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What's the Worst Argument You've Heard to Defend a Game?

captainraincoat

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Once you get past level 50 you can play ranked and it’s a better experience

r6 siege
Never in my 5 year of playing pro counter strike in the late 90s early 2000s have I witnessed the most collection of toxic idiots on one game….finding a good crew to run with is one thing …but solo ranked is like gaming cancer.
 
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So what you are saying is you need to deem that reason "decent" or you will belittle them for disagreeing with you? They need a good reason before you get to the bashing or?

Sir...even when you state this




SO as soon as its a reason you don't deem "decent", they are a fanboy? No views are allowed that you don't feel is decent and let the bashing begin?



I agree bud, but I'd say belittling anyone who has a view you disagree with is just as absurd, they don't need to fucking have any view or opinion that you MUST deem decent and reasonable in order to not get attacked.

How about do not belittle anyone regardless if your views differ man? Wouldn't that make more fucking sense? smh. Its as if the more silly the reason, you think its 100% this open season, attack on sight view simply because you don't get it or disagree or their reason isn't good enough for you.





If someone likes that fucking Goat game and you and I don't fully understand it, that is ok and allowed. They need not provide a solid reason, logical or otherwise on why they like the game and why they play it as us not understanding it is a solid enough reason for some games. They don't need to prove to you shit regarding this. If someone says they like a Big Mac more then water, the fuck you going to do? Sue em? Why would they owe you this deep and logical argument on a subjective concept? Some times it comes down to "you just don't understand" as I can say that how I feel on lots of games that I don't get the popularity of, but what I don't do is demand some "good argument" or else "fanboy" lol The rest of your arguments sound fake as shit, like its trying really, really hard to pretend as if someone is really saying "it sold well, so it must be good" Who the fuck on this forum has stated this about this topic under the context of why they bought or played a game etc?

Is that why no one is even quoted in this shit and its simply this theoretical of things you hope someone would say to um "belittle" them or something? I feel 99% of what you stated is out of context and I wouldn't be surprised if the very people you'd even quote from some thread will not even support that their view was to suggest that the game sale is why they bought the game as in the sole reason.



Ironic as the topic itself is filled with theoreticals that sound like comments completely taken out of context to force this narrative that a games sales was the sole reason someone bought a game or defended a game etc =)

You didn't think something was a bit weird about that? Like how no person is really quoted and its just a list of fake comments that none of us even fucking have the full story to even know what some of the comments you made mean? "Sold a lot thus it's good".....so who said this? What thread? so.....so no one at all? yet I must be twisting it around, on comments that no one made and if they did make them are not even quoted here to defend their comment, in a thread about them defending a game, they themselves can't defend in the thread itself.......

Ok
You know what, it's obvious that you're not paying attention to what I'm saying. I made a very simple point to start the thread, and you're being deliberately obtuse. Read through my post history, and tell me where you see me mocking ANYONE for them liking a game. I might disagree, but there's no instance you'll find of me belittling anyone.
I've made many reviews where the ONLY responses are the nonsense rebuttals that I have given you. If someone gives me a decent reason, even as little as, "well I liked the game", THAT is enough for me. THAT is a decent reason. My problem is when people use absolute non sequitur arguments like "make your own game". Once again, look at the OP, and tell me how in the world you think that it applies to gaming, when it makes zero sense in ANY other industry.

And sorry, but there's a term for people who can't accept criticism for a game they like, and instead resort to petty insults or deflections, and the term is "fanboy". People who can carry on a rational conversation and have a good give and take aren't fanboys.

And it's really funny that you're going to pretend like no one uses those useless arguments. I've seen them all literally hundreds of times. Give me a break. That's why I said you're being deliberately obtuse
 
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TLZ

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My favorite is "Dark Souls/Bloodborne Needs Easy Mode, game is impossible to play!!!!1111" No, how about you fuck off, the game was not designed for you and it is actually not that difficult if you use your brain and have some patience (Clearly these people do not)
Aren't you proving OP's point?
 

Vaelka

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I've heard this in recent years with Anime too, '' I like it because the female characters aren't sexualized ''.
As if that makes characters bad and if they're not '' sexualized '' then it makes them good?
Such a shallow view...

And also why I feel like it's especially stupid is because these same people then give others shit if a character or game they like gets censored and say that '' it doesn't matter who gives a shit '' and don't see the obvious hypocrisy.
And the same people also live in some alternate reality where every single female character in existence is '' oversexualized '' whatever the hell that means, and then every time a character that they think isn't exists they're all like '' wow finally I've never seen this before ''.
Either they're lying, have short term memory or they've never played a game before and are just repeating lies they've heard.

It's the same with the whole '' bikini armor '' thing, please tell me what games especially modern ones that have this?
I actually like that stuff and I feel like I have no options other than really really old games or Korean games like Tera and often times they get censored when brought over too if they're brought over at all.
I dunno what alternate reality some people are inhabiting where like every female character has big boobs and wears a platekini ala Tera like wtf are people even talking about.

This ofc goes the other way around but I tend to see it one way.
It's like female characters are always this battlefield over this but some people are more delusional about it than the other imo.
I have my own preferences too but how a female character looks doesn't make the game good or bad.
 
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TheSHEEEP

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My favourite is "I like the game, therefore it is good" (or "I don't like the game, therefore it is bad").

Some people are really bad at separating their own enjoyment of a game from a game's objective qualities.
I'm sure everyone can tell a bunch of games they know are good, but totally not their jam, while also liking some other games they know are really not good games.

Sometimes, people do indeed not "get it" when talking about a game and criticize things that might have been the entire point of the title to begin with.
But not all criticisms of a game's flaws can be waved off as that, which often enough happens.
 
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DonkeyPunchJr

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You know what, it's obvious that you're not paying attention to what I'm saying. I made a very simple point to start the thread, and you're being deliberately obtuse. Read through my post history, and tell me where you see me mocking ANYONE for them liking a game. I might disagree, but there's no instance you'll find of me belittling anyone.
I've made many reviews where the ONLY responses are the nonsense rebuttals that I have given you. If someone gives me a decent reason, even as little as, "well I liked the game", THAT is enough for me. THAT is a decent reason. My problem is when people use absolute non sequitur arguments like "make your own game". Once again, look at the OP, and tell me how in the world you think that it applies to gaming, when it makes zero sense in ANY other industry.

And sorry, but there's a term for people who can't accept criticism for a game they like, and instead resort to petty insults or deflections, and the term is "fanboy". People who can carry on a rational conversation and have a good give and take aren't fanboys.

And it's really funny that you're going to pretend like no one uses those useless arguments. I've seen them all literally hundreds of times. Give me a break. That's why I said you're being deliberately obtuse
The best part is when the people who say “I’d like to see you make a better game” then switch their tactic to bait you into naming a game you like so they can bash it and put you on the defensive. No self awareness whatsoever. Just a fanboy who’s enraged that someone derailed their hype train.

I usually just tell them “okay so I’m sure you’ve never criticized a game, movie, song, album, book, TV show etc unless you have personally created something better”. If that doesn’t shut them up then I tell them “obviously you disagree with the entire concept of critical review, so how about you stay out of this review/criticism thread”
 
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The best part is when the people who say “I’d like to see you make a better game” then switch their tactic to bait you into naming a game you like so they can bash it and put you on the defensive. No self awareness whatsoever. Just a fanboy who’s enraged that someone derailed their hype train.

I usually just tell them “okay so I’m sure you’ve never criticized a game, movie, song, album, book, TV show etc unless you have personally created something better”. If that doesn’t shut them up then I tell them “obviously you disagree with the entire concept of critical review, so how about you stay out of this review/criticism thread”
Yeah, that's a cheap tactic that you can see coming a mile away. Whenever I see "So tell me a game you do like", I know that they're not really interested in the game, they're simply trying to tee you up so that they can criticize whatever game you mention.
 
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Sorry, but I understand what subjectivity is. That's not the point I made whatsoever. This isn't about different tastes. It's about bad arguments. Way to deliberately miss the point of the OP.

You only judge it as a bad argument because you have a different opinion.

The main point has actually gone over your head.

Frankly, gaming tastes are inherently subjective. So your primary premise that gamers have to be able to construct rational arguments to defend their subjective gaming tastes is a faulty premise to begin with. Their tastes are inherently subjective, so there is no obligation on them to defend them at all.

Ergo, your misunderstanding of the inherent subjectivity of gaming tastes has led you to making this thread under an illogical premise that doesn't stand up to any scrutiny.
 
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You only judge it as a bad argument because you have a different opinion.

The main point has actually gone over your head.

Frankly, gaming tastes are inherently subjective. So your primary premise that gamers have to be able to construct rational arguments to defend their subjective gaming tastes is a faulty premise to begin with. Their tastes are inherently subjective, so there is no obligation on them to defend them at all.

Ergo, your misunderstanding of the inherent subjectivity of gaming tastes has led you to making this thread under an illogical premise that doesn't stand up to any scrutiny.
Lol You're entirely ignoring everything I've said. I have ZERO issues with people making a defense for a game. I have ZERO issues with people who like a certain game. Saying "go make your own game" isn't a subjective opinion about ANYTHING, and that's the point I've been making the whole time. It's a nonsense statement from people who can't over the fact that everyone isn't in love with a game like they are. You tell me that I don't "understand subjective opinions", yet you seem to not even grasp what an opinion actually entails. I'll let people argue all day about game difficulty, mechanics, story, etc. I have no problem with that, because THOSE ARE SUBJECTIVE OPINIONS. Using non-arguments because you're upset that a person doesn't agree with you is what the thread was about.
Are you really going to keep pretending that you don't understand the massive difference between the two things? That seems to be the running theme in this thread.
 
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DonkeyPunchJr

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You only judge it as a bad argument because you have a different opinion.

The main point has actually gone over your head.

Frankly, gaming tastes are inherently subjective. So your primary premise that gamers have to be able to construct rational arguments to defend their subjective gaming tastes is a faulty premise to begin with. Their tastes are inherently subjective, so there is no obligation on them to defend them at all.

Ergo, your misunderstanding of the inherent subjectivity of gaming tastes has led you to making this thread under an illogical premise that doesn't stand up to any scrutiny.
^ does this count as one of the dumbest arguments?

Yes, it’s true that nobody is obligated to defend their subjective opinions. This thread is about people who CHOOSE to defend them and do so with some really flimsy and ridiculous arguments.

And if your only response to critical review is to whine “but, but that’s just your opinion!!!” (and throw in some $5 words to make you sound like an intellectual) then why are you even engaging with the criticism at all? Yeah, no shit it’s subjective, you aren’t saying anything worthwhile in continually pointing that out.
 
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Clear

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Sorry, but I understand what subjectivity is. That's not the point I made whatsoever. This isn't about different tastes. It's about bad arguments. Way to deliberately miss the point of the OP.

Are you sure its that? The thread title says explicitly the context is defending a game.

That's pretty specific as it boils down to two general scenarios: One where the initial* viewpoint is negative and the arguer is trying to make a case that there's actually real merit worthy of highlighting, the other where we start from a positive reception, which is then criticized and its that negative reaction that elicits the "make your own" retort.

Reading the OP, its clear as day that you are thinking about the latter case.

This as I've already said is more about the acceptability and validity of the criticism than about the work itself. Not to labour the point but it strikes me that you simply don't like your negative opinions being pushed back against.

Fundamentally, you need to accept that especially when taking a negatively contrarian stance against a piece of entertainment you are not arguing from a position of strength. You are not only bringing bad news, but you are also telling people who didn't seem to see it that way, that they were wrong and should revise their position!

Like I said, this isn't a situation you can just bash your way through! You need to be persuasive because otherwise you're just going to get people's backs up. Which is fine if you really don't care about anything more than making your point, but if you take that tack simultaneously you can't really complain about others being bullish and dismissive in return.

Which to sum up, says to me this is more about ego and expectation than anything else.



*I mean this in the sense of the flow of the argument/debate. Its implicit because the need to "defend" requires an "attack" either anticipated or in process.
 
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Lol You're entirely ignoring everything I've said. I have ZERO issues with people making a defense for a game. I have ZERO issues with people who like a certain game. Saying "go make your own game" isn't a subjective opinion about ANYTHING, and that's the point I've been making the whole time. It's a nonsense statement from people who can't over the fact that everyone isn't in love with a game like they are. You tell me that I don't "understand subjective opinions", yet you seem to not even grasp what an opinion actually entails. I'll let people argue all day about game difficulty, mechanics, story, etc. I have no problem with that, because THOSE ARE SUBJECTIVE OPINIONS. Using non-arguments because you're upset that a person doesn't agree with you is what the thread was about.
Are you really going to keep pretending that you don't understand the massive difference between the two things? That seems to be the running theme in this thread.

^ does this count as one of the dumbest arguments?

Yes, it’s true that nobody is obligated to defend their subjective opinions. This thread is about people who CHOOSE to defend them and do so with some really flimsy and ridiculous arguments.

And if your only response to critical review is to whine “but, but that’s just your opinion!!!” (and throw in some $5 words to make you sound like an intellectual) then why are you even engaging with the criticism at all? Yeah, no shit it’s subjective, you aren’t saying anything worthwhile in continually pointing that out.

Both of you are still missing the point.

The premise of your thread OP, is that if someone pushes back against your expressed criticism of a game (which is subjective) with a non-argument based on their own subjective opinion of a game, it's somehow bad or wrong or objectionable in an objective sense.

It's not!!! It's immaterial.

Both of you hold your own subjective opinions. Both of you are entitled to do so. And surprise surprise, both of your are entitled to object to each other's expressed opinions using arguments or non-arguments because neither are at all relevant.

The point is, your opinions are subjective, therefore how a person responds to your expressed criticism largely doesn't matter. The quality (logical or otherwise) of their response doesn't matter.

Because each of your opinions on the games is subjective anyway.

I agree with Clear Clear , it just sounds like you don't like your expressed views on a game being challenged. You should care less about needing others to validate your viewpoints on something you experienced and liked or disliked.
 
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Guilty_AI

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I agree with some of what you're saying but for the most part I would argue somebody actually saying that you "don't get it" or "it's art" it's probably the most logical argument they could make to defend the game based on them liking it because they're basically telling you they like something that you don't like. they got it, you didn't.... this is as subjective as it gets which means it's not really a dumb defense, it's the most the logical...

Not everyone is going to get or like the same type of art which means there is no objective thing going on in which a defense like that would be bad.

It's simply means you disagree...that's it.

It's equivalent to getting a painting and having a room full of 10 people agree or disagree with liking it or not and then making it sound like it's now in "excuse" to disagree with you lol

So to even try to argue that something artistic is some excuse is the question why you even play games in the first place or why you feel you need to force your idea upon other users that might simply just disagree with your artistic views as opposed to their own.
There's three things that people need to imprint onto their minds when touching on these types of discussion:

A. Art can be objectively criticized
B. You don't necessarely understand why you like what you like.
C. You can like shitty things

What that means is that its perfectly possible to have a scenario where a person likes some really bad game or a dumb movie, but is incapable of formulating a convincing argument as to why he likes it.
Thats the reason "its art!" or even "i like it and thats my opinion!" aren't real defenses for a piece. After all, art can be bad and you liking something doesn't really mean anything from a objective standpoint.
 
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Both of you are still missing the point.

The premise of your thread OP, is that if someone pushes back against your expressed criticism of a game (which is subjective) with a non-argument based on their own subjective opinion of a game, it's somehow bad or wrong or objectionable in an objective sense.

It's not!!! It's immaterial.

Both of you hold your own subjective opinions. Both of you are entitled to do so. And surprise surprise, both of your are entitled to object to each other's expressed opinions using arguments or non-arguments because neither are at all relevant.

The point is, your opinions are subjective, therefore how a person responds to your expressed criticism largely doesn't matter. The quality (logical or otherwise) of their response doesn't matter.

Because each of your opinions on the games is subjective anyway.

I agree with Clear Clear , it just sounds like you don't like your expressed views on a game being challenged. You should care less about needing others to validate your viewpoints on something you experienced and liked or disliked.
No, that isn't the premise of the thread, and I've clearly explained my point multiple times. You're ENTIRELY IGNORING the premise, because you want to have a tangential rant about subjectivity, when that's the exact opposite of the arguments I'm discussing. Saying "go make your own game" isn't a challenge to an opinion. If I give reasons why a game has bad writing, a logical response would be to counter with reasons WHY you actually liked the writing. What you're describing is the opposite of what I'm doing,in fact YOU'RE the one doing it now.
And acting like everyone's opinion is entirely immaterial makes me wonder why you are on a gaming forum in the first place. A place where everyone gives their opinion lol. People discuss games here. I'm talking about people who DON'T want a discussion, they just want everyone to fall in line with their opinion. People who want to jam their fingers in their ears and demand that everyone like what they themselves like. The way people respond does matter, because it tells you who is willing to have a discussion, and who is not. I have no issue with people challenging my opinion about a game, but too many people choose to do so without being able to form a thought in their heads. Once again, I'm talking about people who DON'T make an actual rebuttal to what other people are saying. I'm talking about entirely dismissing someone with a non-answer.
Are you REALLY not understanding the difference there, because you sound like you're not grasping it at all
 
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Are you sure its that? The thread title says explicitly the context is defending a game.

That's pretty specific as it boils down to two general scenarios: One where the initial* viewpoint is negative and the arguer is trying to make a case that there's actually real merit worthy of highlighting, the other where we start from a positive reception, which is then criticized and its that negative reaction that elicits the "make your own" retort.

Reading the OP, its clear as day that you are thinking about the latter case.

This as I've already said is more about the acceptability and validity of the criticism than about the work itself. Not to labour the point but it strikes me that you simply don't like your negative opinions being pushed back against.

Fundamentally, you need to accept that especially when taking a negatively contrarian stance against a piece of entertainment you are not arguing from a position of strength. You are not only bringing bad news, but you are also telling people who didn't seem to see it that way, that they were wrong and should revise their position!

Like I said, this isn't a situation you can just bash your way through! You need to be persuasive because otherwise you're just going to get people's backs up. Which is fine if you really don't care about anything more than making your point, but if you take that tack simultaneously you can't really complain about others being bullish and dismissive in return.

Which to sum up, says to me this is more about ego and expectation than anything else.



*I mean this in the sense of the flow of the argument/debate. Its implicit because the need to "defend" requires an "attack" either anticipated or in process.
Lol you're acting like there's no fair way to criticize a game. You're only proving my overall point here, so thanks
 
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No, that isn't the premise of the thread, and I've clearly explained my point multiple times. You're ENTIRELY IGNORING the premise, because you want to have a tangential rant about subjectivity, when that's the exact opposite of the arguments I'm discussing. Saying "go make your own game" isn't a challenge to an opinion. If I give reasons why a game has bad writing, a logical response would be to counter with reasons WHY you actually liked the writing. What you're describing is the opposite of what I'm doing,in fact YOU'RE the one doing it now.
And acting like everyone's opinion is entirely immaterial makes me wonder why you are on a gaming forum in the first place. A place where everyone gives their opinion lol. People discuss games here. I'm talking about people who DON'T want a discussion, they just want everyone to fall in line with their opinion. People who want to jam their fingers in their ears and demand that everyone like what they themselves like. The way people respond does matter, because it tells you who is willing to have a discussion, and who is not. I have no issue with people challenging my opinion about a game, but too many people choose to do so without being able to form a thought in their heads. Once again, I'm talking about people who DON'T make an actual rebuttal to what other people are saying. I'm talking about entirely dismissing someone with a non-answer.
Are you REALLY not understanding the difference there, because you sound like you're not grasping it at all
You keep repeating the same ill-conceived point as if by repeating it you're suddenly going to make it have any logical basis.

Ok, let's try it this way.

Why does it matter so much to you that a person is responding to your criticism with a non-argument or non-rebuttal? Why the fuck do you care?

If you're convinced of the validity of your criticism, it shouldn't matter what people think, and therefore it should matter even less how they choose to express what they think or not.

I just don't understand why this subject seems to be such a sticking point as if other people not being able to articulate why they disagree with your subjective opinion makes their subjective disagreement any more or less meaningful. When both perspectives are subjective, neither is required to articulate their positions with any eloquence at all.

You say that I didn't capture the premise of your thread and argument in my last post, but I precisely did. Because you essentially just repeated what I said back to me. You're angry that people can't properly express their disagreement. But why do you feel entitled to an elegantly articulated rebuttal in the first place?

Your entire argument is incoherent and reeks of neuroticism, I'm afraid to say.
 
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Dave_at_Home

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"It's amazing once you finish two extra playthroughs to see the real ending, trust me, it's only 40h until you get to that point."
Nier: Automata
This game has received insane amounts of praise. Seems to have earned it for the most part. I have no desire to play it but I have watched lots of stuff about it. Nice to see someone that has a different take.

Now here I watch as the pitchforks come for you...
Meme Reaction GIF by Silicon Valley
 
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Dave_at_Home

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Encountered this recently with Deathloop, in regards to the lack of an actual"story" and characters. Someone posted a huge response, telling me about all the background lore. Lore and characters don't make a story.
I enjoy Halo (the Bungie ones anyway) as much as the next guy, but there's no way in hell I will ever believe the story has any depth whatsoever. Great gameplay and atmosphere don't make up for cookie cutter characters and bland plot.

I literally had someone tell me "I need to read the novels in order to appreciate Master Chief and the story more".

I don't give a shit what is written in any novel based on a game. If it's not in the damn game than it doesn't matter.
 
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EDMIX

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but there's no instance you'll find of me belittling anyone.
You own post suggest you save that for people who don't give you a "decent" reason for them liking a game.
If someone gives me a decent reason, even as little as, "well I liked the game", THAT is enough for me.
Nahhhh doesn't sound that way at all, when you suggest something like "you don't get it" as not a good enough reason, but try to backpaddle and pretend "i liked the game" is now a solid reason, it sounds like a cop out as I think you get how that sounds.
a term for people who can't accept criticism for a game they like, and instead resort to petty insults or deflections, and the term is "fanboy"
The irony. Other people use petty insults and then proceeds name calls themselves.... too funny.
People who can carry on a rational conversation and have a good give and take aren't fanboys.
I see...so you only reserve this name calling of "fanboys" to people you don't agree with? smh. Yet for fuck sakes you are saying you not belittling anyone though?
And it's really funny that you're going to pretend like no one uses those useless arguments.

Never said anything like that, simply that you are not even quoting those who have said such statements to even understand the context in which they are making the statement in the first place.

ie "Sold a lot thus it's good", why don't you just go in a review thread and quote someone who states that and let them tell you why vs trying to make a fake fucking narrative completely out of context.
 
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You own post suggest you save that for people who don't give you a "decent" reason for them liking a game.

Nahhhh doesn't sound that way at all, when you suggest something like "you don't get it" as not a good enough reason, but try to backpaddle and pretend "i liked the game" is now a solid reason, it sounds like a cop out as I think you get how that sounds.

The irony. Other people use petty insults and then proceeds name calls themselves.... too funny.

I see...so you only reserve this name calling of "fanboys" to people you don't agree with? smh. Yet for fuck sakes you are saying you not belittling anyone though?


Never said anything like that, simply that you are not even quoting those who have said such statements to even understand the context in which they are making the statement in the first place.

ie "Sold a lot thus it's good", why don't you just go in a review thread and quote someone who states that and let them tell you why vs trying to make a fake fucking narrative completely out of context.
Funny that you're so adamant about being taken out of context, when you're doing your best to completely take EVERY word I'm saying out of context. Way to selectively edit out everything I said to amend and qualify my post. Not going to keep going back and forth with you over this, because you're just being willfully ignorant at this point
 
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EDMIX

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Funny that you're so adamant about being taken out of context

I never said anything about me being taken out of context bud, that is for those who you are quoting as we don't have any of those people here to defend what was even being stated, in a fucking thread about defending a game, they can't um "defend" their view as they are not listed, added, tagged etc.

Way to selectively edit out everything I said

Don't know what to say bud, you are talking about not belittling people, but hey ONLY if they give you a good enough reason and then also calling people "fanboys" who disagree. Anyone can read what you've stated regarding that, I'm not deleting your post or something, they exist for anyone to fully read what you've stated...

you're just being willfully ignorant

We just disagree lol Go in any review thread and put your own fucking view to the test and actually quote people on this site who have ever said some shit like "Sold a lot thus it's good". They are either being sarcastic, joking etc or their view is taken out of context greatly.

Let them tell you what they mean vs you telling us a series of fucking fake quotes that never happened or worse, taken out of context to attack those who don't even know you are quoting them to defend their points in the first place.
 

Kumomeme

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" all the critism just a minority"

anything with on same line as this.

either pretended to be blind, or lie to themself for self comfort.
 
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BusierDonkey

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It gets better __ hours in!

Why would I want to wade through hours of shit to get to a puddle of piss?
 
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EDMIX

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It gets better __ hours in!

Why would I want to wade through hours of shit to get to a puddle of piss?

Maybe lol.

Lots have said this, but I don't think its a bad argument. Days Gone for example does indeed get better later in the game, so its hard for me to say if someone will like it or not if they don't complete it. I personally felt it was ok mid way thru, I thought it was pretty good after I was done as the story picks up and you go to new areas and get new abilities and it wraps up nicely. Some times a game can take some time to pick up, some times its crazy fun from beginning to end, so I actually get what some might mean when they say "gets better" especially for RPGs or RPG lights lol

" all the critism just a minority"

anything with on same line as this.

either pretended to be blind, or lie to themself for self comfort.

Well...even this can make sense depending on the context, we've seen many times where gamers online try their best to make it sound like EVERYONE is outraged and turns out the game not only moves massive units, it breaks records.

Battlefront 2015 (oh majority don't want it) becomes best selling Star Wars game

Far Cry 5 (MOST far cry fans don't want this) becomes best selling Far Cry in history

We also see that same shit with Call Of Duty and AC, you'll get people making it sound like ALL the fanbase doesn't want em, only for those titles to move record units.

I'd argue, the most hardcore communities that will give those deep criticisms 90% of the time happen to be the minority. Most of what I listed should have failed based on that logic btw. I don't know if I'd say its enough to defend a game 100% regardless, but it has merit and its based on context of what is being talked about etc.
 

dbilyliker

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"It's good with friends!"

...like, that describes almost literally any activity a human being could engage in.
looool
well,I could even enjoy playing Spider solitaire with my friends, but it don't means that I would like to pay $60 for a spider solitaire
 

Clear

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Lol you're acting like there's no fair way to criticize a game. You're only proving my overall point here, so thanks

Do yourself a favour and just take the L.

As I've shown its not about your right to criticise, its about everyone else's right to not validate your criticism.
 
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Kumomeme

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Well...even this can make sense depending on the context, we've seen many times where gamers online try their best to make it sound like EVERYONE is outraged and turns out the game not only moves massive units, it breaks records.

Battlefront 2015 (oh majority don't want it) becomes best selling Star Wars game

Far Cry 5 (MOST far cry fans don't want this) becomes best selling Far Cry in history

We also see that same shit with Call Of Duty and AC, you'll get people making it sound like ALL the fanbase doesn't want em, only for those titles to move record units.

I'd argue, the most hardcore communities that will give those deep criticisms 90% of the time happen to be the minority. Most of what I listed should have failed based on that logic btw. I don't know if I'd say its enough to defend a game 100% regardless, but it has merit and its based on context of what is being talked about etc.
yep. depend on the context. on the argument.

but like you mention, the massive units sold point usually being used to counter against the argument and depend on the context, this also often be use to 'discarded' the critism, be it fair critism or not.

its like certain critism over obvious flaw of certain game, and the fans basically like: "who cares, it sold millions!".
 
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The Hourly Wage Debater.

Bob: That game is shit. Waste of $60!

Tom: No it's not.

Bob: How so?

Tom: Played it for 20 hours. That's only $3/hr. Cheaper than going to a movie.
 
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Rest

All these years later I still chuckle at what a fucking moron that guy is.
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FFXIII - it gets better after 30hrs of gameplay.

And of course "better" doesn't mean "good".

every person that is like "it gets good after 5+h... STFU and stick that game up your arse where it belongs, cuz that's a shit game...

if a game is only fun after you invest as much time as it takes to complete a freaking smaller title, then it's a shit game

It gets really good after 50 hours!

X game gets better after x hours.

A game has 5 minutes to be fun. I play games to have fun and be entertained immediately. If a game fails to be fun immediately, it has failed to be a good game.
 
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EDMIX

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yep. depend on the context. on the argument.

but like you mention, the massive units sold point usually being used to counter against the argument and depend on the context, this also often be use to 'discarded' the critism, be it fair critism or not.

its like certain critism over obvious flaw of certain game, and the fans basically like: "who cares, it sold millions!".

True, in that situation I can see how that would be absurd as an excuse to like or defend a game.

R Rest lol well it depends on the game or the gamer.

I feel it depends on the game personally. Like a puzzle game, I need a loop that I can get and have fun with in mere minutes, where many RPGs I'm playing the long game. Like hype opening, interesting story, learn the battle system for a bit, dungeon, boss, more story stuff ....repeat. So some loops I like if its a puzzle game like Lumines, some loops I'm ok with being a bit long if it pays off similar to suspense vs horror films.

Some like the long build up to the cool climax in a suspense

Some like the instant gore, murder, blood, high body count etc of a horror lol.


I tend to like both depending on game, film, book etc. I feel it has its place if done correctly. So I play many games for that instant fun like Battlefield MP or something, but I still have fun playing the long game in a RPG.
 
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GametimeUK

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I really hate it when there's a mutliplayer game my friends want to play which I think looks terrible. They use the excuse "it will be fun with friends".

Then when there's a multiplayer game that I want to play and they don't like the look of it the same excuse doesn't apply.