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Who knew that giving a female character feminine features would be so offensive.

PJX

Member
So I was working on character designs with a team of about 8 of us. One of the characters we are creating is a female character. Now mind you two of the team members are females and one of them was the main designer for the female character. So she was showing us the design and one of the guys said "Making her so curvy will offend women" and this guy actually point to the tweet of that guy who left Insomniac over the design of Rivet. So an argument broke out with the other guys in the room and the two women just sat there watching them argue. What I found very funny was that the person who design the character was a woman and here you have this feminist male telling us that women would find that design offensive.
 

Kuranghi

Gold Member
Yeah, he sounds like a craphead. Has he never seen most women? They aren't generally gaunt waifs :messenger_tears_of_joy: I'm quite partial to a miniature waif myself and its slim pickings in these stay-at-home-assisted-fatting times I'll tell you that much.

Were either of the two woman in the room "curvy"? That would make the situtation even more hilarious that it already is. Denying someones existence while they are in the room is peak brainwashing behaviour.
 

Haggard

Member
So I was working on character designs with a team of about 8 of us. One of the characters we are creating is a female character. Now mind you two of the team members are females and one of them was the main designer for the female character. So she was showing us the design and one of the guys said "Making her so curvy will offend women" and this guy actually point to the tweet of that guy who left Insomniac over the design of Rivet. So an argument broke out with the other guys in the room and the two women just sat there watching them argue. What I found very funny was that the person who design the character was a woman and here you have this feminist male telling us that women would find that design offensive.
Sounds like your team needs some replacements and the mental ward gets a new inmate.
 

WitchHunter

Member
So I was working on character designs with a team of about 8 of us. One of the characters we are creating is a female character. Now mind you two of the team members are females and one of them was the main designer for the female character. So she was showing us the design and one of the guys said "Making her so curvy will offend women" and this guy actually point to the tweet of that guy who left Insomniac over the design of Rivet. So an argument broke out with the other guys in the room and the two women just sat there watching them argue. What I found very funny was that the person who design the character was a woman and here you have this feminist male telling us that women would find that design offensive.
1. People will find a way to masturbate on whatever they see fit. There were even videos where people wanked on the lopoly WoW characters...
2. Feminist male because he thought that a woman with larger than average breasts/buttocks is offensive?
3. Give the character proper dialogues and actions that actually are reminescent of how a woman acts in real life. Not just replace the role previously filled by a male character with a female model and consider the job done.
 
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PJX

Member
People that post at Reeeeesetera?
True story.

One of my colleagues used to go there but I remember him showing me a post that got him banned and I just laughed. It was in a topic during an E3 conference and Sarah Bond came on the stage. He ha snever seen her before so he made this exact comment "Wow Sarah Bond is a gorgeous woman" That comment there got him a banned and the reason they gave him was that he was ignoring her accomplishments.

Yeah, he sounds like a craphead. Has he never seen most women? They aren't generally gaunt waifs :messenger_tears_of_joy: I'm quite partial to a miniature waif myself and its slim pickings in these stay-at-home-assisted-fatting times I'll tell you that much.

Were either of the two woman in the room "curvy"? That would make the situtation even more hilarious that it already is. Denying someones existence while they are in the room is peak brainwashing behaviour.

One of them I would say is a bit curvy while the other is just average. The one who designed the character is the average one.
 

SlimySnake

Member
So I was working on character designs with a team of about 8 of us. One of the characters we are creating is a female character. Now mind you two of the team members are females and one of them was the main designer for the female character. So she was showing us the design and one of the guys said "Making her so curvy will offend women" and this guy actually point to the tweet of that guy who left Insomniac over the design of Rivet. So an argument broke out with the other guys in the room and the two women just sat there watching them argue. What I found very funny was that the person who design the character was a woman and here you have this feminist male telling us that women would find that design offensive.
This is pretty disheartening to read. Just goes to show that one nutjob on twitter has managed to affect game development.

People tend to forget that games, movies, tv shows and even novels are a form of escapism. You are literally tuning in to leave the current world behind and get absorbed into this other world for a few hours. That's why protagonists look like models because we dont want to see ourselves up on the screen. How many guys look like Brad Pitt, Tom Cruise or Arnold Schwarzenger? How many women look like Jennifer Aniston? Or Angelina Jolie. Should they not get hired because fat or ugly girls cant see themselves in those characters?

I dont mind diversity. I dont think every character in the game needs to look like Thor, but when it comes to leads, great looks have to be a must. Even the ND artists agreed on a panel about Uncharted 4 where she admitted that your protagonist has to look attractive.
 
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cormack12

Gold Member
So who won in the end? 😂

 

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
So I was working on character designs with a team of about 8 of us. One of the characters we are creating is a female character. Now mind you two of the team members are females and one of them was the main designer for the female character. So she was showing us the design and one of the guys said "Making her so curvy will offend women" and this guy actually point to the tweet of that guy who left Insomniac over the design of Rivet. So an argument broke out with the other guys in the room and the two women just sat there watching them argue. What I found very funny was that the person who design the character was a woman and here you have this feminist male telling us that women would find that design offensive.

I swear I view every word of your post to be a great thing. It's good that people are having these conversations. The bad part is, it doesn't sound like the guys got the women involved in the conversation, which is weird.......
 

PJX

Member
That person seems very toxic for a creative working environment. Time to boot him from the team.
Unfortunately that isn't up to me but I'm close with the owner of the studio. I just had talk with the two women and they actually are upset and very offended that the guy was talking for them. So I might have a chat with the owner and see about having him removed from this project.
 

Kuranghi

Gold Member
True story.

One of my colleagues used to go there but I remember him showing me a post that got him banned and I just laughed. It was in a topic during an E3 conference and Sarah Bond came on the stage. He ha snever seen her before so he made this exact comment "Wow Sarah Bond is a gorgeous woman" That comment there got him a banned and the reason they gave him was that he was ignoring her accomplishments.

One of them I would say is a bit curvy while the other is just average. The one who designed the character is the average one.

Women hate to be complicated on their looks so its probably for the best he was banned. For people like him, its just a failure in their thinking that causes them to believe extreme over-categorization is the way forward, thinking the ideal way to live is everyone being put in their little sub-divided camps so everyone knows at all times exactly where they fall on the Oppression Meter of Life Wackness™. Which is obviously an insanely dangerous path to go down.

Excellent hyper-irony on the 2nd part. Sorry lady you're offensively curvy now go the woods and execute yourself with a revolver like in that episode of Sliders where fat people are banned. What the hell is wrong with these people... well I think I know the answer already but applying the cure is the difficult part.

Their mid life crises are going to be epically funny to observe, we're already seeing the start of it from people who got in early on the crazy-train of insulate everyone from the slightest amount of negativity. Articles about people not knowing why they keep getting rejected 🤔 here a hint for you, its cause you gone cray-cray and stopped thinking critically about these sorts of things.
 

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
This is pretty disheartening to read. Just goes to show that one nutjob on twitter has managed to affect game development.

People tend to forget that games, movies, tv shows and even novels are a form of escapism. You are literally tuning it to leave the current world behind and get absorbed into this other world for a few hours. That's why protaganists look like models because we dont want to see ourselves up on the screen. How many guys look like Brad Pitt, Tom Cruise or Arnold Schwarzenger? How many women look like Jennifer Aniston? Or Angelina Jolie. Should they not get hired because fat or ugly girls cant see themselves in those characters?

I dont mind diversity. I dont think every character in the game needs to look like Thor, but when it comes to leads, great looks have to be a must. Even the ND artists agreed on a panel about Uncharted 4 where she admitted that your protagonist has to look attractive.

The bolded is 100% NOT true. Like AT ALL!
 

PJX

Member
I swear I view every word of your post to be a great thing. It's good that people are having these conversations. The bad part is, it doesn't sound like the guys got the women involved in the conversation, which is weird.......
The other guys were trying to get them involved but that guy was so over the top, as a man, it was very embarrassing.

Like someone said above, not every character needs to be a Tom Cruise, Idris Elba, Salma Hayek or Angelina Jolie, but don't speak for everyone. Especially when the person who created the character is a woman and she is right there.
 

Guilty_AI

Member
but when it comes to leads, great looks have to be a must. Even the ND artists agreed on a panel about Uncharted 4 where she admitted that your protagonist has to look attractive.
Depends. Its just that if your lead will look bad or plain, you have to compensate by making it an actually interesting or charismatic character.
 

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
What makes you say that? Did you watch that panel and heard her say different?

Because we've seen games that sell well that don't have all attractive main leads. Plus, what's consider "attractive" is different in different countries\regions.

Would consider the following attractive?

- Gordon Freeman
- Agent 47
- Marcus Fenix
- Max Payne
- John Marston
- Nico Bellic
- Selene (Returnal)

The other guys were trying to get them involved but that guy was so over the top, as a man, it was very embarrassing.

Like someone said above, not every character needs to be a Tom Cruise, Idris Elba, Salma Hayek or Angelina Jolie, but don't speak for everyone. Especially when the person who created the character is a woman and she is right there.

Yeah, that sounds super embarrassing and annoying.
 
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SlimySnake

Member
Because we've seen games that sell well that don't have all attractive main leads. Plus, what's consider "attractive" is different in different countries\regions.

Would consider the following attractive?

- Gordon Freeman
- Agent 47
- Marcus Fenix
- Max Payne
- John Marston
- Nico Bellic



Yeah, that sounds super embarrassing and annoying.
Well, thats what she said. I am guessing you took an issue with me saying that attractive protagonists are a must in which case Id argue that pretty much everyone aside from Nico on that list is 6 foot tall, fit, muscular with broad shoulders and a wide jaw synonymous with good looking males.

None of those guys look like George from Seinfeld. They dont look pretty like Brad Pitt, but they dont lack the manly equivalent of female curves either. Joel for example is very attractive compared to Abby. He looks gruff and rundown. He's supposed to be in his late 40s and yet despite all that he looks better than Abby a 22 year old girl made to look like a man.
 

Kuranghi

Gold Member
I will never understand how we preach not to tell women how to dress, and they can wear as explicit as they deem fit, but that somehow changes in designs for game characters.

Like, how does that work?

Am I just crazy?

IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.

yes i am going crazy mike napoli GIF

I for one can't wait until we are at the point where most women dress like Faye Valentine from Cowboy Bebop, it'll be fun for a (good) while but I don't think its viable long term:



I prefer to see a woman's clam-mound after I've got to know them a bit, but I'm old fashioned like that. I believe Faye was overcompensating for being the galaxy's oldest woman at least.
 
What I found very funny was that the person who design the character was a woman and here you have this feminist male telling us that women would find that design offensive.

Same thing happened with notorious white knights Jason Schreier & Friends embarking on a quest to shame Emika Kida - the woman who designed the Sorceress and Amazon for Dragon's Crown - for designing oversexualized cartoon characters for a videogame.
 

TGO

Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
Majority of female character designs that are considered sexist or portraying women as sexualised are designed by women.
Majority of clothing that would be considered sexualised or too revealing was chosen by a woman to wear.
A lot of popstar's and singers who look was managed by males was more innocent and covered up while under male management until they got freedom to control their own look.
In which they went straight to sexualisation..
Women like to look sexy, who would of thought 🤔
 

Kuranghi

Gold Member
Because we've seen games that sell well that don't have all attractive main leads. Plus, what's consider "attractive" is different in different countries\regions.

Would consider the following attractive?

- Gordon Freeman
- Agent 47
- Marcus Fenix
- Max Payne
- John Marston
- Nico Bellic
- Selene (Returnal)

Yes, most of them.

Gordon Freeman is above average handsomeness, certainly more attractive than all the scientists I know, but you never see his face in-game really so most people probably don't know what he looks like if they didn't see the promo art. Agent 47 looks like a bald Adonis/GQ model so thats a strange example imo. Max Payne was using photo textures and so thats just a guy on the teams literal face and he's alt-handsome in real life.

John Marston is probably pretty good looking in a world with no face cream and a hard ass gang/farm life but yeah he's not exactly a looker with that scar. Niko Bellic isn't ugly either, he's not classically handsome like Max Payne above but not an uggo either. Marcus Fenix I can't speak to because his design is so stylised its not like a real person. I'd say he looks like a worlds strongest man contestant if pressed though and they aren't very good looking guys due to their ultra-necks.

Selene is the only one who's not really good looking, shes gaunt and has bug eyes but at the same time shes meant to be an older woman and beauty fades.
 

Days like these...

Poonani should have a ph balance of 0
This is like whenever Resetera talks about racial issues while most of them are white. It's like, give me a break. If there are women on the team let them give their opinion and stop trying to pretend you know better.
Yeah, that place use to drive me crazy when YTs would be patronizing all the while trying to "explain" racism to me a brown man who has experienced actual racism.
 

kunonabi

Member
I for one can't wait until we are at the point where most women dress like Faye Valentine from Cowboy Bebop, it'll be fun for a (good) while but I don't think its viable long term:



I prefer to see a woman's clam-mound after I've got to know them a bit, but I'm old fashioned like that. I believe Faye was overcompensating for being the galaxy's oldest woman at least.


Yeah, we're a ways off from that Faye
 
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Fbh

Member
Sounds like someone who should be removed from the team.
It's crazy he doesn't see the irony of telling a woman how her design is offensive towards women

I will never understand how we preach not to tell women how to dress, and they can wear as explicit as they deem fit, but that somehow changes in designs for game characters.

Like, how does that work?

Am I just crazy?

IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.

yes i am going crazy mike napoli GIF

That's mostly because one is the older type of feminism and female empowerment, and the other is the modern woke feminism which is almost ironically coming full circle and going back to a more conservative "don't show skin, be more modest, don't look or act sexy, be ashamed of your curves and feminine features, etc"


Majority of female character designs that are considered sexist or portraying women as sexualised are designed by women.
Majority of clothing that would be considered sexualised or too revealing was chosen by a woman to wear.
A lot of popstar's and singers who look was managed by males was more innocent and covered up while under male management until they got freedom to control their own look.
In which they went straight to sexualisation..
Women like to look sexy, who would of thought 🤔

I honestly the think the root of this whole thing isn't about "men and women" in general, but rather more about how below average or unattractive men and women react to things.

Basically most unattractive men will see a traditionally attractive dude like Nathan Drake in a game and will either be indifferent to it or think he is "cool"
But a lot of unattractive women (specially those active on twitter) will see a traditionally attractive woman like Cammy and they'll get upset
 

Toots

Member
I'll buy your game if you make her curvy
We should all pledge to buy the game only if they make the girl curvy and have the mansplaining dude serve coffee to everyone during meeting with no right to talk.
We would be shutting a mansplainer down and supporting women working in the industry at the same time ✊
 

Kataploom

Member
Damn... these people hate women so much they want them eradicated from media... I think it's a total disrespect not only to the actual women in the room that he was basically "mansplaining" them why they should be offended (if anything, I feel the term justified in here for once) but also to the women in general considering most of them are proud of their curviness and all the features (yes, wokes, it's a feature, not a bug) that make them look attractive.
 
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Kuranghi

Gold Member


Yeah, we're a ways off from that Fay

I just read about the cast the other day and was disappointed its John Cho, he's not tall enough and I don't find him melancholic/too cool for school at all but I will wait for footage before I totally condemn it.

Ffs that Faye Valentine outfit is a rubbish adapation imo, at least Ein looks like himself but you'd really have to be a submental to mess that casting up lol.

Did anyone else not think Jet Black was black in the anime? I mean, I don't generally think about characters race much, but it never even crossed my mind since Ed has darker/bronzer skin than him but I guess its that ultra-ashy-black-man sort of design like Marvin in RE2 Remake.

At least in 30 years we can just have CGI anime adapatations that look like real people and can be as close to the anime designs as they/fans want. The voice actors will probably all be dead by then though unfortunately... AI voices! Oh god what a messed up future we are heading towards, Ari Folman's The Congress here we come.
 

PJX

Member
Sounds like someone who should be removed from the team.
It's crazy he doesn't see the irony of telling a woman how her design is offensive towards women

This is what I can't wrap my head around. I pulled the woman who designed the character aside and without offending her I asked her did she design the character because she thinks that's what would sell or because men would like it. She told me flat out that she designed her that way because that's what she likes.

We should all pledge to buy the game only if they make the girl curvy and have the mansplaining dude serve coffee to everyone during meeting with no right to talk.
We would be shutting a mansplainer down and supporting women working in the industry at the same time ✊

We aren't changing the design, she is staying curvy. The designer said that she wanted to make her curvier but didn't go out because of reasons. I told her go ahead, you're the artist and the designer, do what makes you happy.
 

WitchHunter

Member
when it comes to leads, great looks have to be a must. Even the ND artists agreed on a panel about Uncharted 4 where she admitted that your protagonist has to look attractive.
What the actual fuck? WHAAATWHY? Attractive in a literal sense? What about Halo guy? Noone knows whether he is an ogre or a top model.
 

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Well, thats what she said. I am guessing you took an issue with me saying that attractive protagonists are a must in which case Id argue that pretty much everyone aside from Nico on that list is 6 foot tall, fit, muscular with broad shoulders and a wide jaw synonymous with good looking males.

None of those guys look like George from Seinfeld. They dont look pretty like Brad Pitt, but they dont lack the manly equivalent of female curves either. Joel for example is very attractive compared to Abby. He looks gruff and rundown. He's supposed to be in his late 40s and yet despite all that he looks better than Abby a 22 year old girl made to look like a man.

And see I think this is where things get "dangerous" in this conversation. I'm not saying you are doing anything wrong, but the bolded is kinda not fair to Abby (the character) or the artist that designed her.
 
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