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Trump says he won’t close the country if second wave of coronavirus hits

Patriots7

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Because their deaths are front loaded instead of spread out over likely 6 months like ours will be. As long as their hospitals are not overloaded they are in the exact same boat as the rest of the world.

Lockdowns were never about ending the virus, just flattening the curve until hard immunity is reached. To say otherwise is revisionist.
Flattening the curve to prevent an overload of the healthcare system...but to also implement national testing and tracing policies to ensure that we do not have to implement such a broad-based lockdown. We haven't done so yet.

Only after you properly secure and maintain tight control of your borders so it doesn't get abused by those looking to freeload then perhaps.
That's the only part you can respond to? And even then, with "I'd rather an American die than an immigrant benefit."

Conservative media is really damaging this country.
 
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JordanN

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That's the only part you can respond to? And even then, with "I'd rather an American die than an immigrant benefit."

Conservative media is really damaging this country.
Then I hope you add those U.S death counts to Sweden and Japan's health system because open borders means the entire world wants to be treated but it's the natives who must pay for it.

And in response to your other question: the lockdowns affect more than just businesses that had outbreaks. We know Hair Salons or Movie Theaters are still barred from opening, even if those places never reported an infection.
 
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All Hail C-Webb

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Because their deaths are front loaded instead of spread out over likely 6 months like ours will be. As long as their hospitals are not overloaded they are in the exact same boat as the rest of the world.

Lockdowns were never about ending the virus, just flattening the curve until hard immunity is reached. To say otherwise is revisionist.
They're not frontloaded. They thought that they were at 25%, and less than 8% had antibodies in the capital.
They're as far away from Herd immunity as all their neighbors, but they've had way more death.
They were wrong.
 

cryptoadam

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They're not frontloaded. They thought that they were at 25%, and less than 8% had antibodies in the capital.
They're as far away from Herd immunity as all their neighbors, but they've had way more death.
They were wrong.
You have a link to their updated study?
 

JordanN

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They're not frontloaded. They thought that they were at 25%, and less than 8% had antibodies in the capital.
They're as far away from Herd immunity as all their neighbors, but they've had way more death.
They were wrong.
On May 20th, Sweden said 1 in 5 (or 20%) of Stockholm have antibodies.

 
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#Phonepunk#

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just wait. a second wave happens. then Trump shuts down the country. then the media hits him with "I tHoUgHt YoU sAiD yOu WoUlDn'T sHuT dOwN tHe CoUnTrY!!!"

once again proving Trump is a liar who changes what he says and does to suit the flow of time and NOT a warlock who can predict the future but chose to LIE to us instead
 

GeorgPrime

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We’re so fucked!! Only the election can save us now.

hopefully the second wave doesn’t hit until at least after November or this is really the end....
Choose:

- Get sick and maybe immune after it
- Lose your job and everything else

Covid-19 is here to stay like the normal flu. It will come from time to time. People will get sick. People will heal. There is no reason to close the country now everytime Covid-19 appears. Its just more dangerous for older people.

And as soon as the vaccine is here most people will be more prepared anyway.

Every country got hit by it with immense economic problems, another wave would easily destroy all countries if they do another lockdown.
 
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cryptoadam

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Interesting from Sweden

The results also showed the spread was greater among people aged 20-64, of whom 6.7 percent had developed antibodies, compared to 2.7 percent among those aged 65 and up.

Tegnell said this was "a sign of that group actually being pretty good at keeping themselves isolated and protected."

Meanwhile, around 4.7 percent of those aged zero to 19 had antibodies, which Tegnell said showed "what we have said all along, that this is not where we are seeing a large spread" of the virus.


So what this shows is that younger people have an even lower death rate, while older people have an even higher one.

Most deaths are in the group with the least infection. Just shows that Corona Chan really is a bitch for the elderly.
 

All Hail C-Webb

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On May 20th, Sweden said 1 in 5 (or 20%) of Stockholm have antibodies.

The epidemiologist in charge believe they were at that number. He actually believed they were even higher than that on May 1st, and he was dead (well his countrymen anyway) wrong.

You have a link to their updated study?
 

All Hail C-Webb

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Interesting from Sweden

The results also showed the spread was greater among people aged 20-64, of whom 6.7 percent had developed antibodies, compared to 2.7 percent among those aged 65 and up.

Tegnell said this was "a sign of that group actually being pretty good at keeping themselves isolated and protected."

Meanwhile, around 4.7 percent of those aged zero to 19 had antibodies, which Tegnell said showed "what we have said all along, that this is not where we are seeing a large spread" of the virus.


So what this shows is that younger people have an even lower death rate, while older people have an even higher one.

Most deaths are in the group with the least infection. Just shows that Corona Chan really is a bitch for the elderly.
You don't make antibodies when your dead. Tegnell is a moron, and will be removed from his position.
 

daveonezero

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his house must be a shit hole
I’ve got almost zero debt, good cash flow and ability to move around anywhere.

What’s your place like?
What happens when the real estate market crashes?
What happened when rent is due again?

The pandemic is just covering for the biggest economic crash ever and the reprocess ions will be felt for generations.
 

cryptoadam

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The epidemiologist in charge believe they were at that number. He actually believed they were even higher than that on May 1st, and he was dead (well his countrymen anyway) wrong.



Thanks for the link, though according to the article this was followed up with

Sweden’s state epidemiologist, Anders Tegnell, said the antibodies figure was “a bit lower than we’d thought”, but added that it reflected the situation some weeks ago and he believed that by now “a little more than 20%” of the capital’s population had probably contracted the virus.

Believes? Well we will have to see what updated testing brings out. If these numbers are from late March then another 6 weeks or so could of doubled the numbers since Sweden isn't doing a "lockdown" and that means the virus is still spreading.

London says they are at 17% right now


And we know NYC estimated 25%

Madrid said they were at 11%

I guess we need to be careful with numbers, but from the picture being painted, the dense urban area's with a lot more deaths seem to have 10-20% infected, and those numbers drop as you get further out from the hot spots.

We will probably get better numbers at the end of June and July.
 

daveonezero

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I I post doctors that disagree with the lockdown do we have to respect their science and interpretation of the data?

and no not the popular California ones.
 
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Joe T.

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Why did you guys vote for Castro's illegitimate Son to get another term again?
I think this sums it up (source: Media In Canada):

The 2019 Digital News Report outlines the effect the loss of hundreds of newspapers across the country has had on its media ecosystem, finding trust in the Canadian media is at 52%. Based on a survey of more than 75,000 people in 38 countries Canada ranks fifth; Canadians hold more trust in traditional and online media than their American neighbours whose level of trust sits at 32%.
Our mainstream news is no better than yours and it only goes in one direction. Trudeau receives even more cover and praise from CBC, CTV and Global News than Biden does from NBC, ABC and CBS. It's scary.
 

autoduelist

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The CDC is saying the second wave could be even more deadly as the one in Spring 2020. But Trump is a fool, so it's no surprise that he goes against doctors.

You do realize saying the 2nd wave could be worse than the 1st is the same as saying the 1st wave could be worse than the 2nd, right?
 

oagboghi2

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What about people working in the high risk industries? Are they not important? Lockdown is the only solution, due to selfish af Trump and his supporters refusing to wear masks
What are these high risk industries? Would they not be high risk if people stayed inside and more restaurants failed?
 

Cato

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1. Him not wearing a mask is the only thing that's for show.
2. Yes.
3. He didn't. He went to a state where it's required indoors, and he went to a business that required a mask of all people who enter. Testing is not 100%, and that sure sounds like a lot of testing for someone who says it's not important to test..
Eh, no.
The guy I was responding to already confirmed he thought he should wear a mask because theatre. Not because it made sense medically.
It is simple, a mask will have no effect to prevent you from catching the virus.
It will however greatly reduce the chance of you spreading it to others IF you are infected.

Lets talk about Tom Hanks. Maybe it is easier.
Should he always wear a mask when he goes outside or meets with people in gatherings?
He has had the virus and is immune. He can not now catch the virus and he can not spread it.
Everyone knows Tom got sick and he is now immune.

If you see pictures of Tom Hanks wearing a mask, would you call that out as stupid and just theatre?
Or would you be angry because Tom Hanks is not wearning a mask?
 
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Arkam

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There will be little to no second wave. There wad barely a first wave. CLosing anything other than high risk events/assemblies/travels would be an over reaction. Especially when its at a make/break period of the world economy. 250m people would gladly sacrifice 1m people to preserve their 401k and pension.
 
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Cato

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There will be little to no second wave. There wad barely a first wave. CLosing anything other than high risk events/assemblies/travels would be an over reaction. Especially when its at a make/break period of the world economy. 250m people would gladly sacrifice 1m people to preserve their 401k and pension.
The initial lockdowns were put in place when we did not know much for sure about the virus and was an overreaction.
People paniced, even people on this very board were talking about "this will kill 10-20% of the whole population".
We know a lot more now about the virus and its pathology.

At this point we know with a high degree of certainty that for people under 60 and in general decent health, the virus has very low risk
and is comparable to the ordinary flu.
But for people over 70 and especially if they have underlying conditions then this virus will be deadly.

I would imagine a second wave would mean we quaranteen all the old folks homes, and the resident nurses and other workers in those places, to prevent the virus from hitting nursing homes.
But let the rest of the economy just continue as normal.

Also, do not let Cuomo and friends make any more policies that will immediately lead to strong infection rates in old folks homes.
I.e. constrain Cuomo so he can not murder more old people than he already has.
 
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Cato

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Congrats. Do you want a cookie for that extraordinary breakthrough in logic?
But why should Trump close the whole country? That would be retarded. The country is big and you don;t have one solution that fits all parts of the country.
Shouldn't that be something better done on a per county basis?

For sure, if downtown NYC suffers high infection rates because Cuomo feels like being murdering people again that is one thing,
but why should the 27 people that live in woop-woop in remote Nebraska have the same lockdown as NYC?

There is an island off the coast of Alaska where 12 people lives. Why should they have the same lockdown as downtown NYC?
They are going to fly cops in from Anchorage and fine them if two of them are down on the "beach" fishing at the same time?


This has nothing to do with health anymore and only about far crazy leftists that love strong authorative government pushing people around.
For theatre. Because some people like it and some other people are jealous on "why can Bob have a BBQ in rural Utah when I cant go buy Avocado toast down at McDonalds at the subway station".


Come to my place. Lockdown or not, I have BBQ on the beach for lunch most days. Because I like it.
We go down to the beach, do you surf? and I cook snags or even jambalaya and we sit enjoy the sun, the beach and a few beers.
 
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HeresJohnny

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How about the people who are freaked can stay home and those of us who want to spend life living go ahead and do so? Both sides get what they want.

That way, neither side tells the other what to do. There are far too many people who are completely irrational affecting the lives of those of us who aren’t.
 
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DeepEnigma

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How about the people who are freaked can stay home and those of us who want to spend life living go ahead and do so? Both sides get what they want.

That way, neither side tells the other what to do. There are far too many people who are completely irrational affecting the lives of those of us who aren’t.
Shhh, too logical for the authoritarian puppets.
 

infinitys_7th

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Shhh, too logical for the authoritarian puppets.
Or we just protect the elderly and let healthy people younger than 60 or 70, for whom statistically this virus basically acts like the flu with, live and work freely. Hell, a small economy of sterile grocery/food/supply delivery can pop up for the elderly and their caregivers to utilize.

We know enough about the virus know regarding who it impacts and who dies at this point - Sweden alone is a great test case of who dies in uncontrolled spread, and it really is pretty much the flu in terms of deaths for the relatively young and healthy.
 
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Plague Doctor

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Or we just protect the elderly and let healthy people younger than 60 or 70, for whom statistically this virus basically acts like the flu with, live and work freely. Hell, a small economy of sterile grocery/food/supply delivery can pop up for the elderly and their caregivers to utilize.

We know enough about the virus know regarding who it impacts and who dies at this point - Sweden alone is a great test case of who dies in uncontrolled spread, and it really is pretty much the flu in terms of deaths for the relatively young and healthy.
Are you suggesting quarantining the most susceptible and vulnerable to save lives?

Kind like the opposite of Cuomo did in NY?

This is lunatic talk.
 
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DeepBreath87

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How about you stay home if you are afraid of the virus. If you aren't you can go about your business as usual.
But then only the people who bought into media generated hysteria will be effected. The American left believes in shared punishment and dragging everyone down to the same level. So if some must suffer, all must suffer.
 
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Iorv3th

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You mean handle it like every other public threat that we have to deal with as we go about our lives?

I'm not sure the world is ready for personal responsibility on this scale.

That's modern leftism in a nutshell. "We don't believe in personal responsibility" They want the government to do everything for them. And when something bad happens it's the red government causing it.
 

TwoDurans

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Orange idiot still doesn't realize it's not up to him. If the govs decide to shut down, we're shut down. All he can do it piss and moan about it on Twitter.

We're already seeing spikes because we reopened too early. Not shutting down during wave 2 would be a very costly mistake. Fortunately most states have leadership that listens to doctors.
 
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Plague Doctor

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You know science fiction was all wrong in modern history for decades.

In reality, the villains were realy the irresponsible fucks not giving into martial law of regional leaders and not believing in the media megacorporations. Those values will get everyone killed in weeks. Maybe days. Authority was the good guys all along.

Science fiction, why did you lie to me?
 
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DeepBreath87

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Orange idiot still doesn't realize it's not up to him. If the govs decide to shut down, we're shut down. All he can do it piss and moan about it on Twitter.

We're already seeing spikes because we reopened too early. Not shutting down during wave 2 would be a very costly mistake. Fortunately most states have leadership that listens to doctors.
Fortunately you have no idea what you're talking about. Because "doctors" are saying that the shutdowns are killing people.
 

DunDunDunpachi

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You know science fiction was all wrong in modern history for decades.

In reality, the villains were aly the irresponsible fucks not giving into martial law of regional leaders and not believing in the media megacorporations. Those values will get everyone killed in weeks. Maybe days. Authority was the good guys all along.

Science fiction, why did you lie to me?
I'm beginning to wonder if Philip K Dick really was raided by the CIA because he was getting too close to guessing at their far-flung future plans. :pie_thinking:
 
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TwoDurans

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Fortunately you have no idea what you're talking about. Because "doctors" are saying that the shutdowns are killing people.
You got some receipts on that? Aside from the standard x number of people die for every percentage of unemployment? Has a reputable doctor actually said that this shut down is costing lives, and is it more than 100k Americans?

Look, no one likes this. But it's not over and the only way to combat this thing is to avoid it until we have a vaccine.
 
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Eiknarf

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Orange idiot still doesn't realize it's not up to him. If the govs decide to shut down, we're shut down. All he can do it piss and moan about it on Twitter.

We're already seeing spikes because we reopened too early. Not shutting down during wave 2 would be a very costly mistake. Fortunately most states have leadership that listens to doctors.
You must be lost
 

Eiknarf

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Yeah, I know that GAF Politics is the island of crazies but sometimes it's interesting to see mental gymnastics at work.


I already wrote that the Democrats are in control of the economy now. That’s why it sucks


Right now the Democrats are responsible for our economy. Not trump. Not the virus

The asshole Dems want you to depend on them, so of course they want to keep shit closed

If you disagree with me, YOU ARE WRONG
 

TwoDurans

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I already wrote that the Democrats are in control of the economy now. That’s why it sucks
You do realize there are more republicans in office right now than democrats, right? I get it that democrat bad, because they want you to not get sick, and unfortunately that might inconvenience you a hair, but it's foolish to say democrats are in control of anything. Can't even get us a good nominee for president.
 
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DeepBreath87

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You got some receipts on that? Aside from the standard x number of people die for every percentage of unemployment? Has a reputable doctor actually said that this shut down is costing lives, and is it more than 100k Americans?

Look, no one likes this. But it's not over and the only way to combat this thing is to avoid it until we have a vaccine.
Let’s start with those 600 doctors who are talking about what these lockdowns are doing to everyone who isn’t sick from COVID. The CDC estimates the CFR for COVID is around 0.3%, btw. So you can feel safe without locking up in your basement.
 
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infinitys_7th

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You do realize there are more republicans in office right now than democrats, right? I get it that democrat bad, because they want you to not get sick, and unfortunately that might inconvenience you a hair, but it's foolish to say democrats are in control of anything.
Democrats control all the states with the highest casaulties. Republicans do not control New York, New Jersey, Michigan, all these places. Republicans controlling other states are completely independent of their problems. It is almost entirely on Dems, especially when they blocked state quarantines and killed tens of thousands of elderly by forcing infected patients to be housed in nursing houses.
 

cryptoadam

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Orange idiot still doesn't realize it's not up to him. If the govs decide to shut down, we're shut down. All he can do it piss and moan about it on Twitter.

We're already seeing spikes because we reopened too early. Not shutting down during wave 2 would be a very costly mistake. Fortunately most states have leadership that listens to doctors.
Yup listend to doctors and sent old people back to old age homes and killed thousands. Those are the people you put your faith in LOL.

And you are correct its up to the states. What Trump means is he wont do a federal lockdown and spend trillions of dollars.

If new york wants to lock down then thats Cuomos choice but dont expect stimuls checks and west virginia to do what Cuomo says because he wants to rant and rave about 40 K ventilators again.

Ironic that nearly 80% of deaths and cases are in blue states that listened to doctord while the states that listened to Orange Man only have a small % of the problem.
 

TwoDurans

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Let’s start with those 600 doctors who are talking about what these lockdowns are doing to everyone who isn’t sick from COVID. The CDC estimates the CFR for COVID is around 0.3%, btw. So you can feel safe without locking up in your basement.
Lol, that's cute. I knew you were going to drop the 600 doctors note, which was why I asked for actual statistics. For you see that letter has zero actual data, or to quote FOX News (fuck you, btw, for making me go to FN but I figured that was the only site you'd trust)

"estimates about 150,000 Americans each month that the shutdown remains in place would have had new cancer detected, millions more are missing dental exams that could discover problems linked to heart disease, while others are experiencing domestic violence like child abuse."
I'm sorry to hear that people can't go to the dentist.
 

TwoDurans

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Democrats control all the states with the highest casaulties. Republicans do not control New York, New Jersey, Michigan, all these places. Republicans controlling other states are completely independent of their problems. It is almost entirely on Dems, especially when they blocked state quarantines and killed tens of thousands of elderly by forcing infected patients to be housed in nursing houses.
Yup listend to doctors and sent old people back to old age homes and killed thousands. Those are the people you put your faith in LOL.

And you are correct its up to the states. What Trump means is he wont do a federal lockdown and spend trillions of dollars.

If new york wants to lock down then thats Cuomos choice but dont expect stimuls checks and west virginia to do what Cuomo says because he wants to rant and rave about 40 K ventilators again.

Ironic that nearly 80% of deaths and cases are in blue states that listened to doctord while the states that listened to Orange Man only have a small % of the problem.
You've got it twisted my friend. Yes, in the early days of this the cases and deaths came from densely populated areas. In fact 2/3s of the cases came from 5 states, mostly Blue. But since the shutdown started, nearly all of the new cases and deaths have come from the other 45.

Can't embed from the hill, but look at the yellow here.
 
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