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Opinion WP: Environmentalists make good movie villains because they want to make your real life worse

#Phonepunk#

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This little girl straight up looks like a villain she’s on some cross eyed village of the damned shit or something

“We are all in the beginning of a mass extinction” woah slow down Neil Breen lol
 
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Bolivar687

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She's old enough to credibly testify before the UN but she's not old enough to be criticized = you must listen and you may not question.

This is the unilateral way the global establishment left always engages in politics, because they know they can't litigate their policies in a free exchange of ideas.
 

JordanN

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It doesn't matter. This is the equivalent if Russia were destroying export ships from the US and then whining because the US doesn't export more. Don't whine about a problem you're helping create, it just makes you look like a hypocrite.
You have proof that during the Cold War, both the U.S and the USSR went around destroying every nation's economies? Especially in Africa?

Nope, that information is blatantly false. Africa was sitting on infrastructure that was left behind from the colonial days and after independence, they failed to maintain them.

Edit: Also, I clearly said in the past that the West destroyed both Japan and Germany yet both countries are fully up and running today. There is no excuse. It's not assassinations that these nations fail.

OK so again you're here with your fantasies that will never happen. Im asking in the real world what are your actions? Are you going to vote for Sanders since he's the one who has proposed a bigger deal on cutting dependence of the US in foreign energy sources and reducing military presence. Voting for Sanders is a realistic scenario, you becoming President and cutting foreign aid the next day isnt. So are you willing to put your hands where your mouth is to achieve what you're claiming you want or are you full of shit? Because if being isolationist is living in those fantastical scenarios of yours, you might as well not be since you're never going to become president and cut all foreign aid from one day to the other.
You were asking me how serious I was about isolationism, not who I was going to vote for.
 
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crowbrow

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You were asking me how serious I was about isolationism, not who I was going to vote for.
Yeah I was asking you how serious as in what would your actions be. You came up with a hypothetical fantasy scenario that is never going to happen. That simply tells me that you're not actually serious about it.

Also western governments and Russia have kept trying to influence countries during and after the Cold War, this is a fact. They have interfered in the internal affairs of many nations around the world, in Africa, Latin America, the Middle East and elsewhere. Many times to keep those countries from becoming self-sufficient, they have funded terrorist organisations and guerrillas, sold arms to both sides, bribed government officials, promoted coups, trained assassins and torturers, killed people, etc in order to keep them dependent and on their side and, therefore, easy to manipulate.

Again, don't ask other countries to fix a problem you're actively helping to create. First get your shit together and stop doing so much crap in other lands.
 

JordanN

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Yeah I was asking you how serious as in what would your actions be. You came up with a hypothetical fantasy scenario that is never going to happen. That simply tells me that you're not actually serious about it.
:pie_eyeroll:


Also western governments and Russia have kept trying to influence countries during and after the Cold War, this is a fact.
There are countries interfering with the West today. In the history of civilization, no nation has truly been left alone.
Should Europe be able to sue Mongolia because of what Genghis Khan did to them hundreds of years ago? Should we sue Arab countries for taking Europeans hostage and selling them into slavery?

No, that's silly. Civilizations learn to move on and actually learn how to resist foreign influence. Well, the ones who actually care about being successful. You could blame all your problems on another country forever, it just means don't expect to ever rise up the social ladder either.

Again, don't ask other countries to fix a problem you're actively helping to create.
There were problems predating any Western contact. If you somehow believe these nations were always paradise and it was just the evil West who came in and ended it with a gunshot, I encourage you to actually pick up a history book and see how these countries actually ran themselves.

Case and point, the African country of Liberia was clearly created to be independent and was never colonized by any foreign power, yet even go back 100 years ago, and they were rigging their own elections and even practicing slavery (having just escaped it from the U.S).

I try not to fault people who fall for the media's propaganda that tries and blames all the 3rd world problems on the West, but if after being shown factual evidence that these same countries actually had a longer history of conflict and social instability, then clearly the fault is on those who only want to blame the West everything and not on the 3rd world for refusing to take responsibility.
 
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crowbrow

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There are countries interfering with the West today. In the history of civilization, no nation has truly been left alone.
Yeah but as a citizen of a western power who interferes with other nations I was asking you what would you be willing to do to stop it. You at least have voting power. But apparently you're not willing to do much except come up with impossible fantasy settings that start with "if I were president...". AKA useless.

If you somehow believe these nations were always paradise and it just the evil West to came in and ended with a gunshot
They clearly weren't, but to ask those nations to get their shit together while your own countries are actively sabotaging these nations to even try to get their shit together is the biggest hypocrisy, even more when you're not really willing to put your vote or something else where your mouth is. Stop hypocritically preaching to these nations, accept your governments are going to keep fucking with them and that you're not willing to move a finger about it and then I can at least respect you for being straightforward and honest.

I don't blame the west for everything but to watch a westerner who supports either actively or tacitly governments that destabilize these nations preach about how these nations should get their shit together is laughable and angering. If you're not going to put your part to prevent the issues you whine about then shut the fuck up about them.
 

Teletraan1

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May 17, 2012
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The cultists have already spun a consensus that humans have had an effect on the climate to a doomsday scenario that we are too late to fix. There is not a scientific consensus that we have a doomsday clock measured in a decade. If you don't agree with all of their shit you are a denier. Fuck off. My friends growing up were all climate alarmists. I have heard the we are going to be in an ice age, the oceans were going to wipe out the coasts, that we would have to wear hazmat suits in the rain, the current dogma and frankly I don't even care anymore. I can make personal choices to be a good steward for the environment but I am not going to be told I can't eat a steak or can't take vacations. If the planet is that fragile then fuck it.
 
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JordanN

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Yeah but as a citizen of a western power who interferes with other nations I was asking you what would you be willing to do to stop it. You at least have voting power. But apparently you're not willing to do much except come up with impossible fantasy settings that start with "if I were president...". AKA useless.
I can't make the fucking President or Prime Minister non-interventionist on a whim. When it came down to Trump & Hillary, Trump was actually the better candidate who did want to put more attention on America and less on the outside. It in no way meant he was going to bring back every soldier overseas on day 1 or never threaten going to war in the Middle East, but he did move the overton window so that U.S foreign policy is no longer about what the rest of the world wants but what the U.S wants instead.

That is a bigger win for isolationism as opposed to going with the career and establishment politician who would never disrupt the status quo.

They clearly weren't, but to ask those nations to get their shit together while your own countries are actively sabotaging these nations to even try to get their shit together is the biggest hypocrisy,
No it's not. I just explained this to you. Once again, both Japan and Germany were annihilated at the end of the WW2. Yet these are also countries that "after being interfered with" are complete powerhouses today.

If I'm saying I want other countries to improve themselves, I'm not saying that out of spite. I'm saying I want them to build themselves up and become stronger in the future. All civillizations had to experience such hardships, but they still sucked it up and learned to move on. Even after multiple aggravations.

Germany was even hit harder after the second world war. Their nation was split in half and not unified again until the 1990s. Again, they're a product of our governments "interfering" with them, yet today, they're closer to 1st world status and not 3rd world.
 
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crowbrow

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I can't make the fucking President or Prime Minister non-interventionist on a whim.
I wasn't expecting you. I was just asking for you to be coherent about what you're saying. I don't expect the US to cut back on influence outside from one day to the next but US citizens individually can work towards that or against that, there's not much middle ground here.

Granted supporting Trump over Hillary is coherent. I also did support him (even though I can't vote) because he seemed less of a warmonger than Hillary. But now he's starting to stir shit up with Iran just like his predecessors. Now the only one I see with an actual plan to reduce foreign influence in Bernie Sanders right now, he actually has a plan to reduce dependency on foreign oil and cut back on military bases. Are you willing to get behind him or not? That's all I'm asking. A coherent person that really means they want isolationism would support the candidate that actually has the more coherent plan for it. This is where I don't trust you really mean what you say, I don't think you or many of the people who claim they want less interventionism from the US would ever support Sanders and his plan so that means they're mostly full of shit, all talk. I have been hearing the same shit from americans for decades, for a while I thought democrats really meant it but I realized they are also as or more full of shit, at least the establishment ones. I don't have hope that US citizens that claim to be anti-intervention will start acting coherently any time soon.
 

pennythots

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JordanN

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I wasn't expecting you. I was just asking for you to be coherent about what you're saying. I don't expect the US to cut back on influence outside from one day to the next but US citizens individually can work towards that or against that, there's not much middle ground here.

Granted supporting Trump over Hillary is coherent. I also did support him (even though I can't vote) because he seemed less of a warmonger than Hillary. But now he's starting to stir shit up with Iran just like his predecessors. Now the only one I see with an actual plan to reduce foreign influence in Bernie Sanders right now, he actually has a plan to reduce dependency on foreign oil and cut back on military bases. Are you willing to get behind him or not? That's all I'm asking. A coherent person that really means they want isolationism would support the candidate that actually has the more coherent plan for it. This is where I don't trust you really mean what you say, I don't think you or many of the people who claim they want less interventionism from the US would ever support Sanders and his plan so that means they're mostly full of shit, all talk. I have been hearing the same shit from americans for decades, for a while I thought democrats really meant it but I realized they are also as or more full of shit, at least the establishment ones. I don't have hope that US citizens that claim to be anti-intervention will start acting coherently any time soon.
Unless Trump actually starts a war in the Middle East, then there is nothing wrong with supporting the same president. He fired Bolton, he's stands up to China, he wants to build a wall.

Sanders is all over the place. Especially since he's on the "Orange Man Bad" train, he'll do the opposite of Trump if it lands him a win.
 
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