Why do people think God can change math?

[Two Words]

This has been argument I've had with people that always believe God can change math. Is it because math isn't taught right in school? It's like people think we derive mathematic principles from what we experience. Math is nothing but a set of necessary truths that precede each other. If you say one apple plus one apple makes two apples, that is an argument that is true regardless if God made it so a third apple pops out of nowhere when two apples meet. The statement 1 + 1 = 2 is true and 1 + 1 = 3 is false matter what experience shows us. Maybe this is why more abstract subjects in math is harder for American children. It's like they try and make sense of math from the real world when that isn't always useful.

 

[Robot Pants]

Cause fai- wait what?

 

[RatskyWatsky]

God is all powerful and can do anything he wants.

 

[speculawyer]

Because some people hear 'God' and that makes anything possible.

 

[Two Words]

God is all powerful and can do anything he wants.

Math isn't a "thing".

 

[Tathanen]

What an.. odd thing to come up in conversation. I don't think I've ever encountered a god vs math argument before.

 

[Sapphire Dreams]

Math is the result of our perception of the universe, if God can change how the universe works, I don't see why he cannot change math.

 

[SliceSabre]

Well God is supposed to be able to do whatever the hell he wants so if God says 1 + 1 = 3 then he can make it so.

 

[Arkos]

Well technically I guess he could

 

[GK86]

Can god divide by zero?

 

[Cbajd5]

dude 1 + 1 = 10, don't you know binary

 

[Chezzymann]

I heard somewhere once that the laws of physics change slightly the further you go out in the universe. I wonder if when you go far enough 1+1 equals fish!

 

[Manu]

I don't get it, is this "could God make 1+1 be 3?"?

 

[RatskyWatsky]

Math isn't a "thing".

a principle, a law, a fact. whatever. he created it and, thus, can change the rules whenever he wants. do you really not understand the concept of god? lol

 

[slit]

What is up with all the odd threads popping up lately? I mean GAF's always had its share of them but lately it's like 80% of the board is dropping acid.

 

[Two Words]

Math is the result of our perception of the universe, if God can change how the universe works, I don't see why he cannot change math.

Absolutely false. You are thinking of science.

 

[Chichikov]

I'm going to sidestep the god question, because no good can come out of it, but the question of what is math, and if it's a feature of the universe, our brain or an inevitable truth that exist outside those two is not a simple one.
Also, you say we know it from experience, arguing that math is empirical is not impossible (though it's not a consensus by any stretch of the imagination), but it's significantly more involved than saying "we know that if you have one apple and add another you now have two".

 

[Arkos]

What is up with all the odd threads popping up lately. I mean GAF's always had their share of them but lately it's like 80% of the board is dropping acid.

I've been spiking the GAF drinking fountains for some time now

 

[Starphoenix]

Umm, I've never heard this come up in any Christian (or any religion for that matter) circles... At all...

 

[RevoDS]

Math is just our way to understand and bring some order to our environment via what we perceive as logical.

Absolutely false. You are thinking of science.

As it happens, math is a science.

 

[adj_noun]

Could God make a math so big even He couldn't carry the one?

 

[Piercedveil]

Humans created math. God created humans. Therefore God created math and can alter it.

Now you can rest easy tonight, OP.

 

[Two Words]

I'm going to sidestep the god question, because no good can come out of it, but the question of what is math, and if it's a feature of the universe, our brain or an inevitable truth that exist outside those two is not a simple one.
Also, you say we know it from experience, arguing that math is empirical is not impossible (though it's not a consensus by any stretch of the imagination), but it's significantly more involved than saying "we know that if you have one apple and add another you now have two".

I'm saying math is not derived from experience. You don't need anything to prove what is true math. You can never have seen a circle and prove every element of it.

 

[Hato-kun]

Well he hasn't changed it thus far, I don't think he's going to anytime soon either. Just a hunch.

If he does I'll eat a hat.

 

[Servbot24]

Wait what? I have never heard of anything like this, and I grew up in a Christian community. Why would people think God is changing math?

 

[captive]

Lay off the weed OP.

 

[railGUN]

Which god?

 

[ItIsOkBro]

Us people defined 1 + 1 = 2, God didn't do it so he can't change it.

 

[Arkos]

Can god divide by zero?

That's the big bang

 

[NaM]

Define God...

 

[Two Words]

Math is just our way to understand and bring some order to our environment via what we perceive as logical.


As it happens, math is a science.

No. Math is not a science. Math does not yield to what nature tells us.

 

[Ninja Of Chaos]

Math is just our way to understand and bring some order to our environment via what we perceive as logical.


As it happens, math is a science.

No. It's not.

 

[CarpeDeezNutz]

Something something a priori...

This thread made me think of Henri Bergson.

 

[Snoshado]

What is this "god" you speak of?

 

[Exr]

Math is a human construct regardless.

 

[Two Words]

No. It's not.

What is this "god" you speak of?

It can be as almighty as you want, it doesn't change the result.

 

[Two Words]

Math is a human construct regardless.

No, it's not. The symbols we use for numbers, variables and operators are human constructions, but those just represent what are necessarily true whether we know it or not.

 

[DaveH]

"Is Math a Feature of the Universe or a Feature of Human Creation? | Idea Channel | PBS"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TbNymweHW4E

"Do Numbers Exist? - Numberphile"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1EGDCh75SpQ

His Omnipotence means power to do all that is intrinsically possible, not to do the intrinsically impossible. You may attribute miracles to Him, but not nonsense. There is no limit to His power.

If you choose to say, 'God can give a creature free will and at the same time withhold free will from it,' you have not succeeded in saying anything about God: meaningless combinations of words do not suddenly acquire meaning simply because we prifex to them the two other words, 'God can.'

It remains true that all things are possible with God: the intrinsic impossibilities are not things but nonentities. It is no more possible for God than for the weakest of His creatures to carry out both of two mutually exclusive alternatives; not because His power meets an obstacle, but because nonsense remains nonsense even when we talk it about God.

 

[impirius]

Could God math a math so math he couldn't math

 

[Prinz Eugn]

Math isn't a "thing".

But Everything's a Thing, and Other Middle School Arguments

my soon-to-be published philosophical tour de force

 

[Sapphire Dreams]

Absolutely false. You are thinking of science.

Math is all about quantity, structure, space, and change. How is that not about how we perceive the universe ?

 

[CarpeDeezNutz]

Could God math a math so math he couldn't math

Could god microwave a burrito so hot even he could not eat it?

I used that on a philosophy paper and the prof circled it and wrote "that's one hot oven!"

 

[OrlanisWorks]

Math is bigger than God.

You can change God, but you can't change math.

 

[Two Words]

Math is all about quantity, structure, space, and change. How is that not about how we perceive the universe ?

We use math to understand the universe. We don't use the universe to understand math.

 

[Two Words]

"Is Math a Feature of the Universe or a Feature of Human Creation? | Idea Channel | PBS"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TbNymweHW4E

"Do Numbers Exist? - Numberphile"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1EGDCh75SpQ

That's a great quote that really drives the point home.

 

[J-Rock]

God is math.

 

[RevoDS]

No, it's not. The symbols we use for numbers, variables and operators are human constructions, but those just represent what are necessarily true whether we know it or not.

That's also true of physics. Is physics not a science?

 

[GabDX]

I'm saying math is not derived from experience. You don't need anything to prove what is true math. You can never have seen a circle and prove every element of it.

Everything in math is derived from a set of axioms. These axioms can either be made up or based on experience.

 

[Ninja Of Chaos]

Math is all about quantity, structure, space, and change. How is that not about how we perceive the universe ?

Because it deals with truths that do not change based on perception. Like...a collection of things exists.

 

[unholyrevenger72]

Can god divide by zero?

Only Chuck Norris knows the reciprocal of Zero