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Thanksgiving Isn't Racist: Change My Mind

Kreios

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I think if there was any kind of message we could get from the native Americans, how they lived, and how they would want the holiday to celebrated, that being thankful for what we have and to live more moderately is pretty good. Also to not be capitalist pigs which is the exact opposite

I’ll try to watch the video later. Seems interesting
 
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CeroFrio996

privileged little shit
Jun 20, 2019
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If your ideology teaches you to hate your country, your heritage, your own ancestors... it's a safe bet you should be in the market for a new one. Everyone has ancestors guilty of something, yet here we are.
It's not about hating your country, it's about accepting the mistakes of those who came before you and teaching them so that they may not be repeated. An ideology that seeks to create blind allegiance is just as scary as the one trying to tear down any allegiance.

Happy thanksgiving all!

Give your kids a hug, or your wife kids.

Be thankful for all.
I can multitask.
 
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oagboghi2

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Of course he's not, because he doesnt design these to be good faith. By saying "Thanksgiving isn't racist" hes already framed it in a bad faith way and forces the other side to take the "thanksgiving IS racist" side. People who have a more nuanced opinion would likely be browbeaten into adhering to his ridiculous framing. That's not just conjecture, hes done it before. Meanwhile the crazy people who think Thanksgiving is racist get to rant and make Crowders strawman for him.
How dare Crowder frame it by using the words they use. :pie_eyeroll:

It's not about hating your country, it's about accepting the mistakes of those who came before you and teaching them so that they may not be repeated. An ideology that seeks to create blind allegiance is just as scary as the one trying to tear down any allegiance.
What mistake are we going to repeat? Giving Indians smallpox?

No other country has this self hatred as much a young Americans.
 
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matt404au

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It's not about hating your country, it's about accepting the mistakes of those who came before you and teaching them so that they may not be repeated. An ideology that seeks to create blind allegiance is just as scary as the one trying to tear down any allegiance.



I can multitask.
Entirely pointless if you only teach the mistakes of your own ancestors and not others’
 

CeroFrio996

privileged little shit
Jun 20, 2019
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Yeah we’d still have all the good shit like ritual child sacrifice
Right, because every single practice the colonists brought with them was wholesome and just.

It's so easy the paint the indians as "savages" but if you break it down tribe by tribe and dont equate the mayans and the Inca with all the other american indians how many were as barbarous as all that? The indian tribal wars... how are they all that different from wars that spread throughout medieval Europe?
 

matt404au

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Right, because every single practice the colonists brought with them was wholesome and just.

It's so easy the paint the indians as "savages" but if you break it down tribe by tribe and dont equate the mayans and the Inca with all the other american indians how many were as barbarous as all that? The indian tribal wars... how are they all that different from wars that spread throughout medieval Europe?
Mmm yes both sides mmm yes very equal

 

Tesseract

Banned
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It's not about hating your country, it's about accepting the mistakes of those who came before you and teaching them so that they may not be repeated. An ideology that seeks to create blind allegiance is just as scary as the one trying to tear down any allegiance.



I can multitask.
yeah this is the big brainlet bullshit your lot likes to spew, keep it up dude, let's see how much longer it lasts

slimiest kind of patriotism, heat sinking whatever grand ideology sits at the top of your pyramid (i'd rather you just come out and say what you mean than this firehose of arbitration)
 
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EviLore

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What our male feminist says about differences in native tribes is true. They weren't all as cruel and savage as the Aztecs or the Incas, at least to their own people, and lots of western colonists preferred American Indian culture over their own. Civilization brings prosperity, longevity, and "quality of life," but it doesn't necessarily bring us contentment and meaning and belonging. There are always lessons to learn from ancient cultures.

Plenty of vectors to cut into Crowder's talking points. He views the world as narrowly as these college kids in some ways, but he has a better recipe for functioning within society than the "deconstruct all the holidays, deconstruct society, and wallow in self-loathing" post-modernist lens inculcated upon the students.
 

highrider

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Dec 18, 2010
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I actually really like that Thanksgiving has been adopted by the woke as racist. It’s useful to have additional societal markers that inform me to avoid people. I always get a kick out of how they idealize Meso-America. If only the European people hadn’t ruined the great things happening in the Americas 🙄
 

matt404au

Cyberbully
Apr 25, 2009
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What our male feminist says about differences in native tribes is true. They weren't all as cruel and savage as the Aztecs or the Incas, at least to their own people, and lots of western colonists preferred American Indian culture over their own. Civilization brings prosperity, longevity, and "quality of life," but it doesn't necessarily bring us contentment and meaning and belonging. There are always lessons to learn from ancient cultures.

Plenty of vectors to cut into Crowder's talking points. He views the world as narrowly as these college kids in some ways, but he has a better recipe for functioning within society than the "deconstruct all the holidays, deconstruct society, and wallow in self-loathing" post-modernist lens inculcated upon the students.
Of course, Native American cultures weren’t a monolith, but neither were Native European cultures. I’m down with exploring the intricacies of Native American cultures at the time of settlement with a fine-toothed comb so long as the person doing so isn’t painting all settlers as genocidal oppressors.
 

quickwhips

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Jan 26, 2009
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As I stated in the last Columbus thread, would it have been better if the Chinese introduced Smallpox to the native population? The native population of the both North and South American continent's days were numbered until the first contact from the Old World, whoever it may have been.
Probably so we had less people crying about being alive with the freedom to cry. If it was china you can bet we wouldn't be having these forums today.
 
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TrainedRage

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Right, because every single practice the colonists brought with them was wholesome and just.

It's so easy the paint the indians as "savages" but if you break it down tribe by tribe and dont equate the mayans and the Inca with all the other american indians how many were as barbarous as all that? The indian tribal wars... how are they all that different from wars that spread throughout medieval Europe?
Hey now you're getting it. The fact is every one claims white euros came over and wiped them out (false) the fact is they were doing that to each other long before white colonialist came to America.
Everyone knows its human nature to expand and war with neighbors. Do I feel bad a more advanced civilization spread across America, nope.
 

The Pleasure

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Jan 8, 2019
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I love thanksgiving. Lots of lazy overweight people fighting for the last ham at the supermarket with a case of pabst blue while another overweight person is taking the Hawaiian roles from under the table. It's like real life Maury except without the swear words being censored out.
 

rorepmE

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Hey now you're getting it. The fact is every one claims white euros came over and wiped them out (false) the fact is they were doing that to each other long before white colonialist came to America.
Everyone knows its human nature to expand and war with neighbors. Do I feel bad a more advanced civilization spread across America, nope.
Or that they handed out blankets laced with smallpox 2-3 centuries before germ theory became proven and widely accepted in science.
 
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Iorv3th

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Look at what early presidents said for Thanksgiving. It's a day to give thanks to God for the good things that have happened through the year.

It was not meant to be a day about Indians and pilgrims for the national holiday.
 

EviLore

Expansive Ellipses
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May 30, 2004
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EviLore EviLore you have a mode besides backhanded asshat?
Being called a male feminist triggers you now? Why? Isn't that supposed to be a righteous and correct position to you?

Deep down, though, you resent your own shrill impotence, and lash out at everyone here as a means to cope.

There's another way. Train your body and mind. Take control of your life. Extend a baseline of respect to those you choose to interact with. Sheath your little sword. Become a man.

Take your time, we'll be here.
 

Cybrwzrd

Anime waifu panty shots are basically the same thing as paintings of the french baroque masters, if you think about it.
Sep 29, 2014
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The customs of the holiday being wholesome in no way changes the history of the holiday. For example the pagan origins of Christmas as we know it and the american Christmas being a jumbled mixture of many cultures is still a fact even if you view Christmas as a wholesome holiday. Personally I view most American holidays and commercialized nonsense built up in American culture to make money.
You aren't even American, right? How do you have first hand knowledge of what American holiday are to begin with?
 

Cybrwzrd

Anime waifu panty shots are basically the same thing as paintings of the french baroque masters, if you think about it.
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I was born in CA and live in NH...
Ahh, sorry. I must have you confused with another anti-American poster. I'm surprised the good citizens from NH haven't figured out a way to send you back to CA. Bunch of right-wing libertarians in that state.
 

CeroFrio996

privileged little shit
Jun 20, 2019
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Ahh, sorry. I must have you confused with another anti-American poster. I'm surprised the good citizens from NH haven't figured out a way to send you back to CA. Bunch of right-wing libertarians in that state.
It's so easy to just classify anyone you dont agree with as anti American isn't it?

NH isn't as libertarian as you might think, and I've been living here longer than I ever did in CA. Also my family in Cali is so much more conservative than like 90% of the people I know here.
 

TrainedRage

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A ridiculous ad hominem from an equally ridiculous person.
Is someone forcing you to post here? Who hurt you so bad? You seem really upset about something. I don't think taking it out on the owner is the best way to go, but you do you little warrior.
 

CeroFrio996

privileged little shit
Jun 20, 2019
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Is someone forcing you to post here? Who hurt you so bad? You seem really upset about something. I don't think taking it out on the owner is the best way to go, but you do you little warrior.
Lol, he attacked me with no provocation. Even when he says I have a point it's backhanded fucking nonsense
 
Dec 15, 2011
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Lol, he attacked me with no provocation. Even when he says I have a point it's backhanded fucking nonsense
So, as usual, you post expecting validation and not engagement.
And, even then, the validation must be gift-wrapped in a way pleasing to your, clearly monstrous, ego for you to not lash out like a privileged little shit.

Grow up.
 

Cybrwzrd

Anime waifu panty shots are basically the same thing as paintings of the french baroque masters, if you think about it.
Sep 29, 2014
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It's so easy to just classify anyone you dont agree with as anti American isn't it?

NH isn't as libertarian as you might think, and I've been living here longer than I ever did in CA. Also my family in Cali is so much more conservative than like 90% of the people I know here.
There are things I too don't like about America, but I also believe it to be the best country in the world to live in, ergo I believe it is better than everywhere else. I also believe that Americans, be they native born or naturalized, provided they hold the values of America (Individual freedom, self reliance, equality of opportunity and competition, hard work, and secularism) dear to their hearts, are undeniably some of the best people on the planet. Our values are superior to those of say, China or Saudi Arabia for example.

You don't seem to be one to share that belief.

My biggest gripe with America is that moochers have been hijacking what makes us great for profit, or trying to destroy what makes us great out of envy or a desire for equality of outcome. The structure is still sound, but there are gaping holes where some walls used to be.
 
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legacyzero

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I really feel like this is digging hard to try and find minds to change that didnt have a view either way.

In all of my leftist circles, I struggle to recall literally anyone ever ranting about cancelling Thanksgiving.

Least of all, Steven Crowder taking all of his fuckery to college campuses to get his mind changed, instead of debating other people in the intellectual space, literally anybody who's asked for it, is just really tacky. He could at least sit down with Seder like Pool did. Perhaps I'd take his view more seriously.
 

CausticVenom

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Apr 27, 2018
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Nobody was a victim back then.

Fight me.

Ahh, sorry. I must have you confused with another anti-American poster. I'm surprised the good citizens from NH haven't figured out a way to send you back to CA. Bunch of right-wing libertarians in that state.
Why would we libertarians want to move to CA? I'm lost.
 
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Cybrwzrd

Anime waifu panty shots are basically the same thing as paintings of the french baroque masters, if you think about it.
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Gargus

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Anything can be racist if you want it to be. If you want you can look hard enough, skew enough information, spend time wording opinion as fact, and phrase things to support your theory but none of that makes something true.

The problem now is people look for racism constantly. They want to find it. If you look for something and want to find it then you will find a way to.
 
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Is this guy the origin of the "change my mind" meme? I'm out of touch.

Pretty solid debating tactics from him, though, in the sense that he so calmly lets them speak as much as they want, then only gradually begins the pushback from those points they put on the table.
 

EviLore

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Is this guy the origin of the "change my mind" meme? I'm out of touch.

Pretty solid debating tactics from him, though, in the sense that he so calmly lets them speak as much as they want, then only gradually begins the pushback from those points they put on the table.
Yeah, he is, and these tend to be good examples of long format contentious conversations in relative good faith.

Of course, YouTube demonetized all the Change My Mind videos because the subjects are scary.
 
Dec 15, 2011
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Yeah, he is, and these tend to be good examples of long format contentious conversations in relative good faith.

Of course, YouTube demonetized all the Change My Mind videos because the subjects are scary.
Was this demonetisation separate from all the noise in summer from that Vox activist @gaywonk caused with Crowder and YouTube?
 

VAL0R

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The light and dark turkey meat both make the same gravy. Verdict: Not racist.
 

EviLore

Expansive Ellipses
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Was this demonetisation separate from all the noise in summer from that Vox activist @gaywonk caused with Crowder and YouTube?
Yeah, all the Change My Mind vids were demonetized some time prior to the Vox Adpocalypse in a separate incident.