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Analysis [VG TECH] Doom Eternal PS5 vs Xbox Series X|S Frame Rate Comparison

Tchu-Espresso

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So all you have to do to increase the resolution is lower the image quality.

You won’t notice one but will 100% notice the other from 3m away! Which one though?
 
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Mr Moose

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So all you have to do to increase the resolution is lower the image quality.

You won’t notice one but will 100% notice the other from 3m away! Which one though?
I've noticed in a few shots the PS5 version looks slightly better and in others the Series X takes the lead.
Like this one, slightly softer image on PS5.
No one will notice without actively trying to find differences but yeah they are very close overall.


 
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XSX is the winner, but clear winner in a DRS game no less? Hard to say when the lowest resolution found on both consoles is anywhere from 14-29%.

Balanced
PS5 - 6.71 million pixels
XSX - 8.29 million pixels
23% difference


Ray tracing
2986*1680 = 5.01 million pixels
3200 *1800 = 5.7 million pixels
Difference = 14%

120 FPS
PS5 = 2.23 million pixels
XSX = 2.88 million pixels
Difference: 29%

I dont know who DRS helps most. the XSX or the PS5. It's pretty much impossible to tell resolution drops in hectic action sequences which hurts Xbox, and yet if DRS wasnt around the XSX would likely have been targeting the same 1080p or 1440p settings as the PS5 leaving A LOT of performance on the table. See Control.

I personally think a clear winner is when you have a situation like Hitman where the XSX was native 4k and the PS5 had to settle for 1800p. 44% difference. These tiny 15-20% resolution drops are almost impossible to notice. I would say the 120 fps mode is the only one where you can say the xsx is the clear winner, but its not even the traditional 40-50% pixels upgrades last gen for both the PS4 and X1X.

Another point is, it's "UP TO 15-20%". In vgtech text, PS5 drops more often, but not all the time. Sure there are frames with equal pixel count too.

It's like Metro Exodus, PS5 drops more often, but there are frames in equal resolution too, like NXGamer NXGamer said in his video.

Another point, i really expected imperceptible differences in VRS tier 2. There are minor differences, but it's there.

For me it's a XSX win, but very very close.
 

Mr Moose

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Another point is, it's "UP TO 15-20%". In vgtech text, PS5 drops more often, but not all the time. Sure there are frames with equal pixel count too.

It's like Metro Exodus, PS5 drops more often, but there are frames in equal resolution too, like NXGamer NXGamer said in his video.

Another point, i really expected imperceptible differences in VRS tier 2. There are minor differences, but it's there.

For me it's a XSX win, but very very close.
It's resolution vs IQ in this case, one has a slight edge in res at times, and the other has slightly better IQ, and they all perform great.
 
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elliot5

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I've noticed in a few shots the PS5 version looks slightly better and in others the Series X takes the lead.
Like this one, slightly softer image on PS5.
No one will notice without actively trying to find differences but yeah they are very close overall.


yeah I can hardly tell a diff flipping between these two pics. It's also DOOM so if you're standing still pixel peeping you're literally not playing the game lol who cares in the end.
 

Mr Moose

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yeah I can hardly tell a diff flipping between these two pics. It's also DOOM so if you're standing still pixel peeping you're literally not playing the game lol who cares in the end.
It runs so damn good on all versions, you're not missing out even on the Series S.
This is one of those games that runs so well it really doesn't matter who "wins".
 
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Looks like Tier 2 VRS is the real deal, it not only lets Series X run at the highest resolution but locks that framerate down as well with no perceptible loss in image quality during play, just like Gears 5 outstanding performance.
I wonder what sort of uplift we will get with Mesh Shaders and SFS as they seem to offer much bigger boosts to performance.
As far as Mesh Shaders, they're not really something we had any need to use because they essentially change the way that you run your geometry pipeline and we already have a very mature geometry pipeline. Maybe we can experiment with them, we're not ruling them out, but there weren't strictly speaking necessary for this project.

Source: https://wccftech.com/metro-exodus-e...are-much-more-powerful-than-we-first-thought/


Don't get me wrong, it's all nice features, but don't think it's silver bullets.
 
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DarkMage619

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As far as Mesh Shaders, they're not really something we had any need to use because they essentially change the way that you run your geometry pipeline and we already have a very mature geometry pipeline. Maybe we can experiment with them, we're not ruling them out, but there weren't strictly speaking necessary for this project.

Source: https://wccftech.com/metro-exodus-e...are-much-more-powerful-than-we-first-thought/


Don't get me wrong, it's all nice features, but don't think it's silver bullets.
They seem to be speaking specifically about their game which was already complete with its development before the XSX|S was available. It is totally untestable they won't rewrite their entire game to take advantage of a feature. In the future SFS would be a fantastic way to get additional performance on the XSX|S. I'm looking forward to seeing more games use it.
 
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They seem to be speaking specifically about their game which was already complete with its development before the XSX|S was available. It is totally untestable they won't rewrite their entire game to take advantage of a feature. In the future SFS would be a fantastic way to get additional performance on the XSX|S. I'm looking forward to seeing more games use it.
Out of the features available in DirectX 12 Ultimate, which one do you believe will be most useful in terms of performance? Do you plan to utilize them all in the next 4A Games project?

Currently, we use DXR 1.1 inline raytracing and VRS. I like sampler-feedback - I’ve asked hardware
vendors about this for years and it will be utilized for our future projects. Not sure if we’d go for
mesh shaders in the future as we are not that dependent on traditional vertex/primitive/raster
processing anymore on recent architectures.
Our current frames are only about 10% raster and
90% compute on PlayStation 5 and Xbox Series X. And raster pairs well with async compute.


Source: https://wccftech.com/4a-games-tech-...ue-for-rt-but-amds-approach-is-more-flexible/
 

Neo_game

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Out of the features available in DirectX 12 Ultimate, which one do you believe will be most useful in terms of performance? Do you plan to utilize them all in the next 4A Games project?

Currently, we use DXR 1.1 inline raytracing and VRS. I like sampler-feedback - I’ve asked hardware
vendors about this for years and it will be utilized for our future projects. Not sure if we’d go for
mesh shaders in the future as we are not that dependent on traditional vertex/primitive/raster
processing anymore on recent architectures.
Our current frames are only about 10% raster and
90% compute on PlayStation 5 and Xbox Series X. And raster pairs well with async compute.


Source: https://wccftech.com/4a-games-tech-...ue-for-rt-but-amds-approach-is-more-flexible/

Wow interesting. So 90% compute and only 10% raster means their engine was heavily suited for SX as it has 44% more CU than thePS5. Yet the difference was not big as you would expect. In DE as well on RT mode considering the lower bound res is only 14% is favor of SX. Surprisingly other mode it is more.

IMO the 18% compute performance and 25% BW advantage as this game is likely using less than 10gb or lower memory is simply not showing the performance you would expect. Not sure VRS on SX is worth it. Hitman3 has been the only exception so far this gen.
 

Renozokii

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XSX gets over 20% res over ps5 in counts shown

all while locked FPS too amazing tech

If you had to choose one XSX is the way to go for this game
Unless you sit even a few feet from your tv in which case you literally couldn’t tell and should buy it on the console you prefer lmao
 

DarkMage619

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Out of the features available in DirectX 12 Ultimate, which one do you believe will be most useful in terms of performance? Do you plan to utilize them all in the next 4A Games project?

Currently, we use DXR 1.1 inline raytracing and VRS. I like sampler-feedback - I’ve asked hardware
vendors about this for years and it will be utilized for our future projects. Not sure if we’d go for
mesh shaders in the future as we are not that dependent on traditional vertex/primitive/raster
processing anymore on recent architectures.
Our current frames are only about 10% raster and
90% compute on PlayStation 5 and Xbox Series X. And raster pairs well with async compute.


Source: https://wccftech.com/4a-games-tech-...ue-for-rt-but-amds-approach-is-more-flexible/
They absolutely won't be rewriting their code to take advantage of mesh shaders in Metro so my point there was right. They may or may not use it in the future. To my other point...
In the future SFS would be a fantastic way to get additional performance on the XSX|S. I'm looking forward to seeing more games use it.
"Currently, we use DXR 1.1 inline raytracing and VRS. I like sampler-feedback - I’ve asked hardware
vendors about this for years and it will be utilized for our future projects." :messenger_ok:
 
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Neo_game

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I guess these console are running close to the upper bound. Because looking at PC that is on par with RX 5700. These console should easily outperform this. SS seems to be 1060 range 🤷‍♂️
 
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They absolutely won't be rewriting their code to take advantage of mesh shaders in Metro so my point there was right. They may or may not use it in the future. To my other point...

No, your point is not right. It's not about Metro Exodus, it's about their methodology to manage shaders on their own engine. They mention about not sure if they really need to use Mesh Shaders in future.


And about SFS..

Sampler Feedback Streaming is a evolution of Partially Resident Textures, a 2012 technique. PS5 has an entire i/o system with HW cohency engines and dedicated HW buffer to stream data as fast as they can. I don't think SFS would be a real trouble for PS5 versions.
 
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Shmunter

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XSX sure has a softer look to it than PS5 despite having a ~20% advantage at times in pixel count.
Yes, amusing seeing people deny what’s right in front of them.

And there is even a technical explanation - vrs is producing 1/4 rez in parts of the image. That’s too big a reduction in detail to not be visible to the naked eye when deployed so prominently.

Instead of ticking the ‘features’ box, the game would have been better served with more aggressive drs on XsX instead of an unpredictable 75% drop in parts of the image.

Really, the engine needs reconstruction tech. It’s a suboptimal approach relying on native rez with rudimentary drs.

Now cue the lol reactions….
 

Fredrik

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I hope for more people to be like you.
We all get there, bad eyesight usually comes with age 😜

Seriously though, I’m not trying to completely dismiss these threads but when the differences are this small I think our time is better spent elsewhere, my real takeaway is that ID has shown their skills and optimized the game to perfection everywhere.
 

MrFunSocks

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There aren’t many devs that are technically better than id. Their engine is amazing. As a series X and gaming pc owner I can’t wait to see what they can do when they’re free from the xb1/ps4 garbage hardware. Unlucky for PS only gamers but hopefully some of them will put down their pitchforks at some stage and get a series S at least so they get to play their games.
 

Negotiator101

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Yes, amusing seeing people deny what’s right in front of them.

And there is even a technical explanation - vrs is producing 1/4 rez in parts of the image. That’s too big a reduction in detail to not be visible to the naked eye when deployed so prominently.

Instead of ticking the ‘features’ box, the game would have been better served with more aggressive drs on XsX instead of an unpredictable 75% drop in parts of the image.

Really, the engine needs reconstruction tech. It’s a suboptimal approach relying on native rez with rudimentary drs.

Now cue the lol reactions….
Like clockwork.
 

Riky

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As far as Mesh Shaders, they're not really something we had any need to use because they essentially change the way that you run your geometry pipeline and we already have a very mature geometry pipeline. Maybe we can experiment with them, we're not ruling them out, but there weren't strictly speaking necessary for this project.

Source: https://wccftech.com/metro-exodus-e...are-much-more-powerful-than-we-first-thought/


Don't get me wrong, it's all nice features, but don't think it's silver bullets.

That's a different game from a smaller studio with a last gen game, this is first party we're talking about now for future projects.
 

Md Ray

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Yes, amusing seeing people deny what’s right in front of them.

And there is even a technical explanation - vrs is producing 1/4 rez in parts of the image. That’s too big a reduction in detail to not be visible to the naked eye when deployed so prominently.

Instead of ticking the ‘features’ box, the game would have been better served with more aggressive drs on XsX instead of an unpredictable 75% drop in parts of the image.

Really, the engine needs reconstruction tech. It’s a suboptimal approach relying on native rez with rudimentary drs.

Now cue the lol reactions….
Yeah, it's quite apparent without requiring 400%, 800% zooms. Higher number of raw pixels are nice, but if lower pixel count can produce better quality image, sharper details then I'd take that over higher number of pixels that look soft. You know quality over quantity.

And the performance is just as stable as the XSX version too.
 
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Negotiator101

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Yeah, it's quite apparent without requiring 400%, 800% zooms. Higher number of raw pixels are nice, but if lower pixel count can produce better quality image, sharper details then I'd take that over higher number of pixels that look soft. You know quality over quantity.

And the performance is just as stable as the XSX version too.
They keep on coming.
 

Riky

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Yes, amusing seeing people deny what’s right in front of them.

And there is even a technical explanation - vrs is producing 1/4 rez in parts of the image. That’s too big a reduction in detail to not be visible to the naked eye when deployed so prominently.

Instead of ticking the ‘features’ box, the game would have been better served with more aggressive drs on XsX instead of an unpredictable 75% drop in parts of the image.

Really, the engine needs reconstruction tech. It’s a suboptimal approach relying on native rez with rudimentary drs.

Now cue the lol reactions….

A feature that's imperceptible during gameplay as shown by this game and Gears 5, you need a 400% zoom and a still image and you *might* be able to see a difference.
We will see what DF say but I think having a huge resolution advantage and even slightly superior framerates are better results.
 

Negotiator101

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A feature that's imperceptible during gameplay as shown by this game and Gears 5, you need a 400% zoom and a still image and you *might* be able to see a difference.
We will see what DF say but I think having a huge resolution advantage and even slightly superior framerates are better results.
I called this earlier in the thread, its just people scrambling for any kind of advantage after all the rubbish that was said in the other Doom thread. The facts speak for themselves and the numbers can't lie.
 
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Md Ray

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They keep on coming.
This is why I'm a big fan of DLSS 2.0. It produces even better image quality than native rendering that whenever I see this option, I enable it even though the base internal render resolution is technically lower than my output resolution. Quality over quantity is what matters.

PS5 has no VRS, but atm it is producing better IQ, while having identical perf-level. I'm sure the VRS implementation on the Xboxes will get better over time though.
 
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Really, the engine needs reconstruction tech. It’s a suboptimal approach relying on native rez with rudimentary drs.
I don't disagree with this if worded, "Consoles need reconstruction tech."

id Tech has reconstruction tech in DLSS, but it's Nvidia tech and consoles don't have anything like it. id Tech also has VRS that doesn't impact image quality to the extent of these still shots, but once again it's Nvidia tech. What's used here is like Nvidia's lowest VRS preset "Performance".

I don't think they're using it for the purpose of checking boxes or winning a DF face-off, I think they intend to use it as a standard feature in the future. Even in XSX Eternal it takes still shots and zoom to tell. However, what's needed is simply a better implementation(like Nvidia).
 
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Riky

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This is why I'm a big fan of DLSS 2.0. It produces even better image quality than native rendering that whenever I see this option, I enable it even though the base internal render resolution is technically lower than my output resolution. Quality over quantity is what matters.

PS5 has no VRS, but atm it is producing better IQ, while having identical perf-level. I'm sure the VRS implementation on the Xboxes will get better over time though.

That IGN video just said the image quality is practically identical. Softness is due to the TAA which is on all formats even on PC, nothing to do with VRS.
He talks about the resolution advantage on Series X can be seen on still screens and that you have to look for specific pixels on still screens for VRS as it is by name variable.
 
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Negotiator101

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This is why I'm a big fan of DLSS 2.0. It produces even better image quality than native rendering that whenever I see this option, I enable it even though the base internal render resolution is technically lower than my output resolution. Quality over quantity is what matters.

PS5 has no VRS, but atm it is producing better IQ, while having identical perf-level. I'm sure the VRS implementation on the Xboxes will get better over time though.
Just stop, I'm going to explain so even you can understand, both versions use DRS so how does that work? It scales in accordance to what's occurring on screen, correct?

In balanced mode both versions have the same resolution if DRS is not being used (not a very demanding scene). In this scenario the PS5 version will look sharper as its not using VRS, but when the action kicks in and the far more aggressive DRS is used on PS5 the Series X will look sharper. Once again the we have the fanboys loading in with rubbish gifs showing a marginal sharper image on PS5 when there's nothing happening on screen. This is a FPS with loads of action and that's when VRS comes into its own, the nonsense has to stop.
 

Shmunter

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A feature that's imperceptible during gameplay as shown by this game and Gears 5, you need a 400% zoom and a still image and you *might* be able to see a difference.
We will see what DF say but I think having a huge resolution advantage and even slightly superior framerates are better results.
Framerate I’ll take over pixel count, but here framerate doesn’t seem to be compromised.
 
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That's a different game from a smaller studio with a last gen game, this is first party we're talking about now for future projects.
4A games develops their own engine, with lot of state of art features.

It's totally different than many other studios who depends on third engines like Unreal or Unity.

Even your first-party approach, some of them depend on UE5 implementation.

Again, Mesh Shaders and SFS are useful, but don't believe in Silver Bullets.
 
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Riky

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4A games develops their own engine, with lot of state of art features.

It's totally different than many other studios who depends on third engines like Unreal or Unity.

Even your first-party approach, some of them depend on UE5 implementation.

Again, Mesh Shaders and SFS are useful, but don't believe in Silver Bullets.

I didn't "believe" in anything, my original post says "I wonder" what performance uptick we will see, as in it will be interesting to see the results when games use all three hardware accelerated performance features.
 
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DenchDeckard

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Facts are facts ! PS5 lower overall resolution (due to VRS) but better IQ (also due to VRS)
we are sat here arguing over consoles and pc is just like.....Yeah I'm crisp sexy beautiful texture time and running at 300 FPS....no biggie!

We are a funny bunch. :)
 

Mr Moose

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Just stop, I'm going to explain so even you can understand, both versions use DRS so how does that work? It scales in accordance to what's occurring on screen, correct?

In balanced mode both versions have the same resolution if DRS is not being used (not a very demanding scene). In this scenario the PS5 version will look sharper as its not using VRS, but when the action kicks in and the far more aggressive DRS is used on PS5 the Series X will look sharper. Once again the we have the fanboys loading in with rubbish gifs showing a marginal sharper image on PS5 when there's nothing happening on screen. This is a FPS with loads of action and that's when VRS comes into its own, the nonsense has to stop.
Damn, my GIF really hurt you, didn't it?
 

Md Ray

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I'd love to see someone point out VRS from a gameplay Video without taking stills.
You can clearly see chunky flickering pixels in the blue reflection on the floor.

GIF #1


If you want to see how PS5 compares...

GIF #2

Source: NX Gamer

EDIT: no 400% zooms either :messenger_winking:

You don't see a major res difference here between PS5 and XSX, perf is stable and identical on both. But that VRS artifact sticks out like a sore thumb. If I saw something like this on PC, I would immediately turn it off.
 
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I didn't "believe" in anything, my original post says "I wonder" what performance uptick we will see, as in it will be interesting to see the results when games use all three hardware accelerated performance features.
Like new geometry engine and their new culling geometry process.
 

DenchDeckard

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You can clearly see chunky flickering pixels in the blue reflection on the floor.

GIF #1


If you want to see how PS5 compares...

GIF #2

Source: NX Gamer

EDIT: no 400% zooms either :messenger_winking:

You don't see a major res difference here between PS5 and XSX, perf is stable and identical on both. But that VRS artifact sticks out like a sore thumb. If I saw something like this on PC, I would immediately turn it off.

The PS5 version also has a big blood splatter on the floor which is missing from the XBox version....blood gate...... :D

The ps5 version also has that strange artifacting but not as bad as the xbox.
 
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You can clearly see chunky flickering pixels in the blue reflection on the floor.

GIF #1

i tried using VRS on metro exodus and it made molotov/fire effects horrible even at 2x option

i was very hyped for this performance saving future, i thought it was a clever algorythm that reduced unnecessary workloads but so far most of its implementations are not satisfactory
 
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DenchDeckard

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i tried using VRS on metro exodus and it made molotov/fire effects horrible even at 2x option

i was very hyped for this performance saving future, i thought it was a clever algorythm that reduced unnecessary workloads but so far most of its implementations are not satisfactory

Hopefully it improves more over the generation, but maybe it will just have some artifacts similar to DRS and checkerboard which cant be avoided. Will be interesting to see if the performance increases are worth the trade off.
 

Md Ray

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i tried using VRS on metro exodus and it made molotov/fire effects horrible even at 2x option

i was very hyped for this performance saving future, i thought it was a clever algorythm that reduced unnecessary workloads but so far most of its implementations are not satisfactory
IIRC, it had VRS tier 1, but here it's actually tier 2 according to the reports and yet the artifacts here remind of tier 1.
 
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DenchDeckard

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I was talking about this. There's zero flickering or artifacting on PS5.

Hahaha! OMG yeah i see it now. the smallest square. I thought you were talking about the blu ramp thing having little black squares in it. It's more apparent on the xbox over the PS5. I can see the thing you are pointing out now, and I cant un see it. but yes great spot!
 
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