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'We believe in generations:' PlayStation argues cross-gen games risk stifling innovation

GetemMa

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Microsoft is putting out the heavier hitters on launch day so cross gen just makes more sense considering the investment behind Halo. They want that large install base.

I doubt this would stifle in innovation moving forward as games that are releasing this year would have been in development probably before next gen dev kits even went out. I don't see how one game being cross gen affects one that never was going to be. It makes no sense.

Sony loves saying shit like this because it's a good excuse to launch without a big AAA title. They don't want to make that investment with a small install base so we get a budget release Spiderman spin off and then probably a pretty long wait like how the PS4 launched with a mediocre Killzone game and then it was another 4.5 months for a mediocre Infamous game.

I'm not going to say "Yeah Sony is really looking out for their customers" when the reality is their software strategy is just protecting them financially and it's giving their early adopters not a lot to look forward to in that first 6-9 months of the consoles life.
 

NT80

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Horizon 2 probably will when it comes out a long with Playgrounds new Fable. That's a comparisons i can't wait to see. Both studios highly talented making similar open world rpgs

I disagree from a graphical perspective and from an impact perspective. Both will be old games by the time Halo Infinite launches. Halo Infinite has been in development with the XSX specs in mind for a long time.

And you're kind of changing the goal post now. Its not MS PR. Its simply being more consumer friendly and it disproves what sony has been stating. Most, if not all the games shown at the sony event could have been mistaken for cross gen, or at the least, downscaled to run on PS4
How many of those games are actually confirmed to be PS5 exclusives?
 
Mar 27, 2020
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Well that's much more innovative than a remaster indeed.
Well they are going to remake the assets and optimize it for the PS5. Could also mean that they could add additional content as well.

Definitely not a simple upscale to 4K.



This is also Bluepoint that's making this and they are specialized in remakes and remasters. Also this was a game that many were asking so I'm sure it's not a bad thing that it's coming.
 
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SlimySnake

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This "We believe in Generations" talk from Sony would hold a lot more weight if the games releasing on PS5 this Holiday didn't just look like higher resolution PS4 games. Hell, the most anticipated upcoming PS5 title is Spiderman: Miles Morales which by all intents and purposes is a glorified expansion that will be approximately 1/3 the content of the first game. Look at the screenshots of the game and tell me it can't be done on PS4.

PS5:

PS4 PRO:
higher resolution PS4 game? Lol. You do realize that Miles' entire character model is brand new with skin shaders way ahead of what we had on the PS4? I mean it's all right here.

 
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Microsoft is putting out the heavier hitters on launch day so cross gen just makes more sense considering the investment behind Halo. They want that large install base.

I doubt this would stifle in innovation moving forward as games that are releasing this year would have been in development probably before next gen dev kits even went out. I don't see how one game being cross gen affects one that never was going to be. It makes no sense.

Sony loves saying shit like this because it's a good excuse to launch without a big AAA title. They don't want to make that investment with a small install base so we get a budget release Spiderman spin off and then probably a pretty long wait like how the PS4 launched with a mediocre Killzone game and then it was another 4.5 months for a mediocre Infamous game.

I'm not going to say "Yeah Sony is really looking out for their customers" when the reality is their software strategy is just protecting them financially and it's giving their early adopters not a lot to look forward to in that first 6-9 months of the consoles life.
What a load of horseshit. What exactly are these heavy hitters from Microsoft? Halo is that it? Because all those mid tier studies they bought aren’t going to have triple A games ready for launch.

You don’t know because they haven’t revealed anything yet.

Meanwhile Sony just released two triple A games this year that people can buy for their ps5 if they wish.
 

oagboghi2

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Welp, Halo Infinite (cross gen) will finally be unveiled in about 5 days. What will be the excuse if it ends up looking better than any game shown at the sony event?

Also, nothing at the sony event wowed me. Most of them looked like cross gen games that could easily run on a PS4 with downscaling of effects,loading etc.
The first paragraph was somewhat believable.

But then you just go and expose yourself completely in the second paragraph.
 
May 10, 2018
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What a load of horseshit. What exactly are these heavy hitters from Microsoft? Halo is that it? Because all those mid tier studies they bought aren’t going to have triple A games ready for launch.

You don’t know because they haven’t revealed anything yet.

Meanwhile Sony just released two triple A games this year that people can buy for their ps5 if they wish.
Yes, but Sony doesn't want you to play PS4 games on your PS5...they believe in console generations remember?
 

GetemMa

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What a load of horseshit. What exactly are these heavy hitters from Microsoft? Halo is that it? Because all those mid tier studies they bought aren’t going to have triple A games ready for launch.

You don’t know because they haven’t revealed anything yet.

Meanwhile Sony just released two triple A games this year that people can buy for their ps5 if they wish.
Why are you so upset?

Halo is a massive flagship Franchise. Forza Motorsport is also rumored to be a launch title and would line up with their previous launch schedule for that series. Regardless of what you may think, these are very big AAA franchises. Beyond that, we do not know because the Xbox event hasn't happened yet but multiple insiders that have great track records like Shinobi and Dan Ahmad say MS has more coming. MS Flight Simulator is launching for PC in August and it looks more technically impressive than anything that Sony showed off during their press event for PS5 and that is also coming to XSX, probably this year or next.

So, You're retort to the suggestion that Sony launches are light, which they are, is to say that they recently released two games on the PS4 that can also be played on the PS5. So they are functionally cross gen and could have been played 5-6 months before the PS5 launches? why is that impressive? The XSX is fully backwards compatible with everything on Xbox One.

What are these big Sony games that the PS5 is launching with? the only title they've committed to launch is a $40 Spiderman spin off that looks remarkably similar to Spiderman on PS4. It's almost as if they are just going to recycle assets and make a game that could have easily been a DLC for the PS4 game and put it on PS5 with some resolution and performance upgrades.

Stating facts about Sony shouldn't make you this sad. I bought a PS4, it had a shit first year. I'll buy a PS5 and it may also have a shit first year. This is how Sony has done things for the PS3 and the PS4 and it didn't hurt them. Don't worry.
 
May 10, 2018
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Here is another comparison of Miles' character model. I have no idea what people are looking at when they say this looks like the PS4 character mode.



Usually all the best skin shaders and textures are reserved for the main character, which in the first game was Peter Parker. Compare PS4 Peter Parker to PS4 Miles and you would hardly believe it's the same game. Now that this new game will focus on Miles as the main character, it's only natural that all the extra processing that made Peter look great will transition over to Miles. Don't be fooled, look for yourself.


 
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Psykodad

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We haven’t seen enough of horizon (I think that’s the game you’re implying)
Don't need to. GG is known for delivering tech showcases and since it's open-world, it's 100% guaranteed that Horizon 2 will demonstrate the benefits of the PS5 hardware. Even moreso than R&C.
 
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higher resolution PS4 game? Lol. You do realize that Miles' entire character model is brand new with skin shaders way ahead of what we had on the PS4? I mean it's all right here.

It is funny that these guys in other threads will come to you and tell you how RDR2 on PC is a generation ahead of PS4😂😂😂😂😂, but they cannot see the huge difference of skin shader between ps4 Miles and PS5 Miles
 

Lort

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higher resolution PS4 game? Lol. You do realize that Miles' entire character model is brand new with skin shaders way ahead of what we had on the PS4? I mean it's all right here.

Those skin shaders are years ahead of ... i mean behind RYSE...

All hail the xbox one the king of next next gen graphics ...



a mild improvements in graphics proves the game can be easily scaled.
 
Aug 28, 2019
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Because MS had a partnership deal with Capcom to use it as a vehicle for promoting XBO and thought the best way to do that was by keeping it next-gen exclusive.

You guys are acting like money is never a factor in this. That's crazy.
Where's your source? I legit provided a source that was the dev team for DR3 saying they originally planned for a 360 release but kept hitting brick walls where the system couldn't handle it. Where's your counter-source? Why should anyone take your word for it over the developers?
 
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SlimySnake

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Those skin shaders are years ahead of ... i mean behind RYSE...

All hail the xbox one the king of next next gen graphics ...



a mild improvements in graphics proves the game can be easily scaled.
I love it when goalposts start moving. Yes, let's compare a linear game with prerendered cutscenes to an open world game to prove our point when we have actual evidence of the same character in two different generational games.

I mean if I would actually entertain you a little bit if you had used an example from an open world game with real time cutscenes. In fact, let me make that comparison and pick the best looking open world game out there right now to the spiderman character model.






it's not even close.
 

SlimySnake

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Usually all the best skin shaders and textures are reserved for the main character, which in the first game was Peter Parker. Compare PS4 Peter Parker to PS4 Miles and you would hardly believe it's the same game. Now that this new game will focus on Miles as the main character, it's only natural that all the extra processing that made Peter look great will transition over to Miles. Don't be fooled, look for yourself.


Now this is just getting silly. No, i am not buying your assertion that main characters look better than side characters in most games. Thats simply not true. Especially in this game since Miles is one of the three playable characters and is in many scenes with Peter, and it never looks like they are from different games.





Regardless, Miles now looks a gen ahead of the Peter parker character model.

 

NT80

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Usually all the best skin shaders and textures are reserved for the main character, which in the first game was Peter Parker. Compare PS4 Peter Parker to PS4 Miles and you would hardly believe it's the same game. Now that this new game will focus on Miles as the main character, it's only natural that all the extra processing that made Peter look great will transition over to Miles. Don't be fooled, look for yourself.


But how is the game going to actually play? Will there be elements that set it apart from a PS4 game? We haven't seen enough to know yet.
 

cireza

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Well they are going to remake the assets and optimize it for the PS5. Could also mean that they could add additional content as well.

Definitely not a simple upscale to 4K.



This is also Bluepoint that's making this and they are specialized in remakes and remasters. Also this was a game that many were asking so I'm sure it's not a bad thing that it's coming.
Still amusing as it is contradictory with their argument of previous gen games holding back innovation. At least this one will offer 60fps...
 
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Falc67

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Here is another comparison of Miles' character model. I have no idea what people are looking at when they say this looks like the PS4 character mode.



It’s not even close! That’s why I’m so impressed and eager to see more of Miles-Morales.
 

eastwood333

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I see nothing wrong with Sony's approach. They have the right approach.
Based on the fact that the games shown at the Sony conference looked mostly cross gen and could easily run on PS4 with downscaled effects, i'd say MS has the right approach and more consumer friendly.

What are people going to say if Halo Infinite(cross gen) looks better than anything shown at the sony event that supposedly can only be done on PS5?
 
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eastwood333

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Now this is just getting silly. No, i am not buying your assertion that main characters look better than side characters in most games. Thats simply not true. Especially in this game since Miles is one of the three playable characters and is in many scenes with Peter, and it never looks like they are from different games.





Regardless, Miles now looks a gen ahead of the Peter parker character model.

Honestly, Hellblade 2 trailer looks better than those.
 
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Falc67

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Honestly, Hellblade 2 trailer looks better than those.
Subjective comment, but I agree. For my personal tastes. Hellblade 2 has realised an almost fully photorealistic setting. I’m hoping they show more of it on Thursday.

Snake wasn’t comparing the best looking game, he was just comparing the two Spider-Man games.
 

xPikYx

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Honestly the only thing that can innovate gameplay is VR, there is not room anymore in classic 3d games all they have to do is to get closer to reality in terms of physics, animation 3d assets and texture. And this is what a new generation has to deliver, an improvement over the old one, Ratchet & Clank portals are a good hint of what ssd speed can allow into the making but nothing so different or innovative that smashes your jaw, it is indeed a nice addition as well as SSD can open great scenarios into open world games
 

BlueXImpulse

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Based on the fact that the games shown at the Sony conference looked mostly cross gen and could easily run on PS4 with downscaled effects, i'd say MS has the right approach and more consumer friendly.

What are people going to say if Halo Infinite(cross gen) looks better than anything shown at the sony event that supposedly can only be done on PS5?
Which of the first party offerings looked like cross gen games? I don't mean just visually, but in terms of expected gameplay too. People were calling Horizon FW CGI (that's not cross gen). We know that with Spiderman you're going to be swinging so fast that you will need a fast SSD to keep up with the loading (that's not cross-gen).

I seriously don't know why anyone is defending MS' stance on this. Don't we all want innovation? Stop fanboying and hold people accountable!
 
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Mmnow

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I've been thinking about this a lot since this whole controversy reared its head, and I'm still not fully sure on it.

I think the basic conclusion I've come to is that if something CAN be cross-gen, it probably SHOULD be. If the Halo team can create something mindblowing for the Series X and scale it to the Xbox One, not doing so would be daft. That'll be shown later this week. Then the debate can finally be over.

Same could be said for Spider-Man. If Miles Morales is a prettier, faster version of the original, I don't see any reason why the slower, uglier version just shouldn't exist. Putting it behind the barrier of a whole new console isn't fair. For those who come to this forum, it's fair game. We're buying the new consoles anyway. But there will be a lot of people who can't play the follow-up to their favourite ever game because Sony may be using it as a carrot to upgrade hardware.

That water will become even muddier if a Spider-Man remaster appears, especially if it's packaged in and the "stand-alone expansion" chat is marketing. "Sure, it's stand-alone, but you also get the FULL GAME FREE."

Time will tell how big an upgrade Spidey ends up being, same as with Halo. The better these games are, the more we all win. But when stuff is arbitrarily not released somewhere when it could be, we all lose.
 

Men_in_Boxes

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Honestly the only thing that can innovate gameplay is VR, there is not room anymore in classic 3d games all they have to do is to get closer to reality in terms of physics, animation 3d assets and texture. And this is what a new generation has to deliver, an improvement over the old one, Ratchet & Clank portals are a good hint of what ssd speed can allow into the making but nothing so different or innovative that smashes your jaw, it is indeed a nice addition as well as SSD can open great scenarios into open world games
Social gaming will boom over the next 10 years. Plenty of innovation left yet to see.
 

odhiex

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Sony has given so much for the life of PlayStation 4, I am still rocking the original machine and satisfied with their games output.

Bring on the PS5, Sony. I am ready!!

Ps. I am also interested in buying XBOX, maybe the series S console is suitable for my need.
 
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Keihart

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Those skin shaders are years ahead of ... i mean behind RYSE...

All hail the xbox one the king of next next gen graphics ...



a mild improvements in graphics proves the game can be easily scaled.
i raise you a TLoU2 character models...the real new standard...


source

anyway...Miles Morales does look way better than the characters in the PS4 version.
 
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MrMiyagi

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Just a couple more days and I think we'll see why we absolutely need a complete reset if we want to see a clear generational jump. I just have this very strong feeling that the 20/20 event will be much better than what we saw in May, but when it comes to that next gen wow factor, it will get pretty much the same reactions. Smart Delivery, 120fps and 4k all sound great... until we see the games...
 

Grinchy

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Didn't they once say 10 years of support for every Sony console?
Has that not been the case yet? I guess it depends on how we look at it. What does "supporting it" mean? Making their own 1st party games? In that case, no they won't be supporting it.

But they aren't discontinuing the PS4 and you can still go to a store and buy one years into the new generation. It will still get firmware updates. There will still be 3rd party game releases for it. The PS1 kept selling and getting games years after the PS2, the PS2 did after PS3, the PS3 did after 4. They all approach that 10 years of life point. Now let's look at the competition :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 
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Tiamat2san

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The only thing I hope is that we won’t see too much games with changing worlds/dimensions.
It’s cool but if it’s becoming a trend it will be boring in the end.

Silent hill is the exception.
Please do a new one Goddammit!
 

Hobbygaming

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There's going to be cross-platform games from all the big name developers for YEARS. They're not going to give up on that install base. I wonder what these fanboys will say when its holiday 2021 and they're still releasing cross-gen PS4/PS5 games. Probably bring up the lazy dev rhetoric again.
They're talking about their 1st party. In 2021 all of their exclusives will be only on PS5
 

Hobbygaming

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No.


Next gen Foliage:

Cross gen wild life:

Next Gen Wild life:


Cross gen Character models:

Next gen character models:
I just now noticed that those flying machines have blue lights, if flying mounts are in Horizon Forbidden West then it's going to be even more amazing