MAX PAYMENT
Member
What does pro HUD mode alter?
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What is the consensus on Zelda BoTW's Master Mode?
- Thread starter MAX PAYMENT
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What does pro HUD mode alter?
Hides the HUD, only showing your hearts, the definitive way to play the game.
Mr. Nice_Guy
Member
Having put a ton of hours into regular mode, I imagine o would have really disliked Master Mode. Combat is okay but the weapon breakage keeps it from being as fun as it could. Multiplying that issue with more enemy health sounds like an awful chore for me at least. Fake edit: Forgot about health regeneration. Yeah, I would have hated this.
The main game is almost perfect game design, which is why it's such a surprise and a disappointment that Master Mode is a terribly designed mode that absolutely, 100% makes the game worse. It just feels like so little thought or effort went into it.
The main issues:
-Increased health and regenerating health of enemies does NOT play well with breakable weapons, and makes the erroneous criticism of 'combat not being worth it' absolutely true in master mode
-Regenerating health of enemies does not play well with the rag doll mechanics. You get punished for a hard hit that knocks the enemy away from you because it will regen health more than your hard hit took away. If the enemy ragdolls onto a slope, their entire health bar could be restored. It's awful and frustrating.
-The food issue is unaddressed. By the time you're 20 hours into the game, the amount of food and potions you amass makes the combat a simple war of attrition with you able to top up your health as much as you wish. This is the big issue with combat and difficulty and yet it went ignored.
-The dodge and parry windows are too large in normal mode but that also goes unaddressed.
-The extra health of enemies makes combat that was already 'spongy' and overlong into a ridiculously boring slog. Because the dodge windows are still easy and obvious it's just a question of taking 5 minutes dodging and flurry rushing enemies and it's simply not worth it.
-The extra features are just a couple of floating platforms - not nearly worth it. That one extra Lynel on the plateau is well-placed, but it gives the impression that all areas will have been rebalanced in that way - they haven't.
Honestly, Master Mode is the single worst thing about BotW, and I would recommend everyone ignore it until after you've beat the game.
tl:dr - It's not very hard but it's exceptionally boring. Can't think of a worse criticism.
The main issues:
-Increased health and regenerating health of enemies does NOT play well with breakable weapons, and makes the erroneous criticism of 'combat not being worth it' absolutely true in master mode
-Regenerating health of enemies does not play well with the rag doll mechanics. You get punished for a hard hit that knocks the enemy away from you because it will regen health more than your hard hit took away. If the enemy ragdolls onto a slope, their entire health bar could be restored. It's awful and frustrating.
-The food issue is unaddressed. By the time you're 20 hours into the game, the amount of food and potions you amass makes the combat a simple war of attrition with you able to top up your health as much as you wish. This is the big issue with combat and difficulty and yet it went ignored.
-The dodge and parry windows are too large in normal mode but that also goes unaddressed.
-The extra health of enemies makes combat that was already 'spongy' and overlong into a ridiculously boring slog. Because the dodge windows are still easy and obvious it's just a question of taking 5 minutes dodging and flurry rushing enemies and it's simply not worth it.
-The extra features are just a couple of floating platforms - not nearly worth it. That one extra Lynel on the plateau is well-placed, but it gives the impression that all areas will have been rebalanced in that way - they haven't.
Honestly, Master Mode is the single worst thing about BotW, and I would recommend everyone ignore it until after you've beat the game.
tl:dr - It's not very hard but it's exceptionally boring. Can't think of a worse criticism.
Classicblunder
Member
I like the floating enemies and extra hard enemies added in. But the sponginess and multiple broken weapons gets tiring.
Sentenza
Member
It has the same problem of the end game in vanilla: it makes most of your tools so under-performing to the point of making them almost useless, so whacking HP sponge enemies with weapons becomes pretty much the only viable option.
Yeah, the game was easy before, but I'm not sure just giving more HP and more damage to all enemies was the best solution.
Yeah, the game was easy before, but I'm not sure just giving more HP and more damage to all enemies was the best solution.
Man, bummer seeing all the negative/mixed responses to BotW's Master Mode. I haven't played it yet, but I was hoping it would be the definitive experience for the game, like the Hero Mode's are for WW, TP, and SS.
SS in particular is one of my favorite entries in the series because of the Hero Mode. A 6-heart Hero Mode run of SS is incredibly fun.
The increased enemy HP in particular is ridiculous. Increasing HP is the absolute worst way to increase difficulty - and it arguably doesn't even increase difficulty, only tedium.
SS in particular is one of my favorite entries in the series because of the Hero Mode. A 6-heart Hero Mode run of SS is incredibly fun.
The increased enemy HP in particular is ridiculous. Increasing HP is the absolute worst way to increase difficulty - and it arguably doesn't even increase difficulty, only tedium.
Just to add - I love hero mode in every other Zelda, especially Skyward Sword. But not this one. Here it's an abomination. The best way to play it if you want difficulty is to set a 'no food, no extra hearts' run on normal. Because you actually have to exchange soul gems for hearts this is easy to do. And if you play this way it's challenging and great fun without being a boring war of attrition.
lwilliams3
Member
I believe that is intended to be done after you throughly played the original game, and is now playing it again with an additional twist to the game. You have to consider your environment and the consequences (like the slope example that you made), and using elementary weapons and arrows (and are more important. The mode is not meant to be balanced. Story-wise, I take it to be a scenario in which you were awaken closer to
Calamity GanonÂ’s Revival
I'm currently doing a Master Mode Playthrough and I love it. I wouldn't recommend it for a first time run though.
This mode forces you to take advantage of all the mechanisms the game provides you. Runes, elemental weapons, different kind of weapons, the terrain and so on.
On top of that if you focus on increase your stamina over hearts, every combat is a live or die contest.
That said, now that I have 3 beasts under control and good equipment the game is much easier (I haven't encounter the golden Lynels yet).
This mode forces you to take advantage of all the mechanisms the game provides you. Runes, elemental weapons, different kind of weapons, the terrain and so on.
On top of that if you focus on increase your stamina over hearts, every combat is a live or die contest.
That said, now that I have 3 beasts under control and good equipment the game is much easier (I haven't encounter the golden Lynels yet).
lwilliams3
Member
IMO, I think one reason why BOTW is great is because they took elements of Hero Mode and embedded them into the main game.
Krappadizzle
Member
I think it's the better way to play. Forces you to consider your environment and enemies and how best to utilize all the tools you have.
You get it as early or late as you want more or less. You just have to have the 40 spirit orbs required to get it. On my 3rd playthrough I didn't do any bosses and got the sword as soon as possible by just going around do the shrines.
You get it as early or late as you want more or less. You just have to have the 40 spirit orbs required to get it. On my 3rd playthrough I didn't do any bosses and got the sword as soon as possible by just going around do the shrines.
CloroxLeech
Neo Member
Too scared to try it lmao
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
I quit my Master Mode run because weapons break too easily and all my encounters were boring. It was overly stealthy and not what I wanted. But you're right - the floating stuff was awesome and adding some bonus "extra hard" enemies = awesome.
Ah that really blows.
I did do a 3-heart of BotW, but I also abused the bonus heart food items, so it wasn't as hard as it could've been.
I was really looking forward to Master Mode too. Man...
boiled goose
good with gravy
The way to bump difficulty should have been increasing enemy damage,not health...
Shame really.
Shame really.
Does it increase their damage at all?
With armor upgrades and buffs to defense the hardest hitting enemies eventually can't scratch you in normal mode.
It's kinda fun running into enemies you know are too strong for you at the start and going, 'oh shit!!' and trying to find a sneaky way around. Playing again through master mode rn, and I do a lot more stealth and stealing their weapons and chests and then bolting away than I did the first time on regular mode.
But then as you get stronger it becomes less about the enemies being too strong and more about them being too annoying so you don't really bother.
They'll take much longer to kill, they eat through more of your weapons, and it's not like the combat mechanics or strategies have changed from regular mode so it's just like... eh, I'll save my strong weapons for something else and just go around.
So ultimately I don't really find it better or worse than normal mode, it's just kinda... there.
But then as you get stronger it becomes less about the enemies being too strong and more about them being too annoying so you don't really bother.
They'll take much longer to kill, they eat through more of your weapons, and it's not like the combat mechanics or strategies have changed from regular mode so it's just like... eh, I'll save my strong weapons for something else and just go around.
So ultimately I don't really find it better or worse than normal mode, it's just kinda... there.
James Scott
Banned
ItÂ’s really cool. Maybe not recommend for a first playthrough, but itÂ’s a cool way to replay it
After becoming OP in the base game itÂ’s interesting to revisit while having to play a different way.
I see a group of enemies and I know I canÂ’t take them on myself at that moment so IÂ’ll come back later
After becoming OP in the base game itÂ’s interesting to revisit while having to play a different way.
I see a group of enemies and I know I canÂ’t take them on myself at that moment so IÂ’ll come back later
Waddle Dee
Member
It's a pretty half-assed mode, which is a shame since with all the easy exploits, a proper hard mode was really needed.
Polygonal_Sprite
Member
Giving the option to remove the weapon durability during Master Mode would have made it far more enjoyable. As you say itÂ’s a chore just running away from fights due to simple enemies requiring you to use multiple weapons to defeat.
SoulUnison
Banned
Enemy camps seem impossible since everything is either a Black or Silver class enemy and it takes literally half my arsenal breaking to take down one or two enemies.
And yet, I enjoy the tension and deliberation it brings to the game, so it's kind of a wash.
And yet, I enjoy the tension and deliberation it brings to the game, so it's kind of a wash.
LumpOfCole
Member
I bought and played through the Wii-U version, sold it to Gamestop for more than I bought it for (thank you, +70% trade-in deal). I got it again for the Switch to play through Master Mode (since I not longer had a completed normal save), and I was having an okay time until I got to the Trial of the Sword. That mode is not a joke on Master Mode - the health regen seems to make it just a cumbersome bomb throwing simulator.
I sure hope not
I played it a little bit more, and I kinda like the idea of making combat less worthwhile. Maybe I don't like the way this game does it, but I like the idea that you have more reasons to flee from enemies now because now it's not a game where I'm just killing everything all the time. It's sort of more of a survival/adventure game now which is really what I cared about in Zelda.
If it were me though I would've just made enemies hit a lot harder but give them probably the same health as on normal mode, maybe slightly more. The idea would be to make a more strategic combat system where almost any hit from either side is potentially lethal and the player's only real advantage is their brain. Make entering combat a big decision, but don't turn it into a battle of attrition like it is in the current game. But that's going into a more general rebalance of the game which I'd like to see someone do in these hacks I'm seeing of BOTW on Cemu.
If it were me though I would've just made enemies hit a lot harder but give them probably the same health as on normal mode, maybe slightly more. The idea would be to make a more strategic combat system where almost any hit from either side is potentially lethal and the player's only real advantage is their brain. Make entering combat a big decision, but don't turn it into a battle of attrition like it is in the current game. But that's going into a more general rebalance of the game which I'd like to see someone do in these hacks I'm seeing of BOTW on Cemu.
Are everyone that are having issues killing monsters using the elements effectively? Like I see that is a common complaint reading the thread but the only monsters that rundown my weapons are lynels. Even then those guys have ways of killing them without ever losing weapon durability too.
LordKasual
Banned
I would have beaten the game ages ago if i didn't start my FIRST playthrough on master mode
But i also feel like it makes the game infinitely better. Because if BotW was easy, i feel like it would have lost the majority of its greatness
But i also feel like it makes the game infinitely better. Because if BotW was easy, i feel like it would have lost the majority of its greatness
As mentioned, it changes the fundamentals of the early game enough that you are discouraged from combat due to being near inflexible in most combat scenarios without some external assistance(largely strong weapons, or some environmental cheesing).
On the one hand, I bailed on vanilla BotW after 15-ish hours due to feeling completely dulled by the simple combat and not quite finding the world exploration as satisfying as most. It's possible more time would have altered that opinion as I reach new challenge thresholds or certain unseen locations, but I was sick to death of bokoblin camps and the slight puzzle rooms and was left wanting. Held off further play for Hard mode.
Hard mode did provide an intense challenge, but also robs the game of much of the freedom it was hailed for, at least initially. I put another 10+ hours in and started to feel a bit more confident with leveled gear(the early game really demands stealth avoidance), the curve is far more satisfying to me than normal(comparative in the early game), but I can imagine it being far too frustrating for many to bother dealing with. Unclear how it ultimately pans out(difficulty flattens?), but I largely will never touch vanilla difficulty again.
On the one hand, I bailed on vanilla BotW after 15-ish hours due to feeling completely dulled by the simple combat and not quite finding the world exploration as satisfying as most. It's possible more time would have altered that opinion as I reach new challenge thresholds or certain unseen locations, but I was sick to death of bokoblin camps and the slight puzzle rooms and was left wanting. Held off further play for Hard mode.
Hard mode did provide an intense challenge, but also robs the game of much of the freedom it was hailed for, at least initially. I put another 10+ hours in and started to feel a bit more confident with leveled gear(the early game really demands stealth avoidance), the curve is far more satisfying to me than normal(comparative in the early game), but I can imagine it being far too frustrating for many to bother dealing with. Unclear how it ultimately pans out(difficulty flattens?), but I largely will never touch vanilla difficulty again.
Vigilant Gambit
Member
This post was inspiration enough for me to give Master Mode a second chance after writing it off as lazy. Taken from a point of view that the game is simply forcing you to use more of its mechanics, it's a much better experience. The combat is still pretty wonky in general, but overall, I find myself creating a more challenging gameplay loop due to the simple fact that I'm not necessarily guaranteed to do the thing that I set out to do, which is what ultimately became the case in BotW. Worst case scenario, I could pause and eat. It's like having 1000 hearts and having to pause to add more as you need them.
But in Master Mode, stuff hits so hard that any ability to heal isn't very strong. Random enemies frequently have elemental arrows that can one-shot you early on, so you really have to be moving quickly (i.e. on horseback) or carefully sneaking around. Having to actually respect enemies like that (and the fact that there are more of them, added on floating platforms at key points like bridges and such) makes the game feel how it should've felt all along, rather than how it feels before you get all of its mechanics and systems under your belt after a couple dozen hours.
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