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Wii U Speculation Thread The Third: Casting Dreams in The Castle of Miyamoto

Jan 30, 2006
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I really think the description of PS2 to Xbox is accurate. Or Gamecube to Wii.
I'll be comparing WiiU to Wii games as that is Nintendo's jump. They haven't gone PS3 to WiiU they've gone Wii to WiiU

If I'm not wrong it'll be the biggest generational jump yet from console to console.

I'll compare
Mario galaxy 3 to 2
Pikmin3 to 2
Mario Kart 8 to Wii
As they can't be compared to anything else.

3rd parties will cry bitter tears that they can't compete with Nintendo yet all seem to be doing ports which will look not so.good.

On another note, what do people think of RE6? People in the thread think it looks great... I think it looks awful personally!
 

Log4Girlz

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May 23, 2006
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I'll be comparing WiiU to Wii games as that is Nintendo's jump. They haven't gone PS3 to WiiU they've gone Wii to WiiU

If I'm not wrong it'll be the biggest generational jump yet from console to console.

I'll compare
Mario galaxy 3 to 2
Pikmin3 to 2
Mario Kart 8 to Wii
As they can't be compared to anything else.

3rd parties will cry bitter tears that they can't compete with Nintendo yet all seem to be doing ports which will look not so.good.

On another note, what do people think of RE6? People in the thread think it looks great... I think it looks awful personally!
I know they skipped a generation, but people will be comparing it to said generation which was skipped.
 
Jan 30, 2006
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I disagree.
They could of had EAD Tokyo spend the last 3 years developing an engine for all departments to use.
Not that they have of course...
They'd need new engines anyway as the old ones wouldn't cut it this time around. And Galaxy engine is pretty sweet




Let them compare Galaxy to Uncharted
Or Mario Kart to GT5..... that's as retarded as my tag.
 

jump_button

Banned
Dec 24, 2007
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3rd parties will cry bitter tears that they can't compete with Nintendo yet all seem to be doing ports which will look not so.good.

On another note, what do people think of RE6? People in the thread think it looks great... I think it looks awful personally!
:/ RE6 no still no RE4 really what wrong with them? did they shoot the team that made RE4?

3rd parties will go with the biggest market, they not be happy unless all 3 are the same
 

NBtoaster

Member
Aug 3, 2010
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I disagree.
They could of had EAD Tokyo spend the last 3 years developing an engine for all departments to use.
Not that they have of course...
They'd need new engines anyway as the old ones wouldn't cut it this time around. And Galaxy engine is pretty sweet




Let them compare Galaxy to Uncharted
Or Mario Kart to GT5..... that's as retarded as my tag.
Nintendo doesn't exist in a vacuum. People will be comparing their tech to their competitors, and for the first year or two that will be PS3/360/PC/iPad, not the Wii.
 

Log4Girlz

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May 23, 2006
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I disagree.
They could of had EAD Tokyo spend the last 3 years developing an engine for all departments to use.
Not that they have of course...
They'd need new engines anyway as the old ones wouldn't cut it this time around. And Galaxy engine is pretty sweet




Let them compare Galaxy to Uncharted
Or Mario Kart to GT5..... that's as retarded as my tag.
Hey did you see the newest call of Duty for Wii U? OHMAHGOD its like lighyears ahead of the Wii version. We must whip out our wallets and purchase a Wii U right away!

Nah they'll probably compared it to the Xbox 360 version. If you want to compare Nintendo titles to one another, go for it, that's what most Nintendo fans will do, but the vast majority of hardcore consumers will be more critical. Casuals never cared :/
 
Jan 30, 2006
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Nintendo doesn't exist in a vacuum. People will be comparing their tech to their competitors, and for the first year or two that will be PS3/360/PC/iPad, not the Wii.
How do you compare said games though?

Maybe you'd be able to compare a Retro game or the new Xenoblade type game.... but then again I'm not people
 

Persona7

Banned
Sep 24, 2007
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I want literally every single nintendo franchise to have at least 1 HD entry next generation, just to see what they do.
I would rather have some you know, new titles.

I am bored of the tired old Nintendo franchises.

I am not going to buy a single game set in the mario universe on the wii U.
 
Jan 30, 2006
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I would rather have some you know, new titles.

I am bored of the tired old Nintendo franchises.

I am not going to buy a single game set in the mario universe on the wii U.
Why? 2 of the last console Mario Games are not only the best Mario games but 2 of the best games of all time.
 

Peru

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Dec 18, 2005
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I would rather have some you know, new titles.

I am bored of the tired old Nintendo franchises.

I am not going to buy a single game set in the mario universe on the wii U.
Mario games change and warp in nature each generation. It's a blank template for platform experimentation. Don't know why you'd choose such a continuously innovative series as your example.
 

AzaK

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Jun 11, 2011
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LOL. Close enough. Since you have an infant I'll let you slide. ;)

But yeah there definitely seems to be something to it after Li Mu Bai's post essentially said the same thing. Summarizing, if the GPU's "extra functions" are not used then the GPU is moderately more powerful than the current gen. If they are used, then the GPU is noticeably more powerful

Or the "Remember how Nintendo fans thought Wii...".
Thanks. This mixed system thing is really really interesting even if it means some devs might struggle. Hopefully they can get to grips with whatever it is and create better versions for Wii U.


I don't understand technical mumbo jumbo, but someone told me that more middleware being applied could loosen stress on the processor or something like that.
So the CPU sucks :/
No, just that the middleware is very CPU intensive. I imagine the middleware in question is the audio middleware we have talked about before. It is totally CPU bound, but Wii U has dedicated audio hardware that could take almost the entire audio load off the CPU if that middleware was updated to use it.
 

Log4Girlz

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May 23, 2006
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We keep going in circles and circles fascinated by the new technology...I don't care! I'm one of the sheep too!

 

Hiltz

Member
Dec 8, 2007
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One cannot deny that Nintendo could more new core franchises. It's why so many of us are excited about the idea of Miyamoto acknowledging how long its been since he's made a new mascot character since Pikmin.
 

Gahiggidy

My aunt & uncle run a Mom & Pop store, "The Gamecube Hut", and sold 80k WiiU within minutes of opening.
Jun 12, 2004
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Wich would be what most people in here with at least half a brain is expecting... DC to N64 is the perfect comparison GRAPHICS wise.

But thanks to the amazing 1st and 2nd party offerings, they will be nowhere near "Dreamcasted" this gen! Just to get this out of the way in before someone wants to mention this...
So to further this analogy...
Code:
   Wii U = Dreamcast
Xbox 360 = N64
     PS3 = PSOne
Xbox 720 = Xbox
     PS4 = PS2
Have I got that right?
 

jump_button

Banned
Dec 24, 2007
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One cannot deny that Nintendo could more new core franchises. It's why so many of us are excited about the idea of Miyamoto acknowledging how long its been since he's made a new mascot character since Pikmin.
Well rumours four new IP and two will be at E3, If one of them Retro new IP dear god I dont think I can take a Retro game in HD
 

Log4Girlz

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May 23, 2006
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So to further this analogy...
Code:
   Wii U = Dreamcast
Xbox 360 = N64
     PS3 = PSOne
Xbox 720 = Xbox
     PS4 = PS2
Have I got that right?
In that scenario Wii U is more like the Model 2 arcade board than Dreamcast. Dreamcast absolutely blew the N64 out of the water.
 

guek

Banned
Apr 27, 2011
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Nintendo doesn't exist in a vacuum. People will be comparing their tech to their competitors, and for the first year or two that will be PS3/360/PC/iPad, not the Wii.
That's not how sales work. People on gaf will certainly do so, but not the majority of the public. Like I've said, most people will initially be attracted or deterred by what's actually offered by the system. People wont see the wii u and immediately start comparing it to other products. They'll begin by considering what's offered, what the system's hook is, and what software is offered. And then they'll ask the question whether they need it or not. That's tangentially related to other products they already own or are considering purchasing, but the product will be judged on what it offers, not by what other products offer.

And yes, if they feel that they get what the Wii U offers on other platforms, of course they'll pass. But that's assuming the Wii U wont offer anything new, which we already know it will. It's not an ipad and it's not a 360. It's a Wii U and people will buy it if they think the software and applications are attractive. They wont if they don't.

This is the same principle behind the original Wii's success. People didn't look at the wii and immediately think "this looks worse than xbox 360." They picked up the controller and thought "this is new." At most, people will pick up the upad and think "this is kinda like an ipad," but only a complete imbecile will think they're similar products, namely because wii u is clearly a gaming console with buttons and circle pads meant to be enjoyed in tandem with a television and the ipad is none of those things.
 

Hoo-doo

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Sep 29, 2011
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All I want is them to create a 3D Pokémon RPG.
Not an MMO, just a gorgeous 3D version in style of the DS games.

Would make me an instant WiiU believer. There's just so much potential there!


So to further this analogy...
Code:
   Wii U = Dreamcast
Xbox 360 = N64
     PS3 = PSOne
Xbox 720 = Xbox
     PS4 = PS2
Have I got that right?
Man, I hope you're right. Back in the day the Dreamcast completely blew me away, coming from the PS1.
 

Gahiggidy

My aunt & uncle run a Mom & Pop store, "The Gamecube Hut", and sold 80k WiiU within minutes of opening.
Jun 12, 2004
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In that scenario Wii U is more like the Model 2 arcade board than Dreamcast. Dreamcast absolutely blew the N64 out of the water.
Yet Dreamcast was released only three years after the N64.
 

Log4Girlz

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May 23, 2006
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Yet Dreamcast was released only three years after the N64.
And the Wii U will have 7 years over the Xbox 360. Sigh, how I long for the olden days of monstrous generational leaps.

Which is what ShockingAlberto said.
Dreamcast effectively was 10x more powerful than the N64, and the PS2 was dramatically more powerful than it. We'll be LUCKY to get a 6 x leap with the Loop/Durango/Orbis. Generational leaps aren't what they used to be.
 

guek

Banned
Apr 27, 2011
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I hope Mr. Alberto is correct in his assessment, I really do.

Like I've been saying for awhile, I just want the ability to receive downports >_<

I sincerely believe if it can play them, they will come (even if the support wont necessarily be there from day 1).
 

AzaK

Member
Jun 11, 2011
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And the Wii U will have 7 years over the Xbox 360. Sigh, how I long for the olden days of monstrous generational leaps.



Dreamcast effectively was 10x more powerful than the N64, and the PS2 was dramatically more powerful than it. We'll be LUCKY to get a 6 x leap with the Loop/Durango/Orbis. Generational leaps aren't what they used to be.
Well I wasn't talking in 'x' I was talking about perceived difference. Anyway it sounds like Wii U will look superior to current gen.
 

Log4Girlz

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May 23, 2006
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Well I wasn't talking in 'x' I was talking about perceived difference. Anyway it sounds like Wii U will look superior to current gen.
The perceived difference will be far less than DC to N64. I mean, that made jaws drop when that came out.
 

HylianTom

Banned
May 3, 2007
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Loving life in Uptown NOLA.
I think most casuals right now want touch based games.
In that case, that touchpad might be right up their alley. This seems to be a case where Nintendo recognized the popularity of touch-based games, tablet gaming, and the idea of multitasking at home (watching TV while surfing on an iPad, for example). Having recognzed these trends, it looks like Nintendo is trying to harness them all with one controller and system. In fact, one could argue that they are ahead of the competition since the others aren't offering the same interface and functionality.

Nintendo: ahead of the curve? It'll be fun to see if this gamble works for them. Imagine the reactions around the industry if Nintendo once again leads in marketshare. Media outlets would have a hard time writing it off as another five-year fluke or fad. Do you think third parties would finally get a clue that maaaaybe, perhaps, possibly they should consider throwing some heavier support Nintendo's way? Maybe? :)
 

NBtoaster

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That's not how sales work. People on gaf will certainly do so, but not the majority of the public. Like I've said, most people will initially be attracted or deterred by what's actually offered by the system. People wont see the wii u and immediately start comparing it to other products. They'll begin by considering what's offered, what the system's hook is, and what software is offered. And then they'll ask the question whether they need it or not. That's tangentially related to other products they already own or are considering purchasing, but the product will be judged on what it offers, not by what other products offer.

And yes, if they feel that they get what the Wii U offers on other platforms, of course they'll pass. But that's assuming the Wii U wont offer anything new, which we already know it will. It's not an ipad and it's not a 360. It's a Wii U and people will buy it if they think the software and applications are attractive. They wont if they don't.

This is the same principle behind the original Wii's success. People didn't look at the wii and immediately think "this looks worse than xbox 360." They picked up the controller and thought "this is new." At most, people will pick up the upad and think "this is kinda like an ipad," but only a complete imbecile will think they're similar products, namely because wii u is clearly a gaming console with buttons and circle pads meant to be enjoyed in tandem with a television and the ipad is none of those things.
I'm not necessarily really talking about casuals and sales. I'm talking about comparisons that will be made on places like gaf, and what the 'informed' market will do.

How do you compare said games though?
Compare similar types of games and engines.
 
Jun 11, 2010
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It just occurred to me that Apple has really been thinking out of the box on this. Apple didn't become successful by sticking with the preexisting standards and mass market expectations. They created new product lines and found new ways to present technology. If Apple was only making PCs that ran MacOS, you can bet they'd still be way behind MS. MS, conversely, is probably struggling a bit to keep the hardcore gaming audience that has gotten them where they are now while pursuing Bill Gates' long-standing dream of the Ultimate Set-Top Do-It-All-in-One Box. Bill Gates was a good thinker, but is this the right decision for the company?

Then again, we don't even know for sure what form the Xbox v. 3 will even take: a split model template of "hardcore-friendly" and "casual/Kinect"? Only a guns-ablazin' high-end hardcore half-a-dozen-gigs-of-ram megabeast of "x99 US Dollars" proportions? The rumors out there don't even agree on hardly any points.

Nintendo has always tried to find ways to innovate in the console space. They will almost always try out new things well before any other company. Who would be first to implement haptic feedback on their touchscreen controller: Microsoft, Sony, or Nintendo? You know the answer. Micro— So— Nintendo, of course.

This wasn't meant to be an organized series of thoughts. Just my take on the current state of things.
 

ColdBlooder

Banned
Aug 24, 2006
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It just occurred to me that Apple has really been thinking out of the box on this. Apple didn't become successful by sticking with the preexisting standards and mass market expectations. They created new product lines and found new ways to present technology. If Apple was only making PCs that ran MacOS, you can bet they'd still be way behind MS. MS, conversely, is probably struggling a bit to keep the hardcore gaming audience that has gotten them where they are now while pursuing Bill Gates' long-standing dream of the Ultimate Set-Top Do-It-All-in-One Box. Bill Gates was a good thinker, but is this the right decision for the company?

Then again, we don't even know for sure what form the Xbox v. 3 will even take: a split model template of "hardcore-friendly" and "casual/Kinect"? Only a guns-ablazin' high-end hardcore half-a-dozen-gigs-of-ram megabeast of "x99 US Dollars" proportions? The rumors out there don't even agree on hardly any points.

Nintendo has always tried to find ways to innovate in the console space. They will almost always try out new things well before any other company. Who would be first to implement haptic feedback on their touchscreen controller: Microsoft, Sony, or Nintendo? You know the answer. Micro— So— Nintendo, of course.

This wasn't meant to be an organized series of thoughts. Just my take on the current state of things.
Great post.

I approve!
 

AzaK

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Jun 11, 2011
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I'm not necessarily really talking about casuals and sales. I'm talking about comparisons that will be made on places like gaf, and what the 'informed' market will do
Compare similar types of games and engines.
The 'informed' market will buy whatever platform they have already decided to buy and find whatever 'facts' they can to support their platform being the best. I bet there is less than 1 person here on GAF that's hasn't made up their mind already. Unfortunate as that sounds.
 

z0m3le

Banned
Jun 16, 2011
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www.notenoughshaders.com
So I think these 2 GPU rumors on the other consoles does push an interesting possibility, I think MS and Sony will end up very close to Wii U in specs, except they will have a second, slower GPU designed mostly for quiet operation for media and most importantly it will be used for OpenCL, There is no need to push higher Gflops if they can actually build a cheaper, quieter box that does things current consoles actually can't do... (that is to say, blades of grass that react naturally to environments, along with hair, paper, explosions, it would take the currently static world of games, and allow for dynamic fidelity, it's something that will look nice but allow just about every game for these systems to be produced on the Wii U (except for extreme cases where physics plays a huge role in the game that can't be done on a pc thanks to millions of particles... but that should be very niche.)
 

The_Ayertosco

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Feb 18, 2007
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So I think these 2 GPU rumors on the other consoles does push an interesting possibility, I think MS and Sony will end up very close to Wii U in specs, except they will have a second, slower GPU designed mostly for quiet operation for media and most importantly it will be used for OpenCL, There is no need to push higher Gflops if they can actually build a cheaper, quieter box that does things current consoles actually can't do... (that is to say, blades of grass that react naturally to environments, along with hair, paper, explosions, it would take the currently static world of games, and allow for dynamic fidelity, it's something that will look nice but allow just about every game for these systems to be produced on the Wii U (except for extreme cases where physics plays a huge role in the game that can't be done on a pc thanks to millions of particles... but that should be very niche.)
The WiiU is a 360 with a great amount of memory, even if the specs are still not closed but don't feel too confident that they'll change a lot. Don't know the precise specs but it's pratically a more capable revision of the actual gen. Instead, i think (but it's just a guess) that PS4 and 720 will play on a different field pushing new hardware being real "next gen".
 

wsippel

Banned
May 25, 2006
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The WiiU is a 360 with a great amount of memory, even if the specs are still not closed but don't feel too confident that they'll change a lot. Don't know the precise specs but it's pratically a more capable revision of the actual gen. Instead, i think (but it's just a guess) that PS4 and 720 will play on a different field pushing new hardware being real "next gen".
Ehm... Meaningless numbers aside, the Wii U hardware is several generations ahead of the PS360 generation. It's not using 2004/ 2005 technology.
 

The_Ayertosco

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Feb 18, 2007
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Ehm... Meaningless numbers aside, the Wii U hardware is several generations ahead of the PS360 generation. It's not using 2004/ 2005 technology.
I'm talking about capabilities and that's what they told me (people that are working on it). They're friends and i don't think they lied but they're designers\artists and not tech whores\programmers so i personally think that game studios can make great things with it with a more modern tech even if the raw power seems similar.
 

frankie_baby

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May 3, 2007
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I'm talking about capabilities and that's what they told me (people that are working on it). They're friends and i don't think they lied but they're designers and not tech whores\programmers so i personally think that game studios can make great things with it with a more modern tech even if the raw power seems similar.
And so will the ps4 and durango, just a refinement of the current gen, there's little capabilities wise left to go
 

z0m3le

Banned
Jun 16, 2011
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The WiiU is a 360 with a great amount of memory, even if the specs are still not closed but don't feel too confident that they'll change a lot. Don't know the precise specs but it's pratically a more capable revision of the actual gen. Instead, i think (but it's just a guess) that PS4 and 720 will play on a different field pushing new hardware being real "next gen".
Wii U, 720 and PS4 will all have modern tech in them, they will do virtually the same things, though granted Wii U will likely be slower (how much is anyones guess, personally I would say at most half as fast) My post was about how PS720 will actually be different, it won't be in picture quality, but in more realistic movement, physics and AI. All thanks to OpenCL computing, other than this, there is nothing that these boxes could do in 1080p that 360 couldn't do (/prebake) in 480p at half frames, even if it's 10x slower.