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Xbox One - Help Spread the Word

DC1

Member
Jan 30, 2013
2,425
0
425
Exactly!

While none of the above affects me, I understand people's frustrations, but this kind of hyperbolic, hysterical all-gamers-must-unite mob outrage only undermines the point you are trying to make. If you want to instigate change, preaching to the converted won't cut it. This kind of blanket negativity won't get anyone on your side who doesn't already agree with you.

There are plenty of positives with the Xbox One, its protectionism policy and its contribution to gaming as a whole (#1 - driving up quality) and whitewashing them only makes your opinion, and you in turn, limited.

Protectionism?
Quality contribution to gaming?


Lol!
 

tatotiburon

Banned
Oct 15, 2010
97
0
650
Bogotá
can't someone share the prices of digital xbox one games? i mean everybody is talking about it will be expensive, there won't be any promotions or anything, steam is diferent because it have cheap games and xbox one don't and we're at 6 months to launch...so maybe someone already have xbox one prices and maybe share with us with the source, that will be nice...
 

DC1

Member
Jan 30, 2013
2,425
0
425
Man, what a thread. Yes, let's be silent and sit on our hands and trust Microsoft to do the right thing.

My ignore list keeps growing.

And then you'll be just like MS.
It's ok to disagree.. just don't create your own sound chamber.
 

Moobabe

Member
Mar 24, 2009
10,831
1
0
can't someone share the prices of digital xbox one games? i mean everybody is talking about it will be expensive, there won't be any promotions or anything, steam is diferent because it have cheap games and xbox one don't and we're at 6 months to launch...so maybe someone already have xbox one prices and maybe share with us with the source, that will be nice...

You seriously think they will undercut retail massively? You're living in a fantasy world but, judging from your avatar and some of the juniors we've had recently, I'm not surprised.
 

DecoyOctopus

Member
Dec 13, 2012
1,373
0
0
I did my part. Thanks for this thread OP and everybody who contributed! I'm glad there are still people who are not willing to accept all this bullshit with open arms.

It's also pretty sad that there are so many gamers advocating for the loss of consumer rights.
 

quickwhips

Member
Jan 26, 2009
8,316
3,982
1,360
40
Delaware
What the hell are you on about. Just a few of the things different about Steam.

- Completely open platform
- Digital downloads, not physical copies
- Cheaper pricing and sales
- Complete offline play

People need to stop comparing this to Steam, it's not the same at all.

-So open that indies have to be greenlight to get on it or get rejected if they were in greenlight then got a publisher?
-you can buy a physical copy from walmart activate it and then its digital only
-yet to be determined MS has stated they want a old games to be hot like steam.
-You got me there but this isn't a deal breaker for me.
 

bryehn

Member
Apr 16, 2007
9,314
0
0
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
bryehn.net
I did my part. Thanks for this thread OP and everybody who contributed! I'm glad there are still people who are not willing to accept all this bullshit with open arms.

It's also pretty sad that there are so many gamers advocating for the loss of consumer rights.

What rights exactly? I keep seeing this, but if you read the fine print on any piece of software you bought for your PS3, 360 or Wii/Wii U, you'll see that, in fact you are only ever really licensing a game to begin with and do not in fact "own" it and use is subject to termination at any time. Same goes for music and movies on physical media.

The only difference is that a major hardware manufacturer is implementing a system for content publishers to actually have some control of content on physical media for the first time. And again, this is in no way "anti-consumer" if they tell you what you are getting into upfront. If they pulled this shit a year after release, sure, but as long as they're upfront the point is moot. It's up to consumers to make educated decisions about major electronics purchases.

The Internet check every 24 hours (not a required persistent connection as some seem to believe) does seem a bit absurd to me however, I admit. But it's there in plain English so people should by all rights know what they're getting into when they plunk down four or five hundred bucks on a new entertainment device.

I can understand where publishers are coming from should they choose to lock their software down (and it is a choice, not mandatory) because development costs will continue to rise and they want to recoup as much money as they can from software "sales".

I'm not saying I advocate what Microsoft and presumably the large publishers are doing here, but people really need to learn about what is going on rather than flailing their arms and screaming that their rights are being taken away.

I can understand privacy concerns, since this particular device requires a high resolution camera and microphone array to be connected in order to function, but from the software side I'm just seeing a bunch of people get their panties in a bunch over what amounts to a minor inconvenience.

Also, last I checked a game console was a luxury item. If we were talking about a necessity like your fridge I could see why people would be upset.
 

GitarooMan

Member
Jul 12, 2005
15,250
0
0
I do agree the term "rights" is thrown around way too loosely, as no one has really delineated any legal rights being violated. I think "anti-consumer policies" might be a better phrasing.
 

kitch9

Banned
Jan 23, 2007
7,201
0
0
 

marc^o^

Nintendo's Pro Bono PR Firm
Feb 17, 2005
15,982
26
1,675
45

uncledonnie

Banned
Mar 25, 2009
2,028
0
0
And that's what MS is banking on. Good little proles who do what they're told and don't pause to consider the rights they lose in the process. Enjoy your stack of coasters in 2020 when Xbone servers are shut down for the new console and you lose all rights to your collection since there's no more 24 hour handshake to reactivate them. Oh and be a good little prole next election and don't bother to vote, ok?

Kind of pathetic. Is it impossible for you to conceive that someone might have actually considered these policies and had no issues with them? I can appreciate that others may not be happy with everything, but I have no problems and respectfully disagree that they will "destroy everything we love about gaming".

And while it's nice to speculate on when the servers might be shut down and what measures Microsoft would take if/when that happens, that's all it is: speculation. Frankly even your unlikely doomsday scenario wouldn't impact me much, but I doubt that goes down. There are reasons they went to x86 as they transition to all digital this gen.
 

MirageDwarf

Member
Sep 8, 2006
4,969
1
0
http://i.imgur.com/3OPaHqD.jpg[img][/QUOTE]

Awesome. It is all clear why it is called Xbone One.

Might wanna add this too:
[quote="tusken77, post: 62015445"]How many hours can I game offline if logged on to a separate console accessing my library? ONE[/QUOTE]
 
Feb 10, 2013
3,611
0
0
This thread must not go forgotten, it is in our best interest to keep it alive (if you like gaming as currently is and not the vision Microsoft has for the future of it), it would be a good idea that once they (MS) announce the release date, we (the people that share the same opinion) post on FaceBook, Twitter, etc. on the date that it's set to be released (minus the month obviously), so for example if it's set to be released on 11/26/2013, we should post on 09/26/2013 and 10/26/2013, and one final push on 11/25/2013, that way we don't risk annoying our contacts and have them ignore our posts instead of paying attention to them.

It would also be great if that spreadsheet was made in more languages for foreign speaking neogaffers that might want to participate.
 

N2NOther

Banned
May 30, 2013
899
0
0
Los Angeles
I can't afford a Mercedes, so I buy a Camry instead. I don't understand what's so bad about that. They're pricing people out of their product—perhaps even intentionally. So what?

It's a business strategy used by tons of companies. sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

Eh, I think MS wants one of these in every living room possible. In fact, I think they have expressly stated this. MS isn't in the elitist club. They're in the mass market business.
 

N2NOther

Banned
May 30, 2013
899
0
0
Los Angeles
I can understand where publishers are coming from should they choose to lock their software down (and it is a choice, not mandatory) because development costs will continue to rise and they want to recoup as much money as they can from software "sales".

I understand why they would want to do this, but that doesn't mean that they're entitled to it. Again, not a single person can convince me or has even made a compelling argument that anyone beyond the two parties in involved in a sale should make a dime off of it.

These developers keep sinking money into 6 hours games that offer no compelling reason to keep the game. Maybe that's where they should start instead restricting what, how and where selling a game after the user is done with it takes place.

Also, last I checked a game console was a luxury item. If we were talking about a necessity like your fridge I could see why people would be upset.

Yeah, that makes sense. Laws that protect the rights of the consumer totally don't apply to things like TVs, consoles, books, cars and things like that.
 

LeBoef

Member
Apr 26, 2011
946
0
0
This thread must not go forgotten, it is in our best interest to keep it alive (if you like gaming as currently is and not the vision Microsoft has for the future of it), it would be a good idea that once they (MS) announce the release date, we (the people that share the same opinion) post on FaceBook, Twitter, etc. on the date that it's set to be released (minus the month obviously), so for example if it's set to be released on 11/26/2013, we should post on 09/26/2013 and 10/26/2013, and one final push on 11/25/2013, that way we don't risk annoying our contacts and have them ignore our posts instead of paying attention to them.

It would also be great if that spreadsheet was made in more languages for foreign speaking neogaffers that might want to participate.

that will hit microsoft so hard. Product awaress for free is always something that kills products and companies.
 

FuturusX

Member
Nov 10, 2006
7,084
2
1,000
-So open that indies have to be greenlight to get on it or get rejected if they were in greenlight then got a publisher?
-you can buy a physical copy from walmart activate it and then its digital only
-yet to be determined MS has stated they want a old games to be hot like steam.
-You got me there but this isn't a deal breaker for me.

This proves Steam is shite too. We have a great system now which is being intentionally broken for the benfit of the publisher.

Who wants Steam on a console? I don't.
 

metalmonstar

Member
Nov 16, 2012
408
0
475
I know it won't be for quite some time, but when or if the supreme court rules that first sale doctrine applies to digital products as well, we will look back at this time and laugh. For now though I hope that this little boycott goes well.
 

methane47

Member
Nov 3, 2006
12,000
0
0
St. Petersburg, Florida
Change someone have to someone has. Unless it's some wacky European grammar rule, there's no way someone is a group noun. I really like the idea. I'm not trying to get on you, it's just that it will have more impact if it is grammatically correct and I want it to have more impact.

The Have references the amount of months so plural

eg. How many apples does John HAVE to eat before he wins the contest?
eg. John HAS to eat many apples in order to win.

grammar nazi failure
 

Alx

Member
Jan 22, 2007
19,277
1,825
1,520
The french consumer rights association already reacted, they are astonished at what MS is trying to do. There will be blood, and by that I mean tons of bad press, injonction to write on the box warnings for customers, etc.
http://reviewer.lavoixdunord.fr/fr/...-que-choisir-a-microsoft-dans-le-collimateur/

Nice to see that some people may be worried and still be rational about it.
That's the right way to do it : have lawyers analyze the case, and decide if all of that is legal or not. If they decide it is, then there's no reason to complain, just don't buy it if you don't want it. It they decide it isn't, you will have the law to back you up and force MS to change its conditions. Everything else is just whining.

In the same spirit, all the privacy concerns should be handled by the CNIL. Have them question MS and analyze their storage and access, like they already do for all other companies. If there's something fishy, they'll say it and make it official. If they say they're clean, then there's no reason to worry.
 

Lasdrub

Member
May 20, 2013
832
0
540
The Have references the amount of months so plural

eg. How many apples does John HAVE to eat before he wins the contest?
eg. John HAS to eat many apples in order to win.

grammar nazi failure

I read it wrong. How kind of you to call me a grammar nazi when I was trying to make something better!
 

miso_Jeff

Banned
Mar 27, 2013
89
0
0
Hawaii
We might already be too late...

We might be. I see a lot of apologist out there and it's a little worrying. But to be honest a lot of people are just sheep, and their okay with that as long as they get something in the end. I don't think they realize that this has far reaching implications. If this becomes the norm, DRM/Consumers not owning items they've purchased, and big business controls everything you can and cannot do with items you've purchased with your hard earned money... this is where it started.

"He who sacrifices freedom for security deserves neither."
 
Oct 13, 2012
10,431
1
0
What rights exactly? I keep seeing this, but if you read the fine print on any piece of software you bought for your PS3, 360 or Wii/Wii U, you'll see that, in fact you are only ever really licensing a game to begin with and do not in fact "own" it and use is subject to termination at any time. Same goes for music and movies on physical media.

The only difference is that a major hardware manufacturer is implementing a system for content publishers to actually have some control of content on physical media for the first time. And again, this is in no way "anti-consumer" if they tell you what you are getting into upfront. If they pulled this shit a year after release, sure, but as long as they're upfront the point is moot. It's up to consumers to make educated decisions about major electronics purchases.

The Internet check every 24 hours (not a required persistent connection as some seem to believe) does seem a bit absurd to me however, I admit. But it's there in plain English so people should by all rights know what they're getting into when they plunk down four or five hundred bucks on a new entertainment device.

I can understand where publishers are coming from should they choose to lock their software down (and it is a choice, not mandatory) because development costs will continue to rise and they want to recoup as much money as they can from software "sales".

I'm not saying I advocate what Microsoft and presumably the large publishers are doing here, but people really need to learn about what is going on rather than flailing their arms and screaming that their rights are being taken away.

I can understand privacy concerns, since this particular device requires a high resolution camera and microphone array to be connected in order to function, but from the software side I'm just seeing a bunch of people get their panties in a bunch over what amounts to a minor inconvenience.

Also, last I checked a game console was a luxury item. If we were talking about a necessity like your fridge I could see why people would be upset.

When a company ends their policy statements with a disclaimer like this:

As we move into this new generation of games and entertainment, from time to time, Microsoft may change its policies, terms, products and services to reflect modifications and improvements to our services, feedback from customers and our business partners or changes in our business priorities and business models or for other reasons. We may also cease to offer certain services or products for similar reasons.

They are not being upfront with their customers. The entire policy is worded in a confusing way. I don't think anyone can confidently parse what it all 100% means. And it's not a case of them hiding behind legal language. Legal language is actually very specific; this is a bunch of pablum. Also consumers get to decide what is anti-consumer. If enough consumers consider the Xbox One unpalatable, then that's that.

As for rights, The primary right that people are angry about is The First Sale Doctrine. Which is laid out in the 1976 Copyright act. The concepts of purchase and ownership are fundamental capitalism. Making those definitions fuzzy is corrosive to a free market.

You call these things minor conveniences and I won't argue that, to you, they seem minor. What I will say is that consumers are getting nothing in return for these concessions.

It is the most restrictive media player since DIVX. Which failed spectacularly precisely because it places restrictions on consumers at the behest of publishers with no consumer benefit in return.

I had a thread about DIVX a few months ago. The similarities are striking.