• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

TENET Bombs in the US (Only Made $12 Million) Hollywood in Panic

Bolivar687

Gold Member
Jun 13, 2014
6,564
6,283
800
USA
I had a melancholy feeling watching Tenet knowing that it's just not going to be the same experience after this leaves theaters forever and I'm rewatching it on the small screen.

I have a pretty good home theater setup but it's always going to be a pale imitation. Especially when you're talking about the compressed video and audio from streaming. Yes, they should put this on HBO Max to help drive revenue but it makes me sad to read so many agoraphobic posts about people wanting to stay in their homes, even without a pandemic.
 
Last edited:

laser_printer

Member
Dec 10, 2019
1,426
2,153
445
Sactown
Last movie I saw at the theatre was 1917. Before that was Interstellar and before that was Gravity.

Watching films at home has become more desirable to a lot of people and the technology gap between the cinema and home has closed.
Yeeeeep

I watched Tenet in theaters and it was just me, spouse and our friend. No one wants to go to theaters right now and the ticket prices were child prices so we got to see it in IMAX for 9 dollars each and even then I just wanted to watch it on my OLED with my sound bar because nothing about what I saw screamed to be deserved to be watched on the big screen.
 

sol_bad

Member
Jan 17, 2006
4,847
3,156
1,565
I had a melancholy feeling watching Tenet knowing that it's just not going to be the same experience after this leaves theaters forever and I'm rewatching it on the small screen.

I have a pretty good home theater setup but it's always going to be a pale imitation. Especially when you're talking about the compressed video and audio from streaming. Yes, they should put this on HBO Max to help drive revenue but it makes me sad to read so many agoraphobic posts about people wanting to stay in their homes, even without a pandemic.
The part that annoys me is the people who don't want to leave home and support movies at the theatre are the same people that whinge that Hollywood are out of ideas. It's the fault of people like this that Holywood doesn't want to push original ideas.

Maybe if these people that are scared of leaving home would actually leave home and support the none tent pole blockbuster films, Hollywood would work on more original films.
 

dorkimoe

Gold Member
Aug 19, 2007
10,006
2,472
1,495
I feel bad for Nolan in this situation, I’m sure the studio forced it, but I do also remember saying people should see movies in theaters and were in a pandemic.
I really wanna see this, but I don’t feel comfortable in a theater. That place is a germ casserole.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MiyazakiHatesKojima

MilkLizard

Member
Feb 28, 2011
1,504
184
990
35
For someone that apparently works in the industry you have a weird way of thinking. I don't know why you keep talking about mafia crap. The fact is if studios don't release their movies in theatres, those theatres will shut down. Now imagine if every single theatre shuts down in America, it has a trickle effect around the world.

Fans of theatre lose out and have no where to go, and that's on a world wide scale, the world stage needs Hollywood to thrive for theatres to stay open everywhere.
Studios lose out because they lose an entire revenue stream. They lose out on half the money they could make, even more so.
Loss of profit = lower budgeted movies = loss of spectacle which is the reason people go to the theatres. Studios will be even less likely to take chances on new and interesting projects because they want sure money on VOD.

It's not about mafiaism, it's about an ecosystem that works for all parties involved to create entertainment in the best possible way.
Bullshit
 
  • Like
Reactions: brap
Nov 18, 2016
1,376
604
495
I feel bad for Nolan in this situation, I’m sure the studio forced it, but I do also remember saying people should see movies in theaters and were in a pandemic.
I really wanna see this, but I don’t feel comfortable in a theater. That place is a germ casserole.
Theaters here are only 25% capacity. Even for an IMAX laser room that holds more people, it was the cleanest I've ever seen a theater with plenty of space between moviegoers.

That said, the low capacity thing was gonna tank the numbers anyways. If the studio was smart they should've delayed it until next summer.
 
  • Like
Reactions: sol_bad

MilkLizard

Member
Feb 28, 2011
1,504
184
990
35
Because theaters around the world show a lot more movies that are not from Hollywood than you might think? Of course it would be bad and there would be financial losses and those big multiplex chains would suffer the most but theaters don't need Hollywood to survive. That's just bullshit.

For example, theaters here show a variety of US, EU and Asian movies and prerecorded concerts or stage plays. They'll be fine.

Hell, even the Oscars™ don't need Hollywood anymore after Parasite :messenger_tears_of_joy:

TLDR: These motherfuckers are not that important.
 

Boswollocks

Member
Apr 19, 2019
7,473
11,658
770
Mars
I think most movie studios secretly would rather release their movies on their direct to consumer streaming services. If WB releases TENET on HBO Max for $20-$30, they keep 100% of that $20-$30. Theaters take 50%. Every penny of the $30 Disney makes on the Disney+ Mulan goes to them.

The problem is the National Organization of Theater Owners, which is basically the mafia and the studios are terrified of pissing them off.
I heard that pissing them off is NOTO good idea...
 
  • Thoughtful
Reactions: slugbahr
Nov 18, 2016
1,376
604
495
No. They would have put it online if they were smart.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

You think a cinephile like Nolan would've allowed that? The dude carries around 3 sizes of celluloid in his pocket at all times, there's no way he would've allowed it to go On Demand unless it came with a trojan that bypasses your maximum streaming bitrate, auto calibrates your TV, and/or prevents you from watching if your TV doesn't meet certain specs.
 

sol_bad

Member
Jan 17, 2006
4,847
3,156
1,565
Because theaters around the world show a lot more movies that are not from Hollywood than you might think? Of course it would be bad and there would be financial losses and those big multiplex chains would suffer the most but theaters don't need Hollywood to survive. That's just bullshit.

For example, theaters here show a variety of US, EU and Asian movies and prerecorded concerts or stage plays. They'll be fine.

Hell, even the Oscars™ don't need Hollywood anymore after Parasite :messenger_tears_of_joy:

TLDR: These motherfuckers are not that important.
That's bullshit.

The Philippines and Australia theatre industry for example would be dead without Hollywood. Both countries do not produce enough local films that people want to see to keep theatres running. And I'm pretty positive a fuck ton of countries would be in the same boat.

Parasite is my favourite film of 2019 but foreign films rarely ever hit it big in the west. Back when Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon came out I was hoping that would be the turning point when foreign films would be commonly accepted in the west but nope. It would take another 19 years until another Asian film was internationally recognised.

Look at the highest grossing Asian film
Wolf Warrior 2
870 million box office world wide.
How much in America? 2.7 million.
Australi? 1.3 million.

WOW
Yep, foreign films will certainly keep the local theatre businesses open.
 

Raven117

Member
Oct 5, 2015
5,160
1,470
495
For someone that apparently works in the industry you have a weird way of thinking. I don't know why you keep talking about mafia crap. The fact is if studios don't release their movies in theatres, those theatres will shut down. Now imagine if every single theatre shuts down in America, it has a trickle effect around the world.

Fans of theatre lose out and have no where to go, and that's on a world wide scale, the world stage needs Hollywood to thrive for theatres to stay open everywhere.
Studios lose out because they lose an entire revenue stream. They lose out on half the money they could make, even more so.
Loss of profit = lower budgeted movies = loss of spectacle which is the reason people go to the theatres. Studios will be even less likely to take chances on new and interesting projects because they want sure money on VOD.

It's not about mafiaism, it's about an ecosystem that works for all parties involved to create entertainment in the best possible way.
Things change. And things will die with it while new things take its place. It’s how it always has been.

Hollywood in particular can fuck itself.
 

MilkLizard

Member
Feb 28, 2011
1,504
184
990
35
That's bullshit.

The Philippines and Australia theatre industry for example would be dead without Hollywood. Both countries do not produce enough local films that people want to see to keep theatres running. And I'm pretty positive a fuck ton of countries would be in the same boat.

Parasite is my favourite film of 2019 but foreign films rarely ever hit it big in the west. Back when Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon came out I was hoping that would be the turning point when foreign films would be commonly accepted in the west but nope. It would take another 19 years until another Asian film was internationally recognised.

Look at the highest grossing Asian film
Wolf Warrior 2
870 million box office world wide.
How much in America? 2.7 million.
Australi? 1.3 million.

WOW
Yep, foreign films will certainly keep the local theatre businesses open.
Yeah you actually have to show movies for them to earn money. And with Hollywood gone there would be many slots open ;) But this is all hypothetical anyways. Hollywood will be fine.
 

Mason

Member
Jun 6, 2004
4,837
23
1,560
Is anyone surprised this is how it's performing? It's an incredibly expensive film with a complex concept that's a harder sell than most blockbusters at this scale. They needed to wait until they could roll it out first in bigger markets where it would play better.

In other words, WB had an uphill battle with this one from the beginning. It was always going to have to make a ton of money to be profitable, and overcome mixed WOM from people who didn't like the complexity or understand it.

I don't get why they chose to handicap themselves by releasing this in the current climate. I'm curious how this release timing went down behind the scenes, whether it was Nolan/team pushing WB to get it out, or WB execs thinking it would be a bigger draw right now than it is.
 
Last edited:

NeoIkaruGAF

Member
Dec 8, 2019
847
1,442
385
People will pay $20-$30 to watch at home. It's the model that fits the moment. Sorry that we can't just will everything back to the way it was a year ago.
May I ask how much is the ticket for a movie theater in the US these days? I keep seeing this $20-$30 figure (Mulan, etc) and it's absolutely bonkers to me. Even €12 in Italy were for 3D shows, tickets have been in the €8-€10 range for years here.

I would never pay more than €12 for a new movie, and certainly not to watch it at home from a streaming service that I'm already paying a monthly fee for. That's highway robbery.
 

sol_bad

Member
Jan 17, 2006
4,847
3,156
1,565
Yeah you actually have to show movies for them to earn money. And with Hollywood gone there would be many slots open ;) But this is all hypothetical anyways. Hollywood will be fine.
What world are you living in? Australian movie studios aren't going to miraculously spring up, it's a very small industry and the government has a specific budget to stick to to help finance projects. Hypothetically, that budget won't increase just because Hollywood collapses.

Apart from China, majority of countries rely on Hollywood to make money at theatres. Do the maths, look at smaller movies released by countries other than USA, see what those films made in your country compared to Hollywood films. The money the smaller movies bring in will not be sustainable.

If you are happy with the majority of the lower budgeted films that Netflix make than hats off to you. But I do not want the majority of my movie viewing experiences to be that low quality.
 
  • Like
Reactions: edbrat

Nikana

Go Go Neo Rangers!
Jan 26, 2016
8,008
9,687
810
Theatrical runs used to be a lot longer, maybe going back to that model for a bit would be good.

I've missed so many movies that I would have paid to see if they were not running for just a week and then just a few showings the following week.
I'm an AMC a list member and moviepass before that. I tend to see movies pretty quickly but obviously that's changed.

I concur that a longer theatrical run makes more sense for a lot of these giant budget movies. Even with being an A list member I feel like I have to sometimes prioritize movies based on if I think they will be around in 2 weeks because of how short a run can be in my area.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Alcibiades and nush

Nikana

Go Go Neo Rangers!
Jan 26, 2016
8,008
9,687
810
May I ask how much is the ticket for a movie theater in the US these days? I keep seeing this $20-$30 figure (Mulan, etc) and it's absolutely bonkers to me. Even €12 in Italy were for 3D shows, tickets have been in the €8-€10 range for years here.

I would never pay more than €12 for a new movie, and certainly not to watch it at home from a streaming service that I'm already paying a monthly fee for. That's highway robbery.
The cost REALLY depends on location. My area it's $5-$10 and depends on which theatre and time of day. In other locations in my same state it's as high as $14-$20.
 
  • Like
Reactions: NeoIkaruGAF

Danteyke223

Member
Feb 1, 2020
84
118
225
I got an OLED C9 , I would rather pay for instant VOD or renting it rather than go to a cinema (and I got an Odeon Cinema Pass) . The screen quality is just... Yeah I know it's wall to wall but I just love my OLED better. Oh and after Tenet deliberately having shitty sound mixing I dread to think what people who spent 10-15 GBP on a ticket will think. Not a good way to get people back into cinema, with an overly pretentious movie. I think if all goes well or not Dune might have a better chance, or not. Shits gone bonkers, and people are getting fired left and right. Going to the cinema and spending 40-50 gbp + food for a family night out is ain't happening in 2020
 
Dec 8, 2018
1,256
2,667
605
Kentucky
I would have loved to go see it but the closest theater for me to see it would have been almost a 2 hour drive and I just don't have the kind of time available to justify that.
 

ZehDon

Member
Jun 13, 2013
2,817
2,814
690
Australia
... and they were expecting anything else?

We're in the midst of a global pandemic that's claimed over 925,000 lives world wide, is still going strong. In order to avoid contracting the virus, people are required - by law, in most developed countries - to avoid mass gatherings and stay a minimum of 6 feet apart. Any company who releases a theatrical run right now is a fucking idiot and deserves the financial loss. Hollywood, man.
 

xrnzaaas

Member
Dec 9, 2013
10,274
3,711
680
The studios need to find a good model to earn money in different ways, because there's a chance that a lot of cinemas will be closed even next year... or that many people will still be hesitant to go the movies even when they reopen.

Disney's idea with Mulan to charge 30 dollars on top of their active subscription definitely comes out as being too greedy and people are just going to pirate or ignore it.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: hariseldon

Davey Cakes

Member
Dec 5, 2008
14,439
460
1,015
Quincy, Massachusetts
May I ask how much is the ticket for a movie theater in the US these days? I keep seeing this $20-$30 figure (Mulan, etc) and it's absolutely bonkers to me. Even €12 in Italy were for 3D shows, tickets have been in the €8-€10 range for years here.
$10-$14 for regular shows, $16-$20 for 3D. Depends on where you are.

Matinee prices are always less than $10 though.
 

SLoWMoTIoN

Milk Connoisseur
Feb 2, 2018
17,471
19,787
885
But this is about theater no?
mulan was release in Taiwan’s and mostly Asia, last time I check was 10m (boycott mulan wasn’t working well in TW)


but sure, release digital is the way to go, I buy/rent tenet day one.
Why are you comparing a US streaming only release to Taiwan and Asia theater numbers then?
 

oagboghi2

Member
Apr 15, 2018
8,565
13,612
560
May I ask how much is the ticket for a movie theater in the US these days? I keep seeing this $20-$30 figure (Mulan, etc) and it's absolutely bonkers to me. Even €12 in Italy were for 3D shows, tickets have been in the €8-€10 range for years here.

I would never pay more than €12 for a new movie, and certainly not to watch it at home from a streaming service that I'm already paying a monthly fee for. That's highway robbery.
Depends on the experience you want to pay for. A barebones, no frills showing is like 8 dollars
 
Last edited:

manfestival

Member
Nov 12, 2009
11,964
2,656
1,145
My showing only had 2 other people in the theater. A friend reported that there was 6 total in his theater. I think any expectation of it to "not bomb" were just silly.
 

Alcibiades

Member
Jun 6, 2004
5,844
157
1,615
texas
Dude, it's made $30 million in North America (US + Canada) in the last 3 weeks. That's not spectacular, but considering how many theaters are closed and the seating limitations (25% in some cases), it's not bad.

The seating limitations makes it harder to get a good seat because anybody that buys a seat in the middle will have at least 3 seats taken off availability so that no one sits next to each other unless they are in a group.

I've seen probably 30 or more movies since May when theaters opened up in Texas and I've never felt it any riskier than going grocery shopping. I'm taking Vitamin D, I'm wearing my mask when I interact with employees, and there are always empty seats around me. Yeah I don't wear a mask the whole movie, but if I do get COVID, I doubt it will be more going to a movie theater when the number of people I've interacted with is tiny and is only during buying concessions.

COVID-19 spreads primarily through close, maintained contact (15+ minutes) near someone while talking or doing activity. In a theater, people are quiet and no one is talking or near each other. While I'm sure it's possible to contract COVID this way, you'd have to be pretty unlucky. In normal times, with sold out showings of people sitting right next to each other with no masks, yeah it would be a very high risk activity.

It's a calculated risk, but statistically I'm in more danger on the drive over than I am while in the theater.
 
Last edited:

TriSuit666

Member
Jul 2, 2018
594
555
345
I had a melancholy feeling watching Tenet knowing that it's just not going to be the same experience after this leaves theaters forever and I'm rewatching it on the small screen.

I have a pretty good home theater setup but it's always going to be a pale imitation. Especially when you're talking about the compressed video and audio from streaming. Yes, they should put this on HBO Max to help drive revenue but it makes me sad to read so many agoraphobic posts about people wanting to stay in their homes, even without a pandemic.
I’ve seen Tenet twice, and my friend is seeing it a third time today.
 
Aug 28, 2019
4,742
6,351
770
COVID-19 hysteria consumes another victim, they were never going to do this movie digital streaming because it's made for IMAX or at least a good theater.
 
  • Like
Reactions: hariseldon

YCoCg

Member
Apr 25, 2020
888
1,148
360
It has been getting bad word of mouth around here according to people I know who work in a cinema, the biggest complaint people have had about the film is the terrible sound mixing, many saying they can hardly hear shit people are saying and that the music and SFX are too overbearing and drown everything out.
 
  • Thoughtful
Reactions: hariseldon
Aug 28, 2019
4,742
6,351
770
It has been getting bad word of mouth around here according to people I know who work in a cinema, the biggest complaint people have had about the film is the terrible sound mixing, many saying they can hardly hear shit people are saying and that the music and SFX are too overbearing and drown everything out.
It should honestly win a sound mixing Oscar, most people who complain about the sound mixing don't deserve Nolan films. It's meant to be overbearing, you're not meant to hear every line of dialogue.
 
  • LOL
Reactions: hariseldon

Furlong

Member
Oct 27, 2019
164
389
240
It should honestly win a sound mixing Oscar, most people who complain about the sound mixing don't deserve Nolan films. It's meant to be overbearing, you're not meant to hear every line of dialogue.
It must be shit dialogue then if the studio felt the need to drown it out.
 
Oct 26, 2018
12,852
16,809
695
That's bullshit.

The Philippines and Australia theatre industry for example would be dead without Hollywood. Both countries do not produce enough local films that people want to see to keep theatres running. And I'm pretty positive a fuck ton of countries would be in the same boat.

Parasite is my favourite film of 2019 but foreign films rarely ever hit it big in the west. Back when Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon came out I was hoping that would be the turning point when foreign films would be commonly accepted in the west but nope. It would take another 19 years until another Asian film was internationally recognised.

Look at the highest grossing Asian film
Wolf Warrior 2
870 million box office world wide.
How much in America? 2.7 million.
Australi? 1.3 million.

WOW
Yep, foreign films will certainly keep the local theatre businesses open.
Never heard of Wolf Warrior but googled it. The first movie was $90 million and the sequel about $900 million. WTF?

Unless you're in Asia, most people (I'm an example) has never heard of these big Chinese movies.

With $$$$ like that, Hollywood is sure itching to get some of that action. Expect more Chinese influence movies. That Great Wall movie a few years ago is an example.
 
Aug 28, 2019
4,742
6,351
770
It must be shit dialogue then if the studio felt the need to drown it out.
The studio had nothing to do with it, it's how Nolan has been doing his films for a decade, it's more noticeable in theaters, especially IMAX which is potentially why people didn't pick up on this sooner. The first time internet "critics" complained about it to my recollection was Interstellar (if you don't count the inane complaints about Bane's voice in TDKR) and Nolan said in an interview at the time that his movies are meant to be like orchestras and dialogue is just one instrument in the orchestra, it's not always the most important one. People have criticized him forever for his dialogue mainly being expository, but that's the point, he wants things conveyed through visuals and therefore only utilizes perfunctory dialogue that might even get drowned out by everything else. They aren't dialogue movies, if you want dialogue see a Quentin Tarantino film. Film is a visual medium.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Stiflers Mom

CloudNull

Member
Oct 14, 2019
480
844
350
I mean, I want to see it... But all theaters near me are still closed.
Same here. I don’t think people realize how many cities still have theatres closed. Although when Dune drops I will drive out of state to see it if my city is still locked down.
 

K1Expwy

Member
Nov 28, 2018
228
215
240
Wolf Warrior 2 was a weird, and inferior, mashup of Rambo and Fast & Furious. The action was okay but a letdown, it's certainly not The Raid. And it's a Chinese movie, and it honestly dunks on everyone on planet Earth who isn't Chinese. It's pretty reprehensible from the outside looking in. Shame because Wu Jing is really talented, and the Russo Bros consulted on the production

And that's the movie that almost cracked the billion mark in China alone, at the moment it's China's Titanic, their Star Wars (1977 or 2015). If movies like that are the future of cinema then you can count me out, as long as I have a choice in the matter
 
Last edited:

El Sueño

Member
Jan 19, 2020
99
105
205
What did they expect? There are people dying out there. I love the experience of watching movies in the cinema, but not at any cost.
 
Last edited:

hariseldon

Gold Member
Aug 22, 2018
7,388
15,279
805
Honestly I give zero fucks about COVID. I do give a fuck about watching good films and honestly not many are made these days (only Dune and Top Gun interest me among upcoming films). So that leaves me with a choice:

- watch some shit pandering to China/wokeness and pay a fortune
- watch one of the hundreds of classic films in my collection from the 30s to the 90s and have a guaranteed good time watching it on my huge TV.

No brainer.
 
Last edited: