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TRUTHFACT: MS having eSRAM yield problems on Xbox One

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D

Delano

Banned
Why do they call it the Xbox One? Because it's capable of about 1 TFLOP.

I'm sorry, but as someone who has been a fan and held out hope that the new Xbox would usher a return to diverse games focused on the core, the One is a huge disappointment thus far. I've always ended up owning both console and, ironically, the PS4 seems to be carrying on the heritage of the original Xbox better than the One.
 
T

tokkun

Member
teh_pwn said:
Downgrading the GPU performance goes from low end mainstream to horrible territory. I think there's a Haswell chip with Iris that has that performance. An expensive CPU, but a CPU doing > than XboxOne's APU. Wish MS went with standard parts. Heavily customized parts often have yield issues and COGS issues. I don't understand why people keep doing it.
Click to expand...

Paper specs. Iris Pro competes in theoretical FLOPs, but if you look at the framerates in games it doesn't.
 
U

Unknown Soldier

Member
Watching the rumors developing in real time is one of the joys of GAF before a major console release cycle.

tokkun said:
Paper specs. Iris Pro competes in theoretical FLOPs, but if you look at the framerates in games it doesn't.
Click to expand...

This is mainly because Iris Pro gets spanked in fillrate. Also, Intel's graphic drivers are quite awful compared to Nvidia's and ATI's, their lack of years of experience in programming graphic drivers really kills them compared to their specialist competitors.
 
E

eastmen

Banned
Zukuu said:
Pricing, wrong R&D, not needed etc


Pricing is most likely the reason. Also, MS thought Sony would have 2GB GDDR5. Even the rumored 4GB still meant they would have double the amount of RAM. Even to insiders and devs, the 8GB came out of nowhere, leaving microsoft in the dust. By late feburary (the ps4 reveeal), it was far too late to change the hardware without delaying the release by a good amount.
Click to expand...

Each micron shrink would reap bigger price drops for MS than sony. GDDR5 in high densities will stay expensive much longer than the apu in the xbox.
 
UberTag

UberTag

Member
Sounds like Microsoft bet on the wrong horse technologically and generally dragged their feet to this starting line despite every advantage over Sony going into this race and are now praying they can "smoke and mirrors it up" in order to maintain leverage over the PS4... and even their "double Sony's ad budget" won't amount to much if they can't match them on the supply/price front.

Yikes!
 
M

makingmusic476

Member
If accurate, this would mean the device is coming in underpowered and more expensive than Microsoft expected, which was already underpowered and (I think?) slightly more expensive than ps4.

There's so much that reminds me of the ps3's launch, only the ps3 maintained rough hardware parity with 360, and the XBO looks like it'll have a more fleshed out OS compared to ps4 than ps3 had compared to 360.

And of course, there's always record breaking pre-orders.
 
M

mr_nothin

Banned
Sky Chief said:
Serious question, why would MS go with such a complex design instead of just using better RAM like Sony? It seems like In trying to save money they are actually increasing costs and sacrificing yields and performance.
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They probably wanted 8GB of RAM but having 8GB of GDDR5 was a big gamble and risk and they probably felt that 4GB of GDDR5 was too low. Sooo they went with 8GB of DDR3 and said "we'll just offset the bandwidth deficiencies with ESRAM so game devs can just do a bit more work to get relatively the same amount of bandwidth and we can still get our 8GB of RAM". And now we're here

eastmen said:
Each micron shrink would reap bigger price drops for MS than sony. GDDR5 in high densities will stay expensive much longer than the apu in the xbox.
Click to expand...

But since they're using similar APUs and since Sony has a less complicated version of the same APU, it will still benefit Sony greatly too
 
Z

Zukuu

Banned
Meelow said:
I actually agree, if this is true it won't matter, Microsoft will still moneyhat and the gaming press will hype up the Xbox One more than both Wii U future and PS4.
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You're giving the gaming press way too much credit tho. They won't decide which console the average consumer will be buying.

Also, at this point I can't see the box selling ANYWHERE but NA, and not for the gaming parts. It's almost funny, if it wasn't so sad, how badly the Xbox One has been received in Europe. MS will face harsh problems here down the road anyway, due to Kinectspionage 2.0. The German consumer protection minister upfront demanded FULL INFORMATION about everything kinect does, which information will be recorded and how the data is used / shared. It received bad news in the mainstream media as well. And I don't have to tell you how interested europeans are in US TV, NFL, NBA and co do I?^^
 
T

teh_pwn

"Saturated fat causes heart disease as much as Brawndo is what plants crave."
tokkun said:
Paper specs. Iris Pro competes in theoretical FLOPs, but if you look at the framerates in games it doesn't.
Click to expand...

Maybe, but it also has to do with that level of performance not being anything significant for discrete GPUs. Newer and improved 20 nm AMD GPUs should be coming out in about 6 months with 6 TF.
 
S

StevieP

Banned
TAJ said:
They've done it before. Hell, with the original Xbox they revised the announced GPU clock speed twice. (From 300 to 250 to 233.)
Click to expand...

They did the same thing with the 360. The original engineering documents given to devs in 2004 said 4ghz.
 
K

Knoxcore

Member
While us hardcore gamers care about this, at the end of the day, these numbers won't mean crap to the average consumer who will go out and buy the XBO. Despite my confidence in Sony's PS4, I still think Sony has a steep uphill battle to fight.

Clearly the pattern to these rumors are MS is not as far ahead in developing the XBO as we all thought. I'm curious how this will translate to their game lineup in the fall for the new console and whether or not we will see an immediate difference in the graphical fidelity of games between the PS4 and the XBO at E3, Gamescom etc.
 
B

Bad_Boy

time to take my meds
johnson2.gif
 
K

kevinski

Banned
I really, really hope this isn't true. As much as I want to like Xbox One for its somewhat unorthodox approach to gaming, it's starting to sound like more of a rush job as more information leaks.
 
J

JoeyJo-JoJuniorShabadoo

Banned
Painraze said:
MS is trying to take on Google, Apple, Sony, Netflix and tons of other companies with Xbox One. They've invested in cloud computing, Xbox Studios, Kinect, etc. Their scope is fucking massive. Their hardware has to account for all these goals and ideas. Sometimes things can get out of your control and lose their way a bit in the process.
Click to expand...

Absolutely, but there's a thing called scope control. Leading in all directions is rarely a successful strategy.

1) They got a box that will be destroyed by the PS4 in the race for the hardcore

which wouldn't be a major issue except...

2) Their TV services are only working in the US at launch, which is baffling as the idea of the HDM-in is to be receiver agnostic. The fact they talked about the fucking thing so much, and obviously have it as a core part of their strategy and just write off Canada/Europe/Australia etc. is insane.

but which wouldn't be completely terrible except for...

3) If this is such a TV/entertainment-centric device why haven't we heard of a different business model? Why is this at E3 and not CES? What about subsidization? I liked the concept of EaaS (entertainment as a service) but this just sounds like I'm going to have to walk into a store and plop down $400 and then pay extra for Gold rather than a blended purchase.

If this thing was truly designed for mainstream all-in-one media, their execution is shit.
 
F

Felix Lighter

Member
Being extremely supply constrained this time around would be disastrous, I'd imagine, having a direct competitor launching a similar product within weeks of your products launch.
 
A

artist

Banned
teh_pwn said:
Examples. Because it doesn't look like it here nor did it work for either of the HD twins.

On the other hand, I'm betting PS4's COGS 3 years from now will be super cheap. GDDR5 will be cheap per GB because so many things use it.
Click to expand...
Xenos, compared to RSX.
 
D

Deleted member 8095

Unconfirmed Member
nib95 said:
Rumours that were all correct in the past and that some of these guys have been accurate with in the past too?
Click to expand...

I'm not saying he isn't right, but can you show me what he was correct about in the past? I'm curious, I want to know how seriously I should take this rumor.
 
JordanN

JordanN

Banned
I don't want my PS4/PC multiplats being screwed over because of the friggin Xbox.

If specs aren't ready don't release a next gen console.
 
M

makingmusic476

Member
Who is Matt? I recognize most of the "insiders" so far, but I haven't been around gaming as much as I used to and he's not ringing any bells.

I assume the fact that he's using his first name implies he has some sway with staff?
 
Z

Zukuu

Banned
Matt said:
Yeah, this is true.
Click to expand...
I won't say Xbox Done, but it sure doesn't look bright for MS. Sony holds all strings in their hand, if they don't screw up somehow, we could potentially see a PS2 vs Xbox era again. (if not more severe in some territories)

xboxdones1u9t.gif
 
J

jett

D-Member
Didn't the PS3 have yield issues too? So much that they had to disable one of cell's SPUs.

The parallel's are definitely there. :p
 
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