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Women Characters Redesigned by Women SFF Artists

Aug 29, 2009
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Not GAF, lol
Outrageous! Look at Wright's arms, tighs, shoulders. Zamus is nothing like that, she's just a run-of-the-mill "babe" with huge knockers. Her only outstanding feature are her big feet.
And her toned stomach and muscular arms and legs.

Look at the last two costumes. She's very muscular. But more in a runner way and less in a bodybuilder way.
 

Anton Sugar

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Jul 26, 2007
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I "like" the absolutism of "what women want", didn't know we all want/like/appreciate/are offended by the same things.

Personally I like skin-tight and sensual clothes.
I wear skin-tight shirts at home all the time, alone, in front of my pc; just because I feel more comfy like that I like how I look.

The fact that sexy/sensual clothes are worn to please males, is the most sexist statement in my humble, womanly, personal and totally unique opinion.
That said what I find outrageous and sexist in designs is heels.
Honestly, you can easily kickass in bikini, but high heels? blah. Counter-action par excellence.
The actual text of the article addresses everything you just objected to, from "not all women" to "sexy vs sexualization".
 

Crocodile

Member
Apr 13, 2006
17,699
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Yet they factually were in the all but the most recent games.
No they weren't. Looking over this page though it feels like people are using a different definition of sexualization (which I use to mean just having a sense of sexuality or being designed in such a way as to be considered conventionally sexy) whereas as others are using sexualization to mean defacto objectification?

Like I understand if one prefers the depiction of Samus in say Metroid Prime or some aspects of the presentation of ZSS bother them (which are almost all due to Other M) but it feels like people pretend that, by conventional means, Samus hasn't almost always been a "bombshell" or that she can't/couldn't be one AND a bounty hunter as the same time. It legit confuses me.
 

Roto13

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Dec 5, 2008
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I "like" the absolutism of "what women want", didn't know we all want/like/appreciate/are offended by the same things.
I kind of feel like anyone who thinks any article about what women want is referring to every woman on Earth needs to get some common sense.
 
May 11, 2014
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No, she would not. That's an exaggeration.
Obviously not exactly the same given that Overwatches artstyle is exaggerated, but she would be a large woman...she's 5'2" and 115lbs. Samus is 6' and 200lbs

This woman is the closest I could find at 5'10" 182lbs


So take that and add 20lbs and 2" and that's what a Samus with Wrights weightlifting build would look like
 

Dazza

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Dec 10, 2014
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Large muscles are 100% a masculine feature. Women can not reproduce this without being complete outliers or pumping themselves full of hormones found in vastly greater levels in men. That's why I think there's so much more complexity designing female characters. If you want a strong and powerful male character, you simply give him a first class ticket on the swole train.
It's not even a masculine feature, most guys can't get big without the whole lifestyle change and force feeding of proteins.

Social acceptability plays are far great role in what you think in terms of gender muscularity, there is of course a hormonal role that plays part but there is a certain overlap even there between genders, as with the fat composition retention differences between genders.
 

PtM

Banned
Jan 7, 2015
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And her toned stomach and muscular arms and legs.

Look at the last two costumes. She's very muscular. But more in a runner way and less in a bodybuilder way.
A runner is not "very muscular" and it gets counteracted by her bust size. And those frigging heels. Also this was mostly about the equation to Wright's body.
Like I understand if one prefers the depiction of Samus in say Metroid Prime or some aspects of the presentation of ZSS bother them (which are almost all due to Other M) but it feels like people pretend that, by conventional means, Samus hasn't almost always been a "bombshell" or that she can't/couldn't be one AND a bounty hunter as the same time. It legit confuses me.
Let me put this way: Samus always was some one in a cool space armour. Only in the credits, when she was not in a cool space armour, was she shown to be a bombshell or whatever.

(Although Other M even gave her armour more feminine forms, ugh.)
Obviously not exactly the same given that Overwatches artstyle is exaggerated, but she would be a large woman...she's 5'2" and 115lbs. Samus is 6' and 200lbs

This woman is the closest I could find at 5'10" 182lbs


So take that and add 20lbs and 2" and that's what a Samus with Wrights weightlifting build would look like
Fine. Then how about giving her a bit less muscles so that, even at her size, she'd still look around Wright's proportions? Why are we doing this math around a fictional character?
 
May 11, 2014
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A runner is not "very muscular" and it gets counteracted by her bust size. And those frigging heels. Also this was mostly about the equation to Wright's body.
This isn't true. Sprinters are in fact very muscular...and do a lot of weightlifting for training
 

KDR_11k

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Sep 2, 2011
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Something like this would be passable for me, but you got to remember that an astronauts mission is one of peace and science, they are not bounty hunters. I'd imagine what they wear under their space suits would be very different if they were intergalactic bounty hunters.
I dunno, it's an undersuit that contains some life support features (and is probably fire retarding, like the undersuits Formula 1 drivers wear), that seems like it'd make sense for a soldier too. The armor is meant to be worn on top of that, there's no reason you'd attach armor plates to the undersuit, especially when the outer suit contains critical environmental protection so a breach would kill you anyway. By the way, space suits contain armor to protect against micrometeorite impacts and radiation, I don't think soldier gear would differ all that much.

Though what I don't get about the Zero Suit is why she even removed her armor when entering her gunship since no other Metroid game had her remove the power suit to pilot the ship, that's just a stupid contrivance to create that horrible stealth section.
 

Sweet Ivy

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Dec 8, 2007
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The actual text of the article addresses everything you just objected to, from "not all women" to "sexy vs sexualization".
I was more referring to the thread title, but it's ok.

And I wasn't bashing the article either, just the use of these kind of sentences :).
I actually feel annoyed by the very use of men/women, to me it's all people; regardless of gender, everyone has their own way of looking at the world and perceiving it.

I kind of feel like anyone who thinks any article about what women want is referring to every woman on Earth needs to get some common sense.
Sure, but I still don't like this kind of wording ;).
 
May 11, 2014
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Though what I don't get about the Zero Suit is why she even removed her armor when entering her gunship since no other Metroid game had her remove the power suit to pilot the ship, that's just a stupid contrivance to create that horrible stealth section.
That's like asking why people wear sweatpants at home...because it's more comfortable?
 

Gbraga

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Aug 6, 2009
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Some of those look really amazing. Especially Samus.

About Peach, they should just mail that design to Platinum and give them an action spinoff based on this.

Sorry, folks who think it's nonsese.
 

Apollo Cree

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Oct 27, 2013
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It's not even a masculine feature, most guys can't get big without the whole lifestyle change and force feeding of proteins.

Social acceptability plays are far great role in what you think in terms of gender muscularity, there is of course a hormonal role that plays part but there is a certain overlap even there between genders, as with the fat composition retention differences between genders.
Men have 12 times more testosterone than women. Testosterone plays a large part in muscle growth. Without a doubt, it is a masculine feature. What else would you define it as?
 

PtM

Banned
Jan 7, 2015
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This isn't true. Sprinters are in fact very muscular...and do a lot of weightlifting for training
I'll just say that Zamus could do a lot better than how she gets shown around lately. Maybe it really is only a smaller core and bigger breasts, but that imo makes a huge difference.
 

bone_and_sinew

breaking down barriers in gratuitous nudity
Feb 17, 2009
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Samus has alien DNA and was raised on an alien planet with alien nutrition. So her weight being off from a regular person's is fine. She also spent the whole time there training to be a badass warrior to fuck up the Space Pirates that killed her human family. She's supposed to be buff, not some tiny little gymnast I could break in half.

Her Zero Suit as "she wears this under the armor" is fine. As "she wears this for sneaking missions" is just something SakaLucas came up with to justify fan service because he's a complete hack of a writer.

Sakamoto going full George Lucas shows he is mentally unfit to helm the Metroid franchise. Thus, any and all works and proclamations of canon made during this period of mental incapacity (from Metroid: Zero Mission and on) are deemed invalid until SakaLucas proves he's no longer mentally unfit.

 
Aug 29, 2009
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Not GAF, lol
I'll just say that Zamus could do a lot better than how she gets shown around lately. Maybe it really is only a smaller core and bigger breasts, but that imo makes a huge difference.
I don't understand, are women with large chests not allowed to be muscular or something? What does chest size have to do with her muscles?
This woman basically has exactly Samus' body as depicted in Smash Bros.
Except Samus is way more flexible because she is part bird. And you can't just say "well that's only an excuse to make her look like that" because she's had that Chozo back story since she was basically created. And Samus has a larger chest. But women are different sizes... it doesn't make her less athletic or powerful...
 

Ants

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Dec 4, 2014
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Samus has alien DNA and was raised on an alien planet with alien nutrition. So her weight being off from a regular person's is fine. She also spent the whole time there training to be a badass warrior to fuck up the Space Pirates that killed her human family. She's supposed to be buff, not some tiny little gymnast I could break in half.

Her Zero Suit as "she wears this under the armor" is fine. As "she wears this for sneaking missions" is just something SakaLucas came up with to justify fan service because he's a complete hack of a writer.

Sakamoto going full George Lucas shows he is mentally unfit to helm the Metroid franchise. Thus, any and all works and proclamations of canon made during this period of mental incapacity (from Metroid: Zero Mission and on) are deemed invalid until SakaLucas proves he's no longer mentally unfit.
Hear, hear!

Except Samus is way more flexible because she is part bird.
Nope. The Chozo adopted Samus. She's human, or the closest the galaxy has to humans.
 

Palculator

Unconfirmed Member
Jun 22, 2014
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Nope. The Chozo adopted Samus. She's human, or the closest the galaxy has to humans.
But they gave her Chozo DNA. I guess it depends on what your definition of "part Chozo" is. Does she have wings or a beak? No. Does she have Chozo DNA? Yes.
 

Crossing Eden

Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Feb 14, 2014
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I don't understand, are women with large chests not allowed to be muscular or something? What does chest size have to do with her muscles?
This woman basically has exactly Samus' body as depicted in Smash Bros.

Except Samus is way more flexible because she is part bird. And you can't just say "well that's only an excuse to make her look like that" because she's had that Chozo back story since she was basically created. And Samus has a larger chest. But women are different sizes... it doesn't make her less athletic or powerful...
Samus used to have a smaller chest actually.


But then they for obvious reasons(fanservice) got larger along with the suit being molded to go underneath her breasts


And then they got larger again..


And even larger in her latest appearance


EDIT
Seems she decided to get butt implants as well.



She either has some major insecurity issues and got lots of plastic surgery, or she's a victim of pointless sexualization. Classic zero suit and the concept likely wasn't sexualization, I get the feeling that the same can't be said for the latest renditions.
 
May 11, 2014
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She either has some major insecurity issues and got lots of plastic surgery, or she's a victim of pointless sexualization.
Or her look drastically fluctuates game to game and we really shouldn't consider anything definitive aside from her being a tall blond, muscular/curvacious woman. Everything else seems to be up to that dev/modelers interpretation. Hell, even within just the Prime games she went through 3 different looks. The only consistency has been between Fusion and Zero Mission
 

Crossing Eden

Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
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Or her look drastically fluctuates game to game and we really shouldn't consider anything definitive aside from her being a tall blond, muscular/curvacious woman. Everything else seems to be up to that dev/modelers interpretation. Hell, even within just the Prime games she went through 3 different looks. The only consistency has been between Fusion and Zero Mission
Dude, come on, she clearly has been getting more and more sexualized with each appearance. Full grown women don't suddenly grow larger breasts and a larger butt. This isn't some unintentional thing. The exact same thing happened to lightning from FF13 overtime. Dev modeling "interpretation" doesn't work the way you think it does. In fact, she even got shorter in the new Smash game for some reason. Second in fact, she hasn't been drastically changing appearance each time, her look is pretty consistent. The only time she drastically changed was in Prime 2, which is the standard look for her that keeps getting more and more sexualized.
 

Anton Sugar

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Jul 26, 2007
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Samus used to have a smaller chest actually.


But then they for obvious reasons(fanservice) got larger along with the suit being molded to go underneath her breasts


And then they got larger again..


And even larger in her latest appearance


EDIT
Seems she decided to get butt implants as well.



She either has some major insecurity issues and got lots of plastic surgery, or she's a victim of pointless sexualization. Classic zero suit and the concept likely wasn't sexualization, I get the feeling that the same can't be said for the latest renditions.
Thanks for this--I was certain she hadn't always looked like that but couldn't find pics.
 

Palculator

Unconfirmed Member
Jun 22, 2014
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EDIT
Seems she decided to get butt implants as well.
http://i.imgur.com/9NdOQZ8.jpg[IMG]
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/nggkmPT.jpg[IMG]

She either has some major insecurity issues and got lots of plastic surgery, or she's a victim of pointless sexualization. Classic zero suit and the concept likely wasn't sexualization, I get the feeling that the same can't be said for the latest renditions.[/QUOTE]

Those are pretty good skyboxes!
 

PtM

Banned
Jan 7, 2015
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I don't understand, are women with large chests not allowed to be muscular or something? What does chest size have to do with her muscles?
This woman basically has exactly Samus' body as depicted in Smash Bros.

Except Samus is way more flexible because she is part bird. And you can't just say "well that's only an excuse to make her look like that" because she's had that Chozo back story since she was basically created. And Samus has a larger chest. But women are different sizes... it doesn't make her less athletic or powerful...
She has those big breasts so that she can be more effectively ogled. That does make her less powerful.
Or her look drastically fluctuates game to game and we really shouldn't consider anything definitive aside from her being a tall blond, muscular/curvacious woman. Everything else seems to be up to that dev/modelers interpretation. Hell, even within just the Prime games she went through 3 different looks. The only consistency has been between Fusion and Zero Mission
You heard it guys, the sexualization matter is off the table.
 
Mar 5, 2014
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Speaking of, Overwatch just debuted two new characters, one of them being Zarya:



Mix of unconventional body, pretty face, and boob armor...progress?
(Overwatch's character designs are the business; as much as I love the other female character designs, I'm glad that they've created a new female character who doesn't fit into the thin/leggy/"hourglassy" mold. Anyways...)

I'm not saying that anybody has to like it, but in character design readability is a key concept; first impressions mean a lot, people should be able to gather plenty of useful information from your design in almost a few seconds seconds of looking at it.
With a character like this I can't blame them for defaulting to the whole "boob sock"/boob armor thing.
For a long time there were people asking whether or not this character from Steven Universe was a boy (it was particularly more prominent in regards to her older designs)

mainly because of her figure and hair...and the thing that gets me with this is that her body shape (unlike Zarya's, unfortunately) is generally associated with femininity.
Most of the world's prettiest androgynous male models and fishy/convincing drag queens have this body shape and they're often believed to be women by most people.
Even though I don't think large muscles or a thick body is exclusively male in any substantial way, I do realize (going by a very adamant poster in this thread) that a lot of people unfortunately still do.
Hopefully, character designers can start getting away from unnecessarily adding in boob armor/"boob socks" to characters like Zarya in the future though; better education about sexual dimorphism in humans (which believe it or not is pretty low compared to a lot of other mega fauna), the arbitrary nature of gender constructs, and the fluidity of human gender identity and expression might lead to this.
:p
 

Darth Ghandi

Banned
Feb 4, 2014
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I see more bare-chested male characters than topless female characters in video games.
Nudity (male or female) isn't immoral, the flaws are in the eyes of the beholder.
I think you are mixing up male idealization with female objectification.
 

FyreWulff

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Jan 21, 2010
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Large muscles are 100% a masculine feature. Women can not reproduce this without being complete outliers or pumping themselves full of hormones found in vastly greater levels in men. That's why I think there's so much more complexity designing female characters. If you want a strong and powerful male character, you simply give him a first class ticket on the swole train.
super built men are also outliers.. athletes, by virtue of numbers alone, are all outliers.
 

Crossing Eden

Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
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(Overwatch's character designs are the business; as much as I love the other female character designs, I'm glad that they've created a new female character who doesn't fit into the thin/leggy/"hourglassy" mold. Anyways...)

I'm not saying that anybody has to like it, but in character design readability is a key concept; first impressions mean a lot, people should be able to gather plenty of useful information from your design in almost a few seconds seconds of looking at it.
With a character like this I can't blame them for defaulting to the whole "boob sock"/boob armor thing.
For a long time there were people asking whether or not this character from Steven Universe was a boy (it was particularly more prominent in regards to her older designs)

mainly because of her figure and hair...and the thing that gets me with this is that her body shape (unlike Zarya's, unfortunately) is generally associated with femininity.
Most of the world's prettiest androgynous male models and fishy/convincing drag queens have this body shape and they're often believed to be women by most people.
Even though I don't think large muscles or a thick body is exclusively male in any substantial way, I do realize (going by a very adamant poster in this thread) that a lot of people unfortunately still do.
Hopefully, character designers can start getting away from unnecessarily adding in boob armor/"boob socks" to characters like Zarya in the future though; better education about sexual dimorphism in humans (which believe it or not is pretty low compared to a lot of other mega fauna), the arbitrary nature of gender constructs, and the fluidity of human gender identity and expression might lead to this.
:p
In terms of Pearl, her older designs did look way less feminine than her current design. Her old design didn't fit the voice at all, hence the confusion.



It would certainly be odd if people were still confused but in terms of her first four designs, it makes sense.
 

Karsticles

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Oct 25, 2010
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I "like" the absolutism of "what women want", didn't know we all want/like/appreciate/are offended by the same things.

Personally I like skin-tight and sensual clothes.
I wear skin-tight shirts at home all the time, alone, in front of my pc; just because I feel more comfy like that I like how I look.

The fact that sexy/sensual clothes are worn to please males, is the most sexist statement in my humble, womanly, personal and totally unique opinion.
That said what I find outrageous and sexist in designs is heels.
Honestly, you can easily kickass in bikini, but high heels? blah. Counter-action par excellence.
I have to adore a post that contains "par excellence".
 
Mar 5, 2014
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In terms of Pearl, her older designs did look way less feminine than her current design. Her old design didn't fit the voice at all, hence the confusion.



It would certainly be odd if people were still confused but in terms of her first three designs, it makes sense.
Well I don't know about that...barring the third one (her hair is very boyish, it does kind of look like they were going for an androgynous look), it would be odd for anybody to be confused by those designs imo.
It's hard for me to believe that CN (especially after the whole gay couple thing on Clearance...but then again, it looks like they're fine with Jeff's moms) would have allowed for RS and the crew to create a male hero character that looks like the second Pearl design, that one looks incredibly feminine to me and so does the first one (mostly due to her boobs).
:p