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Why didn't Microsoft win over the hearts of gamers like Sony and Nintendo did?

F

Fluzer

Banned
I see it all over, when you mention Sony as a gaming company you're met with them "Oh they're great, they make some amazing games. I love PlayStation" and Nintendo the same. But whenever Microsoft is mentioned in a positive light, you're sideyed and met with confused looks. Sony and Nintendo are synonymous with gaming, Microsoft wrecked any chance for such recognition when they decided gaming was an afterthought, I believe this was in 2009 when Kinect took over and Microsoft's exclusives drought started.

I will give Microsoft for credit for games/franchises like Halo, Gears, Forza, Fable, Lost Odysessy, Alan Wake, Blue Dragon, Crimson Skies, Blood Wake, Sunset Overdrive and Ori but why do you think these games weren't enough to win over gamers? Also, do you think Microsoft being a fat cat American company had any bearing on people's perception of Xbox? Do you think people just like to root for the underdogs who are Sony and Nintendo in this case?
 
P

Pinktaco

Member
Just my humble opinipn:
They're all in it to make money, there's no denying that, however Sony and Nintendo also comes off as if they care slightly more than MS,, which I contrast comes off more as if they're only in it for the money.
This in return can be seen with the games, which imo is more diverse with Sony than with MS.
XBOX is synonymous with Halo/Gears/Forza, which quite honestly got boring already back in the PS3/XB360 time.

Also, I remember the reveal of the PS4 and Xbox One. While admittedly neither consoles are pretty to look at, it came off as if MS had completely dumped the anesthetic in favor of more power. It looked like an ugly brick and all the power never really amounted to much of anything worth remembering.
Also, I've never enjoyed the E3 presentations by MS, they always appear arrogant.

So I suppose uh.. Lots of biased feelings? :D
 
gifgaf

gifgaf

Member
Fluzer said:
I see it all over, when you mention Sony as a gaming company you're met with them "Oh they're great, they make some amazing games. I love PlayStation" and Nintendo the same. But whenever Microsoft is mentioned in a positive light, you're sideyed and met with confused looks. Sony and Nintendo are synonymous with gaming, Microsoft wrecked any chance for such recognition when they decided gaming was an afterthought, I believe this was in 2009 when Kinect took over and Microsoft's exclusives drought started.

I will give Microsoft for credit for games/franchises like Halo, Gears, Forza, Fable, Lost Odysessy, Alan Wake, Blue Dragon, Crimson Skies, Blood Wake, Sunset Overdrive and Ori but why do you think these games weren't enough to win over gamers? Also, do you think Microsoft being a fat cat American company had any bearing on people's perception of Xbox? Do you think people just like to root for the underdogs who are Sony and Nintendo in this case?
Click to expand...
Were you not around last gen. Xbox 360 was loved, all those games were awesome. But there's a saying that I think fits here "What have you done for me lately"

I have mentioned this in another post but for me MS just needs to back some good games. I dont care about fanboyism. I'm a simple gamer, just give me the games I want to play and I will buy. I bet that is true for a lot of people.
 
F

Fluzer

Banned
MiyazakiHatesKojima said:
Cancelling Scalebound is what pushed me to become a permanent Micro$oft hater.
Click to expand...

Making Death Stranding exclusive was some harsh shit bro.

gifgaf said:
Were you not around last gen. Xbox 360 was loved, all those games were awesome. But there's a saying that I think fits here "What have you done for me lately"

I have mentioned this in another post but for me MS just needs to back some good games. I dont care about fanboyism. I'm a simple gamer, just give me the games I want to play and I will buy. I bet that is true for a lot of people.
Click to expand...

I guess there was a little bit of love but even then it seemed fake, people haven't really accepted Microsoft as a gaming company the way they have for Nintendo and Sony. During the 360 era, Xbox was just there to tide us over until Sony get its shit together.
 
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Humdinger

Humdinger

Member
Xbox generated all sorts of good will among gamers between 2000 and about 2010. They had a good reputation for a full decade. After that, it's been rough. The main missteps have been 1) putting all their energy into Kinect rather than real games, 2) the disasterous Xbox One reveal, and 3) going an entire generation without producing nearly any great, successful exclusives except Gears and Forza.
 
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S

Slings and Arrows

Banned
Quite simple; after ten years of winning over hearts and minds then they went viciously for wallets and deception. Kinect was a complete backfire that only the most hardcore nutjob MS fans thought was good. They lied in all their presentations and against the wishes of true fans, tried ramming kinect 2 down our throats. The end of Kinect was inevitable.

But, instead of being humble and saying "our bad" like sony did, they tripled down with tv tv tv, water coolers and teh power of teh cloud.

Who could give Microsoft their mind when MS lie so much? Who could give them their heart when Microsoft are hell bent on breaking it by, ignoring the desires and wants of their fanbase?

They haven't changed either. Xbox one x is another flim flam, a sham and a rouse to win people over. Its only the most powerful console because its a brand new console.
 
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Y

yoyo67

Member
My first console was the original xbox, so they had me day one. I know it's a business, but all they want to do is print money. I can buy used games dirt cheap and keep them, I don't need game pass. They had decent games in the beginning, but its been years since they pumped anything decent since quantum break. They also lack third party exclusives that NIntendo and Sony gets all the time. Halo infinite is going on PC, so zero reason to stick with xbox.
 
Mokus

Mokus

Member
Their biggest sin is when they shut down Ensemble Studios so they can focus only on their precious console gaming, and now they try to pull pc gamers in to their ecosystem after they realize the gaming division is weak when it can not dominate the console segment of the market. Not to mention I had to play games with Windows Live, a total mess. In my eyes they did more harm than good in gaming. Also the games they put out are not interesting. They desperately tried to build an ecosystem (and they still trying) in which we would be locked in, without quality and ignoring what gamers/consumers want.
 
gifgaf

gifgaf

Member
Fluzer said:
I guess there was a little bit of love but even then it seemed fake, people haven't really accepted Microsoft as a gaming company the way they have for Nintendo and Sony. During the 360 era, Xbox was just there to tide us over until Sony get its shit together.
Click to expand...
I think your wrong here. The xbox and the 360 were awesome, Xbox one is underwhelming for me but I'm still hopeful MS is going to get its shit together and bring us some great games, maybe next gen?

This gen has not been great for MS sure, but to generalise that people wont accept MS as a games company is wrong imo.

 
DunDunDunpachi

DunDunDunpachi

Patient MembeR
Microsoft did win over hearts with the original Xbox, which was a distinct console that set itself apart from the competition.

Then Xbox Live subs poured blood in the water and Microsoft half-assed the 360 lifespan (good at the beginning, terrible at the end).

If I were to estimate completely imaginary statistics, 90% of Xbox's goodwill was earned during the Xbox and early years of Xbox 360. Everything following has coasted on that goodwill.
 
Kdad

Kdad

Member
MS jumped into gaming....it was like IBM jumping into gaming. No history of consumer hardware products. Both Nintendo (being a games/toy/card company) and SONY being a consumer electronics company had long reputations of 'connection' to the home...MS made windows which reminded people of suits and work. JMHO.
 
D

Deleted member 740922

Unconfirmed Member
I think a lot of people like to recall any problems they've had in the past with Windows and instantly disregard Microsoft, which is obviously unfair.

I do think Microsoft is as its worst when they try to be cool and hip. To me, Phil Spencer comes across as an idiot, with his shit-eating grin and embarrassing "HEY GUYS! I'M A GAMER TOO!" t-shirts. Maybe if they toned down all that crap it would help. Also, on this board, there are a LOT of Xbox fans with a victim mentality who constantly bleat about how biased NeoGaf is, yet all the while they get their digs in against other system and people - this really doesn't help Microsoft's image.

Despite all that, the first Xbox is one of my favourite consoles of all time. Loved the 360 as well and I enjoy my One X. Saying "Xbox has no games" is ridiculous - it's a fine system.
 
sublimit

sublimit

Banned
Nintendo and to a lesser extend Sony have a gaming culture that MS never had and never really understood what it is to have one.They are like a multi-billionaire guy who thinks that just because he has a lot of money he can hang out with aristocracy and be like them overnight. But a culture is not established over night by moneyhatting left and right ,it takes a long time of continuous efforts and a plan that aims to build upon solid grounds. Even if growth may seem slower in the short term the seeds are being planted to grow in the longterm and having a gaming culture helps Nintendo and Sony to stick with their plans while MS would immediately terminate anything that wasn't bringing short term profits.
For example you would have never seen a game like The Last Guardian being released from MS if the game had the same struggles as it had.They would have canceled it a long time ago. You would have never seen Gravity Rush 2 if the first game sold as bad as it did. Immediate results are of course very important to keep a company alive but having a gaming culture is to understand the importance of diversity in your portfolio and to have the keen eye to see what move even if it wasn't as successful at first can bring good results in the future.

I think the people who have sticked with Nintendo and Sony over the years realize this and feel more comfortable to invest on their platforms that have a continuous history while with MS they feel like they are more like a firework that aims to dazzle quickly then fade away rather than having this sort of more slow but continuous built up.

However things change and the last moves of MS (studio acquisitions) seem to show that they have finally realized this so hopefully they will also establish their own culture with the patience and mentality that is needed and not intervene in the work of their creators,cancel their games with the first signs of trouble,and ultimately close down their studios.
 
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SkinnerSw33t

SkinnerSw33t

Member
I don't really think any of the OP is true. The 2013-15 stumble aside, the Xbox brand has been and is hugely popular.

Xbox is killing it right now will gamers in general.
 
AeonGaidenRaiden

AeonGaidenRaiden

Member
I donno,they did pretty good with gamers with the 360. I mean they were THE console of choice at mutiplayer/tournament events. When you watched MTV Cribs literally nobody had a PlayStation.

I think they dug such a hole with the xboxONE reveal that people made up their minds right there and then. They lost a massive lead by just that reveal as of the 360 never happened.

Now, even if the reveal was better...i think their priorities and studios hired just weren't putting up good games...like AT ALL. I think the WiiU had better reviewed exclusives than xbox. They just stood out as this money hungry brand that has multimedia first and gaming second on their mind.
 
Kdad

Kdad

Member
I'm reading some of these responses....are you all only thinking from a navel gazing US centric point of view? The xbox brand barely registers outside of US/Can UK.
 
M

MC Safety

Member
It's a game console, people, not the person you're destined to spend your life with. And no matter what console you're buying, you're buying from a gigantic corporation. Do you need the gigantic corporation to win you over, heart and soul?

I understand people are passionate about games. However, romanticizing buying a piece of electronics from a faceless business enterprise is creepy.
 
gifgaf

gifgaf

Member
Kdad said:
I'm reading some of these responses....are you all only thinking from a navel gazing US centric point of view? The xbox brand barely registers outside of US/Can UK.
Click to expand...
Xbox 360 sold 84 million consoles, I think I think I would count that as a success. PS3 only sold 3 million more and I think that happened towards the end of the last gen. Xbox 360 was ahead until near the end I beleive.
 
Deputy Moonman

Deputy Moonman

Member
I shouldn't even be in this thread. It's filled with some next-level lunacy. Who says the xbox didn't win over gamers? When the PS3 initially stunk up the room I'm sure all gamers were like omg poor sony why haven't they won the hearts of gamers over... That's the wrong perspective and not how it works. MS screwed up with the xbox one plain and simple. It doesn't mean gamers hate MS. It means a lot of previous xbox owners switched to the ps4. When next gen hits, apparently a lot of gaf will be absolutely shocked when people go back to liking the xbox, as if that is completely impossible.
gifgaf said:
A brand new console manufacturer coming in and competing as well as the Xbox did is very rare. Yes people liked it, yes it was a huge success and MS built on that with the 360. Were you not around for the Xbox gen? it was a clear second place beating Nintendo game cube.
Click to expand...
This. People act like it's easy to come in and immediately compete with 2 big brands in the console industry. Yet, that's exactly what MS did with the xbox. I see a lot of posts where people only look at the xbox one as evidence of whether MS can put out a good console and good games, and they completely disregard the first two systems. And here we are with people assuming that no one likes the xbox brand... Sheesh. Also, lol at people who think MS is the only company that wants to make money. Don't pretend Sony didn't money hat games from Nintendo when Sony first arrived on the console scene. That's just business.
 
alabtrosMyster

alabtrosMyster

Banned
I am pretty sure they were much more respected before the kinect/xbox one days. I am also sure most people will give them props for some of their platform features (especially the partial backward compatibility feature).

Where I think resistance is met is the minute someone insists that their platform is over all the best, and everybody should buy an xbox - obviously most people don't agree - so the low points will come up (lack of compelling exclusives, even when a game is exclusive it also exists on PC, lack of Japanese games, lack of trust in MS to let their current stables of studios develop games as good as they would be on other platforms, etc.).

They're just not up to par in terms of content, and they need to fix this.
 
Hissing Sid

Hissing Sid

Member
Because although all companies are greedy, money grubbing cunts that exist primarily to make money, at least Sony and Nintendo give you a kiss and whisper sweet nothings before they unbutton your pants.... Microsoft just throws you over the table, rips your duds off and give you a thorough smashing, dry, whilst grinning.
 
Saber

Saber

Gold Member
In my case they didnt win. They lost.

After so many problems and headaches with my xbox 360(which btw cost me a lot of money in problems to fix), I decided to never touch a xbox again.

I miss playing Alan Wake though.
 
SkinnerSw33t

SkinnerSw33t

Member
Kdad said:
I'm reading some of these responses....are you all only thinking from a navel gazing US centric point of view? The xbox brand barely registers outside of US/Can UK.
Click to expand...

You say this like the U.S., U.K. and Canada are three tiny islands off the coast of Europe.
 
TTOOLL

TTOOLL

Member
Microsoft was never cool in any area, it doesn't mean they are bad tho. I think time is key here, Nintendo and Sony belong to a different era and have always appealed to all ages. MS has always tried to be more serious and edgy imo (you can judge this by their "mascots", Masterchief? Really?). I don't know, I'm not even a gamer anymore, but I've never wanted to own an Xbox console in my lifetime.
 
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gifgaf

gifgaf

Member
Saberyoko said:
I miss playing Alan Wake though.
Click to expand...

Its on PC, go play it there. This is one problem the Xbox brand has imo, as much as I love PC gaming and I know its cool to hate on exclusives, but not having console exclusives hurts a console more. I think MS know this. I wonder if MS will make consoles for people who cannot afford a good gaming PC as a secondary cheaper alternative to not having a PC in the future not as their main focus. That's just a wild guess though.
 
ResilientBanana

ResilientBanana

Member
Pinktaco said:
Just my humble opinipn:
They're all in it to make money, there's no denying that, however Sony and Nintendo also comes off as if they care slightly more than MS,, which I contrast comes off more as if they're only in it for the money.
This in return can be seen with the games, which imo is more diverse with Sony than with MS.
XBOX is synonymous with Halo/Gears/Forza, which quite honestly got boring already back in the PS3/XB360 time.

Also, I remember the reveal of the PS4 and Xbox One. While admittedly neither consoles are pretty to look at, it came off as if MS had completely dumped the anesthetic in favor of more power. It looked like an ugly brick and all the power never really amounted to much of anything worth remembering.
Also, I've never enjoyed the E3 presentations by MS, they always appear arrogant.

So I suppose uh.. Lots of biased feelings? :D
Click to expand...
And yet Microsoft never mentions how many units they shipped or how much money they made, just how many users they have. Weird how that works.

Personally, I feel that people love to hate Microsoft, but at the same time they need better games. Near the end of the Xbox 360 and the beginning for the Xbox One they kind of dropped the ball. But now with the Xbox One X, scarlet, expanding their libraries to PC, putting Xbox Live on more devices, crossplay, play anywhere, gamepass with 3rd party titles, etc. You can see that they want to grow the user base and bring more and more people together regardless of platform.

Meanwhile, Sony is trying to keep everything closed off to make sure that they keep there community segregated. In the end Sony has fantastic games, but their business practices will end up hurting 3rd parties and Indies in the end. They’ve always seemed so arrogant to me, but I guess the games are the reason why I own a PS4 Pro. I think, that since the PlayStation Brand has been around longer, people have more of a sense of nostalgia towards them.

Hissing Sid said:
Because although all companies are greedy, money grubbing cunts that exist primarily to make money, at least Sony and Nintendo give you a kiss and whisper sweet nothings before they unbutton your pants.... Microsoft just throws you over the table, rips your duds off and give you a thorough smashing, dry, whilst grinning.
Click to expand...

Do you have any examples where this has occurred?
 
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Grinchy

Grinchy

Banned
The first xbox was a really great introduction. It sent the message that Microsoft wanted premium games that were above what the competition was capable of putting out. Games like Halo 1 and 2 and Splinter Cell just weren't possible at the same level on PS2 and Gamecube.

The 360 came out 12-18 months ahead of the PS3 and was the only next-gen choice you could make. It helped a lot to establish themselves and get more people paying the Online Extortion Tax that has become standard. The PS3 came out and was hard to develop for, strengthening the 360's initial years even more.

Then, for some reason, Microsoft kinda just gave up toward the end of the 360 generation. They started putting out Kinect shovelware and seemed to be doing less 3rd party deals to make their system seem like the go-to place to be. Their mid to late gen exclusives were not shining so bright anymore either.

Then comes their enormous stumble with the Xbox One. They put out an underpowered and more expensive console with Kinect and TV integration that absolutely nobody wanted. They finally ditched that horrible idea, but they were still left with a system that was playing 720p and 900p games while the PS4 was pushing 1080p on everything. That was a big deal for the first couple years of the new generation.

On top of that, the Xbox One has just had a terrible library. Until the X released, the Xbox One was the place to play worse versions of multiplatform games and the place to play mediocre-at-best exclusives. There was almost no reason to own one except for the people who are such huge fans of Gears and Halo that they can't even decipher how average the new entries are. How could Microsoft's efforts in the past 8 or so years win over any hearts?
 
Great Hair

Great Hair

Banned
I think it has to do with Microsoft´s attitude in the business in general, how they accomplished things and how they themselves shot in the foot since 2001. The main reason (one of many) for them to be in the console industry, was not because of $$$ but mainly because they thought that the PS2 could be a threat to Microsoft Windows ... #lol

Their initial vision for the first Xbox 2001 is what we have nowdays with the Xbone. A device capable of gaming, video playback, streaming content and so on ... all this was not doable in 2001, the infrastructure was not there yet.

Their focus/mantra was always "a jack of all trades, master of none". The stigma of a bro-shooter where the cool dudes chill, the MP console .. was fueled by them. They pushed that narrative since 2001, the broadbanding culture, the "clean trashtalk", the "teabaggin", the online is so much cooler ...

This stigma is still intact. If Sony had Halo, 99% would skip the next xbox. Dont get me wrong, Sony and Nintendo are in it for the same reason, money. Overall though i believe Microsoft will always follow their initial vision of 2001. A "HTPC" that can stream movies, consume media of any type and also have Halo.

The 360 defines Microsoft´s Gaming ambition pretty well. If they care enough, they can compete with "content", some even might say quality wise. But should a gimmick take over the gaming space, they´re one if not the first to jump on the bandwagon (wii remote clone aka kinect games).

In short :

2001 to 2005
paygating online/netflix etc.
halo machine
hated by apple&pc fans ... even though they managed to "convert" them
overall : the console flopped, gaming wise 99% of the games were released on other platforms. Rare ... working hard.

2005 to 2013
"kiosk" edition 360 (no wifi, no hdmi, etc) so poorly built that over 50% were affected by RROD, forcing many to buy a new 360 due that shitty 90 day policy.
Kinect years 2009+
just another platform to release game for, it just happen to be easier to code for
according to wiki, MS "had access" to Sony, Toshiba and IBM´s CELL Project ... what is funny to me, is that TOSHIBA (Sony pal during the CELL "inception") thought teaming up with Microsoft was going to win a battle with Sony (Bluray vs HDDVD).
overall : a fun bro-shoter, heavily mp focused console, but nothing revolutionary, not in the same vein as PS2 to PS3, a redefined version of their 2001 machine. Rare doomed to make Kinect games ...

2013 to 2020
monumental fiasco, a "watercooler" for the living room that can do ANYTHING.... just not well enough. Sony beat them in terms of hardware specs, lower price and a better gui/games. No VR, no "PSP" for Xbox ... Microsoft would have had an even tougher task ahead, if they had to support a handheld, twice and fund their own VR device.

Xbox was and will remain a PC in disguise for the living room.
 
ethomaz

ethomaz

Banned
DunDunDunpachi said:
Microsoft did win over hearts with the original Xbox, which was a distinct console that set itself apart from the competition.

Then Xbox Live subs poured blood in the water and Microsoft half-assed the 360 lifespan (good at the beginning, terrible at the end).

If I were to estimate completely imaginary statistics, 90% of Xbox's goodwill was earned during the Xbox and early years of Xbox 360. Everything following has coasted on that goodwill.
Click to expand...
Seems like that is the mostly close to the truth.

MS bad reputation started in mid-360 when they stopped to delivery any kind of gaming software to support their fanbase... XB1 launched after an disastrous end of gen for 360 plus a lot of new issues with the start of a new gen.

MS focus was always controversial... even today and that is showed in the games (or lack of).
 
FranXico

FranXico

Member
Dee Dah Dave said:
Nintendo has true fans who entered gaming at its birth, also ones who like the Disney style approach. Sony has the moronic fanboys who would consider it an honour if Kaz Hirai interfered with them.

Microsoft doesn't really have either.
Click to expand...
Microsoft also has its share of mindless fanatics. Look no further than the Spencer cult, who does everything to perpetuate the myth that the X1 failure was the result of one man alone and now worships another as the second coming.
 
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cm osi

cm osi

Member
they kinda did with the 360 but that's partially because sony and nintendo missteps. also microsoft lacked a diverse portfolio, being more focused on the cool dudebro aimed at america teenagers
 
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ethomaz

ethomaz

Banned
Dee Dah Dave said:
Nintendo has true fans who entered gaming at its birth, also ones who like the Disney style approach. Sony has the moronic fanboys who would consider it an honour if Kaz Hirai interfered with them.

Microsoft doesn't really have either.
Click to expand...
Even using your weird names you build these over the years something that MS only did with first Xbox... 360 started great but ended untrustworthy and XB1 was a shot in their heads.
 
F

FStubbs

Member
It's simple. They were and are completely unable to sell the Xbox outside of English speaking countries, meaning they had to rely on running up the score in those countries to gain traction. The original Xbox had a niche to build on, and the 360 relied on Sony fumbling out of the gate (and it still lost in the end).

And yes, part of the problem is the Microsoft brand in general is a "work" brand. Even Microsoft recognized this, which is why IIRC the Xbox division itself was Plan B and Plan A was to buy Nintendo by offering twice what the company was worth. (In retrospect, they should have bought Sega).
 
C

checkcola

Member
I think their roll out of the Xbox One really hurt them and then, you look at the system, yes, they are doing the backwards
compatibility​
deal now, but their best current gen games are not exclusives. Nintendo is always going to have its stash of great IPs and Sony has amazing exclusives for the PS4.
 
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