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|OT| The 2021 General TV Discussion Thread

Rikkori

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May 9, 2020
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Hey y'all, thought it might be useful we have a thread to discuss TVs and general developments around them for this year. After all, it's not only consoles but also PC gamers more and more who are choosing to use on as their display, and frankly they offer vastly superior picture quality for the money compared to the monitors. So why not?

Hisense
-TBD-

LG
-TBD-

Panasonic
-TBD-

Samsung
55"65"75"85"98"
QN900AReviewReviewReviewReview
QN800AReviewReviewReview
QN95AReviewReviewReview
QN90AReviewReviewReviewReview
Q85AReviewReviewReviewReview

Sony
50"55"65"75"77"83"85"100"
Z9JReviewReview
A90JReviewReviewReview
A80JReviewReviewReview
X95JReviewReviewReview
X90JReviewReviewReviewReviewReview

TCL
-TBD-

Vizio
-TBD-

F.A.Q.
What's the difference between OLED & LCD?
- The most important difference is in the backlight. OLEDs are self-emissive displays where every pixel lights up independently, while for LCD it requires a coarser backlight which isn't capable of such precise control (for normal consumer displays). What that means is with an OLED you will have much better contrast, while with an LCD you can have more brightness but will not have such precise control, which will result in blooming (light halo around an image, so for example when showing a star in space the star will light up but so will the area around it so instead of the area being black as it should, it can be greyer; see this photo).

What's a FALD?
- Full Array Local Dimming is a way of exercising more precise control over the backlight in an LCD. Generally the more zones the better, but most importantly for a FALD is the algorithm controlling these zones otherwise they will be ineffective. Generally these are still quite large and cannot get close to the per-pixel control of an OLED, but are cheap & still effective for HDR.

What's miniLED?
- This is a more fine-grained version of FALD where instead of having a few large zones controlling the backlight you have many more zones which are composed of thousands of mini leds (hence the name). This is a way in which LCDs can rival OLEDs for contrast, but retain their traditional advantages of being brighter & (somewhat) cheaper. A good algorithm is CRUCIAL here or you will have worse results than a FALD and see black crushing (detail no longer being visible in darker areas) or delayed lighting transitions.

What's QLED?
- This is simply a marketing name for LCDs with a Quantum Dot colour filter. It's mostly a Samsung term, but others vendors have used it as well. Similar to it we have Nanocell for LG, or Triluminos for Sony.

What's QNED?
- This can refer to two different things. One, it's a marketing name for LG's upcoming miniLED TVs. Two, it's a display technology that's years away, being developed by Samsung, called Quantum nano-emitting diode, similar in scope to OLEDs and LCDs.

What's microLED?
- Microled is a display technology that tries to marry the strengths of both OLEDs (per-pixel illumination) as well as LCDs (high brightness, no burn-in). It is done on a per-module basis so you can think of them as putting a bunch of tiles together, so you'd get a much larger display. It is mostly a technology for businesses as the costs to manufacture them are extremely high and not meant for regular consumers. It's assumed to be "the future" of display tech. Time will tell.

What's HDMI 2.1?
- In short - it's how you connect your display to your computing machine so that you can display video and reproduce audio. The advantage over the previous HDMI 2.0b is that it has a lot more bandwidth, which enables 4K 120hz & 8K 60hz at 10/12bit. Besides that it can also offer new features such as VRR, eARC, ALLM, etc.

What's VRR, eARC, ALLM, etc.?
- VRR stands for variable refresh rate. What this does is sync the refresh rate of your display to the framerate of the game, thus eliminating screen tearing but with a lower input lag penalty compared to vsync.
- Enhanced Audio Return Channel (eARC) is the next generation of ARC. The main benefit of eARC is a big boost in bandwidth and speed. This allows you to send higher-quality audio from your TV to a soundbar or AV receiver. There’s scope for eARC to deliver up to 32 channels of audio, including eight-channel, 24bit/192kHz uncompressed data streams at speeds of up to 38Mbps. This means all those high bitrate formats currently available on Blu-ray discs, 4K Blu-rays and some streaming services – Dolby TrueHD, DTS-HD Master Audio and object-based formats such as Dolby Atmos and DTS:X – will all be compatible. On paper, HDMI eARC should also make the handshake between compatible devices much smoother and negate the need to activate HDMI CEC (which doesn’t always work properly) - so operating multiple products shouldn’t require any extra steps to get things up and running.
- Auto Low-Latency Mode enables your display to go into "Game mode" automatically when connected to a device it would consider a gaming device (eg a console), thus ensuring you are in the TV mode with the lowest latency, hence the name. This is not a crucial feature and it is something you can simply do manually, by switching your TV manually into game mode (or PC/graphics mode, depending on the TV in question).
 

Rikkori

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<Reserved>

Will continue adding more info as it comes in, and also expanding the FAQ. If anyone wants to re-write any section let me know, I'd be happy to drop it in.
 

Kuranghi

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Apr 17, 2015
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Thread is looking good.

I watched the Sony thing earlier, holy shit the poor people being forced to do that were hilarious, ultra-cringe. I would like to see a more indepth comparison of the differences in the new "Pro" versions of the X-Motion Clarity and Triluminous. Also, Contrast Booster Pro for OLED, which Vincent had a video about already, its something to do with boosting the RGB subpixel's brightness as well as the white subpixels so as not to dilute the colours at higher brightness, as seen on the Panasonic GZ/HZ2000.

I can't wait to see how the new Sony image processor, XR, stacks up against the X1U, I saw nice IQ gains from X1E to X1U, so hope this is a similar or bigger jump.

I'm bummed that there won't be a proper 4K flagship LCD anymore, I will never have the space for a 75" in my current setup so that makes the 8K sets meaningless to me right now, even if I could afford them.

I see the ZD9 staying the 4K LCD master in terms of dimming capabilities/HDR contrast for a while longer, unless the new processor is a revolution, which it could very well be.
 
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kyliethicc

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Mar 14, 2020
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Check out the youtube channel HDTV Test for detailed videos covering all the new 2021 TVs.

I like that guy's videos, informative and funny.

Here's ones he did for Samsung and Sony:


 

Rikkori

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In 2021, LG Electronics will launch G1 (successor to GX) with a brighter 4K 'OLED evo' panel. It is described as "next-generation OLED technology" with 20% improved efficiency by manufacturing arm LG Display.

LG G1 will be available in 55, 65, and 77 inches while the more mainstream C1 (successor to CX) will be available in 48, 55, 65, 77, and for the first time 83 inches. C1 will feature the regular 4K OLED panel but will otherwise come packed with the same technology.

The company will also launch new 77 and 88-inch 8K OLED TVs in the form of Z1 (successor to ZX). There are even hints to a cheaper A1 range of OLED TVs. Although it was not part of LG's press announcement, the company makes reference to it in its footnotes saying that the new 'Gallery' floor stand is "ideally suited for 55/65-inch G1, C1, A1 series models". That is an intriguing clue as it may indicate that the company is planning to bring OLED truly mainstream this year. We are chasing details.

The footnotes also make mention of B1, which is the successor to BX. The B series usually has most of the same features as the C series but a less powerful video processor, presumably Alpha 7 Gen4.

The Gallery stand is optional and sold separately, the company said.




"QNED" takes on "QLED"​

As announced before CES 2021, LG will add new technology to its top LCD TVs. The combination of "a new advanced LCD panel structure that combines Quantum NanoCell color technology with mini LED backlighting" equals "QNED miniLED", according to LG.

"QNED" LCD TVs will compete head-to-head with Samsung's top LCD TVs that in 2021 will be known as "Neo QLED". Neither of the two represent a new display technology. Instead, these are LCD TVs with more a advanced LED backlight for less crude brightness control in up to a few thousand dimming zones. It is still a far cry from the millions of self-emitting pixels in OLED, which still represent LG's best TVs of 2021.
 
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Kerotan

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Oct 31, 2018
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Looking forward to seeing Sony pricing and release dates for their TV's.
 

skneogaf

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Aug 31, 2017
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Great thread and it's amazing to see sizes like 83" 85" and 98" for TVs.

I'm seriously considering renovation to allow such big a big tv to purchased.

Either that or move to a house with the room for one.

Big screen is life so the bigger the better life is is.
 

Fake

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Dec 20, 2018
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I still not ready to get a proper Bravia 'PS5 ready' TV. Will be getting a Bravia 4k 43inch instead. Maybe in the future.
 

Rikkori

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FOMO said LG QNED is a joke.

FOMO is a youtube clickbaiter and clueless, so I wouldn't trust him on anything other than maybe golfing attire. We'll have to see how the new LG LCDs fare but certainly LG has had a bad reputation on the TV LCD side.
 

TKOFromTokyo

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FOMO is a youtube clickbaiter and clueless, so I wouldn't trust him on anything other than maybe golfing attire. We'll have to see how the new LG LCDs fare but certainly LG has had a bad reputation on the TV LCD side.

What he essentially says is that it’s mostly a rehash of current technology and different than what Samsung has been working on and intending to call QNED.
 
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Waiting to see what Panasonic have in the works. The EX750 I got is still hanging in there (and is pretty much the last 3D 4K set) so will probably upgrade to something more up to date they showcase this year
 

StateofMajora

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What he essentially says is that it’s mostly a rehash of current technology and different than what Samsung has been working on and intending to call QNED.
Lg's mini led won't be any good. Samsung's should be easily the best lcd on the market.

If I wasn't a Sony processing purist and I didn't want oled i'd definitely choose the samsung Q90A this year.
 

Rikkori

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Samsung's high-end 2021 TVs are available for pre-order in the US now and will start shipping in March.







 
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Rikkori

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Look at this! Fucking incredible light control - 800 Dim. Zones ftw. This is going to be the ultimate gamer's TV.

 
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Giallo Corsa

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Prediction : the Philips 9506 & 9636 will sell like hotcakes this year.
Mini-led, VA panel, more than 1000 dim.zones, full bandwidth 48Gbps HDMI 2.1 , 4K@120Hz, VRR, ALLM, 1500nits peak brightness (9506) and 4sided ambilight, I mean, what's not to like ?
Price will be around 1700 euros for the 65inch 9506.

IF everything works the way it should (i.e : no fake 4K@120Hz, no DV problems like the previous Philips model etc) i think that it will be a best bang for your buck thing/set.
Looking forward to the reviews
 
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StateofMajora

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I'm wondering if the (792 zones, was it?) figure applies to the 55inch Q90A or just the 65 inch. The 55inch q90r had 240 zones while the 65 had 480. I suspect the 55inch will have less zones.

But yeah, the Q90A will be the best lcd this year. If I read your chart right rikkori, 1800 for the 55inch is not a bad price at all though. On black Friday it'll be a steal. For the price it can't be beat, though if money is no object the A90J is the ultimate gaming AND movie tv. If uniformity is greatly improved on samsung this year I would prefer it over lg g1 evo oled since I think it's cheaper. For the cheapest movie enthusiast option in the US it'll be the A80J oled.
 
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Rikkori

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Samsung absolutely killing it this year. It's a complete and total blow-out. Only the Z9J can hope to match them.

 

TKOFromTokyo

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Samsung absolutely killing it this year. It's a complete and total blow-out. Only the Z9J can hope to match them.


I tried to watch the first video but had to stop after a couple of minutes. The Samsung looks nowhere near as good as the A90J. The colors are off and there is a ton of lost details in those images when you look at the bright sunlight.
 

Rikkori

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I tried to watch the first video but had to stop after a couple of minutes. The Samsung looks nowhere near as good as the A90J. The colors are off and there is a ton of lost details in those images when you look at the bright sunlight.
You've got to keep in mind a few things about TVs and cameras when watching. Obviously in cases where the sun looks blown out that's an issue of capturing two displays with vastly different brightness levels. The important things to note are how well the QN95A preserves shadow detail, contrast, and minimises blooming all while being much brighter. It's sort of similar with colours, oleds show up as much bluer on camera (cold in general) while Samsung is generally warmer (see below f. ex; also it depends on the display you're viewing it on right now, I'm using a calibrated display).

The big takeaway here is that the QLED has closed the gap significantly vs the OLED in the few areas where OLED shined (heh) but still retains a massive advantage where it always did (brightness, bright room viewing, no ABL, $/cm etc.)


Y
 

AddiF

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So I am looking into upgrading my TV. Currently have an LG E6 OLED that both wowed me and disappointed. The disappointment was the burn-in issue (BOTW hearts, Youtube and Netflix logos) and studder.

I have read that recent OLEDs have become much less prone to burn-in after some red pixel technology update (please shoot that down of false).

What TV should I be looking at for gaming (PS5/XSX) and movies/shows? 65" at minimum, preferably ~77"?

I like the 2021 LGs, C1 and G1. Should I rather look at Sony's A90J? QLEDs out of the picture?
 

Excess

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I have read that recent OLEDs have become much less prone to burn-in after some red pixel technology update (please shoot that down of false).
This is true, but you can go a long way to preventing it yourself. Think of every pixel on your TV like a separate light bulb, where all light bulbs have a finite lifespan. If you watched 100 hours of a white screen TV, all of the pixels would degrade evenly. However, if you watch 100 hours of a small white circle at the center of the screen, only those pixels will have degraded 100 hours more than those that weren't active. Extrapolate that over hundreds of days-worth of viewing, and eventually the uneven distribution of pixels used would be come visible under certain conditions. So how could you possibly prevent this from happening? Simply by running different types of content that use all pixels evenly over time. This means doing things such as watching Live TV, playing other games, and even running the no-connection picture slideshow.

With the new TV's, they simply have better compensation cycle technology, which means everything I was just describing is done automatically by attempting to evenly degrade the pixels over time when the TV is in Standby mode, or if you run a full pixel refresh manually.

So yes, they're better at preventing burn-in, but if your viewing habits haven't changed, no compensation cycle will prevent burn-in in the long-run.

What TV should I be looking at for gaming (PS5/XSX) and movies/shows? 65" at minimum, preferably ~77"?
For gaming, you'll want to go with LG OLED again. LG seems to be the only manufacturer that has a focus on gamers with high refresh rates, VRR, etc.

Not to say there are not better TV's out there. The Sony is pretty comparable, but it oddly does not have the gaming features you'll likely want.
 

StateofMajora

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Probably going to have to get the QN90A since my sony oled took a crap, have BB's warranty though. Can't say i'll be getting oled again although i'll miss those perfect blacks and response times... but eventually Samsung's QNED will be a thing which is self emissive as well but not organic.

But yeah not saying i'll never get a Sony again but i'll definitely not count on them for any help lol. Bastards
 

Excess

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So, I was kind of curious to see what Dolby Vision gaming was like, and it's apparently been available on PC for a few years. Unfortunately, there's not many games that support it yet. It came into being, and then because there was apparently no support for it, it fell out of usage. So that means two older games, Battlefield 1 and Mass Effect Andromeda have it. I already owned BF1, so I decided to toggle my settings a bit, a voila, an amazing picture, I must say. I do think it's an overall improvement over regular HDR10.

Now, I own a B7 OLED, so I don't have HGiG, but I'd be curious to see how that compares to DV. Still, Xbox seems to be making the commitment to DV for mainstream gaming, so hopefully more games will begin to support it.
 

OmegaSupreme

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Apr 17, 2019
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Welp. I'm finally joining the oled club. I ordered one months ago and it arrived busted. Took some time to summon the will to try again and my C1 should be here on Tuesday. I had to "settle" for the 55inch but my living room isnt huge so I think it'll be fine.
 
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TKOFromTokyo

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Welp. I'm finally joing the oled club. I ordered one months ago and it arrived busted. Took some time to summon the will to try again and my C1 should be here on Tuesday. I had to "settle" for the 55inch but my living room isnt huge so I think it'll be fine.

I hope the new one looks great! I’m enjoying watching movies at home like never before!
 

MadYarpen

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Guys, I'm not sure this is a correcvt place to ask, because the thread is surprisingly short. If not - please point me to a right direction...

Anyway, I am about to move - in 2-3 months I'm leaving my apartment and moving into a new house. I will need a new TV, 40 inch I have now will look like a toy, and it is 1080p only. So I will be looking at something 4K around 60 inches probably. But I am not sure exactly, I have to measure the distance.

What should I be looking at, if I want it to be a good choice for gaming, OK for watching movies (under assumption that I will use some soundbar)? And, since I don't really use TV that much, i want it to be on the budget. So, good price and quality to price ratio are important. It has to be available in the EU. I don't really trust those new chinese brands such as hisense etc.

It is likely I'll buy it after christmas, there are many sales then.

Thanks

E: PS5 is most likely gaming device, and I would like to make sure the TV has all those new standards regarding HDMI etc.
 
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Kerotan

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So I just had this bright idea. I've a 49" Sony x900f bought it 2/3 years ago brand new for $1000 on a steep sale.

So it's hard to resell these tvs for a good price. But I just got a brand new ps5 so will sell my day 1 model. People are already paying big money for them so I can only imagine the frenzy around Christmas when I'm sure desperate parents, girlfriends and punters in general start paying up to €1000 again.

So it got me thinking, why don't I bundle the ps5 and TV and sell them for €1500. Plus most people who bought my TV paid €1400 for it anyway.

The reason I'm looking to sell is I'd like to get Sonys latest model the x90j for the hdmi 2.1.
 

amigastar

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Whats better. An LED TV that is more expensive than the OLED one, or the cheaper OLED?
The LED TV is around 120 bucks more expensive than the OLED.
 
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Kerotan

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Whats better. An LED TV that is more expensive than the OLED one, or the cheaper OLED?
The LED TV is around 120 bucks more expensive than the OLED.
What tvs are they?

The LED will probably be better in brighter conditions and the oled in a dark room.
 

Hosam6xavi

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Jun 16, 2019
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Hi guys it's time for me to buy a new tv.

I don't know much about TVs. but i asked and most people told me to go with sony x900h.

I want it mainly for gaming and i don't care about the price.

Any suggestions ?
 

Giallo Corsa

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Feb 4, 2021
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Hi guys it's time for me to buy a new tv.

I don't know much about TVs. but i asked and most people told me to go with sony x900h.

I want it mainly for gaming and i don't care about the price.

Any suggestions ?

Hey Hosam.
There's way more knowledgeable users in here than i but...don't get the Sony X900H, it's a set that's been having problems since its release.
Slashed vertical resolution when doing 4K@120Hz resulting a blurry(ier) picture, frequent audio drop outs, half-arsed VRR implementation, can't do 4K@120Hz + Dolby vision etc etc.
I ordered the 65'' on Black Friday 2020 and i just returned it boxed due to all the problems it had (and still aren't fixed).
The 2021 X90J is apparently better since it can at least display proper 4K@120Hz (i.e : no blur) due to the additional chip/co-processor but the VRR is just not there yet.It also cannot do 4K@120Hz + Dolby vision.

Samsung TV's don't have Dolby vision

The LG nanocell series is a (somewhat) budget option, some models have all the HDMI 2.1 features and also feature DV but most of them have IPS panels.

Don't know about Panasonic.

Philips TV's...well, ambilight is (very) cool, most 2021 sets have HDMI 2.1 but from what i've been reading on AVforums.com they're plagued by broken local dimming (PML/miniLED series) and also half vertical res. when doing 4K@120Hz due to the Mediatek chip (same as on the XH90/X90H), plus, they're friggin' expensive , the miniLED models are almost the same price of a good OLED.
Their OLEDs are pretty good from what i've been reading but they're more expensive than the competition (300+ more euros/bucks compared to LG for example - most likely due to Ambilight ).

If you're in the states there's also other, cheaper but better options/bang for your buck.
 
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