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What am I missing with FreeSync "range"

amd-freesync.jpg


So FreeSync is AMD's implimentation of the industry-standard, "DisplayPort Adaptive-Sync", and it enables AMD APUs and GPUs to directly control the update rate (Hz) of a compatible monitor. Got a 144hz monitor but only getting 90fps? Your monitor is magically 90hz. Awesome!

Why is this awesome? Because with this problem traditionally we have traditonally had 2 solutions:

V-Sync On: Locks frame rate in the game to a division of your monitors refresh rate. 60hz monitor limits the framerate to 60fps. Framerate drops? Well, this is where it can be confusing but basically you get options of 60, 30, 20, 15, 12, 10, 8.6, 7.5, etc etc.

This is because the monitor does not change refresh rates at all, you just double the frames or triple or quadruple, that is if you can't hit the target rate at those numbers. The big problem is that this means the range of 31fps - 59fps = zero difference in visual performance. It limits the FPS to 30fps, doubles the images, and displays on your 60hz monitor.

Q) Why do people do this?
A) The major problem solved by this method is screen "tearing" where part of your frame is drawn "out-of-sync" and creates 1 or more lines in your image that appears to misalign your games output.

Screen-tearing-in-CS-GO.png


So this seems pretty great if you have a killer rig. "I never drop below my monitors refresh rate". Well, the trouble is the input lag associated with this solution. It introduces noticible lag in playing the game. The other obvious situation where this is less than ideal is games that don't ping 60fps consistantly. 59fps? Adjusts to 30fps. A pretty jarring transition to see in motion.

V-Sync Off: This isn't really a solution, but rather just the option to live with the problems, mainly screen tearing.

Q) Why do people do this?
A) With V-Sync off, 45fps displays as 45fps. Input lag is limited by your peripherals (and default panel lag). People will accept the screen tearing compromise for a much smoother experience in games, and much improved input lag.

So along comes FreeSync to save us! The monitor updates the moment a new picture is ready, giving gamers unbelievably smooth, responsive, tearing-free games*.

*Kind of.

FreeSync operates on a monitor panel determined "range". The monitor I have is notorious for having a pretty narrow range. It works between 48fps and 75fps. If your framerate deviates from that range, you go back to the "old" method whether it be V-Sync on or off.

So if your rig drops below the range, AMD did address some panels by developing a technology called Low Frame Compensation and adding it in their driver. It's neat. Say your target range is 40-144hz. FreeSync works at all those refresh rates between. Now lets say the framerate drops to 37fps. Uh-oh! Back to the old V-Sync On/Off solution right? Well LFC does a neat trick. 37+37 = 74fps. The driver doubles the frame, outputs to 74fps and guess what, FreeSync tells the monitor "74hz please". And it works. Cool!

In AMD's words: "LFC is an exciting new feature of Radeon Software that effectively extends the refresh rate range of many AMD FreeSync™ displays, enabling pristinely smooth gaming down to 30 FPS or less. Many popular AMD FreeSync™-ready monitors automatically use LFC when Radeon Software Crimson Edition (or later) is installed."

Not for my small window monitor (LG 34UM67), but if you have a range twice as big as the low end, you should be good. 35-75hz? 40-144hz? Good. 48-75hz? Nope.

Whew! That was long winded. But, as awesome as this is, we still run into a problem. What happens when we overshoot the top end? Unfortunately the same as if we don't meet the minimum. The Monitor goes back into the default V-Sync setting. Either tearing or input lag/framerate cap.

It has me asking just a couple questions (and the point for me to make this post):

Why doesn't FreeSync limit the games FPS on the top end with V-Sync off? There are certainly games that have FPS limits (Durante, our savior, is famous for removing said limits).

Can I do this in some type of universal way for all games without introducing the input lag of V-Sync? ie: 75fps is your new speedlimit.

For me, in particular, I don't want to enable V-Sync because while it caps out the rate at 75fps, but it would default to 25fps if I hit 37fps in a game. LFC doesn't help me. Also, the input lag at 75fps (from my understanding on the subject) would noticeably have more input lag than a capped engine.
 

undu

Member
I don't really understand why there's a minimum framerate for Freesync, can somebody shed some light?
 
Wow, I had no idea that FreeSync was so limited like that. 48-75fps only? Weird.

My G-Sync display works between 30 and my maximum refresh rate of 165. Kind of set it and forget it (unless you go under 30, but in that case it's going to choppy as hell whether you have G-Sync or not).

That said, use Rivatuner to cap your FPS: http://www.guru3d.com/content-page/rivatuner.html

Really easy to set up, runs in your taskbar, and limits your fps globally to whatever number you choose.

EDIT - Nevermind, apparently Rivatuner is for nVidia only. MSI Afterburner does the same thing and is available for all brand of cards:https://gaming.msi.com/features/afterburner
 
I don't really understand why there's a minimum framerate for Freesync, can somebody shed some light?

nvidia put hardware in a monitor that does frame doubling to handle this specifically, amd is piggybacking on the adaptive v-sync standard of displayport. They have to handle the same case in their software/drivers... which to my mind has not really been a strong suit of theirs.

IMO amd rushed freesync to market to compete with gsync.
 
nvidia put hardware in a monitor that does frame doubling to handle this specifically, amd is piggybacking on the adaptive v-sync standard of displayport. They have to handle the same case in their software/drivers... which to my mind has not really been a strong suit of theirs.

IMO amd rushed freesync to market to compete with gsync.

This is basically true, however you will notice AMD addressed the problem for the most part. LFC or Low Frame Compensation does the same thing in driver as your G-Sync hardware doubling.

The reason you don't have 100% compatibility of LFC is because AMD doesn't have the same standards as G-Sync when certifying the monitors. I am sure AMD will going forward be a lot more strict in this regard. They did not launch with LFC.

The reason it doesn't work for my 34UM67 is the limited refresh window. There are other FreeSync monitors that do LFC just fine using that guideline I mentioned. Minimum * 2 <= Maximum and you are good to go for LFC.

FreeSync was a little rushed, but LFC really does address the problem in a meaningful way. That said, for me personally, if my rig dips below 48fps I won't mind slight tearing at those rare low points. It was more the worried of the top end high framerates, which I called out in my post as basically the 1 concern I was left with after going all pro/con. I personally try to aim for 1% dips to go no lower than 50fps, and .01% dips will cause very very minimal tearing.

MSI Afterburner does the same thing and is available for all brand of cards:https://gaming.msi.com/features/afterburner

And why doesn't AMD put this functionality into their driver? Thank you.
 
Freesync the standard supports down to very low fps. My monitor supports down to 40 so it depends on what the monitor supports.

Indeed. There are way better monitors for doing this than mine which implement FreeSync.

You can limit a game's refresh rate using AMD's drivers, I think availability depends on the card, though.

Interesting, I guess it is called the Frame Rate "Target". I thought this changed in-game settings to meet a standard. Like "set my options for me to get good framerates". Works 100% perfect for me but it isn't the perfect solution. You can only cap up to 95fps (I needed to only cap at 75fps).

Asus MG279Q wouldn't work too well as it is 144hz, and therefore 145fps goes back to tearing or V-Sync. That MSI program linked should fix that issue. That monitor is amazing and nobody talks about it. 27" 57-144hz 1440p IPS with support for LFC. Sick. If only it was ultrawide. Yum. For the price expected of the Acer Predator X34, I am kind of let down it didn't shoot for those numbers.

Whats weird is that none of the big reviewer guys (LinusTechTips et all) talk about the easy fix to solve the FreeSync "exceeds max hz" problem.

I will hug my LG and be sad about its FreeSync range. :(
 

Irobot82

Member
Indeed. There are way better monitors for doing this than mine which implement FreeSync.



Interesting, I guess it is called the Frame Rate "Target". I thought this changed in-game settings to meet a standard. Like "set my options for me to get good framerates". Works 100% perfect for me but it isn't the perfect solution. You can only cap up to 95fps (I needed to only cap at 75fps).

Asus MG279Q wouldn't work too well as it is 144hz, and therefore 145fps goes back to tearing or V-Sync. That MSI program linked should fix that issue. That monitor is amazing and nobody talks about it. 27" 57-144hz 1440p IPS with support for LFC. Sick. If only it was ultrawide. Yum. For the price expected of the Acer Predator X34, I am kind of let down it didn't shoot for those numbers.

Whats weird is that none of the big reviewer guys (LinusTechTips et all) talk about the easy fix to solve the FreeSync "exceeds max hz" problem.

I will hug my LG and be sad about its FreeSync range. :(

FRTC cap now extends well beyond 95fps in the new Crimson drivers. Also you can do it on a per game basis if you want. I'll need to check what the max is when I get home.

Edit: I'm pretty sure...but now I'm questioning myself.

Edit2: Yes I was correct.

FRTC.png
 
My G-Sync display works between 30 and my maximum refresh rate of 165. Kind of set it and forget it (unless you go under 30, but in that case it's going to choppy as hell whether you have G-Sync or not).

Gsync works below 30 fps as well, it just doubles up the frames first (so at 19 fps it will act as gsynced 38fps instead but displaying each image twice).

That being said, below 30 fps is not a very compelling experience regardless of having gsync or not.
 
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