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What we know so far about the Nintendo NX with sources 2.0

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Mpl90

Two copies sold? That's not a bomb guys, stop trolling!!!
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Then 28nm is confirmed. Shit. I mean, it could be TSMC 16nmFF+, but I highly doubt that.

Yeah, everything is pointing to an Xbone level machine at best. Probably worse to keep the power consumption down.

...Whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy. This is not the first time I see you making insane jumps to conclusion like that, though.
 

Rodin

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Then 28nm is confirmed. Shit. I mean, it could be TSMC 16nmFF+, but I highly doubt that.

Yeah, everything is pointing to an Xbone level machine at best. Probably worse to keep the power consumption down.

You need to stop with this nonsense.
 

thefro

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I would be especially skeptical of anything Emily reports on hardware since she doesn't have a proven track record there.
 

MuchoMalo

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...Whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy. This is not the first time I see you making insane jumps to conclusion like that, though.

You need to stop with this nonsense.

I genuinely think that Emily was refuting all of 10k's hardware rumors, not just the latest ones. She also started trying to downplay power immediately after.

If what Emily was saying is true, it does rule out 14nmFF because GloFo only has one 14nm plant. They could end up going with a Samsung plant, but that's unlikely. As far as it being weak goes, we know Nintendo likes their small, low-power, quiet consoles. PS4 is small, but it's far from quiet. I don't think that Nintendo would want to use laptop fans for that reason, which puts a restriction here, even after factoring out the ODD. PS4 also uses 4-5x as much power as the Wii U, and I don't think Nintendo would go that high. I'm also not sure if Nintendo is the type of company that would be willing to waste silicon with disabled CUs.

It's not a confirmation, but at this point it's extremely unlikely to be a match for PS4 unless all of Emily's sources are incorrect. It not competing with PS4 on a power level was also pretty much the first rumor we heard, and by using a fully unlocked Bonaire-based (14CU) GPU they would be below PS4 without intentionally being weak and just trying to fit within a power budget. That would also make sense with it being 20-25% faster than Xbone, much like the CPU is rumored to be. It all falls into place so well.

I would be especially skeptical of anything Emily reports on hardware since she doesn't have a proven track record there.

Yeah, I thought about that, which is why I didn't give up on 14nm or Polaris right away. I still have some hope, but it's really not looking very good when the pieces are put together.
 

Mpl90

Two copies sold? That's not a bomb guys, stop trolling!!!
Mar 10, 2011
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I genuinely think that Emily was refuting all of 10k's hardware rumors, not just the latest ones. She also started trying to downplay power immediately after.

If what Emily was saying is true, it does rule out 14nmFF because GloFo only has one 14nm plant. They could end up going with a Samsung plant, but that's unlikely. As far as it being weak goes, we know Nintendo likes their small, low-power, quiet consoles. PS4 is small, but it's far from quiet. I don't think that Nintendo would want to use laptop fans for that reason, which puts a restriction here, even after factoring out the ODD. PS4 also uses 4-5x as much power as the Wii U, and I don't think Nintendo would go that high. I'm also not sure if Nintendo is the type of company that would be willing to waste silicon with disabled CUs.

It's not a confirmation, but at this point it's extremely unlikely to be a match for PS4 unless all of Emily's sources are incorrect. It not competing with PS4 on a power level was also pretty much the first rumor we heard, and by using a fully unlocked Bonaire-based (14CU) GPU they would be below PS4 without intentionally being weak and just trying to fit within a power budget. That would also make sense with it being 20-25% faster than Xbone, much like the CPU is rumored to be. It all falls into place so well.

What she refuted, IIRC, was just that Wii U would "rival / be better" than PS4K. She also specified she was talking about PS4K and not PS4 OG. And she also said the console has "good specs".
 

MuchoMalo

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What she refuted, IIRC, was just that Wii U would "rival / be better" than PS4K. She also specified she was talking about PS4K and not PS4 OG. And she also said the console has "good specs".

I don't think that she specified which part of the rumor she was refuting, and "good specs" is subjective. She doesn't seem to care about graphics much, so anything rivaling current-gen could be "good" to her. I'd love it if she would clarify which part of the rumor she was refuting.
 
Jun 7, 2007
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To be honest, even if the NX is "weak" in numbers (I suppose it matches the PS4 anyway), we're currently at a point where this potential "weak" console can produce graphics like this, no matter what the numbers say.


It's not Wii vs. PS3 in terms of visual perception or "visual difference in quality", these times are gone.


What's far more important is the question if it's easy to develop 3rd party games / ports.








 

MuchoMalo

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To be honest, even if the NX is "weak" in numbers (I suppose it matches the PS4 anyway), we're currently at a point where this potential "weak" console can produce graphics like this, no matter what the numbers say.


It's not Wii vs. PS3 in terms of visual perception or "visual difference in quality", these times are gone.

Yeah, but people love numbers...
 

benedictm

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Out of interest before the 3DS and WiiU launch were there many - any? - accurate leaks of what they would be?

Were the announcements a surprise at all (in terms of what they were) or had it all been correctly predicted/leaked?
 

Mpl90

Two copies sold? That's not a bomb guys, stop trolling!!!
Mar 10, 2011
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I don't think that she specified which part of the rumor she was refuting, and "good specs" is subjective. She doesn't seem to care about graphics much, so anything rivaling current-gen could be "good" to her. I'd love it if she would clarify which part of the rumor she was refuting.

I just did some checking: back in the 10k's gigantic thread, she said this

Here is what multiple sources close to Nintendo are telling me about 10k’s hardware rumors: The gimmick is made up. GPU is wrong. Power level is wrong.” “The specs on NX are good, but a lot of the information being shared in this thread is incorrect.

I was told that NX has good specs, but the info in this thread on the GPU and power level is just not correct. Sorry to burst everyone’s hype.

This is the time when the speculation was going insane, with stuff like this

T3 Rumors

The NX gimmick. I uh....was told not to post this part by some people. As usual, take it with a grain of salt (although I don't know why I would be warned if it was false) I'm not under any NDA though, and well, it could end up being false. But I was told a variation of this by three different sources. I don't believe they have a reason to lie to me. Here goes....

The NX is going to have a screen controller (whether it's optional or standard I don't know) and can be used anywhere to play your home console games. The controller itself will not have any processing capabilities, it'll essentially be a dummy vita. It'll likely have basic OS functions to access the NX console from anywhere, like a tiny cpu. Nintendo will use enhanced Wii U gamepad streaming tech, and allow the controller to be taken anywhere, connect to the NX console at home (likely through Wi-fi or personal hotspots and the NX console will likely have to be in stand-by mode). Basically, it's remote play built into the box and won't require a $200 add-on to experience it. This is likely what Kimishima meant in his interview with Sankei (http://www.sankei.com/west/news/1601...030012-n1.html) "different way to play with a dedicated machine" and the whole "new way to experience games" mantra that's been going around Nintendo PR.

Speculation: Nintendo could also sell personal hotspot usb adapters to get internet anywhere and plug either directly into the controller or a wall outlet to not drain the controller battery. The Supplementary Computing Devices may actually be portable hotspot devices with chips in it to boost the quality of the stream. (Maybe the NX will be called the Stream, a speculated final name during the WUST's).

Note: This does not mean there will not be a handheld. This isn't meant to be a replacement for the handheld as there will still be limitations and the controller won't have a full OS or the capability for physical game media (discs or cartridges). The needs of a handheld won't be fully met with this feature. It's just a nice add-on.

T1 Rumors

The NX will use a custom Polaris-like GPU. Likely will be on a FinFET 14nm fabrication node. The source told me it's on the same architecture with heavy customizations of course . It will contain the feature set of Polaris. It is "marginally better than the PS4" and theoretically could be "2x the power of PS4 GPU". I asked about PS4K being rumored to have a gpu 2x as powerful as the OG PS4 and how the theoretical performance of the NX would be and was told "Theoretically it could be close to the PS4K rumored specs". Of course, we know nothing of Polaris or the PS4K specs, but he gave that metric.

I'm going to paraphrase here, but one comment from a source about the power of NX was that "Dev's could port over a PS4 game easily and have power to spare. Even the most demanding ones". My own theory is any game that dips below 30fps on PS4 will likely stay at 30fps on NX and maybe have some enhanced effects.

One feature he highly touted, which improves performance greatly in games, especially graphically demanding ones such as AAA open world games is Primitive Discard Accelerator. A TechGAF member described it as .

So 14nm is still likely in 2016 and Nintendo could still sell it at a reasonable price and not lose too much money or even break even.

tl;dr The NX GPU is using features that are debuting on the Polaris chip, and is therefore heavily speculated to be a Polaris chip, as that would work well in a handheld too and help AMD prove they can make low wattage chips with good performance for small devices. (GCN 1.3, Vulkan, Primitive Discard Accelerator, etc)

This is what she debunked, the speculation reaching such insane heights in terms of power levels dreams and the GPU. Now, she debunking that kind of GPU doesn't completely close the door to something Polaris-like in the console: maybe a customised one, with lesser costs involved? There was speculation about it in the thread as well. Also, she never debunked what LCGeek said about the CPU.

Moreover, on Twitter, she later specified (I read that tweets) that she just wanted the speculation bringing up comparisons with PS4K in terms of "rivaling / exceeding" to stop. I repeat, she specified her reference to PS4K and not the original, still-on-the market PS4.

P.S. As said several times already, I would be well satisfied with a PS4+ machine, even if slightly, that's not a problem at all :p
 

Somnid

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I mean I'd be pretty sure the fab thing is false because really guys, really? But also even if Emily did have any idea were the fab is being done (and her Treehouse sources would not be privy to that info) how on Earth would she know where Xbox fab is being done when we don't even know if it exists?
 

MK_768

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You need to stop with this nonsense.

But that's his shtick :(

Anyways we shouldn't be mentioning 10k's past speculation. That was a sad piece of time. Also, lets not mention any recent or new stuff in the future. The poor fella is getting played with and wants too much attention for my liking.
 

Skittzo0413

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I mean I'd be pretty sure the fab thing is false because really guys, really? But also even if Emily did have any idea were the fab is being done (and her Treehouse sources would not be privy to that info) how on Earth would she know where Xbox fab is being done when we don't even know if it exists?

Yeah, I was wondering this as well. She would need to know a lot of relatively privileged information from several sources at different companies. Can't say for sure she doesn't know, but it seems like awfully specific and hard to get info.
 
Jun 7, 2007
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Yeah, but people love numbers...
I know, but I can imagine that people are going to be quite satisfied if they get a glimpse on Nintendos games on =>PS4 hardware (man, even XBO hardware).

As I edited my post above, I think what's far more important is that the system is easy to develop for (but I also have to say that newer / better hardware makes things easier).
 

daakusedo

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Until she has specific info to bring about hardware, I don't put much stock in that side of her rumour talk. That's more reminiscent of her insider beginnings than anything else.

Also I would like to hear Orgen take about what happened with the supposed nx reveal in this timeframe.
 

Peterc

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May 15, 2015
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Then 28nm is confirmed. Shit. I mean, it could be TSMC 16nmFF+, but I highly doubt that.

Yeah, everything is pointing to an Xbone level machine at best. Probably worse to keep the power consumption down.

Lol, where are your reading this?

Do you have proof?
 

LewieP

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Jan 30, 2015
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The notion of a key feature of Nintendo's new platform relying on cutting edge technology that neither Microsoft or Sony have yet been able to effectively bring to market despite having dropped huge sums of money into it is laughable.

Nintendo typically use proven technology they can deliver in an accessible manner without relying heavily on additional hardware or services (like high quality internet) for basic functionality.

Some kind of streaming offering as an optional service on top of their platform is somewhat feasible, but it will not be a key aspect of the platform. This is obvious for anyone who has a rudimentary understanding of how Nintendo operate.
 

Skittzo0413

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The notion of a key feature of Nintendo's new platform relying on cutting edge technology that neither Microsoft or Sony haven't yet been able to effectively bring to market despite having dropped huge sums of money into it is laughable.

Nintendo typically use proven technology they can deliver in an accessible manner without relying heavily on additional hardware or services (like high quality internet) for basic functionality.

Some kind of streaming offering as an optional service on top of their platform is somewhat feasible, but it will not be a key aspect of the platform. This is obvious for anyone who has a rudimentary understanding of how Nintendo operate.

Are you referring to the Iwata comments about not wanting competitors to steal their idea for this "new concept"? The new ideas don't necessarily have to use cutting edge technology, just look at the Wii. It was a brand new focus for gaming, used old and proven technology, and Sony and MS did try to "copy" it.

Edit: Oh, or are you referring to the 10k rumor quoted above for some reason? Yeah that's been thoroughly discredited so no one should put any stock into that.
 

Muzy72

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Since Minecraft Wii U is getting more support (Mario DLC woo!) should we expect an NX version relatively early?
 

MK_768

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Are you referring to the Iwata comments about not wanting competitors to steal their idea for this "new concept"? The new ideas don't necessarily have to use cutting edge technology, just look at the Wii. It was a brand new focus for gaming, used old and proven technology, and Sony and MS did try to "copy" it.

Edit: Oh, or are you referring to the 10k rumor quoted above for some reason? Yeah that's been thoroughly discredited so no one should put any stock into that.

Nobody should put any shock into anything he says to be honest.
 

LewieP

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Oh, or are you referring to the 10k rumor quoted above for some reason? Yeah that's been thoroughly discredited so no one should put any stock into that.
Aye, that. I know the source has been thoroughly discredited, my intention was to shut it down and explain why any speculation along these lines is misguided.
 

Skittzo0413

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Nobody should put any shock into anything he says to be honest.

Most of what he reported was fairly vague anyway so it's hard to tell if any of it could've been real information. But that specific "gimmick" rumor just screamed fake to me, and I'm honestly surprised so many people believed it could even be possible with current technology. Not to mention it would be ridiculously expensive, not just for the hardware but for the streaming infrastructure and servers.

That said, 10k did specifically tell us all he was doing was posting rumors he was told, so I doubt it was his intention to mislead. That one rumor he "was told" which turned out to be him quoting someone else's tweet was fairly disingenuous though.

Aye, that. I know the source has been thoroughly discredited, my intention was to shut it down and explain why any speculation along these lines is misguided.

Gotcha, yeah that specific rumor is pretty absurd for a number of reasons, so it's best to ignore it from here on out.
 

georly

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Apr 23, 2013
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Yeah, but people love numbers...

Most don't care about actual numbers, they just care about superlatives.

"Which system is the BEST?"

"Which system has the BEST GRAPHICS?"

"Which system has MOST of my friends online?"

Sometimes, it matter which system has "THE BEST GAME." But that's rarer.
 

MuchoMalo

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I just did some checking: back in the 10k's gigantic thread, she said this



This is the time when the speculation was going insane, with stuff like this



This is what she debunked, the speculation reaching such insane heights in terms of power levels dreams and the GPU. Now, she debunking that kind of GPU doesn't completely close the door to something Polaris-like in the console: maybe a customised one, with lesser costs involved? There was speculation about it in the thread as well. Also, she never debunked what LCGeek said about the CPU.

Moreover, on Twitter, she later specified (I read that tweets) that she just wanted the speculation bringing up comparisons with PS4K in terms of "rivaling / exceeding" to stop. I repeat, she specified her reference to PS4K and not the original, still-on-the market PS4.

P.S. As said several times already, I would be well satisfied with a PS4+ machine, even if slightly, that's not a problem at all :p

A customized chip is always gonna cost more than a standard one, unless there's something else reducing costs... like using 28nm instead of 14nm.

It doesn't really matter what we're happy with as much as the market. Personally, I think that the only routes that make sense are the high-power route and the low-cost route. Just going on-par with current gen at a similar price won't get it anywhere. A $350 console that's 50% faster than PS4 or better would cause people with interest in Nintendo games to think twice before getting a Neo. A console under $200 could be bought as a secondary console. Where does a $250-300 console fit? That's too much for a second console, and doesn't offer enough to be a primary console for wnyone other than people who were satisfied with Wii U. I think Nintendo is going to need more than just their games to be successful.

Still, I think the best case realistically is a 16CU Polaris at more than 900MHz, but noticeably exceeding PS4 in well-optimized games due to Vulkan. The problem is that Polaris 11 only has a 128-bit memory interface.

The notion of a key feature of Nintendo's new platform relying on cutting edge technology that neither Microsoft or Sony have yet been able to effectively bring to market despite having dropped huge sums of money into it is laughable.

Nintendo typically use proven technology they can deliver in an accessible manner without relying heavily on additional hardware or services (like high quality internet) for basic functionality.

Some kind of streaming offering as an optional service on top of their platform is somewhat feasible, but it will not be a key aspect of the platform. This is obvious for anyone who has a rudimentary understanding of how Nintendo operate.

Are you talking about 14nm here? Because that's definitely what the Neo is using.

If you mean the gimmick, I never believed that one lol
 

MK_768

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Most of what he reported was fairly vague anyway so it's hard to tell if any of it could've been real information. But that specific "gimmick" rumor just screamed fake to me, and I'm honestly surprised so many people believed it could even be possible with current technology. Not to mention it would be ridiculously expensive, not just for the hardware but for the streaming infrastructure and servers.

That said, 10k did specifically tell us all he was doing was posting rumors he was told, so I doubt it was his intention to mislead. That one rumor he "was told" which turned out to be him quoting someone else's tweet was fairly disingenuous though.


Agreed. However, my issue with him is as of late. He has said multiple times that he was done tying to find out stuff yet that's all he does. I mean just today he said that he can confirm that FFXV isn't being made for NX right now. I just think he wants a little attention now. But hey that's just me.
 

LewieP

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Jan 30, 2015
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Are you talking about 14nm here? Because that's definitely what the Neo is using.

If you mean the gimmick, I never believed that one lol

Nah, the "gimmick".

14nm is fairly logical given that that's entirely outsourced to AMD, and I even think that's the best explanation for the delay to 2017 when it was obviously otherwise on track for a late 2016 release
 

-Horizon-

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Since Minecraft Wii U is getting more support (Mario DLC woo!) should we expect an NX version relatively early?

That and Undertale should be ready at launch. Get those big hit indie games ready to go. Heck, try to get Stardew Valley on board too.
 

LewieP

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That and Undertale should be ready at launch. Get those big hit indie games ready to go. Heck, try to get Stardew Valley on board too.

I imagine Minecraft will hit NX eventually, but surely MS will let them stew for a bit, won't be there for launch imo.
 
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Well, he works for Mojang and has other devs as followers - so his twitter itself is legit and he could have info/insight.
It's a confusing message though. If I get it right he says nintendo will make an announcement about NX today?

He is a Developer? Perhaps he get a Dev-Kit today.
 

Richie

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Well, he works for Mojang and has other devs as followers - so his twitter itself is legit and he could have info/insight.
It's a confusing message though. If I get it right he says nintendo will make an announcement about NX today?

Wasn't it confirmed we'd get NX info after E3? Even if they just announced a reveal date a month on advance, that'd land square on E3...

He is a Developer? Perhaps he get a Dev-Kit today.

See, this makes more sense, but that'd make his "announcement/reveal" tweet all the weirder.
 

MuchoMalo

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Well, he works for Mojang and has other devs as followers - so his twitter itself is legit and he could have info/insight.
It's a confusing message though. If I get it right he says nintendo will make an announcement about NX today?

>Mojang
>Minecraft
>DLC announced today.

We just got trolled. Or he was just joking about that one guy who said something happens on May 9th. Either way, it's late in Japan. If there were something, we would know already.

See, this makes more sense, but that'd make his "announcement/reveal" tweet all the weirder.



trololololo

Also, a fake reddit leaker posted a fake letter talking about a fake event at the fake end of the fake month of July. Fake.
 

Angry Chair

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Feb 2, 2016
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I really find this "one-way communication" rather tiresome and irksome. She's tweeting responses to certain posts on gaf, but usually her tweets raise more questions than they answer.
It's twitter, it wasn't meant to be used for anything besides posting random thoughts. I'm not saying her posts aren't annoying but it's the best that can be done using the format. Anyway, people shouldn't take everything she says about the NX seriously until she proves she actually knows something about it.
 

Hermii

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Well, he works for Mojang and has other devs as followers - so his twitter itself is legit and he could have info/insight.
It's a confusing message though. If I get it right he says nintendo will make an announcement about NX today?

Maybe they will give Mojang an internal NDAd briefing about the NX. So by "we" he means developers at Mojang.
 

MuchoMalo

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Apr 9, 2016
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Maybe they will give Mojang an internal NDAd briefing about the NX. So by "we" he means developers at Mojang.

See what I posted above.

On another note:

https://twitter.com/ArcadeGirl64/status/729731767863664641

THEN WHY DON'T YOU JUST SAY WHAT REALITY IS!? Seriously, don't criticize people for not knowing what you do. It makes it seem like you're just saying things in piecemeal to get attention. Just say what you heard, get that out of the way, and then people can focus on games like you want. Being all mysterious about it doesn't help, and saying that 14nm unrealistic just because it's new shows that you have no idea what you're talking about. Looking at Iwata's design philosophy, there are more points for it than against it, though one or two points against it are kinda strong.
 

blu

Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
May 4, 2007
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See what I posted above.

On another note:

https://twitter.com/ArcadeGirl64/status/729731767863664641

THEN WHY DON'T YOU JUST SAY WHAT REALITY IS!? Seriously, don't criticize people for not knowing what you do. It makes it seem like you're just saying things in piecemeal to get attention. Just say what you heard, get that out of the way, and then people can focus on games like you want. Being all mysterious about it doesn't help, and saying that 14nm unrealistic just because it's new shows that you have no idea what you're talking about. Looking at Iwata's design philosophy, there are more points for it than against it, though one or two points against it are kinda strong.
Heh. I'm starting to like this girl.
 

udivision

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May 19, 2009
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See what I posted above.

On another note:

https://twitter.com/ArcadeGirl64/status/729731767863664641

THEN WHY DON'T YOU JUST SAY WHAT REALITY IS!? Seriously, don't criticize people for not knowing what you do. It makes it seem like you're just saying things in piecemeal to get attention. Just say what you heard, get that out of the way, and then people can focus on games like you want. Being all mysterious about it doesn't help, and saying that 14nm unrealistic just because it's new shows that you have no idea what you're talking about. Looking at Iwata's design philosophy, there are more points for it than against it, though one or two points against it are kinda strong.

Isn't it better that we have someone to shoot down the nonsense rather than letting speculation run wild?

What if the creator of the controller leak never came out and admitted it? Just imagine how things would be, lol.

Every single NX thread would be a lot worse than they already are.
 

georly

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Apr 23, 2013
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See what I posted above.

On another note:

https://twitter.com/ArcadeGirl64/status/729731767863664641

THEN WHY DON'T YOU JUST SAY WHAT REALITY IS!? Seriously, don't criticize people for not knowing what you do. It makes it seem like you're just saying things in piecemeal to get attention. Just say what you heard, get that out of the way, and then people can focus on games like you want. Being all mysterious about it doesn't help, and saying that 14nm unrealistic just because it's new shows that you have no idea what you're talking about. Looking at Iwata's design philosophy, there are more points for it than against it, though one or two points against it are kinda strong.

Jeez. What did she do to you to make you this upset with her? She's letting people know that they should keep their expectations in check - which everyone should. You (not specifically you, i mean the internet at large) don't want to be disappointed because nintendo didn't meet your grandiose unrealistic expectation of them, as I'm sure she's been reading everywhere on the internet. She may not know the specifics but she also knows it's likely not going to be some insane supercomputer like some people might be expecting.

Expect a nintendo system and you won't be let down. Specifics don't matter. The quality of games brought to the system is all that matters in the end. Whether those games are valuable enough for you to buy the system is the core of all of this. Do graphics matter? To some. Do 3rd party matter? To some. Value of the system is all that matters and raw numbers don't mean jack (unless you think good numbers = better games in the future - which isn't a guarantee. Greatness awaits, remember?).
 
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