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[BlackTron]

People with these problems use amd. They choose the problems then selves.

That's like buying an xbox and complain about you can play god of war.

And yes, I don't try to download torrent stuff and watch xxxtranny porn on my pc so it never gets fucked up.

It's not called magic. It's called common sense. Yeah, I know it's so rare so it's categorised as a super power these days.

From experience, he's right. Intel/Nvidia/Windows has always treated me well with a very stable gaming platform. Any point I used AMD hardware, I had problems.

I guess their new CPUs are pretty good, though I haven't used a Ryzen yet. I get the feeling the CPU is fine but I still wouldn't want an AMD graphics card.

And yeah, stay away from warez or you can only blame yourself lol.

 

[Spukc]

Disagree. I'm not against weapon durability, but the way BOTW did it, weapons were SO unrealistically fragile, that it was immersion breaking.

It's jarring and unexpected when a wooden club or stick shatters after just a few swings. They went overboard with this.

Forces you to go after enemies for a new supply of weapons.

 

[dalekjay]

Make the game easier for me because I don’t actually like this inherit to gameplay characteristic of the game

 

[BlackTron]

Forces you to go after enemies for a new supply of weapons.

You could easily have a game where a stick doesn't break after 1-2 swings that still has weapon durability and encourages smart weapon management and motivates you to find new weapons. Zelda went from a game where you can use a dream fantasy weapon (Master Sword) to a game where you wish you could give Link a stick out of your own backyard instead. THAT is jarring and immersion-breaking, when a damn sword made of metal just shatters with such minimal use. As a quick fix I'd say double the durability of every weapon and it wouldn't seem so shockingly silly. The idea is okay, the execution is bad.

Going after enemies for weapons seems pointless anyway because the only purpose of those weapons is to fight more enemies, and you can usually just walk around them anyway. Usually the reward for taking on a fight, beyond more supplies to fight more enemies, is scant. But now we are getting into deeper problems in this game. Personally, I fought every enemy in the game at least once just for fun, which is as good a reason as any, but the game didn't really give you much of a reward or incentive to do it. This is highlighted by blood moons respawning everything and the lack of enemy variety.

Don't get me wrong, BOTW is a fine game, but it's only a tech demo/shell of an excellent Zelda title.

EDIT: This reminds me of my take on the controls in Twilight Princess when it came out. I found it a gimmick because the waggle was only emulating a button press, while being less precise. But ultimately, it didn't make a difference because the enemies in the game were such pushovers that the controls never mattered anyway. Same deal here, one flaw of the game being a moot point because of another flaw. By the same token, I thought the motion aiming was cool, but the aiming tasks in that game were so tame I thought it didn't make a difference if you played it on GCN instead.

 

[Spaceman292]

Turn based combat has still not been bested by any real-time RPG combat system.

Okay let's not get crazy here.

 

[The_Mike]

From experience, he's right. Intel/Nvidia/Windows has always treated me well with a very stable gaming platform. Any point I used AMD hardware, I had problems.

I guess their new CPUs are pretty good, though I haven't used a Ryzen yet. I get the feeling the CPU is fine but I still wouldn't want an AMD graphics card.

And yeah, stay away from warez or you can only blame yourself lol.

 

[brian0057]

You are taking things to extremes, and making your point wrong in the procrss. Of course, if a game is unpleasant to experience then that isn't good even if it has a good story. However, middling gameplay with great characters and story will elevate that game into something more, into something that will stay in people's minds.

Quoting Carmack, who was being an ass when he said it and was working on a simple fps, was you just being edgy.

I'm not taking it to the extreme.
People unironically called Mankind Divided a "shit game" just because the ending was sub par. Even though its gameplay and level design was superior to its already excellent predescessor.
This is why they iced the series and gave us that piece of crap Avengers.

Also, a game with middling gameplay and a great story is still a middling game. If all you care about is the story, then books, movies and TV do it thousands of times better.

If you can enjoy those types of games, more power to you. But that's not why I play videogames. This is also why I consider the MGS series one of the worst in gaming.

 

[supernova8]

weapons that break in breath of the wild it makes the game better you whiny little c*nts

Yeah I actually started off BOTW with looooads of complaints including this one and then gradually I came to appreciate it. I really enjoy the sense of desperation when you break your last weapons and you're like "SHIT, I bet drop a blue bomb, hope the fucker drops his weapon and take it!" or in some cases "SHIT I'm outta here".

We've all played that game where you get that one overpowered weapon and the rest of the game becomes a breeze.

 

[Azurro]

Also, a game with middling gameplay and a great story is still a middling game. If all you care about is the story, then books, movies and TV do it thousands of times better.

If you can enjoy those types of games, more power to you. But that's not why I play videogames. This is also why I consider the MGS series one of the worst in gaming.

You are making statements that only apply to you and then applying them to everyone. Plenty of games with middling gameplay have been incredibly popular, like The Walking Dead.

And you don't like MGS, you have some really shit taste my friend.

 

[DelireMan7]

Disagree. I'm not against weapon durability, but the way BOTW did it, weapons were SO unrealistically fragile, that it was immersion breaking.

I am not here to discuss the weapon durability in BOTW (fine for me but see the point of those who don't like it) but I just find your choice of word funny.
Some stuff are kind of "realist" but it's still a fantasy videogame so there is a ton of "unrealistic" stuff(Carry dozens of weapons/gear but are invisible if not equipped, can climb everything just like that, etc...)

Again I don't want to start a fight, just your choice of word made me smile ^^

 

[brian0057]

You are making statements that only apply to you and then applying them to everyone. Plenty of games with middling gameplay have been incredibly popular, like The Walking Dead.

And you don't like MGS, you have some really shit taste my friend.

If you're talking about Telltale's TWD, those are basically point-and-click games. There's nothing wrong with those. Unless you consider those types of games middling.

Also, you're right. Not all of us have the refined taste to enjoy Kojima's drivel. His games aren't even overrated, they just suck.

 

[BlackTron]

I am not here to discuss the weapon durability in BOTW (fine for me but see the point of those who don't like it) but I just find your choice of word funny.
Some stuff are kind of "realist" but it's still a fantasy videogame so there is a ton of "unrealistic" stuff(Carry dozens of weapons/gear but are invisible if not equipped, can climb everything just like that, etc...)

Again I don't want to start a fight, just your choice of word made me smile ^^

No need to discuss this further, but I wanted to flesh out my thoughts on this as indeed I thought "unrealistic" was a funny word too as I typed it. This is why I used it anyway -consider many elements that seem to add immersion to this game, are "realistic" aspects, like the weather, time, physics, no invisible walls, and how that all adds up to something we see as "better".

A lot of fantasy does its thing by adding fantasy aspects to the real world, like magic, without trying to undermine our existing experience. Like, imagine if the lightning was in the game but wasn't attracted to metal, it was attracted to wood. Or if the wooden shield in OoT melted from water, not fire. We expect some basics of physics to apply, and when they don't, it's naturally jarring. Despite having fairies and giant mechs, Zelda still has gravity as we know it. Changing such aspects are immersion-breaking reminders that you're just playing a game. When a metal sword shatters in a few swings, it's one of those moments. The rest of the game world was made more realistic with physics weather and such, while this seemed less so, a strange contrast.

 

[DelireMan7]

No need to discuss this further, but I wanted to flesh out my thoughts on this as indeed I thought "unrealistic" was a funny word too as I typed it. This is why I used it anyway -consider many elements that seem to add immersion to this game, are "realistic" aspects, like the weather, time, physics, no invisible walls, and how that all adds up to something we see as "better".

A lot of fantasy does its thing by adding fantasy aspects to the real world, like magic, without trying to undermine our existing experience. Like, imagine if the lightning was in the game but wasn't attracted to metal, it was attracted to wood. Or if the wooden shield in OoT melted from water, not fire. We expect some basics of physics to apply, and when they don't, it's naturally jarring. Despite having fairies and giant mechs, Zelda still has gravity as we know it. Changing such aspects are immersion-breaking reminders that you're just playing a game. When a metal sword shatters in a few swings, it's one of those moments. The rest of the game world was made more realistic with physics weather and such, while this seemed less so, a strange contrast.

I totally understand and agree with you actually. I see why you used "unrealistic" and it makes sense for me. It was just funny to read.
Just it puzzled me a bit that this is immersion breaking for you but not the infinite inventory for example. But it's not a big deal ^^ I understand how the weapon durability can be immersion breaking and not other "logical and unrealistic" stuff (like the infinite inventory)

 

[StormCell]

People like games for many different reasons, one of them is stories. Carmack was way of the mark here, games have advanced so much from the simplistic days of Doom to the point that stories and characters are actually just as important as the gameplay.

Carmack was making the engine for a game where you put a gun to a 2D sprite in first person and it went boom. Of course he wasn't going to think it was important for that game.

I kinda agree with Carmack, however, in the sense that story should only ever be secondary to the experience. If a game isn't fun to play, then the story isn't going to matter much.

And I sure wouldn't mind it if a great story with endearing characters was also packed with several 20 minute sex scenes.

 

[BlackTron]

I totally understand and agree with you actually. I see why you used "unrealistic" and it makes sense for me. It was just funny to read.
Just it puzzled me a bit that this is immersion breaking for you but not the infinite inventory for example. But it's not a big deal ^^ I understand how the weapon durability can be immersion breaking and not other "logical and unrealistic" stuff (like the infinite inventory)

Haha thanks, my post was pretty much trying to point out the answer to your question TBH. Thus my example if, for example, lightning was attracted to wood. I don't think anyone would say "why be surprised at that, if you can hold infinite items"? It's like a piece of paper being as strong as steel -apples and oranges. It challenges a different set of our expectations and sensibilities. Last I checked Zelda has iron boots, not paper boots. For a reason.

 

[asc8]

handholding with intrusive UI/map systems can really ruin a game for me. I wouldn't appreciate the exploration in dark souls for example if I had a map with blinking icons. It depends on the game but dumping icons just seems lazy.

 

[TheMasterSwordMaster]

Disagree. I'm not against weapon durability, but the way BOTW did it, weapons were SO unrealistically fragile, that it was immersion breaking.

It's jarring and unexpected when a wooden club or stick shatters after just a few swings. They went overboard with this.

you expect to be able to swing a literal stick at a monster of pure muscle and it not break? bruh

 

[TheMasterSwordMaster]

"It's a walking sim" has to be one of my pet peeve statements. Sometimes I just want to have a more chill experience where I'm immersed in an environment

walking sim isnt really an insult or complaint, just a style of game like any other.

 

[dave_d]

An oldie but the complaint about throws in Street Fighter 2. Oh people complained up and down including EGM that throws should be banned from future versions of Street Fighter. It was a stupid complaint since with out throws there's no way to hurt anybody if they get a lead and decide to turtle.

 

[engstra]

walking sim isnt really an insult or complaint, just a style of game like any other.

Agreed, but people tend to use it to describe a game negatively

 

[EverydayBeast]

3 lane maps in COD it’s a weird complaint, every COD4 maps have great memories, so many different lanes how do 3 lane maps suck?

 

[soulbait]

Complaints about your PS4 controller not working on the PS5. I do not recall at any time where the old controller for the old gen console worked for the new gen console. Your PS2 controller did not work on PS3. Your PS3 controller did not work on PS4. Your Xbox 360 controller will not work on Xbox One. Why is this a big deal now?

2 reasons why it seems to be a bigger deal to people right now:

1) Their direct competitor is allowing previous gen controllers and all peripherals to work on the new console. So it brings up, "if they can do it, why can't them?"

2) You can use the PS4 controllers on a PS5, but only when playing a PS4 game. This is the one that is odd to me, because the controller can connect to the console, but is disabled on a PS5 game. Just seems werid.

It is not a big deal to me, but I can see it being a larger deal to those with kids who want to play the console together. Buying extra stuff is expensive.

 

[ProgenitorCastle]

The complaints about chromatic aberration seemed overblown to me. I think it was a graphical trend for a while but didn't get why it in particular got so much hate. I can see it being annoying if there's no option to turn it off but tbh I barely if at all notice it in games

 

[Nico_D]

30/60

 

[apotema]

Degrading weapons

 

[Bakkus]

"breaks muh immersion". Do you play games and then go like "is this the real life?" while playing it?

You don't for example find an airplane flying in the sky in a midevial setting immersion breaking?

 

[Bakkus]

>"Game is good, but too long"

A good game cannot be too long. If you truly enjoy something, you don't want it to be over.

Have you never heard of 'overstaying it's welcome'?

 

[Barnabot]

You don't for example find an airplane flying in the sky in a midevial setting immersion breaking?

No




I also play real life based fighter jets shooting either lasers beams and rail cannon whenever I want to in a fictional world in a videogame.

And Ninjas. In Space.


Next.

 

[Bakkus]

No




I also play real life based fighter jets shooting either lasers beams and rail cannon whenever I want to in a fictional world in a videogame.

And Ninjas. In Space.


Next.

I'm pretty sure this type of complaint is never adressed to games as lighthearted in tone as your types of examples...

 

[diffusionx]

I still don't understand the anti-PC sentiment on this forum. This is a forum for enthusiasts and the PC is the platform for enthusiasts. You can do whatever you want on it, spend what you want, put it where you want (comfy couch), use the control you want, run the games how you want. It's especially strange when people complain about this or that game not being 60fps on console, when a platform exists that allows you to play 60fps in every game (when it comes out, looking at you CTR).

I know that not everyone wants to or can afford to build and maintain a PC, and that's fine (I play a lot on console, especially PS4 myself), but there's a reason why every successive console generation since Xbox has become more PC-like.

 

[Fbh]

I guess this notion in some core gamers that any form of DLC or microtransaction is bad and pure evil.
There's this weird thing were some people like to pretend games in the "good old days" had infinite content

Cosmetic DLCs.

I was kinda on this camp until Spider Man Ps4 reminded me how fun it is having a ton of cool cosmetic options to unlock through gameplay, specially in single player games.
I still think reactions to it are exaggerated and I IMO they are fine in multiplayer games that continuously add new content for free. But I also don't agree with the statement that they "don't affect the experience in any way because they don't change the gameplay".

 

[Zog]

I guess this notion in some core gamers that any form of DLC or microtransaction is bad and pure evil.
There's this weird thing were some people like to pretend games in the "good old days" had infinite content

That's a strawman, I have never heard anyone claim that before DLC games had infinite content.

 

[theclaw135]

I still don't understand the anti-PC sentiment on this forum. This is a forum for enthusiasts and the PC is the platform for enthusiasts. You can do whatever you want on it, spend what you want, put it where you want (comfy couch), use the control you want, run the games how you want. It's especially strange when people complain about this or that game not being 60fps on console, when a platform exists that allows you to play 60fps in every game (when it comes out, looking at you CTR).

I know that not everyone wants to or can afford to build and maintain a PC, and that's fine (I play a lot on console, especially PS4 myself), but there's a reason why every successive console generation since Xbox has become more PC-like.

The wasted potential is immense. Practically nobody anymore makes games steadfast in devotion to PC enthusiasts. Console ports with better graphics are an insult.

 

[Barnabot]

I'm pretty sure this type of complaint is never adressed to games as lighthearted in tone as your types of examples...

But let's define what's immersion according to you in the first place and then which games are the prime example of that said immersion in your opinion.

 

[Plague Doctor]

1. Volume complaints of a hardware fan/etc. It's always overblown and I am generally listening to music or podcasts or talking to friends. But I suppose if you are the easily irritable type and play must games in complete silence with the volume down... sure.

2. Difficulty complaints. Either play the game as it is... or don't. Don't advocate for strong arming developers to make a game they don't want to make. I can't deal with super meat boy's difficulty after playing it a couple times, so.... I don't play it. Happy for the people who love it. The game is not for me and that is okay. I will not start a crusade so they change the gameplay to bend to my skill or image of how the game could be played. Be a well rounded adult and move on. Accept you won't find this game fun on the developer's terms.

 

[Azurro]

I kinda agree with Carmack, however, in the sense that story should only ever be secondary to the experience. If a game isn't fun to play, then the story isn't going to matter much.

And I sure wouldn't mind it if a great story with endearing characters was also packed with several 20 minute sex scenes.

That motion capture session would definitely be very fun.

 

[engstra]

Oh another that hasn't been brought up yet is loading times. It's something that has never really bothered me, so all the chat about how much faster loading times will be for next gen hasn't really connected with me.

 

[Fbh]

That's a strawman, I have never heard anyone claim that before DLC games had infinite content.

They never straight up say "games had infinite content". They'll just act like it.
Every time there's DLC you get complains of "cut content" and "remember when you got the whole game at launch?". No matter how much content there is in the core game or how much content is added through DLC, there's always people acting as if in the "good ol' days" it would have all been included day 1 at no additional charge.

Same with multiplayer games. If a paid multiplayer game has map packs or a season pass it's bad, but if it has free content updates supported through cosmetic microtransactions it's also bad. Games need to be supported for years with consistent high quality free content while having no further monetization because apparently that's how every game was in the "good ol' days".

 

[Ellery]

Oh another that hasn't been brought up yet is loading times. It's something that has never really bothered me, so all the chat about how much faster loading times will be for next gen hasn't really connected with me.

I mean I agree that it is not the end of the world for me, but people genuinely value their time so it seems like a pure win for everyone.

 

[BlackTron]

you expect to be able to swing a literal stick at a monster of pure muscle and it not break? bruh

I'm pretty sure a tree is harder than a "monster of pure muscle", and way more firmly anchored to the ground too. Find a stick that you'd actually use to swing at someone, and swing it at a tree a few times. Let me know how many times you need to do this before it breaks

Deku stick in OOT didn't last forever either, but at least it didn't turn to dust in your hands like in BOTW. It made more sense.

 

[TheMasterSwordMaster]

I'm pretty sure a tree is harder than a "monster of pure muscle", and way more firmly anchored to the ground too. Find a stick that you'd actually use to swing at someone, and swing it at a tree a few times. Let me know how many times you need to do this before it breaks

Deku stick in OOT didn't last forever either, but at least it didn't turn to dust in your hands like in BOTW. It made more sense.

ok im confused are you talking about this:

or this

 

[JLB]

Uff, the original Xbox One interface. "Its too hard, too complex!!!" JFC, my 4yo kid used it without problems.

 

[Guilty_AI]

The wasted potential is immense. Practically nobody anymore makes games steadfast in devotion to PC enthusiasts.

Now thats a fucking lie. There is Flight simulator 2020, Bannerlord 2, Baldur's Gate 3 yesterday, Starbase, Planet Zoo... All very PC-centric titles. And we could go on and on about smaller games like Factorio, Satisfactory, Stormworks, Noita, Disco Elysium, Rimworld... Multiplayer with titles like Hell let loose, Post Scriptum, GTFO.... VR games with Half Life Alyx and Boneworks.

Just because you don't follow them doesn't mean they don't exist

 

[theclaw135]

OK, how many of those have steep minimum requirements worthy of a PC?

 

[Zog]

They never straight up say "games had infinite content". They'll just act like it.
Every time there's DLC you get complains of "cut content" and "remember when you got the whole game at launch?". No matter how much content there is in the core game or how much content is added through DLC, there's always people acting as if in the "good ol' days" it would have all been included day 1 at no additional charge.

Same with multiplayer games. If a paid multiplayer game has map packs or a season pass it's bad, but if it has free content updates supported through cosmetic microtransactions it's also bad. Games need to be supported for years with consistent high quality free content while having no further monetization because apparently that's how every game was in the "good ol' days".

No one ‘acts like’ pre-DLC games had infinite content.

Truthfully though, you have no idea if a DLC has been cut to sell later. Maybe the idea was just shelved to sell later. For sure you can’t say that has never happened so the complaint seems valid to me.

 

[Woggleman]

People complaining about realism. Many people said RDR2 put realism before fun but to me the realism was part of the fun. I liked the cowboy sim aspects of the game. The controls complaints had some merit but not the sim ones at least to me.

 

[Guilty_AI]

OK, how many of those have steep minimum requirements worthy of a PC?

First, if you intend to follow the conversation you should reply, otherwise i might miss your comment.
Second to answer your question:

FS2020: Don't even need to say
Starbase: Heavy CPU and GPU requirements
Half Life Alyx: Can run on a mild GPU, however its really important to have a powerful rig in order to run it without getting you sick
Bannerlord 2: Heavy CPU requirements
Stormworks: Mild CPU requirements, heavy depend on the size-complexity of your vehicles
Factorio&Satisfactory: Similar to the above, the bigger your factory, the better of a CPU you might need to grant proper performance

Also, taking advantage of the platform doesn't mean just power. Games developed with M&K in mind, genres that are historically successful on PC, strong multiplayer titles, game with heavy community aspect, etc. You also need to take into consideration all of that.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Yeah, when a game doesn't work on PC cuz reasons, going into the .ini files and changing shit around in there and troubleshooting up the ass is total common sense.

I bet my grandma could be a PC gamer, it's so easy.

i can't even remember the last game that didn't work and for the games that have problems, at least there are solutions or were officially fixed. Meanwile tons of games on consoles still runs like crap (like 20fps Ocarine of Time or Just Cause 3 or 10fps SotC or even all the games forever locked to 30fps) and there is nothing we can do about them.

 

[Bakkus]

But let's define what's immersion according to you in the first place and then which games are the prime example of that said immersion in your opinion.

Immersion is when a game sets a consistent tone throughout the entire duration of the game. This game have to of course be fairly serious in tone otherwise immersion doesn't really matter. It's about being able to suspend your disbelief and the game avoiding jumping the shark.

 

[cartman414]

You are taking things to extremes, and making your point wrong in the procrss. Of course, if a game is unpleasant to experience then that isn't good even if it has a good story. However, middling gameplay with great characters and story will elevate that game into something more, into something that will stay in people's minds.

Quoting Carmack, who was being an ass when he said it and was working on a simple fps, was you just being edgy.

Anyone who values those games over games with forgettable to games with no characters/storyline that don't screw around with the gameplay doesn't value them as games proper.

I guess this notion in some core gamers that any form of DLC or microtransaction is bad and pure evil.
There's this weird thing were some people like to pretend games in the "good old days" had infinite content




I was kinda on this camp until Spider Man Ps4 reminded me how fun it is having a ton of cool cosmetic options to unlock through gameplay, specially in single player games.
I still think reactions to it are exaggerated and I IMO they are fine in multiplayer games that continuously add new content for free. But I also don't agree with the statement that they "don't affect the experience in any way because they don't change the gameplay".

Cosmetics are one thing.

God tier weapons/characters exclusively behind paywalls (especially gacha), instead of unlocks, are scummy.