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Windows Central: "At launch, we've heard there won't be any "Xbox Scarlett"-exclusive games.

Ellery

Member
Microsoft is selling games across platforms at this point X1S, X1X, XLockhart, XAnaconda, PC, Cloud, etc. The lowest common denominator will most likely be forced to stream next gen games at this point or they will build games intelligently. I'm thinking they will be building intelligently as they have the funding to do so. One does not simply pass up the opportunity to be on top by not having great looking games. For all we know, this article is hogwash.

Metro Exodus is anotther title that comes to mind that scales fairly well and includes Ray-Tracing on PC that makes it look phenomenal. It currently runs on Xbox One S also.

Yes they will do what they deem to be right. I am just a random dude on the internet and I can only estimate things from my point of view. If the article is not completely fake then I guess Microsoft has reasons beyond my understanding why they would opt to do that. In the end it is about execution and presentation. Microsoft has a real chance now having E3 without Sony and being "the place" for third party developer AAA games to be shown of.
Maybe they can pull it off, but Sony won't sleep and if they start the PS5 with big exclusives like maybe Horizon 2, Bloodborne 2 or a new God of War then I am certain those games will look favorably over Microsoft games.

If I buy a console at launch like PS5 and buy a new 3rd party title then surely there should be some big difference between that and a PS4 version. Otherwise what's the point of buying a new console until a few years later?

Yes of course. Mostly resolution, texture quality, shadow quality, draw distance and of course framerate and frametimings
It will be roughly the same as Multiplats/Multigens on PS3 -> PS4 like Assassins Creed Black Ship or so
 
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thelastword

Banned
To this day, there is no PS console that didn't have exclusive games at launch.......Neither has there been an XBOX console without any exclusive at launch....Hell, it could be Super Lucky Tales 2, Lococyle 2, State of Decay 3 or CrackDown-The Good Version Evolved, but they will have something.......So it's certainly not a norm as a certain poster is trying so hard to imply....Almost in beat my face to the wall to a pulp "believe me guys" fashion....

The only thing is this, it might be harder for MS to have exclusive games going forward, if the intention is to have their games on all devices, it means that their games will scale alot....I think Forza 8 will launch on XBONES, XBONEX, Scarlett, Windows Store, Steam, Xcloud etc......The same for Gears.......Inxile's games, Rare's games, SOD3, and all those indie devs won't have games that are impossible on the lesser kit below Anaconda, so they will try to maximize sales across the pond.......I think the first real exclusive for Anaconda will be what the Initiative is working on and even that may be timed.....and will come to PC eventually....
 

juliotendo

Member
This move makes sense considering the amount of investment both XBOX and PlayStation have made in their respective online digital storefronts and networks.

Going forward generations will have much smoother transitions instead of abrupt stops like we typically have seen. Microsoft and Sony still make plenty of money selling current generation hardware and associated services.
 

Three

Member
If you would develop a new cross-plat game, would you ignore previous gen, which is 100 million install base of PS4 alone?
This has nothing to do with leaving an install base behind because this was already done in the transition to this gen when they mostly left 360 and PS3 behind. Blame the transition to services for this crap. MS don't give a shit about selling you a console, they care about marketing and selling you subscriptions on top of subscriptions. If they haven't sold you a new console but you're paying the same subscription then why would they try and sell you a console for little profit or a loss (I still think they make a small profit on console sales as much as they try to dodge the question)

There is little reason to get you to transition unless they charge more for games or services on the next gen or somehow generate more money (by killing used games for example) .

Before the actual consoles ruled. The hardware manufacturer made some exotic compelling hardware to attract the consumer. The consumer bought the hardware and developers followed the consumer. Now services and ecosystems rule, they sell a service and aren't driven by the need to make hardware that compelling or different to shift people because they don't really care if you shift to next gen or not. "we have a console for that, it's called the 360" has more behind it than you think. Their big online game Titanfall releasing on 360 had a reason. It's the "we don't care, you're still paying the same anyway" reason. Their only incentive for a gen shift on XB1 was to kill used games but luckly that didn't pan out for them. Sony's was following MS' footstep of charging a subscription.
 

Bogroll

Likes moldy games
A lot of things can be done... creativity is not something closed and if you have more power to use you will always find a way to use it.
But when what you can do is limited by something else... you start to limit what you can do.

It is like the EA dev said in the article I posted... if you can focus and works only with GTX 1080 and Ryzen 8-cores on mind you will create something spectacular that can't run (and be sold) to older hardware.
I agree with you but I'm struggling to think of a game that couldn't be cut down graphically on Ps4 that couldn't have a version on a 360 and I'm not saying there aren't any.
Arguably one of the biggest games and genres this gen what was not on last gen consoles is Fortnite and you can even play against Ps4/Xb1 with a mobile phone (well I think you could before)
 
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Hendrick's

If only my penis was as big as my GamerScore!
Nope we had ps4 exclusives early on such as Driveclub, Killzone, Second Son, etc... With over like 70 million ps3 owners. Let's not try to minimize this rumor if true, it isn't a good look. You can have exclusives to next Gen as well as cross gen games just like last time. People want bonifide exclusives to take advantage of the hardware. Shit you have games like Infamous that still looks better than games coming out from the competition.

ps2 had over 120 million sold at ps3 launch. and guess what. ps3 exclusives.
ps4 lauched when ps3 had 75+ million sold. and guess what. ps4 exclusives.

if you think there wont be PS5 exclusives at launch you gotta be dense

edit: started typing on my phone but moved over to my pc

In all of those case, the hardware was drastically different. That is simply no longer the case anymore. Anything made for the PS5 will easily scale down to the PS4.

It's in Sony's interest to implement new technologies into their next gen console that will give the perception to the consumer that these games are simply not possible on the previous gen. It may just be marketing and propaganda, but that is they have sold every other gen, and coming off of the back of PS4, there's no way they can change that strategy now.

My comment about the read speeds of the drive that's going to be in PS5 is also being ignored. Mark Cerny's interview with Wired basically outlines this generational thinking in plain view.

Anyway, Hendrick's, you're just selectively quoting me without fully considering the full implications of getting rid of console generations for Sony, justification from a financial and economic point of view, or from the perspective of being the industry leader.

All we can do is take a wait & see approach. I'm just saying I wouldn't be holding my breath, that's all.

I'm not saying "get rid of console generations" . I'm saying, that it would make sense to release games that work on both generations until a point where adoption of the PS5 ramps up and PS4 winds down.

Y I K E S if true.

I see it as a positive for the consumer. Especially for Microsoft where 1st party games will be play anywhere. For example Halo Infinite will be PC>Scarlett>Xbox One. How can anyone see this as a negative? Obviously it will scale accordingly and still fully utilize the new tech.

When sony was previewing Spiderman on ps5 devkits they said the ssd lets spiderman move around like a rocket engine. Having an ssd would fundamentally change the way the game would be designed. So if all next gen systems are desinged with an sdd in mind, how can you down port that to inferior hardware without making drastic compromises? Its mot just taking it from 4k to 1080p here.

Crazy how people can play games on PC bot with and without an SSD. Longer load times aren't going to break the game.
 

ethomaz

Banned
I agree with you but I'm struggling to think of a game that couldn't be cut down graphically on Ps4 that couldn't have a version on a 360 and I'm not saying there aren't any.
Arguably one of the biggest games and genres this gen what was not on last gen consoles is Fortnite and you can even play against Ps4/Xb1. (well I think you could before)
I can give you a real case example.

Destiny inventory management was super limited because PS360 legacy... after they dropped these consoles (Rise of the Iron expansion) they could increase the vault in the game and new features that were not implemented due PS360 started to popup in updates.

It is a small exemple but a game changer to these that play Destiny.

Bungie was clear about how last-gen memory restrictions was a big issue to implement forward features in the game.
 
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DunDunDunpachi

Patient MembeR
I see it as a positive for the consumer. Especially for Microsoft where 1st party games will be play anywhere. For example Halo Infinite will be PC>Scarlett>Xbox One. How can anyone see this as a negative? Obviously it will scale accordingly and still fully utilize the new tech.
In the short term, maybe it'll be nice for the consumer.

In the long run, nope.

I don't mind admitting I was totally wrong about Microsoft on this issue if in 10 years their deemphasis of the Xbox console brand is still paying dividends for the consumer.
 

Gamernyc78

Banned
In all of those case, the hardware was drastically different. That is simply no longer the case anymore. Anything made for the PS5 will easily scale down to the PS4.



I'm not saying "get rid of console generations" . I'm saying, that it would make sense to release games that work on both generations until a point where adoption of the PS5 ramps up and PS4 winds down.



I see it as a positive for the consumer. Especially for Microsoft where 1st party games will be play anywhere. For example Halo Infinite will be PC>Scarlett>Xbox One. How can anyone see this as a negative? Obviously it will scale accordingly and still fully utilize the new tech.



Crazy how people can play games on PC bot with and without an SSD. Longer load times aren't going to break the game.

I know your name well on this forum, fight that good fight my lad 🤣🤣🤣
 

Imtjnotu

Member
In all of those case, the hardware was drastically different. That is simply no longer the case anymore. Anything made for the PS5 will easily scale down to the PS4.



I'm not saying "get rid of console generations" . I'm saying, that it would make sense to release games that work on both generations until a point where adoption of the PS5 ramps up and PS4 winds down.



I see it as a positive for the consumer. Especially for Microsoft where 1st party games will be play anywhere. For example Halo Infinite will be PC>Scarlett>Xbox One. How can anyone see this as a negative? Obviously it will scale accordingly and still fully utilize the new tech.



Crazy how people can play games on PC bot with and without an SSD. Longer load times aren't going to break the game.
You're a fool if you think they will focus ton making 3 different versions of the same game for launch 😂
 
Seems Bold, if True. Consider how fundametally different designing a game around the OG Xbox one with its jaguar cpu and lack of SSD hard drive. compared to a fully fledged next gen gpu, ssd, and ryzen cpu.
Probably not much that can't be done by sacrificing resolution and/or frame rate and/or details in order to run the game (ex: you have a 4k 60fps target on the new machine.. you target 1440p on the X and 720/900p on the S, load only assets that fit in their respective memory bank, with all the jaguar based machines doing their best to lock 30fps... load times may be longer on the older machines, but they may not be so different than what you are used to at the moment.

Frankly this is what I expected, you're going to get the same games with a couple of perks.
 

BlackTron

Member
If you didn’t expect this, for either console, you really are dumb.

We can agree to disagree, the entire strategy is to make money and by releasing on both consoles starting out would maximize their profits because not everyone is going to buy a new console right away. I don’t expect support to fade away, and rely on third party support. I think at least for a year, maybe more, which may very well align with your statement about Ghost being the last for the PS4.

Yes if a game is cross-gen, more money would be made on that specific software title, but what about the far more important total money made across the lifespan of the new platform you're trying to promote?

Momentum is critically important for game consoles and to make sure the next platform starts building its own installed user base with a bang, it needs exclusive titles.

When Sony was taking a loss on each PS3 sold, it was the same idea. Taking a financial hit to grow your user base so you make more money in the bigger picture/long game is not a new concept in this industry.

I think it's smart for most games to be cross-gen, but total insanity not to have some titles that are exclusive and show off the unique abilities of the system.

If PS5 launched as simply a box that plays PS4 titles but better, I think that's a massive mistake.
 
All I can say is that their exclusivity lineup this gen has been abysmal. Launching a new system without incentive is just *begging* players to switch over to the ps5...
Why wouldn't there be incentive? The phrase stated their wont be any Xbox Scarlett exclusives, not that there wont be new IP's or new Exclusives.
 

Codes 208

Member
Why wouldn't there be incentive? The phrase stated their wont be any Xbox Scarlett exclusives, not that there wont be new IP's or new Exclusives.
Because something like halo being cross-gen alone isn’t enough to make me want a new system. I recently spent about half a grand on an X, why would I want to put out another for a system with no exclusives that I can’t already play on my X?
 
Putting majority of your games on both the previous generation and current generation console imho will give casual gamers less reason to upgrade. I understand the logic behind it, but you have to give more reasons to make the leap to next generation. Yeah the graphics will be somewhat to noticeably prettier(imo) especially if you own a mid gen upgrade console and smoother, but there are a decent amount of casual gamers who don’t care about that. If they did, everyone would of upgraded to a PS4 Pro or Xbox One X. Wait. I can play Halo Infinite on my $500 Xbox One X as well? Hmmm....I’ll wait then.
 
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MadYarpen

Member
I understand cross gen titles but if games have to scale down to old consoles for couple of years, doesn't it mean all we will get from next Gen is better graphics? Cause graphics you can scale down, ai I guess not so much...
 

CJY

Banned
I'm not saying "get rid of console generations"
What you're "not saying" is effectively what would happen. Why would Sony dump billions of dollars into developing and marketing a new system and then make all the games for it compatible with the PS4? It just makes zero sense for Sony to make PS4 forward compatible with PS5 games.

release games that work on both generations until a point where adoption of the PS5 ramps up and PS4 winds down.
Sony don't have to do anything to make this possible, it's called cross-gen games and publishers & devs are free to create as many of those as they want on a case-by-case basis.
 

Three

Member
I agree with you but I'm struggling to think of a game that couldn't be cut down graphically on Ps4 that couldn't have a version on a 360 and I'm not saying there aren't any.
Arguably one of the biggest games and genres this gen what was not on last gen consoles is Fortnite and you can even play against Ps4/Xb1 with a mobile phone (well I think you could before)
it depends how much you are willing to cut back and that includes the way a game plays more than graphics.
The 360 had a mandate before that the game needs to run from the disc. It also charged extra if publishers released a game on multiple discs and had a parity clause to prevent games having extras on bigger discs (to mitigate the blu-ray advantage). Rage 2 could not be done in its current state on a 360 for example. In fact a lot of games wouldn't be practical given the size limitations. Same for next gen. Games designed to stream fast from an SSD would have the same issue. You cant have loading screens every minute in a game designed for SSDs. It would be like playing Resident evil from the 90s vs REmake.
 
Because something like halo being cross-gen alone isn’t enough to make me want a new system. I recently spent about half a grand on an X, why would I want to put out another for a system with no exclusives that I can’t already play on my X?
Fair enough, but that's why you are also being supported with cross-gen content.
 

thelastword

Banned
Putting majority of your games on both the previous generation and current generation console imho will give casual gamers less reason to upgrade. .
I don't think casual gamers is synonymous with "buying a console at $500-600" for an exclusive game or two........Casuals will buy into the ecosystem a bit later.......It is the hardcore that gets the ball rolling..........The people who buy day 1 needs little convincing really.......They see a new Killzone or even Remastered Driveclub and they're there regardless....
 

Hendrick's

If only my penis was as big as my GamerScore!
Sony don't have to do anything to make this possible, it's called cross-gen games and publishers & devs are free to create as many of those as they want on a case-by-case basis.
So we are saying the same thing then?
 

Codes 208

Member
Fair enough, but that's why you are also being supported with cross-gen content.
I don’t mind cross-gen, but that’s the whole point of what BC is for. What I want is the next big thing to convince me that that investment is worth it. And frankly up-ports alone aren’t what I’m looking for.

It may have worked for the switch with bringing ports but the Wii U was dead in the water years before the switch launched. MS doesn’t have that same excuse.
Nope, not at all. Cross-gen games are separate SKUs: i.e. different versions of a game.

What you want is one version of a game that works across two platforms. Completely different.
It’s a subtle but very important difference. Being separate sku’s gives the next gen version more leg room with optimization.

As for consumers, MS I can see doing the best of both worlds by making their games play anywhere so if you buy the XBO version, that gives you access to the XB4 and PC versions
 
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CJY

Banned
It’s a subtle but very important difference. Being separate sku’s gives the next gen version more leg room with optimization.
Yes, absolutely. There is also no effective way of introducing forward compatibility to PS4, and then suddenly "cutting it off" once PS5 has a large enough installed base, like Hendrick's is suggesting. It's an all-or-nothing kind of move.
 

Hendrick's

If only my penis was as big as my GamerScore!
Nope, not at all. Cross-gen games are separate SKUs: i.e. different versions of a game.

What you want is one version of a game that works across two platforms. Completely different.
Honestly don't see much of a difference between those two things. Still the same game on both systems. It would be technically easy and consumer friendly if they we're one SKU.

I know your name well on this forum, fight that good fight my lad 🤣🤣🤣
Honestly not sure what you are implying, but if you are trying to label me a fanboy you would be dead wrong. Read my post history, my praise and criticism is across the board. I am a "what have you done for me lately" sort of gamer who holds no particular brand loyalty. I will, like this gen, own all the game consoles that have games I want to play.
 
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Codes 208

Member
Honestly don't see much of a difference between those two things. Still the same game on both systems. It would be technically easy and consumer friendly if they we're one SKU.
Again, if they were both tied via play anywhere that would fit the role of being consumer friendly without compromising the next gen version by tying it to a lowest common denominator which would likely bottleneck optimization due to the differences in jaguar vs the newer cpu.

It would be better if they were separate sku’s.

Another factor is the UI. We don’t know what kind of kernel the next gen systems will be using but there’s no garuntee they’ll be 1;1 with current gen.
 
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Bogroll

Likes moldy games
it depends how much you are willing to cut back and that includes the way a game plays more than graphics.
The 360 had a mandate before that the game needs to run from the disc. It also charged extra if publishers released a game on multiple discs and had a parity clause to prevent games having extras on bigger discs (to mitigate the blu-ray advantage). Rage 2 could not be done in its current state on a 360 for example. In fact a lot of games wouldn't be practical given the size limitations. Same for next gen. Games designed to stream fast from an SSD would have the same issue. You cant have loading screens every minute in a game designed for SSDs. It would be like playing Resident evil from the 90s vs REmake.
Couldn't they run Rage 2 like how they run Far Cry 3 on last gen, guess what I'm saying depends on skills of devs
 
Microsoft this gen: "There's a console for people who don't want to buy the Xbox One, it's called the Xbox 360"


Microsoft Next Gen: "There's a console for people who don't want to buy an Xbox Two, it's called the Xbox one"

What's changed?
 
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CJY

Banned
Honestly don't see much of a difference between those two things. Still the same game on both systems. It would be technically easy and consumer friendly if they we're one SKU.

I guess we have come down to crux of the matter then. You don't see much of a difference. Yes, it may seem like a subtle difference on the surface to you, but in reality, it would have massive implications to many aspects of Sony's PlayStation business and puts their whole business model at risk.

Sorry to say, but I find it hard to believe how you could be downplaying how significant of a deviation it would be for Sony to give up on winning formula which has served them well across 4 generations of consoles.

From a shareholder perspective, they would be kicking down Sony's doors when it would be clearly suicide.

You also went from saying it would be good for consumers and Sony, to now saying it would be good for consumers. Of course it would be good for consumers, but it would be absolutely terrible Sony, which is why it isn't going to happen.
 

Hendrick's

If only my penis was as big as my GamerScore!
Again, if they were both tied via play anywhere that would fit the role of being consumer friendly without compromising the next gen version by tying it to a lowest common denominator which would likely bottleneck optimization due to the differences in jaguar vs the newer cpu.

It would be better if they were separate sku’s.

Another factor is the UI. We don’t know what kind of kernel the next gen systems will be using but there’s no garuntee they’ll be 1;1 with current gen.
The only benefit to multiple skews is that whoever is selling it might get you to double dip. With 40 gig day one patches and a move towards all digital, there is no reason one skew couldn't be used. I very much hope it does go the PC or IOS route where you buy the game and then it scales to your platform. Why as a consumer anyone wouldn't want this is just assinine.
 
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ethomaz

Banned
Ohhhhhhh.... is he trying to backward? Like I said the story sounded like bullshit.

Update May 30, 2019: Due to some confusion over this paragraph, I've updated this section. We've heard that there's a possibility that, at least at launch, there will potentially be a period where new Xbox Game Studios titles launch for both Scarlett consoles, and original Xbox One consoles. This potentially pertains to the completion of Game Core, which is a development environment that won't be coming to the older Xbox consoles, as it's tied to the development of Windows Core OS. The finer details on this are very scant, so take it with a pinch of salt.

Dabaus Dabaus you can update the op ;)
 
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I don’t mind cross-gen, but that’s the whole point of what BC is for. What I want is the next big thing to convince me that that investment is worth it. And frankly up-ports alone aren’t what I’m looking for.

It may have worked for the switch with bringing ports but the Wii U was dead in the water years before the switch launched. MS doesn’t have that same excuse.

I don't think up-ports are what's being suggested here. I think what's being suggested is new IP's and new Games releasing on both systems simultaneously.

Not really understanding this logic. Why would there be cross-gen content if all games are already compatible across gens?

I mean that kind of answers itself. I think more will need to be answered at E3 at this point.
 
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Gamernyc78

Banned
All I can say is that their exclusivity lineup this gen has been abysmal. Launching a new system without incentive is just *begging* players to switch over to the ps5...

But wait..... Just imagine Crackdown 3 at 4K/8k plus with all the whistles on Anaconda super Python!!! Come on they don't need Anaconda exclusives lol 😂😂😂😂😭😭😭😭😭
 
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CJY

Banned
Ohhhhhhh.... is he trying to backward? Like I said the story sounded like bullshit.
Thanks for this.

This thread got very derailed, so to get back on-topic. I'll just say that if MS go the route of having a single game/purchase work across all their supported platforms like S/X/Next/Windows/etc. and there are no exclusive games for Scarlett, and they'll just iterate on their consoles forever while maintaining support of all their games and systems going forwards and backwards, that would be an amazing achievement and a fantastic thing for them. It might make me wanna jump into Xbox at some point.

I'd still hate it for PlayStation to be like that, though come PS6 or PS7, it may become an inevitability. If it ever does happen, I'll certainly miss the generations and massive leaps in performance we get.
 

Gamernyc78

Banned
There's a difference between BC and cross-gen releases. This comment screams Sony fanyboy, how do you sleep at night?

Your one of the biggest Microsoft shills on this site. We have been watching you 👀👀 with your biased comments, excuses and all your comments are greeny tainted and transparent. You don't fool no one. How much they paying you?
 
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SonGoku

Member
This + Lockhart = DOA
No way its true.
Seems logical. Doesn't mean 1st party games wont be pushing tech in their games, but it may temper 3rd party games for awhile.
Crossgen 3rd parties treated ps360 as an after though, ghosts was the worst looking cod to date on those consoles, Ubi games ran like crap, bf4 was severely cut down.
By the second year 3rd parties were already pumping next gen exclusives and delegating PS360 to external studios.
Both machines have been described as next gen upgrades
lol no, in all their interviews Sony made it clear they believe in clear cut gen jumps, Corny doubled down on this on the Wired interview
 
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Your one of the biggest Microsoft shills on this site. We have been watching you 👀👀 with your biased comments, excuses and all your comments are greeny tainted and transparent. You don't fool no one. How much they paying you?
Yet here I sit, Xbox-less with a PS4 Pro and a PC.

$3.50
 
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We already know Halo Infinite is cross gen. I reckon Forza Motorsport 8 (also at launch) will be next gen only. Or it will have a new upgraded engine for Scarlet and the old one for Xbox One consoles.

Fifa and COD and all that shite will be cross gen too.
 

Gamernyc78

Banned
We already know Halo Infinite is cross gen. I reckon Forza Motorsport 8 (also at launch) will be next gen only. Or it will have a new upgraded engine for Scarlet and the old one for Xbox One consoles.

Fifa and COD and all that shite will be cross gen too.

All I care about is that when the new Fable comes out it is strictly next Gen and focused on the new hardware. That would make me happy.
 
All I care about is that when the new Fable comes out it is strictly next Gen and focused on the new hardware. That would make me happy.
What if it looks next gen, plays like it's next gen, has ray-tracing, but also has a stripped back version for Xbox One? would that somehow sadden you?
 

Gamernyc78

Banned
What if it looks next gen, plays like it's next gen, has ray-tracing, but also has a stripped back version for Xbox One? would that somehow sadden you?

Nah ima get it either which way. I am really looking forward to that but I wish they went all out and develop it around the strongest console with nothing holding it back.
 
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