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WaPo:Trump suggests Republicans will let ACA market collapse, then rewrite health law

MechDX

Member
Feb 22, 2007
46,899
0
0
Here, I'll isolate the relevant bits.



This argument is sourced.

We need to start killing poor people ASAP (or at least push legislation that makes them more likely to die), otherwise more will die in the future. Like deer, or some other nonhuman animal.

It sounds pretty unempathetic, but we need to face reality. Trump and the Republicans are misunderstood. They are trying to save humanity. Like hunters when they cull deer populations so that they don't overbreed and starve the whole species out.

So when will the first annual Hunger Games commence?
 

L Thammy

Member
Nov 4, 2012
15,041
2
0
This is like when the the teacher tears up your homework and then berates you for not handing it in.
 

JettDash

Junior Member
Feb 27, 2017
2,227
0
0
Republicans are trying to save humanity by taking healthcare from tens of millions? Yeah, sure, has nothing to do with securing tax cuts for rich people.
 

HotHamBoy

Member
Jul 21, 2015
10,086
12
0
They hid the fucking bill until the last second! They kept hearings and amendments to the absolute minimum and even talked about calling for a vote before the CBO could provide a score!

Fake news, I know.

America's in serious trouble. Even if Trump isn't around, the way conservatives routinely ignore basic facts is an existential threat..

Yup. Literally every thing I tell my dad is immediately dismissed due to my sources and worldview . Any source that isn't his is liberal propaganda/fake news.

Trump and the GOP have already done incredible, long-lasting damage with "alternative facts."
 

Clefargle

Member
Dec 3, 2012
8,938
6
640
Huntsville, AL / The Netherlands
Here, I'll isolate the relevant bits.



This argument is sourced.

We need to start killing poor people ASAP (or at least push legislation that makes them more likely to die), otherwise more will die in the future. Like deer, or some other nonhuman animal.

It sounds pretty unempathetic, but we need to face reality. Trump and the Republicans are misunderstood. They are trying to save humanity. Like hunters when they cull deer populations so that they don't overbreed and starve the whole species out.

Any solution for healthcare that starts with "we need to start killing people" is not a solution. This argument is unethical and also not true. The rising costs can be mitigated in other ways, single payer says hello. You're literally saying "we need to treat humans inhumanely now to maximize humane treatment of humans in the future" it makes no goddamn sense. You sound like a fucking rampant AI.
 

HStallion

Now what's the next step in your master plan?
Nov 23, 2015
31,114
139
475
New Jersey
Here, I'll isolate the relevant bits.



This argument is sourced.

We need to start killing poor people ASAP (or at least push legislation that makes them more likely to die), otherwise more will die in the future. Like deer, or some other nonhuman animal.

It sounds pretty unempathetic, but we need to face reality. Trump and the Republicans are misunderstood. They are trying to save humanity. Like hunters when they cull deer populations so that they don't overbreed and starve the whole species out.

What the fuck is this? Nothing about sounding unempathetic, that IS unempathetic. What a shitty thing to say, you should be fucking ashamed of yourself.
 

CornBurrito

Member
Dec 1, 2009
29,551
0
845
Any solution for healthcare that starts with "we need to start killing people" is not a solution. This argument is unethical and also not true. The rising costs can be mitigated in other ways, single payer says hello. You're literally saying "we need to treat humans inhumanely now to maximize humane treatment of humans in the future" it makes no goddamn sense. You sound like a fucking rampant AI.

See, I thought single payer was the solution too. But that argument has been thoroughly defeated.

Because there's no clear way to transition the US to a single-payer system in a way that wouldn't cause mass rebellion once people see what it entails:

http://www.newsweek.com/quora-question-why-single-payer-healthcare-wont-work-611168

There WOULD be restrictions in terms of people's options and (in some cases) quality of care (ask anyone who is on Medicaid what it looks like). For example, Medicare forces prices lower by simply capping what it will pay for certain services, which turns Medicare into a money loser for many practices who have a choice to A) simply stop accepting patients who use it or B) make up the shortfall by charging other patients more. If you go to a system where everyone is paying Medicare rates, hospitals start closing.

It's not simple - anyone who tells you it's simple is lying. Medical costs in the USA are skyrocketing and it's not because evil billionaires are stealing all of the money; it's due to dozens of different factors that no one is quite sure how to solve. For example: we are already facing a potentially catastrophic doctor shortage. If we go to a government system that caps doctor salaries, do you think that problem gets better, or worse?
 

watershed

Banned
Mar 12, 2011
19,593
0
0
If this was such a brilliant, sure to succeed plan it would have been plan A and not plan it's-our-only-option-left-because-we-can't-pass-anything. Republicans can't govern and Trump doesn't know how to do his job. There is no brilliance here.
 

Euphoria14

Member
Apr 21, 2010
1,839
0
750
Long Island, New York
What I don't get is, how do we reduce the defecit when whatever we save by cutting these programs is just turned into tax cuts for the wealthiest of Americans?

None of it seems to be going back into the system to pay off the debt.

Unless I'm missing something here. Do they think the tax savings are going to magically end up in everyone's paycheck and they will spend it, rather than the rich just hoarding it as they usually do?
 

mjp2417

Banned
Jan 12, 2012
3,102
9
570
What I don't get is, how do we reduce the defecit when whatever we save by cutting these programs is just turned into tax cuts for the wealthiest of Americans?

None of it seems to be going back into the system to pay off the debt.

Unless I'm missing something here. Do they think the tax savings are going to magically end up in everyone's paycheck and they will spend it, rather than the rich just hoarding it as they usually do?

The GOP doesn't care about the deficit or debt. The GOP has never cared about the deficit or debt.
 

reelbigtink

Member
Feb 6, 2012
2,518
0
0
Well.

My boss was right. :(

Republicans won't care what the consequences are and who gets the blame. They'll handwave away their terrible replacement ideas and blame Obama. The base will buy it 100%.
 

Gallbaro

Banned
May 13, 2008
9,232
2
0
Unfortunately much of the drivers of costs in the health Care system are the reasons Republicans list (at least 2 presidents ago). Doctors do make too much money, pharma does charge too much, malpractice does award too much, insurance should go across state lines.

But Democrats do not like going after costs, especially in those groups. See Obamacare's failures.

But healthcare does need to be regulated at the federal level and it should not be linked to employment (remove the damn tax break), insurance needs to be hugely simplified through that regulation and wealth should be redistributed to help the poor.

But sane republicans do not like expanding the federal government, which is required in a health Care marketplace where people can traverse state lines.

Now the insane turd monkeys we have now, all populist gas but stock in neutral (thank God), solution is to lunch poor brown people.

The easiest transition for the country would be the Dutch system. Everyone had to buy a single plan (gold equivalent) from a choice of insurance companies. You can buy whatever supplemental you want after that.
 

Kremzeek

Member
Jan 8, 2016
1,336
1
0
this is egregiously, horrifically, negligently irresponsible to recommend a collapse of the health insurance market just because F-U.


must be nice to work in government and have A+++ insurance for yourself. the best.
 
Aug 27, 2007
32,888
0
0
Well.

My boss was right. :(

Republicans won't care what the consequences are and who gets the blame. They'll handwave away their terrible replacement ideas and blame Obama. The base will buy it 100%.

They do care about the consequences, they are just misguided in the idea that the American people will blame Democrats and not them.

If Republicans didn't actually care about consequences then they would have repealed ACA by now and been done with this whole ordeal. They don't actually want to reform healthcare. They don't know how to and they don't have any interest in helping people get better health services for less money.

The AHCA is merely a means to an end for cutting Medicaid and other benefits in order to pay for tax cuts. If they weren't afraid of the fallout from their base, they'd be perfectly happy letting the healthcare and health insurance industries collapse back towards the clusterfuck they existed in before the ACA.
 
Nov 23, 2010
4,618
506
950
Here, I'll isolate the relevant bits.

This argument is sourced.

We need to start killing poor people ASAP (or at least push legislation that makes them more likely to die), otherwise more will die in the future. Like deer, or some other nonhuman animal.

It sounds pretty unempathetic, but we need to face reality. Trump and the Republicans are misunderstood. They are trying to save humanity. Like hunters when they cull deer populations so that they don't overbreed and starve the whole species out.

When Mr. Wong implies that the US being $18 trillion in debt is bad (now 19.8 T) and talks about collapsing like Greece, then a light bulb should've went off in your head that you're being fooled. The US has ran a net deficit since its first fiscal year and has leveraged debt as a tool for centuries with great success. It's a big reason why the US is one of the richest and most powerful countries on Earth. Mr. Wong should be thankful as opposed to fear-mongering.

In addition, health care costs skyrocketing will accordingly (if that occurs) elevate inflation as well as GDP. The problem isn't financial as Mr. Wong suggests, but rather that of an absurd burden. One sector will swamp output more than it does anywhere else in the world. In other words, Americans are getting fleeced as they pay more for less. It's very sad.
 
Apr 6, 2016
1,491
2
0
No, people will probably believe that it's the Democrats fault because they didn't want to work with the GOP to fix Obamacare to the point that they (democrats) would rather watch it burn than let the GOP fix it.

Even if that makes no sense since the GOP could fix it if they wanted and don't even need the Democrats help. Control of all branches of government is something that Republicans doesn't want to understand.

They believe what they want to believe.

CNN and the conservative anchors on MSNBC are already planning on running this. Both sides. Why can't democrats play nice?
 

Regulus Tera

Romanes Eunt Domus
Mar 2, 2008
50,646
1
0
twitter.com
Here, I'll isolate the relevant bits.



This argument is sourced.

We need to start killing poor people ASAP (or at least push legislation that makes them more likely to die), otherwise more will die in the future. Like deer, or some other nonhuman animal.

It sounds pretty unempathetic, but we need to face reality. Trump and the Republicans are misunderstood. They are trying to save humanity. Like hunters when they cull deer populations so that they don't overbreed and starve the whole species out.
You know what would be a good way to tackle the rising debt? Funnel some money from defence into it.
 

Loxley

Member
Jul 11, 2008
20,711
1
0
Some of ya'll are acting like Republicans have never paid for fucking things up. The Dems had two wave elections in a row in 2006 and 2008 thanks largely to the Iraq War, Bush Jr's bungling of Katrina, and the recession. If they fuck up healthcare, they'll pay for it. You can moan all you want how they'll blame Dems for it (which they absolutely will), but history has shown that when shit goes south, ultimately it's the party in charge that gets blamed and suffers for it.
 

Wet Bloodfart

Banned
May 13, 2016
693
0
0
Nashville, TN
Here, I'll isolate the relevant bits.



This argument is sourced.

We need to start killing poor people ASAP (or at least push legislation that makes them more likely to die), otherwise more will die in the future. Like deer, or some other nonhuman animal.

It sounds pretty unempathetic, but we need to face reality. Trump and the Republicans are misunderstood. They are trying to save humanity. Like hunters when they cull deer populations so that they don't overbreed and starve the whole species out.

You should be ashamed of yourself.
 

rjinaz

Member
Feb 7, 2012
17,934
2
700
38
Schattenjäger;243856690 said:
From a strategic standpoint this makes more sense than repealing without a plan

hmm ok sure. That's about the best thing you can say about this frankly callous plan. This President is becoming an enemy of his own people. Let them die just to spite Democrats.

Anyway, CornBurrito is not being serious I'm quite sure. He is channeling Wong though that posts this kind of crazy talk right here on GAF.
 

GoldenEye 007

Member
Jul 28, 2006
23,805
0
0
The Big D
Some of ya'll are acting like Republicans have never paid for fucking things up. The Dems had two wave elections in a row in 2006 and 2008 thanks largely to the Iraq War, Bush Jr's bungling of Katrina, and the recession. If they fuck up healthcare, they'll pay for it. You can moan all you want how they'll blame Dems for it (which they absolutely will), but history has shown that when shit goes south, ultimately it's the party in charge that gets blamed and suffers for it.

Yeah people keep focusing on what batshit insane Republicans think (who refuse to have any level of reasoning), instead of independents and others.
 
May 15, 2013
11,351
0
0
GOP is being very foolish if they think blaming Democrats once people start dying is going to do them any favors. 2018 is just around the corner and they decided to keep fucking that chicken instead of conceding that bipartisanship is the only way forward for them.
 

D4Danger

Unconfirmed Member
Dec 5, 2008
25,317
0
0
Consider this everyone. If we don't cut spending on healthcare now, many more will die in the future. Humans are like deer. We need to kill some now to save more later.

I assume you're not including yourself in the cull because you're so special humanity just wouldn't be the same without you.
 

CornBurrito

Member
Dec 1, 2009
29,551
0
845
That dude has got to be trolling.

I do not believe the person who made the original argument was trolling. Why do you assume David H Wong was trolling with his post?

So, you're actually advocating for people who make lesser income to die off in order for the greater good to thrive?

I'm really not understanding why I'm getting such heat, but nobody got mad when the original argument was made not even a month ago.
 

HStallion

Now what's the next step in your master plan?
Nov 23, 2015
31,114
139
475
New Jersey
I do not believe the person who made the original argument was trolling. Why do you assume David H Wong was trolling with his post?

Because David H Wong isn't absolute and a lot of people disagree with him all the time when he posts on this board. You posting "facts" as a justification for euthanasia of the poor doesn't make you sound any less shitty.
 

rjinaz

Member
Feb 7, 2012
17,934
2
700
38
I thought it was obvious when he kept bringing up how the article is sourced, it's some random practicing psychiatrist's blog. He's trolling. That said, it seems to have just derailed a very serious and important topic.

Also, if he is being somewhat serious, people tend to ignore much of what Wong posts because it tends to be walls of Republican rhetoric.