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Trump just ended a long tradition of celebrating Ramadan at the White House

Eusis

Member
Apr 15, 2011
36,666
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As far as I can see Trump is already the worst president by almost every measure(approval ratings, foreign policy, domestic policy, morality, etc.). Only thing he has now is the economy and most of that is just riding what Obama set in motion. However, a recession is coming and Trump/GOP's policies will make it much worse.
Yeah, with W. Bush it felt like it COULD be hyperbolic and we'd only know after a decade or two passed.

Not really how I expected that to be proven wrong though, in that he is at worst the second worst president because Trump got in by practically a fluke.
Bush didn't pile on huge anti-Muslim rhetoric during his presidency.

That shit didn't start into overdrive until Obama.
There was definitely that sentiment exploding in the populace after 9/11, but W. Bush tried to avoid it. Didn't try hard enough it seemed though, and now the whole party comes off as a festering ball of hate towards the religion.
 

Socreges

Banned
Jun 7, 2004
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Eh, the less religion in politics the better.

Not that he'll stop paying lip service to Christians anytime soon, though.
And that's the point. A shift with respect to Ramadan, while retaining all other religious traditions, is steeped in the prejudice of the right.

Anyone celebrating this should consider putting it in context. Religious traditions are as much cultural as anything.
 

Occam

Member
Oct 15, 2013
6,366
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Hope you get banned for this.

Disgusting comment!



Can't argue with science.
 

Steel

Banned
Jun 20, 2013
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Can't argue with science.

The white house does easter celebrations, Christmas(Granted, Christmas is more of a secular Holiday) celebrations, prayer breakfasts... And you can bet that Trump won't stop doing those. If the White didn't acknowledge any religious holiday it would be one thing, but not recognizing just the muslim ones?
 

Occam

Member
Oct 15, 2013
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The white house does easter celebrations, Christmas(Granted, Christmas is more of a secular Holiday) celebrations, prayer breakfasts... And you can bet that Trump won't stop doing those.

Naturally, he's a bigot, trying to appeal to other bigots.

The French are doing it right: Laicism
 
Jun 27, 2010
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Probably not Easter but Christmas is more of a commercial holiday than anything. Without Christmas gift giving a lot of businesses would struggle.

Come on, you're being disingenuous here.

After all the outcries over Christmas the last few years, can you really say it's more a commercial holiday than anything else?
 

Occam

Member
Oct 15, 2013
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Holy crap, please tell me you didn't just play the faux intellectual card and use Wikiislam as some sort of credible source?

My god...I feel like this is some sort of troll.

Was the first result when I googled. Had a quick glance at the article and it seemed sensible. Sorry if it's a bad source, I have no idea what wikiislam is. I've read about the health effects of Ramadan before, and this seemed to mirror what I read. What's wrong about the article?
 

jakonovski

Member
Feb 11, 2008
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I think we can all suss out the real reason why an acknowledgment of Ramadan gets so much talk about separation of church and state, when previously it was nowhere to be seen.
 

Tubobutts

Member
Nov 30, 2007
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why would he celebrate ramadan if he his not a muslim?
Why did Clinton, Bush Jr, and Obama hold a Ramadan celebration when none of them were Muslims? Why did Bush Jr. and Obama hold White House Hanukkah parties when neither of them are Jewish?
 

rls

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Nov 9, 2016
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Why did Clinton, Bush Jr, and Obama hold a Ramadan celebration when none of them were Muslims? Why did Bush Jr. and Obama hold White House Hanukkah parties when neither of them are Jewish?

you tell me


I would rather keep religion out of the white house

especially for something as dumb as the ramadan, its too unhealthy
 

jakonovski

Member
Feb 11, 2008
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you tell me


I would rather keep religion out of the white house

especially for something as dumb as the ramadan, its too unhealthy

It's called respect for your country's citizens. Something your Russian sponsored ass will never understand.
 

Tubobutts

Member
Nov 30, 2007
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you tell me


I would rather keep religion out of the white house

especially for something as dumb as the ramadan, its too unhealthy
To acknowledge the diverse traditions of American citizens.

They could (and I wouldn't have a problem if they did) keep religion out of the White House, but for some reason they still held an event for Easter and for some reason I think they will for Christmas as well.
 
Jun 27, 2010
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The drinking part is understandable and honestly doesn't make sense when you're in a country where the average temp is 30+ degrees, but fasting does have a lot of heath benefits.

Stem cell regeneration and some recent study showed it can lead to pancreas regeneration in diabetics.
 

Don'tBeWeird

Member
Dec 20, 2011
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He wasn't only talking about fasting in hot climates.

I suggest you read Occam's post again.

While fasting can be unhealthy for some, there are numerous health benefits for others. It's not so black and white, and generally, it's pretty harmless. People who have a problem with this tradition are fucking weird especially considering that a major part of fasting is to feel empathetic for the poor and misfortunate. Some utterly bizarre posts in this thread.
 

Kralamoonard

Member
Mar 23, 2015
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Many misunderstandings here in this thread on what Ramadan entails and the guidelines in place on whom can be exempt from fasting. Ignorance is of course fine if someone genuinely doesn't know and is interested in finding out, but I then suggest you perhaps be more appropriate in your tone and less judgemental and hostile, especially when you're spreading misinformation and misleading people.

Was the first result when I googled. Had a quick glance at the article and it seemed sensible. Sorry if it's a bad source, I have no idea what wikiislam is. I've read about the health effects of Ramadan before, and this seemed to mirror what I read. What's wrong about the article?

Ok no worries if it was a legitimate mistake, my bad for jumping the gun.

Basically, WikiIslam is unfortunately a website that is very misleading it it's name; it's a website run by ex-Muslims and hardcore atheists who grossly misrepresent Islam without any theological or scholarly basis. It's initially very subtle in how it portrays Islam but once you see the authors and the blatant lies and disingenuous articles then you see transparent it is. It's basically 'bashing Islam 101' and for those familiar, is laughed at even, by non-Muslims as any sort of reputable source for Islam.

Regarding fasting, it is actually contrary to what some bizarre posts are claiming here. It is healthy for the body. Furthermore, fortunately Islam has guidelines on who is also exempt from fasting, such as the elderly or the sick (and the young who are not of age of course). Instead, the former can pay something known as 'Fidya' which is feeding poor people instead as a compensation for one's inability to fast.
 

Sony

Nintendo
Jun 15, 2016
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especially for something as dumb as the ramadan, its too unhealthy


You can make Ramadan as healthy as you want and as unhealthy as you want. It's not unhealthy by definition. But you can ignore the countless peer reviewed studies on the subject and continue to shitpost.
 

IaN_GAF

Member
Sep 20, 2013
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Why would anyone expect this guy to celebrate Ramadan...

Be glad he isn't taxing/banning it.
 

squallheart

Member
Dec 16, 2013
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To be honest, I'd prefer it if governments didn't participate in any religious ceremonies.
Secularism, yo!
Religion needs to stay far away from government.

US government officials constantly talking about God and having it influence their policies is scary.

This.
 

Nerokis

Member
Feb 28, 2013
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Eh, the less religion in politics the better.

Not that he'll stop paying lip service to Christians anytime soon, though.

Ironically, this does nothing to decrease the amount of religion in politics. It doesn't make the government the slightest bit more secular, but does make it a bit less pluralistic. Seeing as pluralism, in practical terms, tends to create more space for secularism, all abandoning this tradition does is strengthen a particular religion's hold on government that much more. And a government that acknowledges a variety of religious beliefs is vastly superior to one that latches onto a specific religious belief.
 

Stitch

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Nov 26, 2006
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There are so many different people living in America. If Trump would celebrate all their Holidays he'd be celebrating 24/7.
 
Jun 27, 2010
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true. not arguing with that :)

I don't know shit about ramadan and just looked it up on google. first source I deemed credible was cnn article from 2003 which said if done right, there's no problem http://edition.cnn.com/2003/HEALTH/11/06/ramadan.fasting/

Yeah, an old friend who used to fast would go crazy when opening his. He'd down an entire bucket of fried chicken, fries, four cans of Vimto and then there was dessert. That's upwards of 5k of calories easy and you're thinking what the hell was the point of fasting...

Some people use it as an excuse to binge eat everything they normally wouldn't, but when done right, it can have a lot of health benefits and it's something we should embrace. I've done some I.F in my time, it does really make you feel better, less bloated and oddly makes you feel more energetic, but it all comes down to what you eat and drink pre and post fast.
 

mAcOdIn

Member
Oct 28, 2007
10,875
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There are so many different people living in America. If Trump would celebrate all their Holidays he'd be celebrating 24/7.
Hey, if that'd keep him from accomplishing any of his shitty agenda I'm all for it!

Seriously though, I don't believe this is true at all. And might I add, even if it were somehow true that there were enough different unique cultures in America that every second of every day were an observance of something, I don't believe the President himself need be present at everything, White House staff alone should be perfectly capable of planning and hosting events and the President's presence, or lack there of, would be subject to his schedule and assuming people had reasonable faith that our government did indeed respect all the cultures it claims the lack of a Presidential appearance at an event or two shouldn't ruffle any feathers.

Now, Trump likely does not have that goodwill within the Muslim community due to his remarks towards Muslims but that's less a problem with Religion as a whole, the Muslims for not freely placing their respect in Donald Trump but rather the President's apparent lack of respect towards their culture. A better President likely wouldn't have that problem. I don't think the answer's to lower our expectations of the Presidency so that Trump doesn't come up short but rather to elect people who can meet those expectations.

And lastly, damn it would be good to celebrate something every day.
 

Spectone

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Nov 1, 2014
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Of course, it's all bullshit. They never manage to remember that pesky "love thy neighbor"-line.

On the other hand Republicans give us great quotes like God will "take care of" climate change. If it even exists. Which of course it doesn't.

God will take care of your enemies so you don't need a second amendment or nuclear weapons.
 

bionic77

Member
Jun 7, 2004
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Trump and his team are extremely predictable in always doing the wrong thing.

So in his defense this was exactly the right thing for him to do.

I am sure eventually will have a thread about how he hosts cops that murdered black men and got away with it. He will probably do that during Black History Month...
 

Cheezus

Member
Sep 2, 2015
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I really hope all of these small insults aimed at large communities in the US accumulating over this shit stain's term add up to actual results in the next elections.

Then again, this is America and all of those voters probably live in the only two or three deep blue states remaining in this doomed as fuck country, so the electoral college will guarantee 8 years of dipshit.
 

Skellig Gra

Member
Aug 24, 2007
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It's for the best. If he did it he'd trail off in the first minute to a rant about ISIS and his travel ban.

Eagerly awaiting some treats from my Muslim friends. Enjoy Eid Muslim GAF.
 

1.21Gigawatts

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Nov 24, 2012
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munich
Acknowledging the traditions of large parts of society doesn't mean you are not secular anymore.

I agree that religions shouldn't interfere with government, but wishing people a Merry Christmas or Eid Mubarak is just basic decency.
 

entremet

Member
Dec 6, 2008
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Edgy posters out in full force. It was a harmless gesture of respect. You guys get so bent out of shape with religious topics.
 

Nesotenso

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Mar 6, 2011
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The white house does easter celebrations, Christmas(Granted, Christmas is more of a secular Holiday) celebrations, prayer breakfasts...

I don't see how any of this is violation of separation of church and state. The French idea of secularism is something I want to see the US far away from.
 

plagiarize

Banned
May 24, 2006
41,130
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Yeah, an old friend who used to fast would go crazy when opening his. He'd down an entire bucket of fried chicken, fries, four cans of Vimto and then there was dessert. That's upwards of 5k of calories easy and you're thinking what the hell was the point of fasting...

Some people use it as an excuse to binge eat everything they normally wouldn't, but when done right, it can have a lot of health benefits and it's something we should embrace. I've done some I.F in my time, it does really make you feel better, less bloated and oddly makes you feel more energetic, but it all comes down to what you eat and drink pre and post fast.
Ah, Ramadan in Manchester. What a time.
 

Messofanego

Banned
Oct 31, 2011
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twitter.com
I actually prefer people here dumping on Ramadan because they're very anti-religion in any form since it's more honest about their beliefs than these people concern trolling like pseudointellectuals about fasting being unhealthy lol
Well, from a purely medical standpoint, Ramadan is not healthy. Especially if you are in the middle east.

https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Adverse_Effects_of_Islamic_Fasting

Science!

you tell me


I would rather keep religion out of the white house

especially for something as dumb as the ramadan, its too unhealthy
 

Vipershark

Member
Oct 4, 2009
1,625
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The Internet, NC
Should presidents not celebrate Easter or Christmas?

All religious arguments aside, Christmas is a federal paid-time-off holiday so I can see having events for that (yes yes, religious holiday, just ignore that for the sake of the discussion) but the argument for Easter doesn't really stand in that regard.
 

Steel

Banned
Jun 20, 2013
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I don't see how any of this is violation of separation of church and state. The French idea of secularism is something I want to see the US far away from.

It doesn't actually matter to me much whether they get rid of the observance of all religious holidays or they observe holidays from all major religions. But picking and choosing is a problem.
 

StarVigil

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Nov 10, 2013
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There are so many different people living in America. If Trump would celebrate all their Holidays he'd be celebrating 24/7.
And he is elected to represent all Americans. So it is common sense to show gratitude to the people who are the reason he has that job in the first place.
It's really sad that people forgot after 5 months what being President of the United States means. Just because the current one is a moron doesn't mean that he shouldn't be called out for not doing his job. In this case, showing respect to the people that Do uphold that tradition and that belief.
Trump being Trump is not an excuse. The president of the United States sees it not worth of his time to do his job but instead whine on twitter about some stupid thing, play golf or hold a rally for himself.
If trump would replace his own rallies for a day to celebrate a tradition of one of the many people of the US, he would have more support. Instead he only surrounds himself with people who kiss his shoes and celebrate him. People of the Man, instead of how it should be.