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Drama Cringe The left is blaming Trump for Iran shooting down the plane....

dragonfart28

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What does being a CEO have do with left-right divide?
Capitalism is right wing.

The OP is assuming 'the left' are the ones blaming Trump.

It's both left and right.

Conversely, there are a significant number of lefties defending Trump (his cult supporters).
 
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cryptoadam

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Don't worry Iran is already coming up with its propaganda to distract its people


Salami said, "In the coming days we will talk about the great victory over the United States," adding, "The Ukrainian plane crash has not yet allowed us to reveal the full dimensions of the victory that we achieved by bombing the two American bases in Iraq."

Iran gonna lie and say they killed hundreds of American's in their limp wristed attacks to try and take their peoples eye off the fact that they kill 180 people, majority Iranians with their itchy trigger fingers. And this doesn' count the 56 or so that died at the funereal stampede.

And the Left/Arab/Muslim world will probably eat it up and ask for seconds when Iran reveals that USA is lying and their bombs took out George Washington, Abraham Lincoln, Colonel Sanders and the entire Confederate army.
 
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Anyway, no threat necessary anymore and we don't have a death count for Soulemani, but we do for Trump.

Trump says ‘it doesn’t really matter’ if there was an imminent threat from Soleimani
Hmmm, if we don't have a death count or even an estimation for Soleimani then why are so many people saying he was such a terrible person?

Here is some reading material for you.


If you, or anyone else, can read that, and then seriously say that Trump is responsible for more deaths... Then I don't know what to tell you mate. And that's from 2013, not even taking into account recent atrocities and schemes.
 
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Grinchy

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Capitalism is right wing.

The OP is assuming 'the left' are the ones blaming Trump.

It's both left and right.

Conversely, there are a significant number of lefties defending Trump (his cult supporters).
You have to be kidding me. So every CEO is conservative now?

The CEO of Twitter, Jack Dorsey, is a Trump supporter? This is incredible news to me. I just don't understand anything about this weird logical jump.
 
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Zefah

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Capitalism is right wing.

The OP is assuming 'the left' are the ones blaming Trump.

It's both left and right.

Conversely, there are a significant number of lefties defending Trump (his cult supporters).
This is so weird... Seriously, though, are you just playing a character to get reactions or are you really trying to have a serious discussion?
 
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cryptoadam

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Now that Crowbow was banned a second time and TeamGhobad has disapeared off the face of the earth someones gotta pick up the slack.
 
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Cybrwzrd

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This is so weird... Seriously, though, are you just playing a character to get reactions or are you really trying to have a serious discussion?
I have never seem dragonfart28 dragonfart28 engage in a serious discussion. let alone post more than 5 sentences in a single post. The bot that runs the account is still having troubles passing the Turing test, which would explain these non sequiturs.
 

cryptoadam

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Trudeau spoke with Global National‘s Dawna Friesen on Monday about the Canadian response to the plane crash and the ongoing work happening to support the families, identify the victims, and hold Iran to account in the investigation into how the missile that took down the plane was fired.

“If there were no tensions, if there was no escalation recently in the region, those Canadians would be right now home with their families,” said Trudeau.

“This is something that happens when you have conflict and war. Innocents bear the brunt of it and it is a reminder why all of us need to work so hard on de-escalation, moving forward to reduce tensions and find a pathway that doesn’t involve further conflict and killing.”


Go back to your blackface JT. Your beard aint fooling no one.
 
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Trudeau spoke with Global National‘s Dawna Friesen on Monday about the Canadian response to the plane crash and the ongoing work happening to support the families, identify the victims, and hold Iran to account in the investigation into how the missile that took down the plane was fired.

“If there were no tensions, if there was no escalation recently in the region, those Canadians would be right now home with their families,” said Trudeau.

“This is something that happens when you have conflict and war. Innocents bear the brunt of it and it is a reminder why all of us need to work so hard on de-escalation, moving forward to reduce tensions and find a pathway that doesn’t involve further conflict and killing.”


Go back to your blackface JT. Your beard aint fooling no one.
Well he isn't wrong. Those people would still be alive if the tensions in the region hadn't escalated to the point that they did.
 

DunDunDunpachi

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Well he isn't wrong. Those people would still be alive if the tensions in the region hadn't escalated to the point that they did.
If Iran blew up a civilian jet while they were escalating tension themselves, it stands to reason that no outside force could be responsible for the outcome. It would be another thing if they were defending against an incoming strike and shot down the jet out of panic, but they were launching an unprovoked rocket attack against a neighboring sovereign country.

And since Iran was ramping up militia forces within Iraq, it stands to reason things would've continued escalating with or without any outside influence pushing it in that direction.
 

cryptoadam

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Well he isn't wrong. Those people would still be alive if the tensions in the region hadn't escalated to the point that they did.
Yup if Iran didn't attack US interest an allies over the last few years, and then didn't attack US embassy, and then attack 2 empty air bases maybe they wouldn't have had the itchy trigger finger and shot the plane out of the sky.

Iran should learn the lesson that escelating tensions can lead to these types of results. They should also listen to the people on the street protesting instead of gunning them down. It would be nice if they let women dress how they wanted and stopped ethnically cleansing their Arab population and treating other minorities like second class citizens but that might be too much to ask for.

Trudeau is only one man in blackface I know he can't do it all.
 

cryptoadam

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We know that Iran communicated through back channels and they didn't want to escelate anything, thats why no American's died. They did this 100% as a save facing measure and to look tough, but in reality they didn't want to actually do anything. Its on them for screwing up all because they wanted to look like tough guys. Most likely due to the fact that their regime is on the brink of collapse and they had to kill 1500 of their own people about a month ago. Only way tyrants can hold power is through force and fear.

So in Iran's lust for revenge and to hold power they shot down a plane because of their own incompetence, and probably malice and disregard for human live. Remember 1500 of their own dead at protests, how much respect do they have?

Its like if a bully was beating on a kid half his size, and then one day some 300 LB MMA monster shows up and teaches the bully a lesson. So to look tough the next day the bully throws rocks at the kid, but intentionally misses on purpose. But one of the rocks ended up hitting his best friend right in the dick and it was so mangled it had to be amputated.
 
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Capitalism is right wing.

The OP is assuming 'the left' are the ones blaming Trump.

It's both left and right.

Conversely, there are a significant number of lefties defending Trump (his cult supporters).
Do you have data to back of your claims. Also, could you walk us down this idea that Capitalism is right wing?
 
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Jun 26, 2013
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Well he isn't wrong. Those people would still be alive if the tensions in the region hadn't escalated to the point that they did.
It was 100% Iran's choice to fire the missile at the plane and they made the wrong decision. The US did not make Iran shoot down a civilian aircraft. That was all on the Iranian who gave the okay.
 

Zefah

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Trudeau spoke with Global National‘s Dawna Friesen on Monday about the Canadian response to the plane crash and the ongoing work happening to support the families, identify the victims, and hold Iran to account in the investigation into how the missile that took down the plane was fired.

“If there were no tensions, if there was no escalation recently in the region, those Canadians would be right now home with their families,” said Trudeau.

“This is something that happens when you have conflict and war. Innocents bear the brunt of it and it is a reminder why all of us need to work so hard on de-escalation, moving forward to reduce tensions and find a pathway that doesn’t involve further conflict and killing.”


Go back to your blackface JT. Your beard aint fooling no one.
I don't see anything wrong with that, personally. He's not shifting the blame from Iran, but just stressing the importance of not escalating tense situations. Pretty sure he has specifically said he blames Iran and Iran alone for shooting down the plane previously.
 

dragonfart28

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Are you sure that's where it started? I want you to think about it for a few minutes and try again.
Oh we all know well enough that's when things truly escalated.

The media certainly amplified the moment but let's not be in denial about why we're in this mess.

Do you have data to back of your claims. Also, could you walk us down this idea that Capitalism is right wing?
It's closer to freedom than control.
 
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KINGMOKU

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Oh we all know well enough that's when things truly escalated.

The media certainly amplified the moment but let's not be in denial about why we're in this mess.



It's closer to freedom than control.
So your saying that the attack on the most powerful nation on the planets embassy, and one known to attack multiple countries after terrorist attacks, and even without any evidence, was less of a flash point then killing an Iranian general. I want to make sure this is the logic your using.

I want you to say it.
 

Stouffers

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So your saying that the attack on the most powerful nation on the planets embassy, and one known to attack multiple countries after terrorist attacks, and even without any evidence, was less of a flash point then killing an Iranian general. I want to make sure this is the logic your using.

I want you to say it.
I think he’s saying it’s like continuing a fight with a mentally handicapped person. It’s ultimately the able bodied person’s fault if he misses you and accidentally pummels a few bistanders and chokes a few rabbits.
 

dragonfart28

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So your saying that the attack on the most powerful nation on the planets embassy, and one known to attack multiple countries after terrorist attacks, and even without any evidence, was less of a flash point then killing an Iranian general. I want to make sure this is the logic your using.

I want you to say it.
In terms of the actual exposure and impact, an embassy has no face and everyone knew there would be backlash to the current administration so it wasn't really news (or at least news that many people paid much attention to).

But when you unexpectedly put a bullet in a guys head (or however Trump decided to savagely murder this person in cold blood), it's pretty obvious that is a more poignant story.

So much so that you have Republicans, CEOs and other members of the right responding to it.

You would have to live an incredibly insular life to think different on this one as far as I'm concerned.
 
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Handel

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It's like 95% Iran, 5% Trump's administration. You really can't fault Trump for anything but escalation, and if it was US military that got targeted and died then that'd be more on the US government. This was a plane flying out of Iran that got shot down, how's Trump supposed to predict let alone stop that level of incompetence.

So long as REE and some of the left can use it against Trump, they'll throw away all standards to put the blame on him over anyone directly involved.
 
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sahlberg

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In terms of the actual exposure and impact, an embassy has no face and everyone knew there would be backlash to the current administration so it wasn't really news (or at least news that many people paid much attention to).

But when you unexpectedly put a bullet in a guys head (or however Trump decided to savagely murder this person in cold blood), it's pretty obvious that is a more poignant story.

So much so that you have Republicans, CEOs and other members of the right responding to it.

You would have to live an incredibly insular life to think different on this one as far as I'm concerned.
I don't know how to read this.

Are you saying that when one country attacks another country's embassy/territory and harms and kills people, that you should not retaliate?

And are you saying that people are surprised that the man that has been behind a lot of the terrorist acts in the ME and basically ordered his troops to kill 1500 of his own citizens for protesting a few months ago DID NOT expect there would be a big target painted on him?

Is that correct? Trump was behind killing those 1500 protestors too? That is the crazy theory?
Crazy pants
 
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Time to practice what you preach:

For everyone using 'escalation' as a mechanism for blame, you are escalating tensions in this thread. You are responsible for every other post made by every other person in this thread and no matter the conduct of others, you are the ones that must be penalised and blamed.

I demand that you live by your words and exit this thread never to return.

Anything less than 100% compliance will be seen as a conscious effort to escalate. The blood will be on your hands.
Anyone challenging or commenting on this is actively escalating tensions in this thread. The blood will be on your hands.

You've talked your talk.
It's time to walk the walk.
 

oagboghi2

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In terms of the actual exposure and impact, an embassy has no face and everyone knew there would be backlash to the current administration so it wasn't really news (or at least news that many people paid much attention to).
What nonsense is this?
 

Silent Duck

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Doses of reality aren't trolling.

This all escalated after the general was killed.
You mean the same General who was planning numerous attacks against Americans?
A senior administration official said that intelligence showed Soleimani was in Baghdad after the attack on the US embassy this week to plan with future attacks on the US by Iranian-backed forces in Iraq.
 

pennythots

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You mean the same General who was planning numerous attacks against Americans?
It would be nice if another country could corroborate this otherwise I remember all the times US intel communities have lied or greatly exaggerated their findings in order to justify specific actions and I have to wonder what's stopping them from doing it again.
 

cryptoadam

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This was authorized in JUNE, 7 months ago. This was not some fly off his pants plan because Trump got 1 scoop of Ice Cream.

If an American died Salamiman was going to be toast. And guess what a US citizen, a contractor was killed by Iranian backed militias, and now the Salami is 6 feet under.

The escelation is 100% on Iran for killing an American which lead to the kill order being executed. No dead American, no dead Salamiman.
 

dragonfart28

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You mean the same General who was planning numerous attacks against Americans?
Putting aside the fact that there is no supportive evidence for any legitimate threat, why do you think this justifies killing him?

And would you prefer this scenario that lead to deaths by plane crash or the one that would have been fewer deaths altogether?
 
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DunDunDunpachi

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Putting aside the fact
Yes, putting aside facts is what you have to keep doing to legitimize this tinfoil-hat, frothing NPC nonsense. There was evidence of legitimate threat, as we have witnesses who've said they remember his crimes and they are glad he is gone. We have recordings of celebration when he died. Certainly, we could argue about the significance of those facts, but there is plenty of supporting evidence that he was a legitimate threat.

Yes, the USA has lied about their enemies, but that doesn't mean -- out of hand -- that everything the USA claims is a lie. That's the underlying presupposition people seem to be making here, and that's illogical.

There is more than enough supporting evidence that he was a legitimate threat. Do I believe he was plotting some attack while he was in Iraq? Well, I have to consider the available facts...

- he was in Iraq, not Iran
- he was involved in stirring up pro-Iran militia groups and pro-Iran vandals in the weeks and months preceding his death
- he was killed without civilian casualties, including other targets which strangely go unspoken in these arguments
- Iran attacked US bases out of revenge. This was after putting an $80 million bounty on the US president's head. It is surely a comfortable country we live in when that isn't considered an unbecoming thing to do toward a country's president. I find it hilarious that the left is so deranged they can't at least recoil at the bounty alone, but alas.
- Iran knocked a completely innocent plane out of the sky in Iranian territory (the subject of this thread) while they were unexpectedly attacking Iraqi territory with rockets. Remember that little flash in the pan there about WW3? GAF kept a pretty cool head compared to most of the internet. Some people were seriously worried that a war had just begun ("because the USA will need to strike back to show force").

But the attack on Iranian soil never came. It certainly didn't help that they initially lied about killing them. Really goes to show they'll stand behind their truth until forced to admit they did it.

Now the left is -- predictably -- blaming Trump. It's predictable because TDS has gotten so strong in some brains, they cannot fathom a single event that doesn't in some way "prove" Trump's incompetence and evil. So they come to the conclusion that "Trump is at least partially to blame" because it sounds good in their heads, and then they work back the logic from there.

If you find yourself working backward from a conclusion in this manner on a regular basis -- like the Left is -- it is a sign that you've been indoctrinated. This is an illogical way to view world events. Believe it or not, Trump can do a good thing sometimes. Believe it or not, the left can be wrong about things sometimes. Because the ideologues on the left have fused "righteousness" and "truth" into one blob, they believe certain facts simply because it is their truth, as President hopefully Corey Booker would say.
 
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cryptoadam

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Putting aside the fact that there is no supportive evidence for any legitimate threat, why do you think this justifies killing him?

And would you prefer this scenario that lead to deaths by plane crash or the one that would have been fewer deaths altogether?

President Donald Trump authorized the killing of Iranian Gen. Qassem Soleimani seven months ago if Iran's increased aggression resulted in the death of an American, according to five current and former senior administration officials.

Iran and the Salamiman were on notice if any American's died from Irans continual attacks on the USA and its allies that Salami was going to wind up 6 feet underground.

Well guess what an American died, and so did the Salamiman. Iran's lust for revenge and to look fake strong lead them to killing 180 civilians. USA killed 0 civilians and multiple other terrorist when it took out Salamiman.

The blood is soley on Irans hands. Trump had this actually well thought and gave Iran 7 months to stop their activites. Instead they killed an American.

the biggest tragedy is that he wasn't iced 2 months ago so maybe 1500 Iranian protestors would be alive, and 500 Iraqi prostestors as well. But since all that is on Iran's hands and can't be connected to Trump no one cares about their lives.
 

dragonfart28

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Yea, the response by the US was disproportionate and this is why are here today.

It's pretty clear that there was an opportunity to hold back and instead the US chose to (predictably) escalate the situation.

I'm sure we would all rather not be talking about this but that's what you get when ego leads from the top.

This kind of tactic is nothing new or unexpected.
 
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cryptoadam

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Yea, the response by the US was disproportionate and this is why are here today.

It's pretty clear that there was an opportunity to hold back and instead the US chose to (predictably) escalate the situation.

I'm sure we would all rather not be talking about this but that's what you get when ego leads from the top.

This kind of tactic is nothing new or unexpected.
How is it disproportionate? They killed an innocent civilian, US killed a military target, a man who Obama designated as a terrorist, and no civilians died. Is the proportionate response to kill one of their innocent civilians instead of a terrorist and military target?

The oppurtunity to hold back was on Iran. Consider that the OK was give in JUNE, 7 months ago, and only if US citizens died, Iran had a big chance to not escelate this by stopping attacks on US in Iraq. But instead Iran doubled down, killed an American and 500 Iraqi protestors.

If anyones ego lead to this its on Iran's part. The ego to think they can continue to attack US and its allies with impunity and face no consequences.
 
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Yea, the response by the US was disproportionate and this is why are here today.

It's pretty clear that there was an opportunity to hold back and instead the US chose to (predictably) escalate the situation.

I'm sure we would all rather not be talking about this but that's what you get when ego leads from the top.

This kind of tactic is nothing new or unexpected.
Yo, still waiting for your reply to my post breh.
 

godhandiscen

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The people of Iran are trying to fight for their independence and they should be supported. I am very disappointed that spinning the events to smear Trump continues being the focus for 50% of Americans. It is clear that we Americans embody every despicable thing the rest of the world thinks of us.

 
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NickFire

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Didn't the left also blame Trump for the times parts of the left riot and beat people up for red hats?
 

Silent Duck

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Putting aside the fact that there is no supportive evidence for any legitimate threat, why do you think this justifies killing him?

And would you prefer this scenario that lead to deaths by plane crash or the one that would have been fewer deaths altogether?
Are you serious?
This asshole was responsible for a whole lot of deaths and they say they have evidence that he was planning more attacks. Do I believe it was justified? Presented with what we know about him... Yes. Oh, hell Yes, I believe it was justified.


Do really you think America should let killers like Soleimani continue to kill Americans (and others) just because the Iranians might accidentally shoot down one of their own planes? That is completely absurd.
 
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dragonfart28

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Are you serious?
This asshole was responsible for a whole lot of deaths and they say they have evidence that he was planning more attacks. Do I believe it was justified? Presented with what we know about him... Yes. Oh, hell Yes, I believe it was justified.


Do really you think America should let killers like Soleimani continue to kill Americans (and others) just because the Iranians might accidentally shoot down one of their own planes? That is completely absurd.
C'mon.

Think what you said through.

You would be justified in killing criminals instead of putting them in jail or launching an attack on North Korea.

There's a reason why we evolved to have peaceful diplomacy and this whole disaster is an example of that.