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The shooting of Ahmaud Arbery

DeafTourette

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McCRACKIN



v.



STATE.



Supreme Court of Georgia.



Dec. 15, 1920.



"A person cannot create an emergency which renders it necessary for another to defend himself, and then take advantage of the effort of such person to defend himself in the face of such emergency so created, and justify the taking of the life of such person.


I just found out about this 2 days ago (posted about it in another thread but thought it deserves a thread of its own). So ... it's interesting that the DA recused herself after calling the cops OFF the case because the perps were friends of hers, a subsequent one recused himself and the 3rd wanted to send the case to a grand jury but thought they would be exonerated. The person who leaked the video (which the police had been sitting on for over 2 months) was a friend of the father and son idiots because he thought it would exonerate them and paint the victim as the aggressor. He thought wrong as it galvanized people to protest AND is what brought the GBI (Georgia Bureau of Investigation) onto the case and got them arrested.

One thing that angers me is that the police report stated, and later told HIS FAMILY, that Arbery was "caught in the commission of a crime"... Even though the 911 call stated that the home was under construction and all Arbery did was peek inside and then went back to jogging. And to add to injury, there hadn't been a case of a burglary since January this year and these two idiots just saw him and ASSUMED he was guilty. A lot seems fishy with them and with certain aspects of officials in Glynn County.

I hope the case is brought up to Atlanta as I don't expect any Justice to be done in Brunswick or Glynn County.

Commissioner Peter Murphy, who also said he spoke directly to Glynn County police about the incident, said officers at the scene concluded they had probable cause to make arrests and contacted Johnson’s office to inform the prosecutor of their decision.

“They were told not to make the arrest,” Murphy said.

https://www.ajc.com/news/local/watch-gbi-updates-following-arrests-ahmaud-arbery-shooting/1aJbZe2uL9HrndjyWYjB2L



https://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/ny-no-burglaries-reported-for-weeks-before-ahmaud-arbery-killing-20200508-6pp35kjezbeszckj4hwvf2h4be-story.htm
l
 
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Guynamedbilly

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In that video, dude wasn't jogging until he comes sprinting out the door of the house where he was trespassing. Houses under construction often have drills and other tools around.

Like most highly publicized cases, we just don't have information to decide like the jury will, so we can only hope they make a wise and accurate decision.
 

Weiji

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In that video, dude wasn't jogging until he comes sprinting out the door of the house where he was trespassing. Houses under construction often have drills and other tools around.

Like most highly publicized cases, we just don't have information to decide like the jury will, so we can only hope they make a wise and accurate decision.
I mean I would also assume he was trying to steal shit. Everything about his demeanor says that to me.

Regardless it’s ridiculous to shoot a guy for trespassing on an empty property. To assume and kill someone on that basis is pretty terrible.

So I guess what I’m saying is fuck the people who play the “he’s an angel how dare you point out his family are criminals!” But also fuck the people who tried to cover for this asshole who killed someone on a hunch.

The dude can totally be a criminal or a bad dude, that doesn’t justify what happened here or make it ok.

Anyway it looks like justice will be served at this point, we will have to see. I hope so.
 

Guynamedbilly

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I mean I would also assume he was trying to steal shit. Everything about his demeanor says that to me.

Regardless it’s ridiculous to shoot a guy for trespassing on an empty property. To assume and kill someone on that basis is pretty terrible.

So I guess what I’m saying is fuck the people who play the “he’s an angel how dare you point out his family are criminals!” But also fuck the people who tried to cover for this asshole who killed someone on a hunch.

The dude can totally be a criminal or a bad dude, that doesn’t justify what happened here or make it ok.

Anyway it looks like justice will be served at this point, we will have to see. I hope so.
Yea, but the other video of the two guys that chased him showed they were trying to hold him for citizen's arrest. He charged the one that was holding a shotgun, which they struggled over and then the guy holding the shotgun shot him. They didn't chase him down to shoot him for trespassing. They chased him to try to hold him for the police.

But in his defense, since we don't know definitively, maybe he did just take a break from his jog in someone else's house before sprinting out the front door and when he saw these redneck white guys with guns he thought they were just going to murder him, so he attacked the shotgun guy in self defense.

I think chasing people down with a shotgun and pistol pointed at them to try to do a citizen's arrest is overkill regardless, so I don't think they should have been in that position to begin with. Just follow the guy and keep your guns handy if you need, but let the cops handle it. If I were making the decision, I would be leaning toward manslaughter.
 

Stouffers

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In my last neighborhood, there were a number of houses in various stage of construction. A few times while jogging, I’d stop and walk a few of the houses just for the hell of it or hide out during extreme heat/pop-up thunderstorms. Assuming he’s entering an open home under construction to do something nefarious is a bit suspect.
 

Weiji

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In my last neighborhood, there were a number of houses in various stage of construction. A few times while jogging, I’d stop and walk a few of the houses just for the hell of it or hide out during extreme heat/pop-up thunderstorms. Assuming he’s entering an open home under construction to do something nefarious is a bit suspect.
How nice of you to casually trespass on other people’s property for fun.
 

DeafTourette

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So... An empty house under construction where no one is actively living in ... He's going to steal... What?

And I'm guessing he started sprinting because of those two good ole boys chasing after him. With weapons. You really think they were chasing him just to talk?

Add in the fact the DA told the police to drop the case... Yeah, there's nothing nefarious about that.
 

Stouffers

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So... An empty house under construction where no one is actively living in ... He's going to steal... What?

And I'm guessing he started sprinting because of those two good ole boys chasing after him. With weapons. You really think they were chasing him just to talk?

Add in the fact the DA told the police to drop the case... Yeah, there's nothing nefarious about that.
While building my last house, some assholes broke in and stole the just installed dishwasher and built-in microwave.
 

Zefah

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I don't really care if he actually just came from robbing someone's house.

Vigilante justice is not OK, especially when they just "suspect" him. Those fucks had no right to pull up on him armed in a pick up truck and try to stop him from moving on. He was murdered, that's all there is to it.
 

monegames

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I don't really care if he actually just came from robbing someone's house.

Vigilante justice is not OK, especially when they just "suspect" him. Those fucks had no right to pull up on him armed in a pick up truck and try to stop him from moving on. He was murdered, that's all there is to it.
Never heard of a citizen's arrest. They were well within their rights to do just that. They can still be held criminally or civilly liable for a false arrest, unlike the police. But they did have the right to pull up on him armed in a pick up truck and try to stop him from moving on if they saw him break the law or believed he committed a felony. Is it smart to do so, nope, but its was still within their rights to do so.
 

jsnake19

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My post was pretty snarky, but only because Ive been debating this nonstop with everyone on social media. This is clearly another one of those Trayvon/Mike Brown situations. The media puts out this make believe story, paints it like two KKK members pull up on some random dude out for a jog, wrap themselves in the confederate flag and start blasting. Everyone gets worked up, people screaming white priveledge and justice for Ahmuad, marching in the streets, etc. Then we find out well, wait, there's more to it. Turns out he wasnt just jogging, turns out he had a criminal past with firearms. All of a sudden, the headline could have been, suspected burglar violently resists citizens arrest and is accidently killed while trying to take weapon from armed citizen. And nobody would have batted an eye. There is no denying that a life should not have been lost, burglar or not. However, poor choices were made over and over, by both sides. I just get tired of the constant baiting by the media, and this delusion that there's racist white people around every corner. If two black guys in a cutlass had gunned him down after he tried punching one in the face and tried to take his gun, its a non issue.
 

Zefah

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Never heard of a citizen's arrest. They were well within their rights to do just that. They can still be held criminally or civilly liable for a false arrest, unlike the police. But they did have the right to pull up on him armed in a pick up truck and try to stop him from moving on if they saw him break the law or believed he committed a felony. Is it smart to do so, nope, but its was still within their rights to do so.
I do not think they were within their rights or even within the letter of the law when it comes to a citizen's arrest.


A private person may arrest an offender if the offense is committed in his presence or within his immediate knowledge. If the offense is a felony and the offender is escaping or attempting to escape, a private person may arrest him upon reasonable and probable grounds of suspicion.
Unless they can prove that they knew who they were pulling over and what crimes he committed beyond simply suspecting him because "he fit the description," I don't see how they acted within the legal allowances of a citizens arrest.

Remind me who's the perpetrator in this case again?
Definitely not the two dudes who started a situation and killed a man.
 
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jsnake19

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I do not think they were within their rights or even within the letter of the law when it comes to a citizen's arrest.




Unless they can prove that they knew who they were pulling over and what crimes he committed beyond simply suspecting him because "he fit the description," I don't see how they acted within the legal allowances of a citizens arrest.



Definitely not the two dudes who started a situation and killed a man.
Will it help you figure things out when it comes out during the trial that they were a few houses down in that vid thats shows him entire the house? Their truck is in the vid. They probably saw him run by. There was a guy on the phone calling the police and who knows who else in that same video.
 

Zefah

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Will it help you figure things out when it comes out during the trial that they were a few houses down in that vid thats shows him entire the house? Their truck is in the vid. They probably saw him run by. There was a guy on the phone calling the police and who knows who else in that same video.
Then you call the police and let them deal with it. Follow the guy if need be while staying in contact with the police. In any state in this country, you're going to have a hard time justifying murdering someone for fleeing a crime scene, especially if it isn't even your house and when you unnecessarily instigated/escalated a situation. And for good reason. Vigilante justice is not OK.
 
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jsnake19

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That's about the level of intelligence I expect, carry on.
Ive just lurked enough to know that no matter what I type, your TDS fueled liberal mental disease will cause you to ignore any points that I might make. No matter their validity. So you get that response. You are a joke of a poster, so you can carry on.
 
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finowns

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Very suspicious of MSM narrative seems unlikely. If this guy was a thief I have very little sympathy for him. It should be investigated though what actually caused the two white guys to try and arrest the black guy and if the black guy tried to fight the guy with the gun.
 

finowns

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Then you call the police and let them deal with it. Follow the guy if need be while staying in contact with the police. In any state in this county, you're going to have a hard time justifying murdering someone for fleeing a crime scene, especially if it isn't even your house and when you unnecessarily instigated/escalated a situation. And for good reason. Vigilante justice is not OK.
I read that there was a struggle for the gun. Are you saying differently?
 

jsnake19

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Then you call the police and let them deal with it. Follow the guy if need be while staying in contact with the police. In any state in this county, you're going to have a hard time justifying murdering someone for fleeing a crime scene, especially if it isn't even your house and when you unnecessarily instigated/escalated a situation. And for good reason. Vigilante justice is not OK.
Pretty sure the police were called. Im also pretty sure that when they tried to stop him, they weren't expecting him to attack and violently try to take their firearm away...rational people dont behave that way. Unfortunately, he got shot and paid for his mistake. And now they will go trial and maybe pay for theirs.
 
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Zefah

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I read that there was a struggle for the gun. Are you saying differently?
No, it looks like there was a struggle. If you were being incessantly followed by two armed dudes in a pick up truck while you're on foot, and they finally stopped you in your tracks, you can either run and risk getting shot in the back, or try to take their weapon from them. Or just give up and see what they do to you. All a bunch of shitty options that are likely to end in your death.

Citizens should not be unnecessarily putting other citizens in positions like these. It was not a matter of self defense. It should have been left to law enforcement.
 
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AfricanKing

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My post was pretty snarky, but only because Ive been debating this nonstop with everyone on social media. This is clearly another one of those Trayvon/Mike Brown situations. The media puts out this make believe story, paints it like two KKK members pull up on some random dude out for a jog, wrap themselves in the confederate flag and start blasting. Everyone gets worked up, people screaming white priveledge and justice for Ahmuad, marching in the streets, etc. Then we find out well, wait, there's more to it. Turns out he wasnt just jogging, turns out he had a criminal past with firearms. All of a sudden, the headline could have been, suspected burglar violently resists citizens arrest and is accidently killed while trying to take weapon from armed citizen. And nobody would have batted an eye. There is no denying that a life should not have been lost, burglar or not. However, poor choices were made over and over, by both sides. I just get tired of the constant baiting by the media, and this delusion that there's racist white people around every corner. If two black guys in a cutlass had gunned him down after he tried punching one in the face and tried to take his gun, its a non issue.
Firstly he was found with nothing on him .. the only suspicion there is was going onto a construction site and walking away...

That should not be a death sentence in any country regardless of the matter. But it’s clear you think so. What does him having criminal record have to do with the matter anyway. Has he now forfeited his right to life... fuck outta here.

From the get go the two guys should have been arrested and charged.
 
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Yea, but the other video of the two guys that chased him showed they were trying to hold him for citizen's arrest. He charged the one that was holding a shotgun, which they struggled over and then the guy holding the shotgun shot him. They didn't chase him down to shoot him for trespassing. They chased him to try to hold him for the police.

But in his defense, since we don't know definitively, maybe he did just take a break from his jog in someone else's house before sprinting out the front door and when he saw these redneck white guys with guns he thought they were just going to murder him, so he attacked the shotgun guy in self defense.

I think chasing people down with a shotgun and pistol pointed at them to try to do a citizen's arrest is overkill regardless, so I don't think they should have been in that position to begin with. Just follow the guy and keep your guns handy if you need, but let the cops handle it. If I were making the decision, I would be leaning toward manslaughter.
A citizens arrest in this situation is completely ridiculous. Call the cops and let them deal with it, especially when your accusations in the moment are tenuous at best.
 

jsnake19

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Firstly he is as found with nothing on him .. the only suspicion there is was going onto a construction site and walking away...

That should not be a death sentence in any country regardless of the matter. But it’s clear you think so. What does him having criminal record have to do with the matter anyway. Has he now forfeited his right to life... fuck outta here.

From the get go the two guys should have been arrested and charged.
Keep reading my responses, because I clearly say that loss of life should not have been the outcome, no matter if he was a buglar or not. My issue is with the protrayal of the event like it was some poor innocent jogger gunned down for being black, when clearly there were a lot of factors to the situation.
 
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rorepmE

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I don't really care if he actually just came from robbing someone's house.

Vigilante justice is not OK, especially when they just "suspect" him. Those fucks had no right to pull up on him armed in a pick up truck and try to stop him from moving on. He was murdered, that's all there is to it.
Actually they do have a right, most states have a citizen's arrest law on the books. Yes you can hold people you reasonably suspect to have committed a serious crime at gun point.

You'd have a point if they drove up to him guns-a-blazing with no rhyme or reason for opening fire. The fact that the firearm wasn't discharged until after a struggle points to defensive use, not offensive. A firearm is a ranged weapon and it's very fucking effective at range.

Before this video the assumption was they assumed he was a burglar because he's black.
After this video they have a much stronger legal case that they had probable cause they witness what they though was a burglary.
 
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Zefah

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Actually they do have a right, most states have a citizen's arrest law on the books. Yes you can hold people you reasonably suspect to have committed a serious crime at gun point.

You'd have a point if they drove up to him guns-a-blazing with no rhyme or reason for opening fire. The fact that the firearm wasn't discharged until after a struggle points to defensive use, not offensive. A firearm is a ranged weapon and it's very fucking effective at range.

Before this video the assumption was they assumed he was a burglar because he's black.
After this video they have a much stronger legal case that they had probable cause they witness what they though was a burglary.
Sorry, but there is no situation in which you are legally allowed to chase down a thief and gun them down or even threaten their lives with a firearm. That's a crime.

And that's even assuming they witnessed his stealing something, which seems like it's probably not the case at all.
 
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AfricanKing

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Keep reading my responses, because I clearly say that loss of life should not have been the outcome, no matter if he was a buglar or not. My issue is with the protrayal of the event like it was some poor innocent jogger gunned down for being black, when clearly there were a lot of factors to the situation.
What was he guilty of that a judge and jury have convicted him with if his not innocent?
 

King of Foxes

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Sorry, but there is no situation in which you are legally allowed to chase down a thief and gun them down or even threaten their lives with a firearm. That's a crime.

And that's even assuming they witnessed his stealing something, which seems like it's probably not the case at all.
oh please, you are completely ignoring the fact the moron without the gun attacked the moron with a gun

the guy got himself killed, doesnt change the rest of the story but he did get himself killed
 

darkestdame

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oh please, you are completely ignoring the fact the moron without the gun attacked the moron with a gun

the guy got himself killed, doesnt change the rest of the story but he did get himself killed
No the person with that brought the gun in the equation is definitely the 'reason' he was murdered. Fighting for his life doesn't make him a moron.
 

Zefah

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oh please, you are completely ignoring the fact the moron without the gun attacked the moron with a gun

the guy got himself killed, doesnt change the rest of the story but he did get himself killed
I'm talking about the legality of it, not speculating on his intelligence. Outside of some very specific situations that do not include this one, you are not allowed to pull a gun on people and shoot them if they come at you. For good fucking reason, too.
 
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King of Foxes

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I'm talking about the legality of it, not speculating on his intelligence. You are not allowed to pull a gun on people and shoot them if they come at you outside of very specific situations. For good fucking reason, too.
it doesnt matter what you are or are not allowed to do, attacking a person with a gun has an obvious end result.

If he cant reason that then he is in the wrong for escalating, this situation is no different from those two red necks killing that guy with a bat who attacked them while they were holding guns.

There was no reason to escalate the already bad situation, he did and he got killed.
 
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King of Foxes

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No the person with that brought the gun in the equation is definitely the 'reason' he was murdered. Fighting for his life doesn't make him a moron.
fighting for his life or attacking someone with a gun?....he made choices that directly lead to his death, that denotes a lack of forethought and i say intelligence
 
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Zefah

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it doesnt matter what you are or are not allowed to do, attacking a person with a gun has an obvious end result.

If he cant reason that then he is in the wrong for escalating, this situation is no different from those two red necks killing that guy with a bat who attacked them while they were holding guns.

There was no reason to escalate the already bad situation, he did and he got killed.
You don't get to make a situation bad and then kill someone when they fight back. That's illegal. It's murder. It doesn't stop being murder just because they fought back.

If some rando enters private property, I'm always going to assume they're up to no good because I'm not a fucking idiot.
That's a fair assumption. You probably shouldn't go chasing people down at gunpoint and shooting them when they resist just based on your assumptions and suspicions, though. Because that is rightfully illegal.
 

Zefah

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fighting for his life or attacking someone with a gun?....he made choices that directly lead to his death, that denotes a lack of forethought and i say intelligence
Why are you bringing up his intelligence at all? He may have been the dumbest person in the world and it wouldn't be relevant to this discussion.
 
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King of Foxes

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You don't get to make a situation bad and then kill someone when they fight back. That's illegal. It's murder. It doesn't stop being murder just because they fought back.
This fought back narrative isnt believable to anyone and i dont know why people keeping bleating it, at best he was threatened. He did not fight back he escalated and got killed.

im not saying they were right to kill him at all, but the fault is not entirely theirs either.
 

King of Foxes

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Why are you bringing up his intelligence at all? He may have been the dumbest person in the world and it wouldn't be relevant to this discussion.
would you call attacking a man with a gun smart?

would you call taking a gun to stop someone who trespassed smart?

the answer to both is the same, two idiots escalated a situation that did not warrant it
 

Zefah

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would you call attacking a man with a gun smart?

would you call taking a gun to stop someone who trespassed smart?

the answer to both is the same, two idiots escalated a situation that did not warrant it
I'm talking about the legality of it, which was the topic of this thread.

This fought back narrative isnt believable to anyone and i dont know why people keeping bleating it, at best he was threatened. He did not fight back he escalated and got killed.

im not saying they were right to kill him at all, but the fault is not entirely theirs either.
You're not allowed to hold people at gun point or threaten them with firearms just because you feel like it or suspect them of something.
 
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King of Foxes

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I'm talking about the legality of it, which was the topic of this thread.
yeah we all know shooting someone is illegal, as is killing them? so? that doesnt mean the guy didnt get himself killed, people are acting like he was ducking, hiding and trying to escape while being hunted
 

darkestdame

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This fought back narrative isnt believable to anyone and i dont know why people keeping bleating it, at best he was threatened. He did not fight back he escalated and got killed.

im not saying they were right to kill him at all, but the fault is not entirely theirs either.
At best he was chased in trucks by armed men, of course the 'fought back' narrative works. It's 100% their fault and hopefully they're correctly sentenced.
yeah we all know shooting someone is illegal, as is killing them? so? that doesnt mean the guy didnt get himself killed, people are acting like he was ducking, hiding and trying to escape while being hunted
So you're defending a confirmed breaking of the law by pointing out what the victim did wrong?
 
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Zefah

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It's was illegal for him to be there in the first place.
It was illegal for him to be running down the street? No, it wasn't. And you know what? Even if it were, it would not be legal for those other citizens to stop him and hold him at gun point, and then end his life when he resisted. It was not their property. Their lives were not in danger. They are not law enforcement.