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Why do gamers think it’s bad Gamepass is bad when major developers and some indie developers use Gamepass?

Do you have an issue with Xbox Gamepass (and other services)

  • Yes they should all die and go to hell

    Votes: 71 26.5%
  • No they should continue to coexist

    Votes: 197 73.5%

  • Total voters
    268

DarkMage619

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Jun 19, 2004
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The word you are looking for is "knowledgeable".
The option to purchase something you are currently renting is nothing new, and doesn't make the rental anything other than a rental.
You are renting your access to the library, and have the option to buy individual games at a discount.

Did you understand?
Thank you for correcting my auto correct it's appreciated. Your point makes no sense. If you are renting an apartment no matter how long you pay you don't own anything and could be taken from you at the owners whim. Purchasing a condo means you own it and as long the mortgage and taxes are paid no one takes it away from you. Game pass can't be a 'rental' service if you can buy any title on the service with a discount.

You might not know this but if you buy a game on Gamepass even if it leaves the service you can keep the title. That is NOT the definition of rental. It gets compared to Netflix but you can't purchase the movies you like from Netflix. That means Netflix IS a rental service. Maybe you got confused.
 

Croatoan

Member
Jun 24, 2014
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If gamepass was a Sony thing (PSNow ISN'T gamepass) it would be the "Greatest Invention Of All Time". If Sony had purchased Bethesda it would have been the best, most positive, gaming acquisition ever.

Its all just a never ending console war shithole on this forum.

Gamepass is amazing, and its likely the future. Sony exclusives are good to (except for TLoU2 which is shit).
 
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supernova8

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Jun 2, 2020
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I originally disliked the idea of Game Pass (thinking it would somehow devalue/lower the production quality of games) but I think my experience with Amazon Prime Video has turned me around on it. Thanks to Amazon Prime I've been exposed to all kinds of movies, documentaries, TV shows and variety shows that I wouldn't dream of paying for individually, but ones that I thoroughly enjoyed.

Besides, I figure if you end up buying an Xbox Series S/X, it's almost a stupid decision not to get Game Pass. If you do any decent amount of gaming you're probably already paying for Xbox Live, so it's a no-brainer to pay that little extra and get Game Pass Ultimate. It's $15 per month which is $180 per year, but are you telling me you wouldn't have bought 3 games in a year ($60 per game x 3 games = 180)? That's also $180 dollars but you only get to play 3 games unless you cough up more money and you're still paying for Xbox Live anyway.

The real downside is if you're the type of person who likes your Maddens, FIFAs, CODs, Battlefields. Those won't be on Game Pass (at launch or anywhere near launch), so your annual spend ends up being $180 PLUS whatever you end up spending on the games you actually want to play, as opposed to what happens to be available on Game Pass at a given point in time. I'm getting old and I've lost interest in the mainstream shooty bang bang games. I will probably buy the next Battlefield and GTA games but I think I would be content with the Game Pass selection beyond that. I think really if Game Pass is able to stop you from going out to buy that one extra game that you didn't really need (but you were bored and wanted to play something) then Game Pass is doing its job - keeping you engaged/satisfied.

I found myself going out to the movies far less because there are so many good titles on Amazon Prime. Sure they may not be the latest blockbusters but it suits me just fine. I think this is what Game Pass essentially is, and that's cool! It's just like getting Amazon Prime or Netflix. You get access to a wide variety of content for one, easy-to-manage/predict monthly cost. It doesn't have everything but you'd be naive to expect that for such a low price.

Now... whether you should buy an Xbox or not depends on your preferences and financial situation.
 
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Nikana

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Jan 26, 2016
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Why is owning your own media such a bad thing? You are just allowing these games/media companies to dictate what THEY want, and by following whatever they do, things will remain like that forever. I loved getting my new Friday The 13th box set from Shout Factory (I believe it was released by them). It came in a beautiful package with plenty of special features. It's something that streaming or renting can't give you, and it baffles me why people are happy with that.
I never said it was a bad thing at all.

I am a fan of owning media myself but particularly movies in the 4K format because the quality of the video and especially the audio are far superior to streaming.

But again, the market tells you what it wants. Most people do not want something physical taking up space and couldnt care less the difference between a compressed stream and an uncompressed stream.
 

MacReady13

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Jun 22, 2018
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I never said it was a bad thing at all.

I am a fan of owning media myself but particularly movies in the 4K format because the quality of the video and especially the audio are far superior to streaming.

But again, the market tells you what it wants. Most people do not want something physical taking up space and couldnt care less the difference between a compressed stream and an uncompressed stream.
And again I will say, if the people in charge give you something, you can either accept it and go that route (gamepass) or give it a wide berth and buy your stuff physically. I'm telling you that eventually ALL the big compaines will create a subscription service, and instead of OWNING games you want, you will be playing the games they have curated for you and then take them away when they like! All for a monthly fee that, after you factor in all the subscription services, will cost a fucking fortune! Don't say I didn't warn any of you... And that isn't to pick on any of you in particular, but I'm really strongly against this shit. I was always happy renting films knowing that if I loved it I could purchase it (and trust me, my VHS/DVD/Blu Ray/4K Blu Ray collection is huge)! We are able to purchase games now even with gamepass BUT, the day will come (streaming) when it will be ONLY subscription. You will be begging to own games especially when you don't have the time to finish that game they are taking off the service in a few days.
 
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Veysetia

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For people like myself who have a massive multi hundred game backlog, having a service like Gamepass or PSNow isn't worth it, I have too many games and not enough time, if I found myself out of a job and no prospects for one ever again then yeah they'd be great, but the pricing/model of those services are geared towards a certain type of audience, you probably don't have a massive backlog if that kind of service is appealing to you.
 

sublimit

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Aug 28, 2009
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It shouldn't be a surprise to anyone when seeing the xbox fanboys praising Gamepass as the second coming of Christ.When the only thing that your favorite company has to show for itself is a subscription service (that isn't even for everyone) it's absolutely normal they are going to keep trying to shove it down our throats as "the best thing evah".If they had even 5 exclusive games they could brag about then they wouldn't defend Gamepass so much. But now it's the only thing they can talk about.
 
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bxrz

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Oct 30, 2020
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The irony of this statement when you considering massive bitching that Spider-Man wasn’t coming to Xbox
Wheres the correlation?

Xbox fanboys were mad that Spiderman wasn’t coming to Xbox cause they were missing out on a good game. They didn’t downplay it and slander it like Sony fanboys do with Gamepass.

All the “I want to own everything” talk is BS cause games now are very rarely worth $70 (and more in other parts of the world).
 
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Three

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Oct 26, 2014
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If gamepass was a Sony thing (PSNow ISN'T gamepass) it would be the "Greatest Invention Of All Time". If Sony had purchased Bethesda it would have been the best, most positive, gaming acquisition ever.

Its all just a never ending console war shithole on this forum.

Gamepass is amazing, and its likely the future. Sony exclusives are good to (except for TLoU2 which is shit).
PSNow is literally like gamepass with a different library (Sony games not day 1 but there). The reason it's not touted as 'The greatest thing ever' is because it isn't. It's the people saying that about gamepass that are touting gamepass as amazing and unique and think PSNow is something different.
 

Dthomp

Gold Member
Sep 17, 2005
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Don't you people get tired of having the same pointless argument over and over around here? Imagine being so deep into console warring that instead of playing games you are having the same conversation in circles defending your multi million dollar company that gives literally zero shits what you think.
 
x1

Chukhopops

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Mar 5, 2020
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PSNow is literally like gamepass with a different library (Sony games not day 1 but there). The reason it's not touted as 'The greatest thing ever' is because it isn't. It's the people saying that about gamepass that are touting gamepass as amazing and unique and think PSNow is something different.
This conversation has been done a million times already, the two are not comparable in terms of first party availability, age of the catalog, average and median metacritic, etc. Not gonna go into this since it’s not even what the thread is about.
 

Croatoan

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Jun 24, 2014
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PSNow is literally like gamepass with a different library (Sony games not day 1 but there). The reason it's not touted as 'The greatest thing ever' is because it isn't. It's the people saying that about gamepass that are touting gamepass as amazing and unique and think PSNow is something different.
Games being there day 1 is the whole point of gamepass...
 

JerryinSoCal

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Apr 11, 2020
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I just don't think a subscription service where your AAA games launch on day one makes sense, eventually investment will dwindle because too much money is being lost. MS has already said it'll be doing a lot of AA games going forward which makes more sense for a service like that but it's not a great thing to focus most of your studios on doing. Are there 3rd parties on there? of course but they are all older games which already got the most of out their retail release, I'd be totally fine with GP if MS didn't tie first party AAA games to it, they've had a problem with those for years and now I'm supposed to believe they are going to do better when they won't even get the hundreds of millions of dollars per game in it's launch month when it's a hit? I know some will point out to the studios they've bought but most of them are AA studios or even indie studios, Bethesda is the biggest thing obviously but that is only giving them exclusives by taking games away from other platforms, xbox owners would have had access to all of these game already. Yes now they'll be on GP but how often does bethesda release a huge title? every few years? and if you are someone who's mostly into them for their RPG's you'll be lucky to get 2 games out of them per generation.
 
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Bo_Hazem

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Yet here we are needing to pay to play online on PlayStation, on top of already paying for internet.

Just like paying for online gaming on Xbox to play free2play games like fortnite vs totally free on PS and The Switch. Same thing with GamePass games that you need to pay for Ultimate to be able to play MP with those or have Gold included vs you don't need that on PS Now.

Widen your perspective.
 

NickFire

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Mar 12, 2014
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There's nothing wrong with gamepass. But if someone tells me one system is better because I can rent old games on it, then I completely disagree with their argument.
 

x@3f*oo_e!

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Just like paying for online gaming on Xbox to play free2play games like fortnite vs totally free on PS and The Switch. Same thing with GamePass games that you need to pay for Ultimate to be able to play MP with those or have Gold included vs you don't need that on PS Now.

Widen your perspective.
Not sure what you're saying here. I was using Xbox Live as an example of a 'trojan horse' that eventually spread to PlayStation (F2P excepted)
 

bxrz

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It looks like too many people here blew all their cash on Demon Souls and Morales and have nothing else to do. Grow up. It is great for gamers, great for indie developers and probably will be great for MS sooner or later.
Yup. They ran through Demon Souls and MM in a week and now they’re stuck for a couple months. Tough luck
 
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Nikana

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Jan 26, 2016
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And again I will say, if the people in charge give you something, you can either accept it and go that route (gamepass) or give it a wide berth and buy your stuff physically. I'm telling you that eventually ALL the big compaines will create a subscription service, and instead of OWNING games you want, you will be playing the games they have curated for you and then take them away when they like! All for a monthly fee that, after you factor in all the subscription services, will cost a fucking fortune! Don't say I didn't warn any of you... And that isn't to pick on any of you in particular, but I'm really strongly against this shit. I was always happy renting films knowing that if I loved it I could purchase it (and trust me, my VHS/DVD/Blu Ray/4K Blu Ray collection is huge)! We are able to purchase games now even with gamepass BUT, the day will come (streaming) when it will be ONLY subscription. You will be begging to own games especially when you don't have the time to finish that game they are taking off the service in a few days.
Still doesn't change what I have said. I am with you, I like owning my stuff too, but the mass market simply doesn't. People aren't begging to own their music and movies so I dont see why video games will somehow be different. Its all entertainment that is disposable to 90 percent or higher of the market. They simply do not care.
 
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Bo_Hazem

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Not sure what you're saying here. I was using Xbox Live as an example of a 'trojan horse' that eventually spread to PlayStation (F2P excepted)

Did I say both are great features? I would rather have microtransactions but I never run out of PS+ out of the novelty of it, even though I rarely play MP nowadays. But that doesn't make any of them great.
 

DarkMage619

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Just like paying for online gaming on Xbox to play free2play games like fortnite vs totally free on PS and The Switch. Same thing with GamePass games that you need to pay for Ultimate to be able to play MP with those or have Gold included vs you don't need that on PS Now.

Widen your perspective.
Has Sony made cloud saves and syncing free? If I had to choose between free online for F2P games or cloud saves I pick saves all day.
 
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Gamers who think GP is bad don't have an optional sub plan service as good as GP on their platform.

Most of them are surely Netflix subbers though. Instead of following their gaming advice of buy games and why play old games, they sub to NF for $10/mth and binge watch NF instead of buying the disc or digital download for $20 per movie.
 
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Chris_Rivera

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What do you mean by gamers having “issues” with it? You mean, not buying it? Or are you talking about random forum posts.
 

Bo_Hazem

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Has Sony made cloud saves and syncing free? If I had to choose between free online for F2P games or cloud saves I pick saves all day.

I don't give a shit about both cloud saves and F2P games. Also if you give me both PS Now and GamePass for free I won't bother to run any, not to mention the 300+ms ping but you can still download like 350+ games on PS Now. I buy the games that I really care about, not waiting for them to come. They are good services if you have kids and don't wanna pay much, assuming fortnite is 100% free.
 
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geary

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I dont understand the argument with owning games (physically) since a majority of people buy a physical copy so then to sell it on ebay or some other marketplace platform to get back some money which they paid initially.
 
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Has Sony made cloud saves and syncing free? If I had to choose between free online for F2P games or cloud saves I pick saves all day.
 

Bo_Hazem

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and yet they whine about gamepass. That says it all.

Actually many have expressed that is shit. I don't use cloud saves anyway nor I run out of PS+, but because both have paid online with Xbox taking it into the next step by restricting F2P games and GamePass MP so that's worth noting. If you ever find someone saying that paid online on consoles is wonderful tag me so we can shit on him/her.
 

Fbh

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It's a good service though not usually for me. If a game is $30 or less I'd rather buy it. With the time I have to play it's usually going to take me over a month to finish anyway (unless it's really short) at which point I'll already have paid $20 to basically rent it.

I don't particularly like the MS approach of releasing everything on it Day 1. I think ultimately it doesn't encourage devs to make the sort of games I like (big, 10-40 hours single player games). And yeah "If SONY did it you'd think it's great", that's true, I just don't think Sony would release the games they do if their revenue model was based on a subscription service.

If gaming subscriptions services become the norm moving forward I hope it works more like movies (well, before covid). You still get the theatrical release (the $60-70 release), then the Bluray/On Demand period (The $70-$30 range) and then once the game starts to consistently drop bellow $30 you put it on subscription services too.
 
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Slings and Arrows

Formerly 'Boswollocks'
Apr 19, 2019
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Why do you think games aren't worth their cost ? I think, if anything, games are worth their cost and then some more than any other time in history. To think some arcadey games of the 80s and 90s, and many feature-lacking software were priced up to $70 or more. And you think they're overpriced now? Prices drop too, as ever, and there's the used games market, etc. It's not like the only option is to pay for day 1 full-price games. If you're willing to wait for some games chosen randomly by a company to make it to some service and pay for that as a rental, then I'd say waiting for some price drops or waiting to buy used could accomodate your gaming neccesities and budget. Maybe Game Pass does just that, but I find it hard to believe it's because "games aren't worth it" for any reasonable argument, I think you are either tight on money or gaming is not longer a main hobby to you.
We don't need to go all the way back to the beginning of time to compare when games were worth their cost, because it can't all be measured in money.

The early games cost what they did because you were experiencing an experiment, a passion project and a work of art. It varies depending on taste, but for me, games like Monkey Island, Syndicate wars, Command and Conquer, were our eras mona lisa or cistine chapel. I know that sounds cheesey and high praise, but we look among some games in their genre as gamings finest moment or finest idea.

When the golden era hit for me, which again varies person to person, I experienced the Dreamcast, OG Xbox and early years of the 360 and some of their games which were so experimental and fun to play, that the cost didn't matter. The first time i played Half-life, or heard the Aria of Halo, some of those priceless moments defined gaming to me.

But nowadays? None of that exists. The risk and passion projects exist, but they are few and far between and often rushed to meet some deadline, rather than being able to stew a bit longer. Games aren't primarily about experiences anymore, that's secondary to selling you MTX. Sad, but true. Games are now a vessel to feed you addictive mechanics to get you to spend more, buy more, waste more time fetching pointless crap. Gaming has taken the worst mechanics of mobile phone games and use it, through the mainstream set of gaming, to taint everything that is a game.

Even worse, and i won't go in to detail here because i'd be flogging a dead horse, but gamergate happened and like it or not, that has changed the course of gaming like nothing else ever has. The change from arcades, from cartridges, from 2d and from the couch to the online sphere, gaming kept it's core ethos. That is until gamergate came along and pooft, just like that, it changed forever.

So you say to me that i don't see gaming worth it any more? And you don't think i could use that as a real reason? You're wrong. I used to rent and buy games as a kid, now as an adult, there's no need to buy games, because their impact just isn't as lasting. I don't need to hold on to a physical copy, because the chances are i won't replay it (though i do have a copy of KUF 2 for the OG xbox which i'm waiting to become BC, because that's a lasting experience). As for digital, what sucker, what rube, what easily led fool would give a corporation that much money for a product they can only experience? £1 a month for 200 games on gamepass? Sure, that's what i value those games to be. But £60+ for a digital game? You're a mug. Pre-ordering that game digitally, 12 months before release? You're a f*cking mug.

That's just my thoughts and opinions on it 🤷‍♂️
 

LordBlodgett

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I've used gamepass before and know what's available on it. We are in the early stages and an old library of games exists becuase they need content. The landscape is already changing even without gamepass though. 3 generations and only one GTA, GTA5 online. No titanfall 3? Apex legends. Gamepass is just a good fit for this. Release a small budget GaaS game, get several continuing revenue models which is the backbone of Gaas, pay for xbox live, pay for gamepass, pay for in game content. That's what GaaS is and big budget single player games that have people engaged/subscribed for only a week/month do not fit into that very well.
Games are taking longer to develop, that is for sure. But Gamepass being only good for small budget GAAS games not only has not played out in real life, but doesn't make sense for the future either. Would anyone pay for Netflix if they were still just a collection of older TV shows and movies? No, Netflix needs constant content, and specifically top-tier, high quality content to keep subscribers hooked. Gamepass will die and wither if they decide to stop investing in big budget games. You can also look at their upcoming first party content and see a lot of single player games getting approved......Again these are "concerns" about things that are not even happening...
 

Moogle11

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Feb 7, 2020
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Why do you think games aren't worth their cost ? I think, if anything, games are worth their cost and then some more than any other time in history. To think some arcadey games of the 80s and 90s, and many feature-lacking software were priced up to $70 or more. And you think they're overpriced now? Prices drop too, as ever, and there's the used games market, etc. It's not like the only option is to pay for day 1 full-price games. If you're willing to wait for some games chosen randomly by a company to make it to some service and pay for that as a rental, then I'd say waiting for some price drops or waiting to buy used could accomodate your gaming neccesities and budget. Maybe Game Pass does just that, but I find it hard to believe it's because "games aren't worth it" for any reasonable argument, I think you are either tight on money or gaming is not longer a main hobby to you.
To throw my own two cents in there, I do think today's great games are absolutely worth the money and the past couple of generations have arguably been my favorite (and I started gaming seriously with the SNES. But that doesn't mean I don't like to be frugal, and wanting to be frugal doesn't have to be due to necessity. My wife and I both make a bit over $100k and aren't having kids and have no bad debts so our budget isn't tight. But having a decent amount of disposable income doesn't mean we don't want to be frugal--I'd like to retire sooner than later, especially the more sick I get of my career and living in the US.

So I've got no qualms shelling out $60-70 for a new release I'm super hyped to pay day one. There just aren't anywhere near enough of those each year to fill my time since I really only play AAA, narrative-driven, single player games and not big time sink MP or service games. So in the past I often wasted money buying things I was kind of meh on just to have stuff to play, wasted time selling games I didn't like to recoup some costs etc.

Gamepass, PS+ freebies, Epic and other PC giveaways have been great for both the above reasons. Gamepass helps my frugality by not having to buy MS exclusive that are on there day one, and all those services are great for just having a bunch of games to play in between big new releases I'm hyped enough to pay full price and play at launch. Especially the first year or two of a new generating when those games are pretty sparse for me most of the time and I end up wasting time and money on medicore games just to use my new consoles.

The other big thing for me is I just have gotten to a point where I actively dislike owning media as I so rarely replay games, rewatch movies etc. One of my biggest regrets is having 300 some DVDs/BRs from my younger and dumber days. Realized a few years ago that we'd gone years without watching any of them and downsized by putting them into binders and recycling the cases. That's been like three years and I haven't unzipped those binders once. SMH. So it's just clutter at this point, but at least just a shelf in a closet instead of ugly media racks now.

Digital media solves the clutter problem, but rubs my frugal sensibilities the wrong way. So I've taken to buying most games I'm hyped about playing day one physically so I can sell when I'm done to keep costs down, not buying things I'm super on the fence about/that are out of my comfort zone and just playing stuff on Gamepass, PS+, Epic freebies etc. when I need some stuff to kill time until the next new releases. Or buying some games I was hyped for but didn't have time to play (either physically to sell when done, or digital if they're cheap enough)

So for me it's nothing to do with games not being worth it, it's just about hating clutter, not revisiting things after I play/watch them once, and getting more and more frugal in my 40s and onward as retirement looms. I'd rather enjoy games, movies etc. more cheaply with streaming services, Gamepass etc. as the only bottom line I care about is my own. I'll never spend money in interest of keeping a publisher or studio afloat. They can worry about their bottom line, I'll worry about mine by trying to find the cheapest, legal way to consume their products. And ownership just doesn't matter to me as someone who so rarely revisits things, isn't having kids to pass things down to and so on.

TLDR: I love games. I just love saving money more. So it's not a matter of games not being "worth it," just a matter of spending priorities and being in an era with so many cheaply available games, cheap video streaming services etc. to fill my free time for less cost than ever before.
 

LordBlodgett

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And again I will say, if the people in charge give you something, you can either accept it and go that route (gamepass) or give it a wide berth and buy your stuff physically. I'm telling you that eventually ALL the big compaines will create a subscription service, and instead of OWNING games you want, you will be playing the games they have curated for you and then take them away when they like! All for a monthly fee that, after you factor in all the subscription services, will cost a fucking fortune! Don't say I didn't warn any of you... And that isn't to pick on any of you in particular, but I'm really strongly against this shit. I was always happy renting films knowing that if I loved it I could purchase it (and trust me, my VHS/DVD/Blu Ray/4K Blu Ray collection is huge)! We are able to purchase games now even with gamepass BUT, the day will come (streaming) when it will be ONLY subscription. You will be begging to own games especially when you don't have the time to finish that game they are taking off the service in a few days.
I think the biggest counterpoint to this is the digital game market on PC. Most PC gamers in the western world buy digital, so much that physical games are almost impossible to buy. This has not led to games costing more though, in fact PC gaming probably has the lowest costs and highest availability for games of all platforms.

The other counterpoint to this is digital music and digital TV/movies. Sure, tons of shows/movies are on subscription services, but even with that a majority of them can be rented/purchased on Apple Store/Google Play/Amazon/Microsoft Store/Sony Playstation Store/Vudu or any plethora of other services. Some people still love to own their media, even if it is in digital form.

The entire idea that subscription services lead to the downfall of entire industries has proven false again and again, and I don't see it being any different in gaming than other forms of content. In fact, I would argue that we are in a better place in gaming because digital delivery and digital storefronts allow game makers of all sizes to access the market, whereas previously large game studios dictated releases due to the cost of physical release and distribution.
 
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Arkam

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Here, Now and maybe later
From my view, there is nothing Objectively wrong with GamePass (or PS Now, Stadia, etc). However the value proposition is very subjective. Some people are more than happy to pay a set fee to have access to a rotating set of content. Some people want the content they want, WHEN they want it and this model does not work for them. Its just like it was back in the day HBO vs buying movies.

There are smaller elements that differentiate the two paradigms (ownership vs access) as they work by different motivators. Ownership targets big/memorable events that you wait for and then remember longingly. This allows long lead times but raises the expectation. Access is built around novelty of the moment. Lowers the expectation but demands constant fresh content. Both are powerful and can be successful.... but they make two different end products. Ownership rewards big gambles/investment, access does not (to the same degree). Does this stop big content from coming to an access service? No. It makes it economically harder as you have to do it often and when you do you are cannibalizing your own eco system.