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[Faustek]

Sega didn't mismanage Valkyria, Sony fans just completely failed to realize the game's promise and didn't buy it enough. PC fans are giving it the love it deserves.

Hahaha wait a second I'm laughing my ass off. Not literally but I can feel the poop pushing.

I mean no way in hell many of us are double dipping. Or the fact that a game that got nearly no adds would do well above "expectations" after it's been hyped up by existing fans that are probably buying it again.

___________

And yes, I kinda see it as Golden Boy says. Sega is doing well. I just don't see them taking a chance on us in the West again. Especially not with text heavy games. Even if I'm sure they could cover the localisation costs I'm not sure about the various publishing costs. But I do think Sammy will let Atlus still be Atlus and not force to much of an overlap in Sega and Atlus.

 

[Saven]

I got their team in contact with sega just about 2 years ago, actually. Their programmer had moved on by that point and didn't want to deal with Sega.

And, because it's already being discussed - Sega shut down Streets of Rage remake because they started taking donations for the thing. Making money off of sega's IP is where they draw the line.

First of all, sorry for bumping an old topic, but I just want to clarify some information regarding what was said here about the Streets of Rage Remake project. I am an active member and contributor to the Bombergames community for a long time now, and what the poster above said about why the project got a C&D is absolutely not true.

Bomberlink states the reason behind the game getting taken down in this post below. He explains that there was no permission from Sega of Japan to distribute a Streets of Rage game, and Sega of Europe requested that the game be taken down. It had nothing to do with profiting off of donations or the game.

http://www.bombergames.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1012

Bomberlink never profited from the game. While it's true that donations were made, all of those donations were strictly FOR the forum, as bandwidth was costing Bomberlink quite a bit. It was clearly stated every time any donations were for hosting costs, never the game.

Also, while we are on the subject, I have no idea who you are Krejlooc. I have been involved with the Bombergames community since 2007 and I have never seen you on the old forum or on the new forum before. I find it interesting that you supposedly know all of this but at the same time don't work for Sega. Can you at least show me proof that you tried to get Sega and the team in contact? Otherwise, you are talking out of your ass.

 

[Arc Christelle]

Nobody bout their Playstation Exclusive Japanese entries, including Shinobi,Valkyria Chronicles, and Yakuza.

With Resonance of Fate being available on 360 and PS3 being a failure in [due to Final Fantasy XIII release LOL]
Sega was like, "Y'all don't want this shit."

Binary Domain only made it obvious. Especially with the only money they were making just happened to be Sonic.

 

[TC McQueen]

What happened to SEGA is what basically happened to every Japanese media company over time: the Japanese branch ignored all input from the western branch(es) and focused on catering to Japan (aside from stuff that deliberately targeted the west), which meant that they always had stuff people wanted but not on the platform they wanted. Then they didn't port stuff people wanted to PC fast enough, which meant they wound up leaving a lot of money on the table.

 

[Arc Christelle]

What happened to SEGA is what basically happened to every Japanese media company over time: the Japanese branch ignored all input from the western branch(es) and focused on catering to Japan (aside from stuff that deliberately targeted the west), which meant that they always had stuff people wanted but not on the platform they wanted. Then they didn't port stuff people wanted to PC fast enough, which meant they wound up leaving a lot of money on the table.

So how does that equal bad IP management?

 

[The Mad Draklor]

Sega's amount of mismanagement and lack of awareness of the western fanbases are astonishing. So many IPs and yet, Sega refuses to nurture them.

 

[TC McQueen]

So how does that equal bad IP management?

Not putting their stuff on platforms people actually wanted and focusing on Japan first meant that A) their IPs weren't making money because the people who wanted them couldn't get them, B) not porting to PC meant they couldn't more make money off certain IPs (which hurt the possibility they could be continued), and C) preventing your IPs from making money (which is the goal of your company) is the height of IP mismanagement.

 

[ZSaberLink]

Pretty simple, they are following the same development curve that other annualized series like Call of Duty uses - they're rotating teams on a 2-3 year dev cycle to produce games to fill a yearly void. I don't understand how people can comprehend the difference between Treyarch, Infinity Ward, etc, but can't distinguish between the developers of the Sonic series. They have their main team, the titular Sonic Team, which resides in Japan, which makes games like Sonic Unleashed and Sonic Generations and assisted with Sonic Colors. Then you have the Storybook team, which makes games like Sonic & The Black Knight and Sonic Lost World. They've been using 3rd parties to fill their void for a 3rd team, previously Sumo Digital, currently Big Red Button.

This year was Big Red Button's turn. Last year was the Storybook team's turn. Next year is Sonic Team's turn. I would put money down on a sequel to Sonic Transformed arriving in 2 years. The secret to following Sonic games? Only pay attention to Sonic Team and Sumo Digital. Their last 3 games have followed a very definite design philosophy.

Why do people keep saying Sonic Colors & Lost World were different teams than Generations & Unleashed? Dimps only made the portable versions. Sonic Team made the console ones (Wii & Wii U).

 

[sörine]

Why do people keep saying Sonic Colors & Lost World were different teams than Generations & Unleashed? Dimps only made the portable versions. Sonic Team made the console ones (Wii & Wii U).

The Storybook team was folded into the core Sonic Team for Generations, which they also worked on. They're not separate anymore afaik and haven't been since Gen. Lost World wasn't by the Storybook team since there is no longer any Storybook team. It also used core Sonic Team's Hedgehog Engine, like Unleashed and Generations.

Dimps also worked on Wii/PS2 Unleashed, which some preferred to the HD version. Plus Sonic 4 but we don't talk about that.

 

[Arc Christelle]

Not putting their stuff on platforms people actually wanted and focusing on Japan first meant that A) their IPs weren't making money because the people who wanted them couldn't get them, B) not porting to PC meant they couldn't more make money off certain IPs (which hurt the possibility they could be continued), and C) preventing your IPs from making money (which is the goal of your company) is the height of IP mismanagement.

Ah. I think I see what you mean.

The Storybook team was folded into the core Sonic Team for Generations, which they also worked on. They're not separate anymore afaik and haven't been since Gen.

Dimps also worked on Wii/PS2 Unleashed, which some preferred to the HD version. Plus Sonic 4 but we don't talk about that.

I liked Sonic 4. Episode I was alright, but weighed down by all the recycled shit. Episode II was solid imo. As in I could run through it for fun.

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

As far as home releases (whether hardware or software), the only thing Sega ever actually did right was with the Genesis. Pretty much everything before and after has either been shoddy, rushed, poorly thought out, poorly advertised, or a combination of those four things.

So to me, it's not a matter of why they've managed these IPs so badly, since what they've done with their IPs just seems to be par for the course.

 

[Arc Christelle]

As far as home releases (whether hardware or software), the only thing Sega ever actually did right was with the Genesis. Pretty much everything before and after has either been shoddy, rushed, poorly thought out, poorly advertised, or a combination of those four things.

So to me, it's not a matter of why they've managed these IPs so badly, since what they've done with their IPs just seems to be par for the course.

but... the Dreamcast....

 

[JoeyJungle]

-PS02 still has no international release.

This is true, but a western release has been confirmed. It's just been delayed.

Spoiler

Forever.

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

but... the Dreamcast....

Was a pretty amazing console that suffered from shitty promotion (those weird "It's Thinking" ads...?) and the combined weight of the Saturn, Sega CD, and 32X dragging it down.

 

[rjcc]

why has Sega managed everything so badly.

 

[Arc Christelle]

Was a pretty amazing console that suffered from shitty promotion (those weird "It's Thinking" ads...?) and the combined weight of the Saturn, Sega CD, and 32X dragging it down.

Yeah I was about to say that. It fell due to the past more than anything.

 

[MechDX]

Actually it does its released to SEA and its fully translated to English.

So why not release it? Money?

 

[JoeyJungle]

So why not release it? Money?

Probably server costs, translation costs for new content, and difficulty licensing the HUGE amount of licensed content from other series/anime. I get a new email from them every couple weeks letting me know about some new limited time DLC costume from fate/stay night and other game/anime series, a bunch of them definitely obscure in the west. I'd unsubscribe but I'd need to fill out a hiragana captcha.

 

[Duxxy3]

I think some of it is that their IP's don't translate all that well to today's gaming market. Their best games work well for the PS1 and PS2 generations, but with rising costs and changing tastes those games just don't make sense any longer.

I would kill to see a new Phantasy Star JRPG, a new Sega Rally and a new Virtua Fighter, but they would all likely lose money.

 

[TreasureHunterG]

That deal Sega cut with MS in 2002 to make a dozen OG Xbox exclusive games single handedly killed half a dozen IPs.

Yep, well put. It was a terrible business direction that took a massive blow on many of their franchises. Xbox userbase simply didn't gave a shit for Sega's games and they were heavily invested into that platform. That decision killed franchises like Jet Set Radio, Sega GT, Panzer Dragoon, Toejam & Earl, Shenmue and Crazy Taxi because of Xbox's audience indifference. There were possibilites, perhaps, if those games were made for PS2 or GCN instead, they could have a better performance and lasted longer. I really don't get why Sega was so invested on Xbox given Sonic Adventure 2 and Super Monkey Ball did great on GCN and Virtua Fighter 4 and Shinobi on PS2.

 

[Hcoregamer00]

I think some of it is that their IP's don't translate all that well to today's gaming market. Their best games work well for the PS1 and PS2 generations, but with rising costs and changing tastes those games just don't make sense any longer.

I would kill to see a new Phantasy Star JRPG, a new Sega Rally and a new Virtua Fighter, but they would all likely lose money.

The sad part is that they did license out a profitable mobile game, Chain Chronicle, to an incompetent, idiotic company that is damaging the game. Sega should have just kept the game in-house and localized it.

So you can argue even now, Sega is doing dumbass decisions for its IP.

 

[Spyder_Monkey]

Pretty much lack of vision + confidence in IPs. Same thing plaguing various other Japanese devs.

Right answer.

 

[Windforce]

Nothing is worse than the fact that Shining Force has been abandoned. SFIII on Saturn was amazing, wish it would have continued. Or even an HD port somewhere....

Yeah man, this hurts my feelings so much...

Other day playing Sleeping Dogs, I couldn't help but think it felt like a natural evolution of Streets of Rage.

Shining Force, PSO, Daytona, Virtua Fighter, Virtua Cop, there's just so much stuff...

 

[4Tran]

What happened to SEGA is what basically happened to every Japanese media company over time: the Japanese branch ignored all input from the western branch(es) and focused on catering to Japan (aside from stuff that deliberately targeted the west), which meant that they always had stuff people wanted but not on the platform they wanted. Then they didn't port stuff people wanted to PC fast enough, which meant they wound up leaving a lot of money on the table.

Sega's amount of mismanagement and lack of awareness of the western fanbases are astonishing. So many IPs and yet, Sega refuses to nurture them.

The very opposite is true. Sega tried to release a lot of their Japanese titles in the West, and they generally didn't sell very well. And so, they decided to change their tact towards Western PC releases. These have been so successful that they've been allowed to eat up a lot of development resources and even grow. And the same is true of any experimentation Sega does that seems to work: they will capitalize on any successes and allow further experimentation. That's pretty much where the Atlus sits in the larger company. I can also see games like Valkyria Chronicles getting a revival if the second (or maybe third) game also does well on Steam.

Sega has been cutting away the chaff that isn't very successful and nurturing whatever seems promising. That's a sign of a company that's finding its place in the market, and it's a quality that's somewhat lacking among the Japanese publishers save for Koei. While you may find it a shame that they're cutting the kind of games that were successful twenty years ago, it's only reflective of the fact that the market is different from twenty years ago.

 

[Megalosaro]

Truth is Sega has always been a joke company. There was a 3 to 4 year period where they were doing well but before and after were mismanaged.

Dreamcast was boss though