Why does the main character from Control look less feminine than the concept art?

Contica

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Nice deflection.

But this isn't about Remedy alone, this is about a political agenda being pushed in the entire industry that is well reflected in that article.
Deflection? For me to deflect there needs to be something to deflect. Posting this article is a deflection, and a useless one at that.

The closest we've gotten to anything resembling proof for this chinspiracy is an article completely unrelated to the game and the company behind it.

I wonder how gaf anno 2019 would have reacted to Alien if it had been released today. I'll put my money on a lot of whining online about the political agenda behind this extremely masculine woman that somone put in this movie to eradicate pretty girls.

I give up. I'm in disbelief that these opinions actually exist.
 
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Jon Neu

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Deflection? For me to deflect there needs to be something to deflect. Posting this article is a deflection, and a useless one at that.
You are deflecting direct proof of an agenda being shoved on videogames, which is precisely why people suspect of this game.

I wonder how gaf anno 2019 would have reacted to Alien if it had been released today. I'll put my money on a lot of whining online about the political agenda behind this extremely masculine woman that somone put in this movie to eradicate pretty girls.
Probably. And you know why? Because this is 2019 and we have to suffer from all the spectrums of the cultural landscape with people trying incredibly hard to push a certain political agenda. People didn't care back then because there wasn't this political brainwashing appropriating everything to further their political beliefs. There wasn't this huge political wave trying to criminalize white men and videogame culture like there is today.
 

Cosmogony

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? Well....the person that plays her looks like that. I don't see anything wrong. Did OP not know women can look different or?

Yet you folks wonder why people look down on the community...
Doesn't this community include you?

I certainly wouldn't want to be associated with some the things you've said in the past. At least here people can and do disagree whereas in other places the bandwidth of disagreement has been artificially narrowed down by moderators. Posting there is indeed tantamount to tacit agreement with that sort of moderation.

Maybe you shouldn't care too much about the assessment of those ready to disregard your individual opinions and willing to bundle you up just because you post on GAF? If people want to know what I think, let them go through my individual posts and not stop at the fact I post here.

You're free to play a disingenuous game where you pretend no one is allowed to disagree with Remedy's aesthetic choices and free to chalk it all up to whatever male societal malaise you can think in the spur of the moment.
 

psorcerer

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This game is technically subpar and artistically impotent. What do you expect?
Essentially the same premise of a cyberpunk + surreal was much better executed in Remember Me. And the female lead was way more attractive and relatable.
 

Negotiator

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So you're trying to prove Remedy's woke agenda by linking to an article that doesn't mention Remedy, Control, Jesse Faden or anything else actually related to the game?
Are you playing dumb or what?

The article mentions Brooke Maggs, look it up.

“Diverse teams create diverse games,” maintains Australian writer and narrative designer Brooke Maggs.
 

Contica

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Probably. And you know why? Because this is 2019 and we have to suffer from all the spectrums of the cultural landscape with people trying incredibly hard to push a certain political agenda. People didn't care back then because there wasn't this political brainwashing appropriating everything to further their political beliefs. There wasn't this huge political wave trying to criminalize white men and videogame culture like there is today.
Yeah, your pain is real, I can tell. You pretty much just admitted that you're triggered by women being anything but set dressing.

Here's the kicker though. I agree with you. There's a clear agenda, and it's present in lots of places, such as the butchering of one of the baddest toughest girls in gaming, Lara Croft. It is however, not present in Control. At all.

Unless you're terrified of girls who haven gone through the glamour mag process of course.

I'm done with this topic, but let me just say this. If you think Control is "woke" just wait till you get to play Gears 5.

Are you playing dumb or what?

The article mentions Brooke Maggs, look it up.



Yes, because everybody knows who Brooke Mags is. Maybe you should lead with that next time.

In any case, lead writer is Sam Lake. She is a narrative designer, not a writer. It's not her story. Jesse Faden is not her creation.

I found a more relevant interview with her though, which is actually about Control. I don't think her job is what you think it is.




I think you all need a good dose of Heavy Metal magazine just to reset your brains a little.
 
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Negotiator

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I don't know what that magazine is, nor do I care. I've argued enough with virtuous SJWs like yourself. Ignored.
 

Cosmogony

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Yeah, your pain is real, I can tell. You pretty much just admitted that you're triggered by women being anything but set dressing.

Here's the kicker though. I agree with you. There's a clear agenda, and it's present in lots of places, such as the butchering of one of the baddest toughest girls in gaming, Lara Croft. It is however, not present in Control. At all.

Unless you're terrified of girls who haven gone through the glamour mag process of course.

I'm done with this topic, but let me just say this. If you think Control is "woke" just wait till you get to play Gears 5.



Yes, because everybody knows who Brooke Mags is. Maybe you should lead with that next time.

In any case, lead writer is Sam Lake. She is a narrative designer, not a writer. It's not her story. Jesse Faden is not her creation.

I found a more relevant interview with her though, which is actually about Control. I don't think her job is what you think it is.




I think you all need a good dose of Heavy Metal magazine just to reset your brains a little.
The problem with this ultra-sophisticated analysis of yours is the mistake of equating praise for female attractiveness with the hypothetical claim women only have beauty to offer and lack any moral virtues, which would indeed qualify as a sexist assertion.

Praising a woman for her beauty is no different than praising a Nobel prize winner for his academic achievements or a politician for having the courage to stand up to the acephalous mob. It doesn't mean all there is to these individuals is beauty, smarts or testicles. A beautiful woman is no more a sex object than a talented PhD is an academia object and a successful politician is a politics object.

All it means is that for convenience sake, conversationally, I am at the moment choosing to isolate one particular aspect of this person, but not at the expense or exclusion of all others aspects. I am certainly not claiming that, absent of beauty, women are worthless.

But some of the people who make the mistake you made do seem to think that beauty is a critical flaw and go to great lengths to kill off any vestige in them, notably via blue hair dye. Evidently, it's their body and they have every right to do as they please, even if that means making the world an ever so slightly worse place to live in.
 

Contica

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The problem with this ultra-sophisticated analysis of yours is the mistake of equating praise for female attractiveness with the hypothetical claim women only have beauty to offer and lack any moral virtues, which would indeed qualify as a sexist assertion.

Praising a woman for her beauty is no different than praising a Nobel prize winner for his academic achievements or a politician for having the courage to stand up to the acephalous mob. It doesn't mean all there is to these individuals is beauty, smarts or testicles. A beautiful woman is no more a sex object than a talented PhD is an academia object and a successful politician is a politics object.

All it means is that for convenience sake, conversationally, I am at the moment choosing to isolate one particular aspect of this person, but not at the expense or exclusion of all others aspects. I am certainly not claiming that, absent of beauty, women are worthless.

But some of the people who make the mistake you made do seem to think that beauty is a critical flaw and go to great lengths to kill off any vestige in them, notably via blue hair dye. Evidently, it's their body and they have every right to do as they please, even if that means making the world an ever so slightly worse place to live in.

The problem woth yours is that I've never said beauty is a problem.
 
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Cosmogony

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The problem woth yours is that I've never said beauty is a problem.
You insinuated someone for whom female beauty is indeed important displayed the usual vices ending in -ism or -ny. If beauty is a virtue, then female beauty qualifies and is praise-worthy. If beauty is a virtue, then deliberately seeking ugliness merits criticism.
 

Contica

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I don't know what that magazine is, nor do I care. I've argued enough with virtuous SJWs like yourself. Ignored.
To others who don't know, this is Heavy Metal magazine:



As you can see, it's very sjw.

You insinuated someone for whom female beauty is indeed important displayed the usual vices ending in -ism or -ny. If beauty is a virtue, then female beauty qualifies and is praise-worthy. If beauty is a virtue, then deliberately seeking ugliness merits criticism.
Horseshit. We're not discussing whether or not beauty is okay. Beauty is okay, always. If anyone thinks differently, fuck them.

But attacking a game for not having a main character who's pretty enough for you , and thus accusing the whole thing of being sjw pandering and designed to look like a man to suit some agenda?

Fuck out of here.
 
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Cosmogony

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(…)

Horseshit. We're not discussing whether or not beauty is okay. Beauty is okay, always. If anyone thinks differently, fuck them.

But attacking a game for not having a main character who's pretty enough for you , and thus accusing the whole thing of being sjw pandering and designed to look like a man to suit some agenda?

Fuck out of here.
What is the problem - exactly - with disagreeing with Remedy's chief artistic choices?
What is the problem with expressing the opinion A ) the protagonist is not attractive enough , B ) is not feminine enough ?

Do you acknowledge or do you not that a square jaw is objectively speaking a masculine feature?

If the claim is that it's all part of a campaign by Remedy, then the burden of proof is on him and he has to show evidence that's the case.
 

Contica

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What is the problem - exactly - with disagreeing with Remedy's chief artistic choices?
What is the problem with expressing the opinion A ) the protagonist is not attractive enough , B ) is not feminine enough ?

Do you acknowledge or do you not that a square jaw is objectively speaking a masculine feature?

If the claim is that it's all part of a campaign by Remedy, then the burden of proof is on him and he has to show evidence that's the case.
I guess that depends on how you define masculine. I've seen plenty of girls with fairly square jaws who are beautiful and feminine. It's not a feature that defines anything in any capacity. So no, it's not inherently masculine.

The rest I've already gone over ad nauseum, so I'm not gonna bother one more time.
 
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Jon Neu

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Yeah, your pain is real, I can tell. You pretty much just admitted that you're triggered by women being anything but set dressing.
Wow, I didn't know I was dealing with the type of antagonistic contrarian that literally invents things that doesn't exist because he doesn't have any real arguments to back his tantrums.

I'm done with this topic
You keep repeating that, but as the rest of your "arguments", it's still very unbelievable, both by the very fact of you still posting after already saying it and for the impression you are leaving in this thread.

Yes, because everybody knows who Brooke Mags is. Maybe you should lead with that next time.
Your level of intellectual dishonesty is embarassing.

You have been literally proven wrong and you still act like a condescending asshole that keeps deflecting to not acknowledge that someone who works at Remedy, literally admits to have a desire to further a political agenda into it's games.

You could make yourself a favor and this time actually keep your word about being done with the topic.
 

Contica

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Your level of intellectual dishonesty is embarassing.

You have been literally proven wrong and you still act like a condescending asshole that keeps deflecting to not acknowledge that someone who works at Remedy, literally admits to have a desire to further a political agenda into it's games.

You could make yourself a favor and this time actually keep your word about being done with the topic.


I fail to see the proof. Where is it? That tiny article where some women were interviewed and Maggs said she wanted to make a game were a boy and a girl were just friends? Is that the proof that Control is an agenda driven sjw piece with a woman designed to look like a man?

I could work at Remedy with an agenda to make every man and woman wear nothing but thongs, that doesn't mean it would actually happen.
 
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Jon Neu

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I fail to see the proof. Where is it? That tiny article where some women were interviewed and Maggs said she wanted to make a game were a boy and a girl were just friends? Is that the proof that Control is an agenda driven sjw piece with a woman designed to look like a man?
Yeah, is proof that people working at the industry and in Remedy in particular, have a will to infuse their videogames with a certain political agenda.

Nothing that anybody else with a shred of a brain wouldn't have already noted just by observing their "woke" language and artistic decisions, but at least is proof for the people like you who like to pretend that agenda doesn't exist.
 

Rhazer Fusion

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In my own world.
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I think the point of the thread is, if you are going to change appearances or make an average looking character in a game, why hire a beautiful actress and then disrespectfully deviate from the original appearance? I’m not necessarily talking about Control, but in general.

Again, literally everyone on TV, commercials or movies is generally portrayed to be as beautiful as possible, yet creators feel they should take a more grounded or average approach for females in video games, comics, etc? If it’s to get rid of the supposed “male gaze”, then do it in all forms of entertainment and don’t be selective or hypocritical.
 
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Contica

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Yeah, is proof that people working at the industry and in Remedy in particular, have a will to infuse their videogames with a certain political agenda.

Nothing that anybody else with a shred of a brain wouldn't have already noted just by observing their "woke" language and artistic decisions, but at least is proof for the people like you who like to pretend that agenda doesn't exist.
That's all you've got? It should be obvious? Lol
 
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lock2k

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I think the point of the thread is, if you are going to change appearances or make an average looking character in a game, why hire a beautiful actress and then disrespectfully deviate from the original appearance? I’m not necessarily talking about Control, but in general.

Again, literally everyone on TV, commercials or movies is generally portrayed to be as beautiful as possible, yet creators feel they should take a more grounded or average approach for females in video games, comics, etc? If it’s to get rid of the supposed “male gaze”, then do it in all forms of entertainment and don’t be selective or hypocritical.
You just made me remember one of fhe stupidest terms coined by these bozos: "male gaze" lmao :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 

joe_zazen

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I find it really stupid that you prefer to talk about a jaw or whatever, rather than about the good story of the game. I mean this tread is already 12 pages and the OT for control is 8... Something is wrong.

this thread is funny, so broad appeal

Control is a short game about throwing garbage at bad guys. Less people interested in that i guess?
 
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flacopol

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I think they want a hybrid char so everyone is happy? , this char have a penis , a vagina , 3 boobs (same girl from the Arnold swaschehrehger futuristic movie)

The game is good imo , maybe for a sale it is a little expensive full price, but is a good game , the storytelling very max payne , the shooting is good, the level of destruction ,is a little "you never die" also I think one of the best face modeling / expression. The cynical smile from P6 top noch
 
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CRUNT

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How come there were no threads on Lara's face from the last reboot changing rather than aging?
Only a guess but probably because the model/actress they used got a little older and during the third game's production she was starting to be pregnant so that's why her face is more pudgy. (If they recaptured for each game that is, I don't really know how any of it works.) Faces can change pretty quick post 30 years of age.
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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Only a guess but probably because the model/actress they used got a little older and during the third game's production she was starting to be pregnant so that's why her face is more pudgy. (If they recaptured for each game that is, I don't really know how any of it works.) Faces can change pretty quick post 30 years of age.
I doubt Square did all that extra work for each game.
 

EDMIX

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I think the point of the thread is, if you are going to change appearances or make an average looking character in a game, why hire a beautiful actress and then disrespectfully deviate from the original appearance
? Not everyone person used for mo cap was hired to be a 1.1 representation.

Again, literally everyone on TV, commercials or movies is generally portrayed to be as beautiful as possible
Thats 100% incorrect by default bud "literally everyone" can not be as many concepts seek someone that is average if they are seeking to prove a point.


Stop bud, just stop. I don't even think some of you have slowly evaluated what you are even posting. My god, to even say "literally everyone" makes me question if you've actually SEEN TV!

What someone thinks is beautiful is 100% subjective, even the link given to those people I sure some of them are married. Look at your own parents, are they all super models? Yet....you exist here before us... so the average person doesn't look like a damn super model and if you look around any public place at couples you might find some people you think are ugly. Thats ok, thats reality. That might be what many film directors, game developers etc are seeking with their titles....reality.

It'd be pretty weird to play any open world game where the entire population was fit, buff folks that looked liked models. That doesn't sound like any real situation. Like when you play a open world game and everyone happens to be the same height or something lolz
 

EDMIX

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not so sure about remdy being under some woke agenda with the protagonist...looks at this other "female" chara...


i think they are just bad with woman faces...

I don't think anything is wrong with it. Its not a good or a bad, you telling me the person above must look a different way? Based on what? What source of information is telling you this person must like different?
 

Danjin44

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For once I want to see western developers make sexy design and over the top. I feel like their idea of “over the top” is going with punk style character design.



I guess some people might find this “sexy”.
 
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EDMIX

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For once I want to see western developers make sexy design and over the top. I feel like their idea of “over the top” is going with punk style character design.



I guess some people might find this “sexy”.
What if they have been and you simply don't find that sexy?

So I think you might be wasting your breath asking for something you don't even like, the developer has no clue what you are talking about and can't get in your head. If you like Anime looking girls, thats what you like, but to think that is the default term for sexy and then start asking developers around the world to do the same makes very little sense.

It would be like me having some cookie monster fetish and saying its "sexy" and saying "For once I want to see western developers make sexy design and over the top....as in cookie monster". I'll tell you why they don't want to, its an agenda against fuzzy monsters.

So you can't ask a developer to make something that is literally subjective, they will make what they THINK is sexy as what you like differs from person to person.....ie subjective. Be like "why can't developers make it play good?" Sir, we know not of what you find "good" thus no one can really do what is being stated as its too subjective.

 

GymWolf

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I don't think anything is wrong with it. Its not a good or a bad, you telling me the person above must look a different way? Based on what? What source of information is telling you this person must like different?
are you serious? she doesn't even look like a human, let alone a female...
she loks like a bad npc from bethesda games...
 

EDMIX

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if you don't see what is in front of you nothing that i can say can convince you tbh...
If its something so easily explainable, why not? So...this tells me you likely understand what you see isn't really objective enough to give any real explanation on, it simply your opinion. Thats ok btw, but relax on the exaggeration, ie "doesn't even look like a human". That is something anyone can clearly support with real detail based on a human being made up of easy parts to explain, ie no head, eyes, mouth or something like that. Saying something you don't like, doesn't look human simply because you don't like it doesn't help your argument, it further proves what is being talked about is simply subjective in looks. So anyone can see someone that looks like that walking in the street and not find them attractive, that doesn't actually mean that person doesn't look human. Relax on trying to use a subjective view, to define something as good, bad, human etc.

So you don't need to "convince" me of anything, if you are correct, what a human is can be defined objectively, I don't need to agree or believe or have faith in that as all that is factual.

Soooo the fact that you can't really give any detail of what you are talking about doesn't help your point, it proves what you believe regarding this is solely subjective. I also don't know why you thought in order to be human, someone must be attracted to you or something lol If I saw that person walking down the street, I wouldn't be like "oh that person doesn't look human" etc.

Stop bud, its taking it to a whole level of nonsense. If you had something, you easily could list so many reasons behind it vs "nothing I can say". OHHHH you mean, its something that you feel? Personal taste? Oh based on opinion? Based on your own perception thus can't be objectively proven? Can not be explained maybe? hmmmm I mean damn, if only we had a word for that.