republican]

. There is a reason Tekken has sold more units than any other fighting game on the planet.

For now. MKX is missing sales since 2015, but even if we were to put LTD at only 6, one more good MK game with MKX sales and Tekken will be lapped.

Tekken 7 is doing great, hope they continue and dont screw up with 8, though if they keep the roster based on the story mode 8 might have a few mad fans due to a ummm missing character. of course they'll likely find someway to make him not have "really" died but we'll see.

 

[Cyber Caesar]

Tekken's missing a huge opportunity by not focusing its narrative around its top 15 charaters. Tekken's narrative focus has been clearly Kazuya, Jin and Heihachi for 25 years. Even Mortal Kombat realized it was time to kill off Lui Kang. To be honest it was the best thing MK has ever done.

The fans love "The Man God" Heihachi but as you can see he's the 21st ranked character, from a narrative standpoint if all the Mishimas died tomorrow it would be great thing for Tekken.

 

[ReBurn]

I always hated Heihachi.

 

[DForce]

Tekken 6 which was the best selling tekken (post 3) last LTD was 3.5

Tekken 7 is doing more than adding story mode (which 6 also had) as more people are buying tekken faster than the last several entries. A big deal.

Tekken 6's story wasn't cinematic. It was just some over the top Tekken force mode. Having a cinematic story mode is more attractive than some bland force mode. Guest characters also helps with sales and that's why many fighting game developers are starting to add them in their games.

This is just one aspect but there are several others too.

It's hard for devs to make a fighting game that will sell millions of copies unless they create a good fighting game based off of existing popular IPs.

 

[Afro Republican]

Tekken's missing a huge opportunity by not focusing its narrative around its top 15 charaters. Tekken's narrative focus has been clearly Kazuya, Jin and Heihachi for 25 years. Even Mortal Kombat realized it was time to kill off Lui Kang. To be honest it was the best thing MK has ever done.

The fans love "The Man God" Heihachi but as you can see he's the 21st ranked character, from a narrative standpoint if all the Mishimas died tomorrow it would be great thing for Tekken.

Well MK never really focused only on Liu Kang or a few characters, it always focused on like 8 characters at a time but they somehow got it to work very well. Why Tekken has focused on 3 characters (well 4 as of tekken6, and I guess technically 7 if we include the robot girl and the two sisters.)

 

[Space Runaway]

Tekken 6 which was the best selling tekken (post 3) last LTD was 3.5

Actually I believe Tekken 5 is the best selling Tekken after 3, with like 6m+ on PS2. That's not even counting DR.

 

[bitbydeath]

Xenoverse had sold 10M between two titles, so even if the split were at 5M it should put it at number 2 and if the split leans in a direction then it could even be the number 1 best selling fighting game this gen.

http://www.pushsquare.com/news/2018...se_series_has_been_a_big_hit_for_bandai_namco

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

Tekken's missing a huge opportunity by not focusing its narrative around its top 15 charaters. Tekken's narrative focus has been clearly Kazuya, Jin and Heihachi for 25 years. Even Mortal Kombat realized it was time to kill off Lui Kang. To be honest it was the best thing MK has ever done.

The fans love "The Man God" Heihachi but as you can see he's the 21st ranked character, from a narrative standpoint if all the Mishimas died tomorrow it would be great thing for Tekken.

Yes. I Always been waiting for Paul Ova or at least with the charisma and personality of Tekken 4, i wish again make a Ova With Xiaoyu (My favorite character ) and Alisa.

I really dislike and Hate Kazuya and Jin... For me the worst thing of Tekken.

 

[Alexios]

They can have a focus for the story, I don't care, but every character should have an ending for arcade mode. I loved Tekken 3 for it, even if many were joke clips (well, how can you have a serious storyline for a bear or a mokujin, lol) everyone got their due. I don't like the trend of fighting games having a cinematic story mode that tells a single story for everyone over having every character have their story if you wish him/her/it to. They can choose a canon to advance the story line for a sequel every time but not leave anyone behind in any game like that. I don't need them to be super elaborate CG for all, it can use in-game graphics like Soul Blade or a few 2D images with moody nicely done text like, iirc, Soul Calibur or CG, or anime like Xiaoyu's ending in Tekken 3, whatever works for the budget, just don't blow it all on a dumb full length story padded with useless fights. Even older 2D fighters have better moody story presentation to me when you go for a number of fights with nothing past the intro and then some mid-boss or secret encounter appears with moody music and, for once, a few lines of dialogue before the showdown and what not and then the final boss with a similar set up, it works so well for arcade modes!

 

[TheDuskwalker]

All others should learn from Tekken 7 is shipping games with larger rosters and plenty of stages are important, don't deliberately exclude popular characters just to scam people with DLC within the first couple months of release or to force pre-orders, and include characters because people actually like them not because they just so happened to debut in 1 or 2 particular installments.

Actually I believe Tekken 5 is the best selling Tekken after 3, with like 6m+ on PS2. That's not even counting DR.

You are correct, 6 million for PS2 T5, 2.2 million for PSP, and PS3 numbers were never given. Also I think Tag 1 was over 4 million.

Tekken's missing a huge opportunity by not focusing its narrative around its top 15 charaters. Tekken's narrative focus has been clearly Kazuya, Jin and Heihachi for 25 years. Even Mortal Kombat realized it was time to kill off Lui Kang. To be honest it was the best thing MK has ever done.

The fans love "The Man God" Heihachi but as you can see he's the 21st ranked character, from a narrative standpoint if all the Mishimas died tomorrow it would be great thing for Tekken.

It should be noted this usage list was created using leaderboard stats from a fan, and so since the person that made it had to manually count characters he didn't include characters where the player never got them past kyo or early dans ranks (I think this includes characters that are around rank Dan 8 and above), and doesn't include players that only play player matches and never played rank once. So there is a probability of some big changes for a few characters as they are known to be highly encountered at lower ranks then disappearing or drastically decreasing at higher, or being more encountered in player matches.

Also something to note is even in arcades (where there was official usage lists from Namco themselves like you can find for Street Fighter V) this list doesn't change much, Lili is most used female in all regions the arcade version was released in, and everyone still loves King.

I have never understood why fighting game devs/publishers ignore popularity, and always focus on the same characters over and over again even after they've long ceased to be relevant. This even includes merchandising and even DLC costumes, it's like they deliberately throw money away out of either there own bias or because "legacy." Like how they had Funko pops for Tekken 7, and it was only the 3 Mishimas, King, and Nina, and they didn't do so hot and never got a wave 2. Gee, wonder why those lacked interest.....

 

[Dada55000]

I've said this in the other thread, but I don't believe it's sales reflect the game doing something better than its peers. It's more to do with mainline Tekken returning after an incredibly long absence. It's been 8 years between T6 and T7. That's almost as long as SF's absentia post 3. Couple that with marketing, that made the game look more AAA than it was, and you have a strong start. Content wise it has the same issue all other Japanese fighters have, it's sparse and cheap. Visually it's a mid-range title trying to masquerade as AAA. It doesn't do anything more correctly than SFV in it's current form. There's not much to learn from the game itself. All the other things surrounding a game being released? Some food for thought.

Most recent thing I found was an interview in June that said SF5 was nearing 2.5 million copies sold.

SFV was at around 2.5m a little before AE's launch. I think it's still under 3m post AE though.

The 2.5 million number was bs. Ono was talking out of his ass in an interview and said SFV was "approaching" 2.5 million. The end of the sales quarter for the same time period revealed that SFV has shipped less than a 100k copies since the last quarter, it has stayed exactly 2 million. SFV is barely closer to that milestone even now, it's at 2.2 million, with Arcade Edition included, mind. See, AE, much like RE7 Gold Edition, is not treated as a separate SKU, it's sales are directly added to the vanilla games' sales. In the sales quarter AE came out in, SFV sales only increased by sub-200k at most. It was a flop.

Obviously, FGC sites were desperate to make SFV seem more popular than it was, so once the interview was out they started shouting "SFV SOLD 2.5 MILLION, ONO CONFIRM!!!?!?". Even though that would've meant SFV had a random 500k+ jump in sales in a single quarter, when in prior quarters it was lucky to sell a 100k.

Tekken 6 which was the best selling tekken (post 3) last LTD was 3.5

Tekken 5 shipped 6 million copies on the PS2. And an additional 2 million on PSP. More than 6+7 combined. During the alleged "fighting games are dead" period. Crazy. If Namco went Capcom on T5 and had like 4 different revisions and releases with ports on all platforms, it would have sold like 10 million, easy.

 

[EDMIX]

I bought it day one (with first season pass etc) and enjoyed it a lot for a bit. I fell off as it's just too complex/technical for me. I just don't have the time or patience for games like it or Street Fighter anymore. I just stick to simpler fighting games with more single player content these days (MKX, Injustice 2, Soul Calibur 6, Smash soon etc.).

That said, it's fantastic for what it is and deserves the sales for sure. It's a great sign for the genre that such a complex and difficult game that's pretty thin on single player content has sold so well.

Same. If anything, I wish I had more time lol. Tekken has easily my favorite single player story of all the fighting games.

 

[God Enel]

Most recent thing I found was an interview in June that said SF5 was nearing 2.5 million copies sold.

It's bad launch hurt it a lot. I think the art style hurt it's appeal in the west. It's not that different than SFIV which sold better (though also inflated by having so many versions), but things like Ken's hair just look terrible and make it look super low budget. Compared do stuff like this or SC6 or Injustice 2 that look amazing.

Crazy it only moves ~2.5. I always thought sf was the king of fighters, even despite the bad launch and all the controversy. But yeah.. just to judge by twitch views apparently isn’t the right thing to do. Because I know the tournaments always get a lot of views - more than any other fighting game. Thanks for the heads up!

And btw I love the new art style and how the fighters are older in this game. Thought it’s really cool Dhalsim for example.

 

[TheDuskwalker]

Street Fighter V is only at 2.2 million if you want exact numbers.
http://www.capcom.co.jp/ir/english/finance/million.html

Crazy it only moves ~2.5. I always thought sf was the king of fighters, even despite the bad launch and all the controversy. But yeah.. just to judge by twitch views apparently isn’t the right thing to do. Because I know the tournaments always get a lot of views - more than any other fighting game. Thanks for the heads up!

And btw I love the new art style and how the fighters are older in this game. Thought it’s really cool Dhalsim for example.

That's always been a misconception about the series because of the massive success of SFII and SFIV, and how popular it is a tourney fighter/eSports. But in actuality, as you can see from link I posted above, from the release of Super Street Fighter II on SNES in 1994 until Street Fighter IV in 2009, only 1 other SF game even sold a million in that time frame, Alpha 3, and it barely made it with exactly a million. All million sellers in the series is different versions of SFII and SFIV except for 3, and one of those 3 is a crossover with Tekken.

 

[ReBurn]

Tekken 6's story wasn't cinematic. It was just some over the top Tekken force mode. Having a cinematic story mode is more attractive than some bland force mode. Guest characters also helps with sales and that's why many fighting game developers are starting to add them in their games.

This is just one aspect but there are several others too.

It's hard for devs to make a fighting game that will sell millions of copies unless they create a good fighting game based off of existing popular IPs.

Guest characters and crossovers in fighting games have been a thing for a decade or so. It's not something that's starting.

 

[Secret_Lover]

I´m curious how much guest characters actually help a fighting game sell in the grand scheme of things. Not that its a very accurate indicator of anything but for Tekken 7 on psn the Geese Howard dlc (niche character mostly unknown to non-fighting game fans) has over twice as many ratings as the Noctis dlc (current face of long-running popular franchise).

NRS games also sell great despite the launch rosters typically not including guest characters. Would Mortal Kombat suddenly move a bunch more units if they threw Naruto or some shit into the mix? Would Guilty Gear finally become mainstream if Superman was a playable character? If so, please add him.

 

[TheDuskwalker]

I´m curious how much guest characters actually help a fighting game sell in the grand scheme of things. Not that its a very accurate indicator of anything but for Tekken 7 on psn the Geese Howard dlc (niche character mostly unknown to non-fighting game fans) has over twice as many ratings as the Noctis dlc (current face of long-running popular franchise).

NRS games also sell great despite the launch rosters typically not including guest characters. Would Mortal Kombat suddenly move a bunch more units if they threw Naruto or some shit into the mix? Would Guilty Gear finally become mainstream if Superman was a playable character? If so, please add him.

Akuma and the DLC guests are barely used in T7, so I doubt they did anything. SoulCalibur II is really the only fighter that I can think of off the top of my head that got a notable sales boost because of guests.

 

[Afro Republican]

Tekken 5 shipped 6 million copies on the PS2. And an additional 2 million on PSP. More than 6+7 combined. During the alleged "fighting games are dead" period. Crazy. If Namco went Capcom on T5 and had like 4 different revisions and releases with ports on all platforms, it would have sold like 10 million, easy.

The FGC has desperately tried to make before SFIV "Fighting games were dead" in order to come up with this nonsense that SFIV "revived" fighting games even though MK 3D trilogy and Tekken were selling crazy numbers (not to mention some outliers like SC2).

Heck even near SF you had Tekken 6 and MK Vs. DC selling darn good.

 

[Afro Republican]

Street Fighter V is only at 2.2 million if you want exact numbers.
http://www.capcom.co.jp/ir/english/finance/million.html


That's always been a misconception about the series because of the massive success of SFII and SFIV, and how popular it is a tourney fighter/eSports. But in actuality, as you can see from link I posted above, from the release of Super Street Fighter II on SNES in 1994 until Street Fighter IV in 2009, only 1 other SF game even sold a million in that time frame, Alpha 3, and it barely made it with exactly a million. All million sellers in the series is different versions of SFII and SFIV except for 3, and one of those 3 is a crossover with Tekken.

One thing that SF fans or hardcore japanese fans seem to not understand is that Capcom basically killed SF after SFII and ran it into the ground. Once SFII was wearing out the biggst fighters were MK, Tekken and VF and eventually would just be Tekken and MK for the next many years until SFIV.

 

[goldenpp72]

It won't be the best selling in 2 days, but still impressive.

 

[DForce]

Guest characters and crossovers in fighting games have been a thing for a decade or so. It's not something that's starting.

Never said it was starting now, basically in recent memory. It's becoming more frequent. In Soul Calibur 2, there was Link and Spawn, but many other fighters didn't have guest characters.

Tekken started adding guest characters in Tekken 7
Mortal Kombat started with Mortal Kombat 9.
Dead or Alive added VF characters in Dead or Alive 5.
Crossovers such as Marvel vs Capcom and SNK vs Capcom is a crossover game, so they're not technically "guest" characters.

Now with latest installments of fighting games, people are expecting guest characters and they're asking for them too. Many people wanted Kazuma Kiryu in Tekken 7, but it's very likely that Negan from Walking Dead will bring in more casuals considering he's a more popular character. These are things that helps fighting games grow.

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

Crazy it only moves ~2.5. I always thought sf was the king of fighters, even despite the bad launch and all the controversy. But yeah.. just to judge by twitch views apparently isn’t the right thing to do. Because I know the tournaments always get a lot of views - more than any other fighting game. Thanks for the heads up!

And btw I love the new art style and how the fighters are older in this game. Thought it’s really cool Dhalsim for example.

I heard awhile back that SF5 was passed 3 million units. Strange because it seems like by far one of the most popular, if not the most popular fighter for streams and viewership.

Nice to hear about Tekken 7 sales. Excellent fighter imo. Another strange thing is, if Tekken has numbers like that, why does it still take me so long to get fights online? Unless everyone is doing lobbies or something.

 

[Afro Republican]

MK is doing guest characters because they are shifting how many characters are playable in MK now with he new storyline and trying to (for better or worse) force play of some characters.

Older MK's like Deception with 27 or more characters has enough characters as it was. But since the reboot has went back to MK1 and not everyones involved with every conflict it makes the rosters smaller. Not to mention some characters (like Jarek) just not existing anymore even if storyline wise he would still exist but eh.

 

[Dada55000]

I heard awhile back that SF5 was passed 3 million units.

It's been said in this thread already, but SFV is nowhere near 3 million, and is a ways off from 2.5 million as well. It's 2.2 million. Arcade Edition included.

To put failure into context, Capcom expected SFV to ship 2 million copies by March 2016.

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

It's been said in this thread already, but SFV is nowhere near 3 million, and is a ways off from 2.5 million as well. It's 2.2 million. Arcade Edition included.

To put failure into context, Capcom expected SFV to ship 2 million copies by March 2016.

Oh, I see. That’s weird considering the games community seem really active in it and it’s seemingly the most important fighting game for tournaments.

 

[Afro Republican]

Oh, I see. That’s weird considering the games community seem really active in it and it’s seemingly the most important fighting game for tournaments.

Niche tournaments don't equal the actual gaming market. SF has been outsold by like 5 other franchises since 1996, with a small bump in 2008 and even then vanilla SFiv wasn't the best selling fighting game.

 

[ReBurn]

Never said it was starting now, basically in recent memory. It's becoming more frequent. In Soul Calibur 2, there was Link and Spawn, but many other fighters didn't have guest characters.

Tekken started adding guest characters in Tekken 7
Mortal Kombat started with Mortal Kombat 9.
Dead or Alive added VF characters in Dead or Alive 5.
Crossovers such as Marvel vs Capcom and SNK vs Capcom is a crossover game, so they're not technically "guest" characters.

Now with latest installments of fighting games, people are expecting guest characters and they're asking for them too. Many people wanted Kazuma Kiryu in Tekken 7, but it's very likely that Negan from Walking Dead will bring in more casuals considering he's a more popular character. These are things that helps fighting games grow.

Soul Calibur 4 had guest characters in 2008.

 

[MDSLKTR]

It sold more than injustice 2? Damn.

 

[Dada55000]

It sold more than injustice 2? Damn.

We don't have numbers for IJ2. All that's know is that it performed really well.

 

[DForce]

Soul Calibur 4 had guest characters in 2008.

Yeah, read my post. I'm referring to more devs adding DLC characters.. Something that wasn't happening earlier with fighting games.

 

[h0mebas3]

Doesn't Tekken have comback mechanics these days? Pretty sure that falls under "sacrificing quality and mechanics".

No, not really...

 

[Froschi]

Loved Tekken 7 very much. Still do, actually. Great fighting mechanics, presice controls, really nice graphics, okay soundtrack. And great additions tpo the roster - especially Katarina Alves has had me hooked for months.

What killed me though, and still is far beyond "acceptable", are the loading times (on vanilla Xbox One). Having to wait almost a full minute for a fight to start ist simply not acceptable, in no known universe.

 

[TheSHEEEP]

I tried playing it online for a while, but gave up because their matchmaking is just trash. Specifically in tournaments, the whole thing ends if the host quits. Out of all the tournaments I tried, I maybe finished 30%, and half of those I hosted myself to make sure they actually finished...

 

[Lucumo]

No, not really...

Lowers skill ceiling, punishes playing well...

 

[Afro Republican]

It sold more than injustice 2? Damn.

It sold 1.5 million within the first few months but we haven't gotten anything new. They could be neck and neck.

 

[h0mebas3]

Lowers skill ceiling, punishes playing well...

Analytically, no, not really.