• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
  • The Politics forum has been nuked. Please do not bring political discussion to the rest of the site, or you will be removed. Thanks.

Drama Xbox’s Phil Spencer criticises PlayStation’s PC strategy for being ‘late’ and ‘charging twice’

AllBizness

I cry about Microsoft. A lot.
Mar 22, 2020
195
341
385
Damn I was critical of Sony for going to PC but if Phil is this shook they must be on to something

Maybe Horizon outsold all of their recent PC games
Yeah I think this is the only reason Sony releases games years later on PC.
 
Jan 21, 2019
3,816
4,604
460
As far as timed exclusives, yeah he does. What he says is not the same as what he does.

Medium? And probably more will come thanks to your new Jesus GamePass all in for the gamers rights. We need to be very naive to think temporal exclusive won't come anymore on Xbox because studios acquisitions. Lol

He mentioned it's not part of the long-term strategy, we are still in short-term phase. Once the Timed-Exclusive games are out, there's a good chance we won't see timed-exclusives from third party devs. Microsoft simply won't need to do that.

Yes MS are very consumer friendly. They're so friendly they started charging to go online? F2P was behind a paywall including services like Netflix. That's how pro consumer MS was. They started the money hatting of AAA and to prevent them from releasing on a rival platform. Refused crossplay because they were in the lead in the X360 era. But that all changed when they lost the last gen and they looked for a new strategy which included PC their main platform.
Everyone charges for online services. Microsoft surely started the trend, but they also made online gaming a standard on consoles which offsets the money lost on console sales. Microsoft did not start the money-hat, but they will most likely be the ones to resort to it less as games release. Also, I want to say Minecraft and Shadowrun were crossplay on PC / Xbox 360, but I don't recall many others. Sony never wanted Cross-play however.
 

iHaunter

Member
Sep 6, 2015
2,867
3,136
560
How big of a problem is PC piracy in 2021? Literally everyone I know who used to pirate has stopped now, maybe it’s an age thing I don’t know but I’m guessing it’s also their Steam library they don’t want banned, Epic’s free games, humble bundle, cheap summer sales etc that is keeping them away from piracy.
So I think it’s an extremely small group of people who would skip a console release and pirate on PC if games released simultaneously.
It's quite huge, potentially one of the biggest it's ever been.

Piracy Is Back: Piracy Statistics for 2021 | DataProt

Number of visits to pirate sites per country​

What is piracy, and what are its consequences to society? MUSO is a company that deals with these questions every day. It also tracks piracy trends across various media categories and analyzes the most interesting of them. In its 2018 report, the company found there were over 190 billion visits to pirate sites in 2018 alone. See the following list:

 
Last edited:
Mar 6, 2016
4,897
5,427
900
It's quite huge, potentially one of the biggest it's ever been.

Piracy Is Back: Piracy Statistics for 2021 | DataProt

Number of visits to pirate sites per country​

What is piracy, and what are its consequences to society? MUSO is a company that deals with these questions every day. It also tracks piracy trends across various media categories and analyzes the most interesting of them. In its 2018 report, the company found there were over 190 billion visits to pirate sites in 2018 alone. See the following list:

not all piracy is games though. i bet films and tv are way bigger.
 

laynelane

Member
Aug 21, 2019
431
708
330
He mentioned it's not part of the long-term strategy, we are still in short-term phase. Once the Timed-Exclusive games are out, there's a good chance we won't see timed-exclusives from third party devs. Microsoft simply won't need to do that.


Everyone charges for online services. Microsoft surely started the trend, but they also made online gaming a standard on consoles which offsets the money lost on console sales. Microsoft did not start the money-hat, but they will most likely be the ones to resort to it less as games release. Also, I want to say Minecraft and Shadowrun were crossplay on PC / Xbox 360, but I don't recall many others. Sony never wanted Cross-play however.

Final Fantasy XI was crossplay between PC and PS2. Final Fantasy XIV and Portal 2 had crossplay between PC and PS3. I think Dragon's Dogma online had it with PC and PS3 too.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Bo_Hazem
Jan 21, 2019
3,816
4,604
460
Final Fantasy XI was crossplay between PC and PS2. Final Fantasy XIV and Portal 2 had crossplay between PC and PS3. I think Dragon's Dogma online had it with PC and PS3 too.
Well that's cool, I only had a PS3 for a brief stint to play some of the exclusives, but I didn't know this.
 
Dec 10, 2020
1,840
4,008
380
Should 2018 & 2019 be included there?

E3 2018 - games announced: Halo Infinite, Gears 5, Forza Horizon 4, Gears Tactics - all exclusives. But even Sekiro (remember not everything is a console war. It's about providing for their own ecosystem as well, whether or not the game has a fancy "exclusive" sticker)

They also announced the acquisition of five more studios, including Ninja Theory, The Initiative, and others.

I believe CDPR also revealed some of the very first Cyberpunk 2077 footage during their presentation.
To round it off, Phil seemed to plant the seeds for the next Xbox console announcement. It was a big showing.

E3 2019 - I mean, that's a pretty small promise, which he delivered on. Elden Ring and a few others were announced I believe.

Look, I'm not going to say Microsoft has delivered as well as Sony on the exclusives - certainly not. But I've seen this posted several times and if we are taking these quotes and talking about Phil over promising and under delivering, then it doesn't seem accurate at all. At best, it's an exaggeration of the truth and should probably be trimmed down a little. I didn't even check the years before 2018, but who knows how accurate they really are.

In addition last year :




 
Mar 6, 2016
4,897
5,427
900
Should 2018 & 2019 be included there?

E3 2018 - games announced: Halo Infinite, Gears 5, Forza Horizon 4, Gears Tactics - all exclusives. But even Sekiro (remember not everything is a console war. It's about providing for their own ecosystem as well, whether or not the game has a fancy "exclusive" sticker)

They also announced the acquisition of five more studios, including Ninja Theory, The Initiative, and others.

I believe CDPR also revealed some of the very first Cyberpunk 2077 footage during their presentation.
To round it off, Phil seemed to plant the seeds for the next Xbox console announcement. It was a big showing.

E3 2019 - I mean, that's a pretty small promise, which he delivered on. Elden Ring and a few others were announced I believe.

Look, I'm not going to say Microsoft has delivered as well as Sony on the exclusives - certainly not. But I've seen this posted several times and if we are taking these quotes and talking about Phil over promising and under delivering, then it doesn't seem accurate at all. At best, it's an exaggeration of the truth and should probably be trimmed down a little. I didn't even check the years before 2018, but who knows how accurate they really are.
LOL

announcing games > delivering games is where we should give credit now? They've announced games before too.
 

SafeOrAlone

Member
May 22, 2018
1,584
1,607
445
LOL

announcing games > delivering games is where we should give credit now? They've announced games before too.
I think you got a little confused. E3 is about announcements.

the post was about Phil Spencer over promising and under delivering at E3.
if you quote Phil saying “this will be a big E3 for us” and they announce 5 studio acquisitions, 4 big exclusives, Sekiro, lay seeds for next-gen announcements and premier Cyberpunk gameplay.... that’s a big E3 showing.

for heavens sake people refer to “the year of dreams” and praise it constantly, but it was an E3 full of announcements for games that took forever to release, such as FF7 Remake.

...oh yeah - LOL!
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: DarkMage619
Dec 10, 2020
1,840
4,008
380
I’m surprised you added another year instead of acknowledging whether the years even deserve to be there in the first place.

Didn't added that, but nevertheless. 2020 launch lineup was crap, he promised differently. Also, previous years deserve to be on that list.
 

SafeOrAlone

Member
May 22, 2018
1,584
1,607
445
Didn't added that, but nevertheless. 2020 launch lineup was crap, he promised differently. Also, previous years deserve to be on that list.
you didn’t acknowledge all the reasons I felt 2018 was a good year, you just stepped around it. So agree to disagree, I suppose.

four exclusives, five studio acquisitions, Sekrio, gameplay premiers for hyped games, and more. I think it’s silly to snub that.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: DarkMage619
Dec 10, 2020
1,840
4,008
380
you didn’t acknowledge all the reasons I felt 2018 was a good year, you just stepped around it. So agree to disagree, I suppose.
I know what happened in 2018. I think you missed the point of these statements. Every year Phil said "biggest ever". Which of course was bollocks.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Bo_Hazem

SafeOrAlone

Member
May 22, 2018
1,584
1,607
445
I know what happened in 2018. I think you missed the point of these statements. Every year Phil said "biggest ever". Which of course was bollocks.
But in reality, that isn’t what all the quotes say. Quite a few don’t resemble that remark at all really.

and again 2018 was one of the biggest years. So it’s hard for me to understand your argument if you don’t acknowledge that. “I know what happened in 2018.” Well, okay.
 
Last edited:

SafeOrAlone

Member
May 22, 2018
1,584
1,607
445
"Biggest", "best", "most special", "greatest" all the same meaning in the end.
No, some say “most exclusives”, one says “progress on xcloud and unannounced games. It will be big” That is so tame. And it was true.

and you are downplaying 2018.

there is some truth in that image. But there’s also some bull crap in it. It’s misinformation.
 
Last edited:
Dec 10, 2020
1,840
4,008
380
No, some say “most exclusives”, one says “progress on xcloud and unannounced games. It will be big” That is so tame. And it was true.

and you are downplaying 2018.

there is some truth in that image. But there’s also some bull crap in it. It’s misinformation.

There is no mention of "most exclusives". There is a truth in that image and that is - load of crap from his mouth.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Bo_Hazem

SafeOrAlone

Member
May 22, 2018
1,584
1,607
445
There is no mention of "most exclusives". There is a truth in that image and that is - load of crap from his mouth.
You’re right - it wasn’t “most” exclusives, it was simply “more exclusives than 2016”, which is an extremely low goal post he set. Doesn’t sound like “biggest year ever” to me. At all. I can’t tell if you’re even reading those quotes. Signs point to no.

you don’t think 5 studio acquisitions, 4 exclusives, Sekiro, and more make for a huge E3?
Interesting.
 
Last edited:

HawarMiran

Member
Jan 2, 2020
967
3,715
365
For fucks sake, are you 12 years old? "Look at Phil Spencer pretending to be a friend of PlayStation when he is actually just a big ol' meanie!"

Thinking people have nuanced positions. It isn't a contradiction to praise Sony's studios for making great games and then criticize Sony management for business practices that aren't consumer friendly.

By the way, if you actually are under the age of 18 then I apologize.


I think this might be happening soon. Microsoft either needs to drastically improve their own storefront so PC players don't mind playing games on it, or they should partner up with Steam. Hopefully Sony does something similar (either creating their own store or partnering with Epic).

Ideally, you should buy media once and be able to access it from all your devices. That's the way it is with music and movies. We aren't quite there with games yet, but I think it is inevitable. I think a lot of PlayStation fans are worried this development will threaten the existence of console gaming, but I don't think this fear is warranted. I don't know if it would even decrease console sales. Sure, there will be a few PC centric gamers that stop buying PlayStation consoles because they can now play Sony games on PC. But there will also be people who buy PlayStation consoles because it is a great way to access their entire game library from their living room. Ultimately, I think it will make consoles more desirable, not less desirable.
Is Phil your daddy? Serious question
 
  • LOL
Reactions: Bo_Hazem

Bo_Hazem

Gold Dealer
Feb 10, 2020
16,892
78,656
965
35
Salalah, Oman
can you try using a VPN to activate US gamepass?

something like free tunnelbear, just need a few mbs, 10 mins of your time.

dont waste that 3 years Gamepass loophole!

Many people around here don't even know what an xbox is. Never officially released as well and big stores avoid it.

And for gamepass I really don't waste my money on things I won't use. Ori and FH4 are the only good games I might try there, and could comfortably buy them on PC if feeling like playing them.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: HawarMiran
Dec 10, 2020
1,840
4,008
380
You’re right - it wasn’t “most” exclusives, it was simply “more exclusives than 2016”, which is an extremely low goal post he set. Doesn’t sound like “biggest year ever” to me. At all. I can’t tell if you’re even reading those quotes. Signs point to no.

Like i've said : Biggest", "best", "most special", "greatest" every year compared to previous has all the same meaning in the end.
 

HawarMiran

Member
Jan 2, 2020
967
3,715
365
Many people around here don't even know what an xbox is. Never officially released as well and big stores avoid it.

And for gamepass I really don't waste my money on thing I won't use. Ori and FH4 are the only good games I might try there, and could comfortably buy them on PC if feeling like playing them.
I played both Ori games. Best Xbox had to offer last generation imo. Gears 5 was boring and I pushed myself to finish it because my Gamepass subscirption was about to run out
 
  • Like
Reactions: Bo_Hazem

Bo_Hazem

Gold Dealer
Feb 10, 2020
16,892
78,656
965
35
Salalah, Oman
I played both Ori games. Best Xbox had to offer last generation imo. Gears 5 was boring and I pushed myself to finish it because my Gamepass subscirption was about to run out

I would honestly download my PS Plus games that I never touched instead, but standards get higher the more PS Studios push it so most games are unplayable to me now.
 
Mar 6, 2016
4,897
5,427
900
I think you got a little confused. E3 is about announcements.

the post was about Phil Spencer over promising and under delivering at E3.
if you quote Phil saying “this will be a big E3 for us” and they announce 5 studio acquisitions, 4 big exclusives, Sekiro, lay seeds for next-gen announcements and premier Cyberpunk gameplay.... that’s a big E3 showing.

for heavens sake people refer to “the year of dreams” and praise it constantly, but it was an E3 full of announcements for games that took forever to release, such as FF7 Remake.

...oh yeah - LOL!

Big difference. Those games actually released. Starfields been touted constantly around here and looks like it’s 2023 now. More waiting.

Also announcements of buying studios no one cares, they want games. Not mergers and acquisitions.
When was the last time publishers were announcing assets they bought at e3 as some win..
 
Last edited:

SafeOrAlone

Member
May 22, 2018
1,584
1,607
445
Big difference. Those games actually released. Starfields been touted constantly around here and looks like it’s 2023 now. More waiting.

Also announcements of buying studios no one cares, they want games. Not mergers and acquisitions.
When was the last time publishers were announcing assets they bought at e3 as some win..
Those games actually released....years after being announced. You’re not giving the same patience to some of these announcements that those games had.

You can say you don’t care about acquisitions. That doesn’t mean they aren’t a huge deal for Xbox. When they say “this is one of our biggest years” and five acquisitions are announced, they ain’t lying.

Maybe it doesn’t excite you but it’s huge news for the brand and that is Phil Spencer living up to what he is being quoted on.

but at the end of the day, you guys keep cherry picking. I point out 15 great things they announce at 2018 and you say “who cares about acquisitions.” ...is that it? Four exclusives? Sekiro? Gameplay premier for games that were highly anticipated? You say no one cares about acquisitions (arguable), but it’s the only one of my examples you picked out from my post.
People don’t care about Four exclusives being announced? They don’t care about Sekiro? Seeing Cyberpunk gameplay?
....Really?

and it’s not just about 2018. 2018 is just the best example of the inconsistency of the image/original post. There’s also the fact that one of the years has Spencer saying “we will have more exclusives than [last year]”, yet a few of you are quoting him as saying “it will be the best year ever.” With this one, it feels like purposefully sticking your head in the stand. I mean, I pointed it out to FatKingBallMan and he simply stopped responding.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: DarkMage619

Rhazer Fusion

Member
May 2, 2006
11,147
2,440
1,660
In my own world.
m.youtube.com
Why dont you address that in the early ps1-ps2? This was Sony practice, when they were new to the business. Microsoft just took it to a whole new level that is all.
Perhaps, but Sony didn’t ridicule the competition talking about their anti-consumer tactics during the PS1-PS2 era and then go ahead and do the exact same thing, but on a larger scale.
 

Hezekiah

Member
Jul 16, 2020
1,373
1,722
365

"Xbox boss Phil Spencer has criticised PlayStation’s PC release strategy in a rare dig at the rival platform holder.

Speaking during a briefing for media and analysts this week, the exec criticised “others” who bring console games to PC, stating that they were releasing PC versions “years later” and “charging [players] a second time”.

For several years Microsoft has released its Xbox Games Studios titles simultaneously on PC and console platforms.

In comparison, Sony released its first PC port, Horizon Zero Dawn, in 2020 – over three years after the game’s PS4 debut – and the company has said it will prioritise consoles for its game releases going forwards.

“So right now, we are the only platform shipping games on console, PC and cloud simultaneously,” Spencer said in a video presentation.

Others bring console games to PC years later, not only making people buy their hardware up front, but then charging them a second time to play on PC. And of course, all of our games are in our subscription service day one, full cross-platform included.”
Microsoft really can't keep Playstation (sorry "others") out of their mouth can they.

I have a PC and a Playstation and I by no means feel compelled to 'pay twice'. Hell in the cases of Horizon and Days Gone you're getting superior performance on PS5 compared to PS4 anyway.

I am glad that Microsoft releases their games day and date on PC though - for those that are any good lik Gears I can just buy them on PC, and don't have to deal with or pay for Microsoft's online structures, and can ignore their cringe-worthy marketing ✌️.
 

8BiTw0LF

Member
Jun 5, 2013
725
1,896
755
Phillyboy is just trying to sell DirectX to Sony. That's the only way PS5 games can be ported to PC in the near future - and that's only if (a big if) DirectStorage can match PS5's IO. He knows just aswell as others, that super speedy SSD's won't be standard on the PC market for at least 4-5 years. But hey, good luck with cross-gen titles and multiplatform titles for the entirety of this generation Microsoft.

Jim Carrey Laughing GIF
 
  • LOL
Reactions: Krappadizzle

reinking

Member
Jun 1, 2020
1,223
1,779
445
Does Spencer think everyone that has a gaming PC also has a PS4 or PS5? I know it must seem like it to him but Sony is going after PC gaming as a secondary market. They have no need or resources to bring it in as part of their primary market.
 

ReBurn

Member
Dec 6, 2008
12,689
3,522
1,240
SC USA
Does Spencer think everyone that has a gaming PC also has a PS4 or PS5? I know it must seem like it to him but Sony is going after PC gaming as a secondary market. They have no need or resources to bring it in as part of their primary market.
Tons of people have PC's and PS5's. What's bad about a gamer being able to choose which one they want to play their games on?

I swear I don't understand why people hate choices.
 

reinking

Member
Jun 1, 2020
1,223
1,779
445
Tons of people have PC's and PS5's. What's bad about a gamer being able to choose which one they want to play their games on?

I swear I don't understand why people hate choices.
Why would me pointing out that the PC market is a secondary market for Sony mean that I hate choices? I just understand that Sony has a finite amount of resources and a business model that they have chosen to follow. You think Sony has some moral obligation to support PC gaming so you have a choice where to play it?
 

Brofist

Member
Jun 15, 2004
10,951
1,134
1,765
I have a PS5 and PC but I don't buy things twice.
I think the question is more would you like to be playing on both without having to pay twice. Maybe not. Some people probably would though. Sony probably doesn't owe it to anyone to let them play anywhere, but from a gamers standpoint it would be better.
 
  • LOL
Reactions: S0ULZB0URNE
Oct 30, 2011
6,670
6,819
1,075
lol lmao.

This might be true today, but I strongly suspect come Sunday we are gonna be looking at Phil in another light.

I think they are about to have a kickass show. Not just because they now have 23 studios, but also because there is a good chance Bluepoint and Kojima are making games for him. If those MGS remake rumors are true, thats a $120 game for me. Anything kojima makes is priceless. Bethesda games are an easy buy.

I dont know. This is a silly thing for him to even talk about, but hes done a good job staying quiet this year which leads me to believe that he might actually have a good show planned.

it’s either really bad or quite good

im going with bad. Halo and starfield are the major announcements and neither inspires confidence

I suspect they’ll have a better show in 2022
 
Oct 26, 2018
20,017
27,764
820
Phil is right. Nothing wrong with allowing gamers to pay once and get it across several platforms.

If you want to pay twice to play the same game on two platforms, you can choose a different company.
 

S0ULZB0URNE

Member
Jan 27, 2020
3,303
4,160
620
I think the question is more would you like to be playing on both without having to pay twice. Maybe not. Some people probably would though. Sony probably doesn't owe it to anyone to let them play anywhere, but from a gamers standpoint it would be better.
Not from this gamers standpoint.
I buy PlayStation consoles to play PlayStation games.
I buy Nintendo devices to play Nintendo games.
 
  • LOL
Reactions: Hendrick's

S0ULZB0URNE

Member
Jan 27, 2020
3,303
4,160
620
Phil is right. Nothing wrong with allowing gamers to pay once and get it across several platforms.

If you want to pay twice to play the same game on two platforms, you can choose a different company.
Then Phil needs to start practicing what he preaches.